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Shar Tegral
Posted - 2006.11.29 06:17:00 - [151]
 

Originally by: Rivur'Tam
Looting now is just a tedious chore.

Is this your experience or a summary of what everyone before you has been saying? Becuase while I'm sure you may think you've laid upon us enlightenment at best you've only just come along a day late and a dollar short.

Nothing wrong with an opinion mate... just read the thread before you lay your thang down. Then you can add something or just /signed and move along.

PS: I expect this thread to start coming alive. The whinage might be overwhelming though.

Ares Nightshade
Posted - 2006.11.29 08:41:00 - [152]
 

As a new player as of about four weeks ago I must say the wrecks setup as it stands now is horrible. I have been running missions and collecting loot and selling it to earn money. Now when I'm picking up loot i have to shoot down every wreck to keep track of ehat I've looted. As I understand it, it would take me months to train the skills to make the wrecks be of any use to me besides a waste of ammo and time. There MUST be some kind of flag to say whether a wreck has been looted or not. I don't really care about empty ones, but I don't feel it's right for me to have to shoot down ships twice just to know what I've checked for loot. I understand the reason for them, and have no problem with that, but how is a new payer going to figure that all out without seeing the old can system? This is honestly bad enough that i may cancel my subscription till it's fixed. It's completely unfriendly to everyone but salvagers. Since Salvaging takes alot of time to train and is certainly not a newbie friendly profession, everyone who is just starting and can't sort through thier loot is just going to get fed up and leave. PLEASE FIX THIS ASAP!!!

Funbit
Amarr
Posted - 2006.11.29 10:28:00 - [153]
 

Signed.

Kouran Darkblade
Caldari
Dark Circle Enforcement
Posted - 2006.11.29 11:05:00 - [154]
 

There realy does need to be a way of identifiying looted wrecks, t2 ammo is hard to come by in 0.0 and i'll be damned if im wasting it blowing up wrecks.

Shar Tegral
Posted - 2006.11.29 11:30:00 - [155]
 

Originally by: Ares Nightshade
As a new player as of about four weeks ago I must say the wrecks setup as it stands now is horrible.

I like the arguments you present. However it should be pointed out that it wouldn't take months to train up this skill however it is a serious diversion for any player under 6 months to focus on. And I mean it is a massive diversion... like a profession. But then that is what it is designed to be.

Salvaging itself is a branch out of the COSMOS mini-professions that was not new player friendly either. This was understandable as much of COSMOS was geared to veteran activity. New players could partake but would have to tap the shoulders of veterans to accomplish things. Truly one of the few adhoc teamwork areas of the game.

Wrecks/Salvaging however is not as isolated as the COSMOS activities were. This is making the problem massively pronounced. And thus, lessons believed to have been learned from the COSMOS experiment are proving to have more problems with it than might have been expected.

Also, currently it appears that wrecks will disappear within about one hour. So leaving your cans will not create lingering works of chaotic can art.

Ganging up with someone can provide an invaluable tool for wreckage sorting. We've been doing the non-fleet gang and our loot guy just tags the cans he's "cleaned" as he goes along. The rest of us then tractor any tagged cans and salvage as we go along. (Those of us with the gear and skill)

This is making for a situation for a specific role within a group of people, can cleaner, even more important. But I expect others will adapt like we have, we don't play this game as a mostly single player instance, but we all agree... the process has needed some additional levels of depth and adjustment.

Dackar Naviner
Posted - 2006.11.29 15:54:00 - [156]
 

These wrecks are awful to some one who makes money the way I do. I rat Belts and run missions. I make most of my money from Mods and things I find in the cans or the new wrecks. I have run through it in my head and the past several missions and Belt runs have been very lean. 4 Mods from the "Unothorized Military Presence". You know that mission has a lot of rats. Its hard to tell between Wrecks I have checked or not but I just blow them when I am done with them. The odd thing is there is much less loot than there used to be. Normaly I could come away from "Unotherised Mitary Presens" with 14-20 Mods of different values.

