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Venkul Mul
Gallente
Posted - 2006.11.21 20:55:00 - [121]
 

Originally by: ShadeLiner

anoter option for corporate so after the large mission can come the hauler and the scavangers to clear the space..


Exactly why that should be good? I dubt the average player like to be the janitor for the big guns of a corporation. I could do that occasionally, but it seem it will be a profession. Some rechent (today) test has gotten: 31 wrecks tried from the mission "In the midst of deadspace", ship where Amar navy armaggeddon, Delta frigate II caldari and Amarr, Caldari Navy Raven, so no little newbie ships.
Salvaged item 0 (as in none, nada, ecc.).
A player in help chat has sayd that if you install more than one salvager and use them all on the same wreck you always get salvage.
If this is right and a good chance of salvage is so skill and module intensive, the one doing the salvage will be pratically struck in his role.
In the end the only ones doing it will be some mission runner with a prepared recovery ship after completing a mission near his home base and the corporations with some "mule" player doing the dirty work.

Even if EVE is Massive Multy Player it isn't always played in Massive Multiplayer Organizations. For a 8 person corporation with player dispersed in all the timezones it will be a Massive Logistic Problem.

Shar Tegral
Posted - 2006.11.21 21:24:00 - [122]
 

I'll be spending time in salvaging, though widely considered dubious, as I did with COSMOS. (Another widely considered dubious activity.) I don't care for all the hooplah about profitability and all that jazz. It's part of the game, it produces something, and I'm going to try it out and try it out to the fullest extent.

Currently I'm playing around on SISI low sec ratting in a scorp with 4 salvagers installed. Fair bit of success. Let me say that whoever realized the COSMOS spawns would be farmed is a clever chap. Getting mostly scrap metal from salvaging those wrecks was rather fitting reward for such little work.

After working for a bit I do see that there is a problem with, as someone pointed out, the number of actions required to salvage. One thing I would agree with is an icon change, or color change, from a "looted" wreck and a non-looted wreck. It would speed interested parties along on their way.

I would also sign off on the salvager being an auto-looter module. It makes far more sense to have the module auto-empty any cans into my cargo hold then to have to open each wreck, loot or no loot, and then empty and salvage scan. Another, secondary suggestion, would be to have a looted wreck not spawn a container window. This would also mean that any wreck that has the loot taken out the window would automatically close.

That would clear up a few things easy and quick in some regards. If the window opens there is loot, if it doesn't there isn't. Right now a player's screen can get a bunch of windows that you have to either close or keep letting stack up.

I also wish there was a daily bug list thread. Found a few things with today's build, non-salvage, related but rather hard to find a place to see if it has been reported already.

PS: To the people that can not find a salvager on the market. It takes no time to buy the bpo, at npc price, purchase the minerals at the seeded stations and to have your very own salvager I. CCP can't do everything for you.

Hockston Axe
Amarr
Posted - 2006.11.21 23:29:00 - [123]
 

Iíve been interested in the salvaging mini-profession since I first heard about it, have been following the reports on it and have some comments/questions. I like the concept of salvaging and wrecks, but from what Iíve gathered so far the implementation seems to be at such a rudimentary stage as to be of little real value as a mini-profession or enhancement to the Eve experience.

∑ Upon ship destruction, a wreck is spawned with a 100% drop rate, except for mission specific objectives, which still drop in loot cans. Loot is contained within the wreck, using variable drop rates.

Q: Why is the wreck drop rate 100%? Is this merely just to ensure there are ample rig components at the start? A variable drop rate for wrecks would be far more immersive, ships used to be vaporized in the explosion from time to time.
Q: Has it been added yet/will there be a quick and easy way to determine if a wreck contains loot from the overview/in space icons?

∑ Tractor beams now tow wrecks, and are unable to tow loot cans/jetcans.

Q: Why? That used to be their primary role, is it impossible to allow activation on two types of items?

∑ Wrecks behave like loot cans, vanishing after one to two hours.

Q: Is this simply for an easier introduction of this new feature, with plans for improvements?

∑ Optimally a dedicated ship/setup should be used for salvaging.

