open All Channels
seplocked EVE General Discussion
blankseplocked no bid in other regions makes contracts worthless
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: 1 [2] 3

Author Topic

Gemini Zero
ANZAC ALLIANCE
Southern Cross Alliance
Posted - 2006.12.06 11:56:00 - [31]
 

Edited by: Gemini Zero on 06/12/2006 12:00:45
Originally by: Plutoinum
Well, interbus transport sounds nice, but will surely be used in 0.0 in warfare, except it doesn't work there ofc. Laughing

If your station is sieged, move your stuff out via interbus
transport. Only problem would be insurances.
If gates are camped, move stuff in and out via interbus transport like poses and pos-fuel.


Oveur was very quick to say that the interbus would be for movement in the same constallation, which would help spread the density out of mega hubs. It would also be impossible to use it to get goods in and out of a region since most gate camps are done at region links, and I'm pretty sure no constallation spans two regions.

I'm not sure how I feel about the interbus idea myself. Everything else you buy you must pick up. If the interbus was implimented it might be intersting to add some variety to the delivery time and cost. Possibly a chance based delivery speed. Standings with interbus should increase your chances of a speedy delivery as well as lower your cost.

Allen Deckard
Gallente
Roadking Hawg's
Posted - 2006.12.06 14:36:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: Nicocat
Since when is Jita its own region? Go to something else in the Forge to bid on items in Jita. You already had to fly there to pick it up.


Cause it's over 50 stupid jumps to the stupid region.

Zar Dim
Minmatar
Devil Human Dark Side
RED.OverLord
Posted - 2006.12.06 14:46:00 - [33]
 

Originally by: Haffrage
You didn't use escrow too frequently, did you?


Eh?

I can't think other stupid enough answer on such stupid question.

(Well since this still could be a genuine curiosity, i'll answer - i did)

Zar Dim
Minmatar
Devil Human Dark Side
RED.OverLord
Posted - 2006.12.06 14:57:00 - [34]
 

Edited by: Zar Dim on 06/12/2006 14:58:03
Originally by: Lucre
Regional contracts are slightly less irritating but only slightly. And as others have noted, it'll just lead to everything and everyone going to Jita because nobody wants to check half a dozen regions unless they can do it in one click.


That's simply wrong. That wasn't true earlier, this is not true now. And won't happend any time soon.

YOU HAD to fly to Jita earlier because due to bugs, it was quite possible that items wasn't visible away from the region. So in fact escrow wasn't global. Now you can check every item + search options, that's great.

Moreover not every jerk will fly to jita to get a contract or bid on an auction, such systm will help spread contracts over all regions and not just jita-The Forge.

So you are wrong on all accounts.

Tachy
Posted - 2006.12.06 15:51:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: Zar Dim
Edited by: Zar Dim on 06/12/2006 14:58:03
Originally by: Lucre
Regional contracts are slightly less irritating but only slightly. And as others have noted, it'll just lead to everything and everyone going to Jita because nobody wants to check half a dozen regions unless they can do it in one click.


That's simply wrong. That wasn't true earlier, this is not true now. And won't happend any time soon.

YOU HAD to fly to Jita earlier because due to bugs, it was quite possible that items wasn't visible away from the region. So in fact escrow wasn't global. Now you can check every item + search options, that's great.

Moreover not every jerk will fly to jita to get a contract or bid on an auction, such systm will help spread contracts over all regions and not just jita-The Forge.

So you are wrong on all accounts.


You used to visit Jita once for shopping. For auctions you have to stay in the Forge for the duration.

I had no problem finding stuff on the far side of the known systems using escrow. Esrow was global - but there as some kind of time limit in effect.

Finding offers for different versions of a modul type was a nobrainer. Now you can start with knowing the very name or fail.

When I went to Jita, I could get everything right there, in one go, without waiting a couple of days for auctions to run out and for the contractors to finalize all the deals.

Nox Solaris
Posted - 2006.12.06 16:20:00 - [36]
 

As I am on a long vacation and have not experienced the new contract system, the posts I'm reading do not give me a high degree of confidence in how the system works now. :/

They've made escrow filterable (yay!), but put limits on the number of active escrows (??? Wah!), limited them to regional access/bid only (so now just use the market... WTF bother with contracts?) and shortened the available duration from 7 days (always annoyingly brief) to 5 (even worse).

So... one good point and offhand three usefulness-killers.

Fix: Triple the duration. Remove regional limits.

This is why Jita has become more glutted and not less... because everyone knows where Jita is, and that the market there is huge, so that's where they go when they want to find a generally competative price and actually find what they want.
The new vastly limited contract system has cemented hubs more firmly, not forced their dissolution.

