open All Channels
seplocked Ships and Modules
blankseplocked TII Torps , T I Torps or TII Cruise missles + TII heavy DRone combo ?
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Author Topic

Teebee
XERCORE
Transmission Lost
Posted - 2006.12.18 17:20:00 - [1]
 

I know almost know nothing about missles. Most of my skills is in drones but I have Missles skills and can use all T1 missles. I was thinking about getting a Typhoon and using TII Torps + TII heavy drones for PvP I still need to train for TII Torps but people have been telling me to just stay with T1 torps or go TII cruise missles . What do you guys think would be the most effective?

Kinsy
Rionnag Alba
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2006.12.18 17:27:00 - [2]
 

Heavy Assaults old chap, whatwhat

Tribunal
FIRMA
Posted - 2006.12.18 17:32:00 - [3]
 

Heavy assaults are affected by the 25% RoF bonus on the Typhoon?

Use cruise missiles on a Typhoon.


Teebee
XERCORE
Transmission Lost
Posted - 2006.12.19 08:52:00 - [4]
 

I would like more opinions Laughing

Dr Aryandi
Posted - 2006.12.19 09:14:00 - [5]
 

Torps are better vs battleships.

Cruise are better vs most other ships.

Torps use more grid so are harder to fit.

ELECTR0FREAK
Eye of God
Posted - 2006.12.19 09:19:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 19/12/2006 09:21:15

I'd recommend T2 Torps and T2 drones. Use the Torps to kill big stuff, the drones to kill little stuff.

I'm the guy who discovered the missile formula and also a carrier pilot... those good enough credentials? Razz

EDIT- On the flip side, I don't fly Minmatar. Take that how you will.

Teebee
XERCORE
Transmission Lost
Posted - 2006.12.19 09:38:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: ELECTR0FREAK
Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 19/12/2006 09:21:15

I'd recommend T2 Torps and T2 drones. Use the Torps to kill big stuff, the drones to kill little stuff.

I'm the guy who discovered the missile formula and also a carrier pilot... those good enough credentials? Razz

EDIT- On the flip side, I don't fly Minmatar. Take that how you will.


Yeah thats works =D

Wrayeth
EdgeGamers
Situation: Normal
Posted - 2006.12.19 09:49:00 - [8]
 

Typhoon setup with siege, nos, and heavy drones:

4 siege II
2 heavy E500 or diminishing nosferatu
2 medium E50 or diminishing nosferatu

1 LiF-fueled AB
1 faint 20km scrambler
1 langour web (for CPU)
1 heavy electrochemical cap injector

2 large accomodation armor reps (again, CPU)
2 EANM II
1 internal force field damage control
1 1600mm rolled tungsten plate
1 RCU II

Various heavy drones.

ELECTR0FREAK
Eye of God
Posted - 2006.12.19 10:06:00 - [9]
 

Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 19/12/2006 10:14:59

One disclaimer: I haven't checked to see what kind of fittings you'll have left after fitting T2 torp launchers, but honestly, the 'Phoon is a fast BS so I'd probably make it a gank setup. (Edit - well it looks like the guy who posted above me dropped you a good setup so that should clear that concern up).

Secondly, keep in mind that T2 missiles have some nasty penalties. On the plus side, if you use Rage Torps along with a painter or 2, you can crank out some serious damage on another BS.

EDIT- Holy moly... you just put me onto something though... since the EVE database is out of sync currently with the T2 torps on live, I checked out an updated database and found that Tux did indeed play around with AOEFalloff... at least the values are different than they nromally are! Holy crap... this will be important to test later on!

To explain better, missiles have always used a hidden value of 1500 in their formulas to dictate essentially how quickly the damage bleeds off when firing on a target flying faster than the missile explosion speed. Until now, that's always been a constant. But now I'm looking at a value of 750 on Rage torps which essentially is a huge stealth nerf against fast moving targets. Well... I guess not a huge nerf since the missile is still pretty slow already.

!!!
Wow, has nobody caught this yet or just nobody told me about it?!

Uhm... anyhow... back to subject... Uh... I still think T2 torp launchers are a good bet, but I'm going to have to do some testing tomorrow to see if thise AOEFalloff nerf is for real before I can go giving you advice to use T2 torps. This change doesn't seem to apply to Rage Cruise missiles. In reason, it really only would effect how much damage you do to a target moving faster than 100 m/s, so if you opt to fit a gank setup with an AB, a painter or 2 (or 1 T2 painter would probably do), and a web, you'd be fine to use Rages. You could also tote along some Javelins if you run into HACs and the like. Another advantage of training to Torp spec is you won't have to bother with Guided Missile Precision skill book since it doesn't effect Torps, nor will you need to train Missile Launcher Op 5 (as Cruise needs), though you will want to eventually.

: Blinks and shakes his head at his new discovery :

But like I said... this changes a lot... I've got some work to do testing that AOEFalloff.

Wrayeth
EdgeGamers
Situation: Normal
Posted - 2006.12.19 10:13:00 - [10]
 

A gank config on the typhoon isn't really viable. It simply has too little CPU/grid to fit much. Also, the split weapons systems really hurt its gankability, even if it was to almost entirely sacrifice its tank - you'd have to run damage mods for both guns and missiles.