A mature state of a salvaging mini-profession/wrecks to me would look like:
∑ Variable drop rate on wrecks, really fancy would be drop rate variables: NPC<PC, T1<T2<Faction, Frig<BS<Cap, SigRad to SigRes on final blow Rad<Res=higher chance of destruction, Damage on final blow to remaining HP, active/passive damage controls/reps, and resists. Like I said, fancy stuff. Some of those variables could also be used to help determine the quality/type of rig components spawned.
∑ Variable lifespan on wrecks. Itís fine to have NPC frigs/cruisers vanish in an hour or two, but the larger the wreck, or the higher the quality, the longer it should live. All the way up to capital ship wrecks being permanently in space until salvaged. This would promote a true mini-profession, where one could search out or stumble upon unsalvaged player created wrecks, rather than just being the guy with the broom, cleaning up after your group or self.

Currently salvaging looks to be little more than an extra step to the looting of personal kills, while confounding the basic item looting in the process. There is no incentive to for example go to low sec and search for juicy unsalvaged wrecks, of which there will probably be plenty, because the wreck will be gone within hours of its creation (and those who created it will probably still be around).

What have I missed/gotten completely wrong, and is this only the first step in the implementation of salvaging/wrecks or is there nothing planned to enhance what could be a very cool and immersive new feature?

Shar Tegral
Posted - 2006.11.22 01:24:00 - [124]
 

Originally by: Hockston Axe
Q: Why is the wreck drop rate 100%? Is this merely just to ensure there are ample rig components at the start? A variable drop rate for wrecks would be far more immersive, ships used to be vaporized in the explosion from time to time.
Can't answer for the dev's myself but I'd say it was to provide ample wrecks for the many attempts. From the experience I'm having with it... I'd say that it is determined at the time of the wreck if something is contained within. The salvaging just goes through to see if you find or lose it.

Inferred guessing on my part. The rig blueprints require enough of these materials that it is going to be work to accomplish any rig. Maybe not as much as some fear but ... well I'm just glad there is such a wreck ratio.

--Additionally--

Also, during my last space flight we watched another ship, in our caravan, get struck by meteorites. It was utterly vaporized which investigators reported as being the first such an accident had ever been record in the preceding centuries of space flight.

This is of course recorded history over the past several centuries. What accidents may have happened in space flight prior to then, or >gasp< if they even had space flight!, we can only guess.

Realism 4tl.

DukeJoost1
The Last Solution Inc
Posted - 2006.11.22 13:19:00 - [125]
 

With todays version i can tractor both wrecks and cans.
It appears no more salvagable items come from wrecks,
but that might be related to the missions i did : Illegal Activity,
since i guess these faction standing killing missions could very well give no salvageable items.

As to the significantly increased time looting now takes, this is bad.
Stop ship, tractor wreck to ship, grab loot, switch off tractor, switch on salvager, get next can with tractor etc.
The salvager takes up to 5 tries to determine if there is something to salvage, so up to 50 seconds Shocked. Making salvaging chance based is ridiculous Exclamation Please make it same as looting.
All this delays looting significantly and with it the fun of doing missions.

We need a tractor salvager hi-slot device, which tractors the wreck, grabs the loot into the cargo hold, salvages any salvagable parts in ONE go and then pops the wreck.
Could the tractor beam tech2 be like that Question

And please display different icons for new and looted wrecks, for example remove the line above the traingle when the wreck has no loot.

Fly safe.

Mr Goods
Posted - 2006.11.22 13:22:00 - [126]
 

Its a pain to clear my overview and i spare too much time for check all wreck.

please make it:
no loot = no wreck
after loot = wreck desappear

Shar Tegral
Posted - 2006.11.22 14:48:00 - [127]
 

Originally by: DukeJoost1
We need a tractor salvager hi-slot device, which tractors the wreck, grabs the loot into the cargo hold, salvages any salvagable parts in ONE go and then pops the wreck. Could the tractor beam tech2 be like that Question

I think this is what is being avoided. If this came to pass salvaging would not be a mini-profession but just another thing that everyone does and not for the sake of salvaging. Just for the sake of making looting easier.

TBH I think the ideal situation would me to have the salvager go to work regardless of if the loot has been removed or not. The salvager would not move the loot into your hold at all. Just it would do what it does and then pop the wreck.

The option to loot or not loot pre salvaging can have a popup warning, with a disable switch, and be completely upto the Player.