So is it just me or has the loot ratio gone in the pit? Also the normal problem of wrecks being a waste of ammo and time to destroy. Every Ship I destroy leaves a wreck. Unless I destroy the wreck in the Belts It will quickly clutter up with empty Wrecks. As you can imagine thats is a lag causing messy nightmare. Its a great Idea but this one really need some work unto the point of sending it back to the test server.


Commander Nemesid
Posted - 2006.11.29 16:48:00 - [157]
 

Im playing about month and im mission runner. Only income of money is from bounty,rewards and CARGO. I picked every cargo before patch but now its HORRIBLE. About 60-80% of NPC ships doesnt drop cargo. They now all drop wreck and its EMPTY. I dont have nerves to search all empty wreck so my income is going to hell.

Sorry, pls make ships to drop wreck AND cargo. YES, both items. So i can turn off wrecks from overwiev.

Megadon
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2006.11.29 17:38:00 - [158]
 

Well the deal is that because every ship USED to drop tons of tech 1 mods, the tech 1 market was in the toilet.

Sooooo, now they don't drop tons of mods which actually is a boost to those that spent billions in BPO's and research to build tech 1 items so the economy for tech 1 got a huge boost by this.

The flip side of the coin is that if you train up to salvage wrecks properly, you can supply the rarer materials that are required to build rigs which will help offset your loss of income from what used to be npc's dropping tons of tech 1 gear.

This is actually a good thing.

So now there is a bit of strategy to looting and npc'ing for isk and it brings a whole new profession to the game.

Exploration and Salvaging.

So that is the big picture and I think it's a long over due improvement.Cool


Your welcomeYARRRR!!

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2006.11.29 19:57:00 - [159]
 

I've just completed L3 "Illegal Activity 1/3" for Motsu Ititeimo (Oimmo), and (with a Salvager I fitted, Salvaging skill at L1) proceeded to (slowly) salvage each and every wreck in the mission (including the Gallente Miners).

Ok, it took a while, as I only had a ~10% chance to salvage per activation and there are quite a few ships in that mission (many support frigs, several Gallente Officer, Gallente Navy Thorax x2, etc). So far, all I got is this...
Most of the time (9/10): "2006.11.29 19:xx:xx Notify Your salvaging attempt failed this time."
Rarely (then wreck gone): "2006.11.29 19:xx:xx Notify You successfully salvage from the Wreck. Unfortunately there was nothing to be salvaged."

So... is salvage really bugged, or is it just the "salvage tables" on the navy wrecks ?
Didn't get a chance to test on anything else yet.
Anybody got even a SINGLE component out of salvaging so far ? If yes, what/how/where ?

Amira Silvermist
The Aegis Militia
Aegis Militia
Posted - 2006.11.29 22:50:00 - [160]
 

I think that Mission and Deadspace NPCs have a very low component drop rate and hope the same is true for the standard belt rats.

Mik Nostrebor
Minmatar
Ex Coelis
Posted - 2006.11.29 23:11:00 - [161]
 

Edited by: Mik Nostrebor on 29/11/2006 23:27:40
OK so this will come across as a whine but...

If the purpose of wrecks was to extend missions so that they took longer then they are a success. The problem I have is that the processing of wrecks for loot is very very repetative. Lock, tractor, open, loot (if any), unlock, destroy.. and repeat. Unlike before wrecks when ships only dropped cans when there was loot, this new system drops 2-4 times then number of objects.

I found that after 3 simple Level 3 missions My wrists and hands were becoming very fatigued and sore. I was taking breaks, getting up and moving around etc, but still had problems. I know I had some problems before with loot processing but now it is worse. Before it was 5 clicks per can now it it 8 clicks per wreck.

This means in a mission before where there were 10 ships, 4 of which dropped a can I would be clicking 20 times. Now I have to click 32 times for the ones with loot and a further 42 times for the ones that are empty. So the RSI click factor has gone from 20 to 74! That is nearly 4 times!

The sad truth of the matter is that I may not be able to physically continue to keep doing this. I already use wrist supports, breaks, changes in seating position and a bunch of other tactics to combat RSI.

So I guess, I might be forced to be a miner. Oh joy...

Mik

SoulTornado
Posted - 2006.11.29 23:32:00 - [162]
 

Hello.