ELECTR0FREAK
Eye of God
Posted - 2006.12.19 10:25:00 - [11]
 

Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 19/12/2006 10:26:30

Yeah, looks like you gave the dude a good setup to work off of, and I still think he's better off with T2 Torps over T2 Cruise, but man, this little discovery about the Rage Torp's AOEFalloff stealth nerf has me reeling.

And to think I talked with Tuxford in IRC a couple months ago about how I thought unguided missiles should have a different AOEFalloff... and he commented that he thought it was a good idea... but I wasn't expecting this.

...and, on a hunch, I went and checked rockets. He's doubled the AOEFalloff to 3000 for Javelin Rockets, and reduced it by 50% to 1000 for Rage Rockets.

Wow. I know this probably doesn't mean anything to most of you folks since it's a hidden value, but it does to missiles damage reduction based on enemy speed what turret falloff does to damage reduction based upon target range. Now pretend all guns had the exact same falloff up until Revelations, and so it was a hidden value that never needed to be displayed. Now, pretend it's a variable instead of a constant, and thus I think AOEFalloff really needs to be included in the in-game data now. I find it surprising that the HAMs, which are technically unguided, however have gone untouched. Interesting.

Anyhow I'll stop rambling, I'm half asleep, really surprised, and thinking out loud through text... I'll do some testing tomorrow and take this to another thread. Carry on! Laughing

Leandro Salazar
Quam Singulari
Posted - 2006.12.19 10:42:00 - [12]
 

Edited by: Leandro Salazar on 19/12/2006 10:47:00
Originally by: ELECTR0FREAK
Edited by: ELECTR0FREAK on 19/12/2006 10:26:30

Yeah, looks like you gave the dude a good setup to work off of, and I still think he's better off with T2 Torps over T2 Cruise, but man, this little discovery about the Rage Torp's AOEFalloff stealth nerf has me reeling.

And to think I talked with Tuxford in IRC a couple months ago about how I thought unguided missiles should have a different AOEFalloff... and he commented that he thought it was a good idea... but I wasn't expecting this.

...and, on a hunch, I went and checked rockets. He's doubled the AOEFalloff to 3000 for Javelin Rockets, and reduced it by 50% to 1000 for Rage Rockets.

Wow. I know this probably doesn't mean anything to most of you folks since it's a hidden value, but it does to missiles damage reduction based on enemy speed what turret falloff does to damage reduction based upon target range. Now pretend all guns had the exact same falloff up until Revelations, and so it was a hidden value that never needed to be displayed. Now, pretend it's a variable instead of a constant, and thus I think AOEFalloff really needs to be included in the in-game data now. I find it surprising that the HAMs, which are technically unguided, however have gone untouched. Interesting.

Anyhow I'll stop rambling, I'm half asleep, really surprised, and thinking out loud through text... I'll do some testing tomorrow and take this to another thread. Carry on! Laughing


(nm...)

Imho, since the Javtorp overnerf and rage rebalancing (resulting in a nerf too imho), it is really not worth training for T2 torps anymore. Much better to use cruise, furies are almost as good as torps against battleships, and standard and precision cruise work fine against smaller ships too.
Throw in 3 rigor rigs once those become affordable, and cruise are win, while torps are suck.

ELECTR0FREAK
Eye of God
Posted - 2006.12.19 10:52:00 - [13]
 

I dunno... I'm still a fan of Rage torps and painters. If you can make the target sit still (web?), you can put out some pretty crazy firepower.

Leandro Salazar
Quam Singulari
Posted - 2006.12.19 11:36:00 - [14]
 

~700 DPS from rages in a gank setup, not really all that stellar considering your target needs to be painted up and slow. Close range turret ships do way more and would hit a target under those conditions just as well. Old rages did at least 800ish and all you needed was one more painter...
I still use Rages because they are the only point of T2 torps anymore, but imho their performance was nerfed, not boosted.

Zehn Takakura
Caldari
Skill Level Six
Dara Cothrom
Posted - 2006.12.19 12:59:00 - [15]
 

how many painters would you need to make rages viable as a replacement for T1's? Just asking cos i used rages without any painters on a bs rat and they did less dmg than T1 (obviously because of the explosion radius im guessing?).
Anyways, how many painters to make rages worthwhile?

Rixsta
0utbreak
KrautbreaK
Posted - 2006.12.19 13:37:00 - [16]
 

Hmm, haven't had a chance to see if this fits but i was considering it earlier it terms of gankability...

4x Siege Launcher Best Named
4x 425mm AC T2

AB
20pt Scrammer
Target Painter
Tracking Disruptor (not sure here, but my reasoning is Gank Mega, can probably keep it at bay for a while and abuse the AC Faloff and the torps range)

1x BCU (best named?)
1x Gyro (best Named?)
2x EANM2
2x 1600 Rolled Tungsten Plates
1x Damage Control

5x T2 Wasps
Webber Drone
5 Lights

Basically the lights are for frigs and Inties and the heavy's against anything else, and then the webber drone chucked in to help dictate range, but i'm not sure how it would work...

I know whenever i fit a phoon the PG is always a problem, but the low slots are relatively easy on the PG so it looks like it MAY fit, at work at the moment so i can't crunch the numbers... but if it does fit replace any best named with T2.


 

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only