Originally by: DukeJoost1
And please display different icons for new and looted wrecks, for example remove the line above the traingle when the wreck has no loot.
Now this I agree with however it may take alot of beers to get the dev's to consider this at this point. I think it's more a case of "pain in the butt" to change aspect as this close to release date. >shrugs<

Ariane VoxDei
Posted - 2006.11.22 15:09:00 - [128]
 

Edited by: Ariane VoxDei on 22/11/2006 15:18:03
please,

1) make the client autoclose the loot window of the wrecks, once you have removed all loot from them - since salvaging appears to keep failing until the window is closed.

2) make it possible to distinguish, both on the overview and the space view, between looted and unlooted wrecks.

or
3) put the loot in the old containers we were used to, until you find solutions to the 2 above.

-added by edit-

4) give us "shift-looting" like in wow. 1 hotkey=loot all to cargobay and close window.
5) in addition give us one that can also do the same, but automatically fires the first available salvaging module.

ty.

ripstop
Gallente
Posted - 2006.11.22 16:09:00 - [129]
 

All of us have been looting cans since time began, it was easy, shoot the ship, ship blows up, open the can and take the loot.

Salvaging is now a new skill to aquire with more gameplay involved. Ignoring the rigs aspect for now, it should be straightforward for most people to accomplish. Shoot the ship, ship blows up and leaves fancy ship graphic shell. Now you have a choice, Loot and leave or Loot, salvage and leave. Personally I like the latter as it allows harvesting of components needed for rigs and is an extra roleplay ability in game (wonders at whole new chat vocabulary in local now "yeah I was in the outer belts and managed to get this deep fat planck bubble stabliser circuit"...but I digress)

What happens if you loot and leave...easy..ship still has salvageable parts and could be salvaged by someone else. But how do you spot a salvageable ship or how do you know if your dead prey has components in it? Some have said colour code, some have said flag symbol. This needs to be worked on but any of these could do even no indication is an option. You would just have to try and salvage it to see if it gives up anything. In gang situations this gets a bit hairy as it takes an extra few seoonds to do this so components could get left behind. Scavenging wrecks is a whole new profession if the ship carcass remains persistant for a few hours. Imagine the scavengers following gangs and cleaning up their mess and salvaging ships. However if you want to take the components yourself go ahead.

I would advocate a deacy rate based on the presence of components in the carcass. If there are components then the decay is slower as residual electrical activity maintains some hull integrity and so the ship carcass stays around for the same amount of time as a can..lets say 2hrs. After that the components are gone and the ship carcass disappears. If the components are removed then the decay is much quicker as there is no electrical activity and no hull integrity...So at this stage the carcass could disintegrate instantly or last for a few minutes.

This behaviour is very similar to jetcans and means there is no real clutter after a finite period of time...until the next ship gets blown up.

Feyd Darkholme
Caldari
Posted - 2006.11.22 17:03:00 - [130]
 

Originally by: Hockston Axe

∑ Tractor beams now tow wrecks, and are unable to tow loot cans/jetcans.

Q: Why? That used to be their primary role, is it impossible to allow activation on two types of items?


Oh yuck, Tractor Beams don't tow loot cans at all? That would kind of defeat the purpose of Tractor Beams for everyone that's not a Salvager... I really don't want looting to go back to being even more tedious than it was before, what an unecessarily complicated time-sink. Rolling Eyes

Venkul Mul
Gallente
Posted - 2006.11.22 17:36:00 - [131]
 

Yesterday (21) the loot cans where targectable by tractor beam. So now it work both on can and wrecks.
The problem is that on about 40 wrecks of high end NPC shiip in a mission I found 0 salvagable parts.
Onestly I feel the skill needed for salvaging are too high. Even if it is a mini profession I think it should be accessible without too much hardships by a new player. Mechanic 5 and survey 5 are a high skill total for a "young" player.
Whit the same skill point he can pilote an assault frigate.

Hockston Axe
Amarr
Posted - 2006.11.23 03:00:00 - [132]
 

Originally by: Shar Tegral
Originally by: Hockston Axe
Q: Why is the wreck drop rate 100%? Is this merely just to ensure there are ample rig components at the start? A variable drop rate for wrecks would be far more immersive, ships used to be vaporized in the explosion from time to time.
Can't answer for the dev's myself but I'd say it was to provide ample wrecks for the many attempts. From the experience I'm having with it... I'd say that it is determined at the time of the wreck if something is contained within. The salvaging just goes through to see if you find or lose it.