Cyclops43
Posted - 2006.12.06 16:25:00 - [37]
 

Edited by: Cyclops43 on 06/12/2006 16:25:31
Originally by: Tachy
For auctions you have to stay in the Forge for the duration.

Not really:
1. Create Alt
2. Move Alt to Jita
3. Alt bids on auction
4. Alt stays until auction is over

Rinse and repeat....

EDIT: Still awfully annoying though.....

Lord WarATron
Amarr
Shadow Warri0rs
Posted - 2006.12.06 16:28:00 - [38]
 

Originally by: Cyclops43
Edited by: Cyclops43 on 06/12/2006 16:25:31
Originally by: Tachy
For auctions you have to stay in the Forge for the duration.

Not really:
1. Create Alt
2. Move Alt to Jita
3. Alt bids on auction
4. Alt stays until auction is over

Rinse and repeat....

EDIT: Still awfully annoying though.....



Granted, however some people may need to train a t2 hauler alt, or a freightor alt depending on the situation. They will also have to transfer back and forth isk from their mains.

Harisdrop
Gallente
Vindicate and Deliverance
Posted - 2006.12.06 16:31:00 - [39]
 

Super size- Essence and Sinq Laison - New name Gallente Prime
Super size- Lonetrek and Citidel - New name Caldari Prime

These two regions would be great.

Please make contracts and orders for the market into one field. remove the Contract skill and allow the trader just use his market skills. I guess your a tycoon if you need more contract slots. either way I dont see a problem with this.

Harisdrop
Gallente
Vindicate and Deliverance
Posted - 2006.12.06 16:38:00 - [40]
 

Edited by: Harisdrop on 06/12/2006 16:40:28
Quote:
- Interbus transport. Inside Constellations you can pay extra for "instantaneous" delivery, longer than that you would be offered to create a courier contract which would have insured delivery by Interbus if a player hasn't transported it within X days (insert any kind of range and criterias here, just examples). This could diffuse the single-system hubs entirely, having them on a constellation level.


Do not charge us for the courier contract.
Let the system create courier contracts they would be different.

I place a buy region wide. I set a trigger when qty is reached of this item i get a courier mission to my base. If a player gets it then its all good otherwise i have set date limit that interbus does it.

The settings will be layed out. The price for each courier is set and the collateral and qty.
My courier charge is taken at the beginning. Given that low sec has to be figured into this charge for both.
Interbus are not actual ships but a batch job behind the scene.move item from here to here.

I can choose not to have players do it.
I can choose no courier at all
I can choose no interbus.

Interbus better be exspensive!!!!!!!!!

Allen Deckard
Gallente
Roadking Hawg's
Posted - 2006.12.06 16:42:00 - [41]
 

Originally by: Lord WarATron
Originally by: Cyclops43
Edited by: Cyclops43 on 06/12/2006 16:25:31
Originally by: Tachy
For auctions you have to stay in the Forge for the duration.

Not really:
1. Create Alt
2. Move Alt to Jita
3. Alt bids on auction
4. Alt stays until auction is over

Rinse and repeat....

EDIT: Still awfully annoying though.....



Granted, however some people may need to train a t2 hauler alt, or a freightor alt depending on the situation. They will also have to transfer back and forth isk from their mains.


I realize eve is not really a rpg. But i have 1 character 1 account I dont want to train another character to do what this character should be able to do. Guess I am completely alone on that one though.

Shakuul
Caldari
RuffRyders
Axiom Empire
Posted - 2006.12.06 18:09:00 - [42]
 

Super highways changed travel time, making the universe smaller in terms of space. Super regions will make the universe smaller in terms of information, as all of the information will be collected in smaller groups. Super highways would actually create more regions of countryside, because they increase population density by confining people to areas closer to super highways. Super regions will cause everyone spend more time in their home system (wherever they run missions from, etc) since they can see Jita prices whenever they want.

If it kills traders, fine. They really don't add anything of real value to the economy. Miners and maufacturers create value. Minerals are worth more than nothing, a ship is worth more than the minerals that make it up. Traders are in fact an isk drain, since they incur additional fees by buying and reselling. Super regions will be more convenient and more efficient.

Instant transport within constellations seems fine too. Its just like a super system, moving the server load from one system to 5 or 6. This adds convenience without removing many aspects of logistics, like the risk involved in moving minerals in and out of 0.0.

Harisdrop
Gallente
Vindicate and Deliverance
Posted - 2006.12.06 18:13:00 - [43]
 

Ask again if there are stations in 0.0 that are in the same constellation?

The answer is "YES"!!!!!!!!!!!!

Meep Eep
Posted - 2006.12.06 18:56:00 - [44]
 

Just some anectdotal evidence:

- In WoW the Auction Houses used to be separate. This caused everyone to use a single AH (Org for Horde, IF for alliance). The other cities became empty, since it was pointless to go there.