I really need to yell and scream at someone, the wreck system is horrible.
Spent 10 minutes completing the mission objectives and thirty minutes running through the wrecks and blowing them up! It's stupid and a downgrade from the previous system ...

Color code wrecks : EMPTY or WITH CONTENT
Option to remove empty wrecks from overview!!!

Gawd this is stupid , really!

Have a good day now, for this shure made my day... well WEEK, god nows when youll fix it!

Ares Nightshade
Posted - 2006.11.29 23:52:00 - [163]
 

If Salvaging is supposed to be a mini profession then why is it that every mission runner is now forced to deal with every wreck?

Couldn't we at least have the old can system back and just create wrecks aswell that non salvagers could ignore? When a mission item is dropped like marines or VIPs it is dropped in a can that pops when empty.

Let's go back to putting normal loot in cans that pop when empty and leave the wrecks to be dealt with by those who want to salvage. Just imagine how cumbersome this is on new players who would take 5 minutes to shoot down a wreck of a ship they already killed just to know that it was empty so they don't search it again.

At the VERY LEAST make wrecks taggable so that those using ammo don't have to waste isk just keeping track of what has been searched! This needs to be high priority to the devs or there will be alot of unhappy new players out there. I am among those right now.

Probita
Gallente
3B Legio IX
Atlas Alliance
Posted - 2006.11.30 16:31:00 - [164]
 

Yeahh ... awfull system.
I completes a lev3 mission in about 15 minutes, but taked me 25 minutes to check all and every single wreck left behind ... I didn't wanted to try another mission after that ... It's a waste of time. And that were a simple mission. A Gurista Extravaganza will be 2 hours to complete ... 4 hours to loot ... no no noooo. Confused

Schwaxpl
Gallente
Federal Defence Union
Posted - 2006.11.30 16:58:00 - [165]
 

yes , please fix that , since revelation , i just did one mission and when i saw the wreck system ShockedMad...
it's like we're forced to train salvage skill ( wich is called "mini profession" , not "vital profession for looters" ), please make a system so that we don't have to destroy wrecks , maybe by keeping the loot cans separates from the wrecks , that would be the best idea imo , salvager could salvage and looters could still take their loot in cans , the can system was perfect imo , the wreck system is a regression , i'd not be surprised if peoples leave the game because of that ugh

Lisena Agardis
Posted - 2006.11.30 17:07:00 - [166]
 

Hm i like the wreckage and salvaging mode... it's only half a month to learn and now you can get even more loot :)
and if your neighbours agree, you can harvest their victims too :)

Senyn
Posted - 2006.11.30 20:53:00 - [167]
 

Edited by: Senyn on 30/11/2006 20:54:30
Thanks a lot to CCP for this new feature: wreckage, salvaging, and removing the can system from the game. Thanks a lot Very HappyVery Happy
I am playing eve now since 14 months, the last 10 or 12 weeks very much, too much, since I have a lot of private work and this work suffered from playing so much EVE.
Now things are going to change. With this piece of bullsh*t programmed into the game I am just thinking not only of reducing playing time but even to quit my abo for EVE.
The reasons were already told in the posts before. Again for confirmation: as a mission runner and as such not only living from the bounty but also from the loot, this game is not playable anymore (running missions). Dozens of wrecks, in some missions even two or three wrecks of 40 have a loot, flying from wreck tot wreck just to seee that many of them are empty, NOPE!!
You even cannot beginn looting during fight as I did it before. I can keep track of 6 targets, with a Mega I have 8 weapons. But when fighting and looting, I can only target 5 enemies instead of 6 cause I need one free target slot for targeting the ship wreck I have recently looted. Huh, this is ****** Mad
Same with weapons. I can't use all weapons while fighting cause I need at least on or two quiet for blowing up the wreck after looking into it. Huuuh, this is ****** Mad
Yes, I can also wait until all ships have popped and only then begin to loot. LOL, do this in an Extravaganza. It is even not possible without the double or triple time (ore more) you need for killing the ships, when waiting with looting until the level is emptied from rats. Huuuh, this is ****** Mad

I am playing computer games for about 20 years, and I have played many thousands of hours (I am a liar, it were much much more Rolling Eyes ) an I agree, I understand the idea behind salvaging, but this new feature is ********. Can't remember that I have seen such an aggravation before in a game.