Inferred guessing on my part. The rig blueprints require enough of these materials that it is going to be work to accomplish any rig. Maybe not as much as some fear but ... well I'm just glad there is such a wreck ratio.

--Additionally--

Also, during my last space flight we watched another ship, in our caravan, get struck by meteorites. It was utterly vaporized which investigators reported as being the first such an accident had ever been record in the preceding centuries of space flight.

This is of course recorded history over the past several centuries. What accidents may have happened in space flight prior to then, or >gasp< if they even had space flight!, we can only guess.

Realism 4tl.



I was just referring to ships that dropped no cans.

But randomly roaming natural disasters would be interesting, especially if you could chase down the meteoroids and mine them in a fast enough ship.Smile (Meteorites on the other hand don't generally move very quickly, or much.)

Matrix Aran
Reikoku
IT Alliance
Posted - 2006.11.23 03:44:00 - [133]
 

Edited by: Matrix Aran on 23/11/2006 03:44:16
I think the idea about mission NPC is that they have a fairly low rate of salvage, just as in missions the NPCs have relativly lower drop rates on everything, compared to belt NPCs. Anyone able to confirm this?

Shar Tegral
Posted - 2006.11.23 06:16:00 - [134]
 

Anyone else notice the change from mid slot to high slot for the Salvager?

Ishquar Teh'Sainte
Euphoria Released
Merciless.
Posted - 2006.11.23 10:04:00 - [135]
 

not sure if this is the right thread for this, but i got a few questions regarding wrecks and rigs.

Questiondo you need materials for t2 rigs that can only be obtained through wrecks of t2 player ships?

Questionwhat are the amounts of materials you need to create a t1 rig/t2 rig?

Questionhow much materials do you need that can't be obtained by NPCs?

Questionwhat are the salvage rates for those non-NPC materials if you salvage a player ship?

why i'm asking this? well ... in the worst case scenario is expect the rise of the cheaper t2 ships (like interceptors/AFs/logistics) to a level where only rigbuilder buy them.

Ariane VoxDei
Posted - 2006.11.23 14:27:00 - [136]
 

Originally by: Ishquar Teh'Sainte

Questionwhat are the amounts of materials you need to create a t1 rig/t2 rig?

Questionhow much materials do you need that can't be obtained by NPCs?
materials for T1 rigs can be viewed via the BPO's , whci happen to be on the market.
Most of the t1 rig materials are salvaged goods. It is highly likely that the only supply of those will be what players gather. The current sell orders of the needed trade goods on singularity are huge cheap ones put up by CCP to facilitate testing (you buy bpo & materials and produce your own).

Ishquar Teh'Sainte
Euphoria Released
Merciless.
Posted - 2006.11.23 15:08:00 - [137]
 

Originally by: Ariane VoxDei
Originally by: Ishquar Teh'Sainte

Questionwhat are the amounts of materials you need to create a t1 rig/t2 rig?

Questionhow much materials do you need that can't be obtained by NPCs?
materials for T1 rigs can be viewed via the BPO's , whci happen to be on the market.
Most of the t1 rig materials are salvaged goods. It is highly likely that the only supply of those will be what players gather. The current sell orders of the needed trade goods on singularity are huge cheap ones put up by CCP to facilitate testing (you buy bpo & materials and produce your own).



thx .. i know that you can look up the materials in the BPO .. problem is - where do you get them .. can you build a rig only by looting the materials from NPC wrecks? or do you need to salvage also player wrecks to build vanilla t1 rigs?

if you need for a t2 rigs materials that you can only obtain through t2 player wrecks i estimate a rise in the price of the cheaper t2 ships (interceptors/logistics) ...

want to build a t2 rig? (that likely can be sold for several hundred millions) buy some ares/craptors - "create" wrecks out of them .. salvage the needed materials - build your rig - profit. so more and more t2 ships will be used only for production of t2 rigs Neutral

BaJaiah
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2006.11.23 22:52:00 - [138]
 

Edited by: BaJaiah on 23/11/2006 23:02:12

I just tested salvaging on sisi, and I must say it works out pretty good imho.

There is the issue about wrecks not changing state (color in overview or similar) and not being able to rename them, which makes good old fashioned looting a pain. But I'm sure this will be taken care of.