- A few patches back they linked all the AH, suddenly everyone spread out and used whichever city they wished.

So basically, by trying to 'force' regions they actually caused everyone to congregate. Only by making the AH global did it make people spread out.

BTW, I think regional markets are possible (obviously they are in real life) but they can only work with population much larger than any typical MMOG of today.

Mack Dorgeans
Camelot Innovations
Posted - 2006.12.06 19:15:00 - [45]
 

There are a number of things I think need to be done to the contracts system to make it a better tool for everyone.

Arrow The Multiple Items tag reduces visibility of contracts with more than one thing included. How to fix this? Maybe increasing the space/visible characters in the Description field and making it more prominent and sortable would help.

Arrow Maybe allow bids on auctions across all of space, but item exchanges and other immediate transactions stay limited to regions. If you're outside the region, you need to pay an additional broker fee because you're employing someone to go place your bids for you. The upside is auctions will get more competitive bidding, while local players have the best chances to get good deals on item exchanges and such.

Arrow HELP TEXT / DOCUMENTATION!!! CCP, we luv ya, but you're bloody awful at documentation. I had to walk a very veteran, intelligent player through how to find a direct item exchange he set up from one character to another today. There should be more in-game support for stuff, AND it should probably be more intuitive. People were used to the old system, and now there are more steps and more ways to get lost in the process.

Arrow Maybe costs of listing in overpopulated trade hubs should be increased. Do we really want everyone to have alts in Jita? At least, everyone who doesn't already have one? It was blatantly obvious that Jita population and traffic would only get worse with this system, so there's no excuse for not having at least tried something to combat the problem on initial rollout.

Arrow We need better sorting tools. Within a region, you ought to be able to sort a specific item by price, and the first page would show the cheapest ones, regardless of how long ago they were initially listed, not just the stuff on page 1. Sorting blueprints by stats sure would be nice, too. Secondary sorting would help, so you can choose both a primary filter and secondary one, for instance the cheapest Drake BPCs at the top, with highest ME level or number of runs coming in above lower ones at the same price. Another useful sorting tool would be by jump distance. I'm sure there are others we could come up with.

Harisdrop
Gallente
Vindicate and Deliverance
Posted - 2006.12.06 19:17:00 - [46]
 

Originally by: Mack Dorgeans

Arrow We need better sorting tools. Within a region, you ought to be able to sort a specific item by price, and the first page would show the cheapest ones, regardless of how long ago they were initially listed, not just the stuff on page 1. Sorting blueprints by stats sure would be nice, too. Secondary sorting would help, so you can choose both a primary filter and secondary one, for instance the cheapest Drake BPCs at the top, with highest ME level or number of runs coming in above lower ones at the same price. Another useful sorting tool would be by jump distance. I'm sure there are others we could come up with.



I really think making Contracts into XML pages would be awesome.

ProphetGuru
Gallente
Evolution
Band of Brothers
Posted - 2006.12.06 19:22:00 - [47]
 

If I had 1 trit for every time I've heard a dev invoke interbus since beta.. I'd have enough to build dread.

Don't get me wrong, be nice to finally see em....



Marcus Starr
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2006.12.06 19:35:00 - [48]
 

I thought the whole point of the contract system was to force everyone, through contract fees, to go to less populated systems to sell their stuff. Just keep raising the fees until it becomes unbearable for buyers and sellers to pay for the item. Give it a year or two and if that doesn't work then go with your super regions idea.

Mack Dorgeans
Camelot Innovations
Posted - 2006.12.06 19:37:00 - [49]
 

Arrow One more thing... FIX THE BROKER RELATIONS AND ACCOUNTING SKILLS so they actually work on contracts issued on behalf of your corp. They appear to work somewhat now, but for instance the taxes they say you're going to be charged when you create the contract are not what you get charged upon completion of the contract. Instead the corp gets charged a full 1% rather than the skills-lowered amount.

Mack Dorgeans
Camelot Innovations
Posted - 2006.12.06 20:52:00 - [50]
 

Arrow Yet another request: please add contracts completed to the transactions tab of the wallet, with a rundown on what sold. It's hard to keep track of what exactly I've sold by memory alone, though the notepad helps if I remember to keep track of all my running contracts.

Anyone got a +10 memory implant to sell?

Argenton Sayvers
Posted - 2006.12.06 23:29:00 - [51]
 

Edited by: Argenton Sayvers on 06/12/2006 23:30:00
Originally by: Marcus Starr
I thought the whole point of the contract system was to force everyone, through contract fees, to go to less populated systems to sell their stuff. Just keep raising the fees until it becomes unbearable for buyers and sellers to pay for the item. Give it a year or two and if that doesn't work then go with your super regions idea.