So maybe goodbye for ever .....

Talani Allure
Posted - 2006.12.01 09:11:00 - [168]
 

i have 2 questions. Where do you get salvage modules and why dont I have a picture?

Di Jiensai
Gallente
Domination.
THE KLINGONS
Posted - 2006.12.01 09:25:00 - [169]
 

Originally by: Talani Allure
i have 2 questions. Where do you get salvage modules and why dont I have a picture?


you get salvage modules in the market, called "Salvager I" and you dont have a picture, because, well i dont know why, but i heared someone at CCP will be fired, if we dont have pics until christmas Twisted Evil

on a Diffrent note:
Mercenarys, rogue drones, and faction navy ships leave broken wrecks wich dont yield materials when salvaged.

And I will stopp reading forums now for 2 weeks, because if i read one more "OMG!!!11! WRECKS ARE CRAP!!!" post i will get a shotgun and clean up humanitys gene pool a bit. I realy dont know how you CCP guys can stand that.


HooFlungDung
Posted - 2006.12.01 09:58:00 - [170]
 

Edited by: HooFlungDung on 01/12/2006 10:05:25
Edited by: HooFlungDung on 01/12/2006 10:01:23
The reason why there is so many topics e.g. "Wrecks are C R A P" is because the loot system is ruined at the moment.

If CCP implement something which is 95% a waste of time and breaks the "practicality/fun" of something that worked before then they deserve to recieve criticism. That's what forums are for - people voice their opinions.

If there a lot of posts saying something like this it more than likely means that the majority of people's opinions playing the game think that the loot system is now "broken". If you disagree, then sorry, but you are in the minority.

And yes The loot/wreck system is F U B A R and a COMPLETE WASTE OF TIME ATM.

simple - FIX IT CCP OR YOU WILL LOSE CUSTOMERS BECAUSE OF IT.

What I think is amusing is that CCP introduce an 800K+ SP start for new characters to attract more new players, but then screw up the loot system and make it 500% longer and harder to loot their missions just to scare them off.....

Di Jiensai
Gallente
Domination.
THE KLINGONS
Posted - 2006.12.01 11:36:00 - [171]
 

Edited by: Di Jiensai on 01/12/2006 11:37:17
Originally by: HooFlungDung
Edited by: HooFlungDung on 01/12/2006 10:05:25
Edited by: HooFlungDung on 01/12/2006 10:01:23
The reason why there is so many topics e.g. "Wrecks are C R A P" is because the loot system is ruined at the moment.

If CCP implement something which is 95% a waste of time and breaks the "practicality/fun" of something that worked before then they deserve to recieve criticism. That's what forums are for - people voice their opinions.

If there a lot of posts saying something like this it more than likely means that the majority of people's opinions playing the game think that the loot system is now "broken". If you disagree, then sorry, but you are in the minority.

And yes The loot/wreck system is F U B A R and a COMPLETE WASTE OF TIME ATM.



The point is not that it needs fixing, but that THE FIX IS ALLREADY ANNOUNCED.

so, 90% of these posts are completly redundant, and should be considered spamming.

[edit: Yes i said i wouldnt read the forums for 2 weeks. i lied.]

Mik Nostrebor
Minmatar
Ex Coelis
Posted - 2006.12.04 05:47:00 - [172]
 

Announced and in the patch notes the skill requirements for salvage have dropped from Mech 5 and Survey 5 to mech 3 and survey 3

Making the mini profession much more available and achievable.

In some ways I think it should be 4 and 4 just to put it a little way off for people. LOL

M

Sentar Manar
Amarr
NailorTech Industries
Posted - 2006.12.04 18:46:00 - [173]
 

Well I read the patch notes.ugh They are putting in an option to let us know where we have been but there is no looted/unlooted change.Evil or Very MadEvil or Very Mad The lower skill Reqs make it easier to be able to salvage however its still a long and unpleasent chore...


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