Currently wrecks do disappear when salvaged, so if people clean up after themselves we'll have no more or less lag than before (I hope). They can also be shot down as easily as normal loot-cans.

Instead of complaining about you can't loot in you favorite tier 1 hauler anymore, try to adapt a bit. I present the poor mans scavenger:

Osprey
2 x tractor beams
2 x salvagers
10nm afterburner or MWD if you tend to end your missions before looting and don't go into deadspace.
3 x cargo expanders

[EDIT] Yes tractor beams works on wrecks as well - in case you wondered

This leaves you with 3 med slots and lots of power & CPU to put whatever you want in them.

This scavenger is going 350 m/s (850 m/s MWD) with about 850 m3 cargo hold which really should be able to loot the valuable remains after most encounters.

Of course this can be improved with named/T2 equipment and salvage rigs (when they arrive).

The sweet thing is that the Osprey for some reason have 3 rig slots and the usual 200 points to distribute, resulting in 2x Salvage Tackle rigs and 1 x Salvage Tackle tech 2 rig. This might be surpassed by the Basilisk because it has 2 more high slots than the Osprey, but it only has 2 rig slots...

I'm not sure why we are still plagued by non-named loot in the wrecks and would like to point to an old topic I made regarding this here (look at option 2).

Don't get me wrong - I like to new elements of burned out salvaged stuff, but why ohh why must we still go rummaging through standard loot that any sane pilot would never have fitted on his ship ?

Kervoran
Posted - 2006.11.24 00:20:00 - [139]
 

Just did a bit of testing on wrecks/salvaging. This is from a tier 1 mission that generated 35 wrecks, one of which i shot to see how much ammo/time would be used. I salvaged with a catalyst with 4 Salvager I's fitted, Salvage 3 skill as given automatically for testing, and no other modifiers I know about (no rigs for this for instance). This is still a viable combat ship for T1 missions as I also had 4 guns fitted etc.

Salvage method i used -

1) Target, approach to within 5000 meters and activate salvagers
2) If error "You fail to salvage from the Serpentis Small Wreck because your salvaging equipment cannot be engaged until all loot has been removed from it." approach to within 1500 meters and loot, trying to salvage another target while doing so where another is in range. Salvage first one after looting.



Points I want to make:

1) 35 wrecks in a 30 km radius, more or less, were just too many to keep track of if you just want to find loot and not salvage. It also really complicated targeting by the overview until i filtered them out. Anyone without salvaging skill & equipment fitted is going to have a really hard time - and it's going to be a long time till a new player gets this (see point 2). An option to treat them as cans - i.e. destroy on looting automatically, or some way to tell the ones with loot inside from the ones that don't, is definitely necessary IMO. I'd prefer a color difference to an icon difference. Shooting them up takes too long and too much ammo, not a winner. In my opinion this is a showstopper and MUST be addressed.

2) Prereqs - The prereqs for the skill are way too high in my opinion. WIth a new character I'd tend to concentrate on learning and base skills needed for combat and better ships. I already have 60+ trains planned for the character I'm going to start with Kali's release, all directed at learning and preparing for L2 missions. Mechanic 5 isn't in the list, and Survey 5 is even further. I'd suggest Mechanic 4 and Survey 3?

3) Mechanics - Working just fine IMO. Salvage 3 gives 15% bonus to chance of finding something and the Salvager I gives 5% bonus for a total 30% bonus. From 34 wrecks (I shot one) I got 12 components, 12/34 = 35.29% salvage rate. I concluded (admittedly working from too small of a sample here) either:

base chance is 15%, with bonuses 35% with my skills and equipment, and salvagers do not stack, or;
base chance is 0% plus 35% and multiple salvagers do stack.

Whether or not 4 salvager I's on one target up the odds - you will salvage in 1 cycle 80% of the time, 2 cycles 20% of the time. This seemed well balanced!

If the second option is the case and salvagers on one target stack, and I have 2 Salvage Tackle II rigs installed (15% bonus each), Salvage 5, and 8 Salvager I's equipped, the bonus would be 8*5% + 2*15% + 5*5% = 95% chance. Given this, I would think that variants of the base Salvager I, when introduced, would reduce fitting needs and give a small improvement on cycle time.