I thought the point of the contract system was to create a better trade system, not remove the trade system from the game.

There is one and only one way to prevent people from clustering in Jita while keeping this pathetic approach of restrictive game design: permaban everyone who puts contracts in Forge. There is no other way.


Marcus Starr
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2006.12.07 00:49:00 - [52]
 

Originally by: Argenton Sayvers
Edited by: Argenton Sayvers on 06/12/2006 23:30:00
Originally by: Marcus Starr
I thought the whole point of the contract system was to force everyone, through contract fees, to go to less populated systems to sell their stuff. Just keep raising the fees until it becomes unbearable for buyers and sellers to pay for the item. Give it a year or two and if that doesn't work then go with your super regions idea.


I thought the point of the contract system was to create a better trade system, not remove the trade system from the game.

There is one and only one way to prevent people from clustering in Jita while keeping this pathetic approach of restrictive game design: permaban everyone who puts contracts in Forge. There is no other way.



I got the idea from the Contract blog under the taxes section, but I didn't remember it correctly Embarassed

I like the permaban idea though Wink but let's just keep it to public contracts.

Perseus D'Solos
Posted - 2006.12.07 01:08:00 - [53]
 

I probably shouldn't be saying this, since it will probably give the devs some bad ideas, but if you're able to send isk to pretty much anyone anywhere in EVE, why shouldn't you be able to bid on contracts from anywhere? It's not very consistent, is it? One more thing, anything less than making contracts searchable in all regions at once, will just concentrate all commerce to one place. In other words, "Jita" would be a better name for the contracts system.

Avera Mikou
Posted - 2006.12.07 01:55:00 - [54]
 

It doesn't make any sense lag-wise to try to force everyone in the universe who wants to buy things into the same system

Barbarellas Daughter
Lonely Barbarella
Posted - 2006.12.07 02:02:00 - [55]
 

Originally by: Perseus D'Solos
I probably shouldn't be saying this, since it will probably give the devs some bad ideas, but if you're able to send isk to pretty much anyone anywhere in EVE, why shouldn't you be able to bid on contracts from anywhere? It's not very consistent, is it? One more thing, anything less than making contracts searchable in all regions at once, will just concentrate all commerce to one place. In other words, "Jita" would be a better name for the contracts system.
Hm, comparing to real life, u can send money via online banking, but would you make a bid on a Gistii-Mercedes in *insert random country* from your computer?
I bet you will inspect first!

Perseus D'Solos
Posted - 2006.12.07 02:08:00 - [56]
 

Originally by: Barbarellas Daughter
Hm, comparing to real life, u can send money via online banking, but would you make a bid on a Gistii-Mercedes in *insert random country* from your computer?
I bet you will inspect first!

Moot point, since inspecting something located in Jita looks the same when doing it in Jita as it does doing it from *insert-name-of-place-not-in-the-forge*.

EVE isn't real life. If it was, I'd be depressed atm.

Sorela
Gallente
Posted - 2006.12.07 02:19:00 - [57]
 

One thing I'd like to see is being able to search for item exchange contracts a bit more globally to make it such that people could setup "buy contracts" out at the edges of empire and leave the actual item aquisition and transport up to someone else.

The way it is right now though nobody will ever even see a contract where someone might be offering ISK for a particular item. This will lead to people not bothering to put up such buy orders which will lead to people not even trying to search.

Celeste Coeval
The Gosimer and Scarab
Posted - 2006.12.07 02:36:00 - [58]
 

no it just makes you get off your arse

Jinx Barker
Caldari
GFB Scientific
Posted - 2006.12.07 03:00:00 - [59]
 

Originally by: Celeste Coeval
no it just makes you get off your arse


No mate, this is not a matter of "getting off one's arse" - it is a matter of the system, which was designed to streamline the escrow, being unintuitive and counterproductive.

The way system is now makes everyone create an ALT specifically to be in Jita and other "Hub" systems. The way it should be is to have global access to contracts, where anyone in any system or region can bid and buy, so long as they have gone into small trouble of searching a particular region.

If "contracts" were globably accesible then there will be no reason for one's ALT to camp a hub system, in essence making people spread out more and cutting down on the significance of Lag Inducing Hubs.

MissileRus
Posted - 2006.12.07 03:11:00 - [60]
 

Edited by: MissileRus on 07/12/2006 03:12:27
i would like to see NPC haulers jumping gates and transporting stuff, i would like to see pirates being able to take them down, and you can even escort them to keep the transport safe. since players dont seem to be willing to transport things if your not paying them 2x the price of the thing you bought or even more id like to see something like this someday...

i dont like the ideas of instant delivery Neutral

edit: the skillbook changes for regions to claim in sounds needed though Smile


Pages: 1 [2] 3

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only