If salvagers don't stack, and frankly I think this would be a better option (multiple salvagers almost always getting the job done in 1 cycle is a great timesaver and probably enough of a bonus)then you have room to play with the bonus to chance to salvage to differentiate them.

In general I like the system - but I think dealing with large amounts of wrecks for months before you can even start salavaging is a non-starter. Personally I'd have no interest in being a specialized salvager, i.e. doing this as a mini-profession. Trading, mining, research and manufacturing and combat operations are enough variants for me. THis is not suited since we need to loot our kills and the current setup will make this very hard.

Mor Vince
Posted - 2006.11.24 04:21:00 - [140]
 

Edited by: Mor Vince on 25/11/2006 11:51:24
Kervoran here - I did some additional testing. Mission was Worlds Collide - I cleared out the initial worp in, the Serpentis Side, and the final area. I collected with a cat fitted with 8 Salvagers and 2 tech 1 salvage tackles (riggings). Total wrecks 50, successes 31. items colleceted 36. 5 times I got 2 items (or 3 times 2 and 1 time 3 - not sure my count got a little fuzzy by the end.)

If percentages on salvagers stack, my chances should have been 75%.*edit* 65% - only one rigging counts
success vs attempts was 62%. Perhaps only 1 rigging counts? *edit* - only one rigging counts, riggings do not stack.

Is approzimately 10% of the time 2 (or 3?) items dropped a bug or by design? I only got one salvage success message in log when it would happen.


Mor Vince
Posted - 2006.11.24 04:42:00 - [141]
 

You can tell if a wreck has loot from a distance with...drum roll please....

Cargo Scanners!

Yep, cargo scanners do indeed show you what is in that wreck, if anything.

This does not resolve the issue. Adding a target, scan step will NOT reduce the aggravation and you would have just as much trouble keeping track of which wrecks you've scanned as which you have opened. It might save some time in travel but only at the addition of up to 150 more operations per 50 cans (target, scan, untarget if empty, target next etc.)

How about dropping a can next to the wreck for loot?

On another note, if I loot someone else's can I'm a thief and they (and thier corp) get temp. kill rights. Does this hold true for wrecks? Does salvaging a wreck give the temp kill rights?


Bermag
Point-Zero
R0ADKILL
Posted - 2006.11.24 09:10:00 - [142]
 

Is the items you salvage depending on race, ship type or all random? For example would killing Gurista rats always drop the same x types of rig components (just like which loot they drop)?

Keitaro Baka
Babylon Scientific and Industrial Enterprises
Babylon Project
Posted - 2006.11.24 09:55:00 - [143]
 

I have tested a few wrecks before, but I haven't checked wrecks from ships with rigs installed.. has anyone tried this already? arguably there should be a lot more salvage in them...

also, on a side-not, anyone recycled a ship with rigs installed yet?

Shar Tegral
Posted - 2006.11.24 14:30:00 - [144]
 

Originally by: Mor Vince
On another note, if I loot someone else's can I'm a thief and they (and thier corp) get temp. kill rights. Does this hold true for wrecks? Does salvaging a wreck give the temp kill rights?

Salvaging the wreck does not criminal flag you. However you must remember that emptying said wreck will. And most times I've tested salvaging on left behind wrecks the pilot left the loot as well.

For myself I was of the mind of trying to push the idea of non-looting activation of salvager. The requirment to have to empty the can, all the time, makes salvaging somewhat cumbersome in my opinion. I'd be happy to see that salvaging destroys the wreck, and any contained loot, when it is completed regardless of what was in the wreck.

I think it would lead to people being selective in the looting process, why have to carry all the loot if you don't want, as well as encourage salvaging over all. Currently I think there will be a wave of people trying it out (like they did when COSMOS first came out), getting frustrated with it, and declaring it a waste of time.

Of course I'm still leary of this idea as; Salvaging does not criminal flag a person so someone can go around griefing by destroying someone else's wrecks before they can loot it or salvage it.

Eve, the game played according to the lowest of ethics.

Arbenowskee
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2006.11.25 22:33:00 - [145]
 

why do i have to empty the wreck before i can salvage it?

why just not get a warning that items still inside will be destroyed if i proceed with salvage?

Shar Tegral
Posted - 2006.11.25 23:01:00 - [146]
 

Originally by: Arbenowskee
why do i have to empty the wreck before i can salvage it? why just not get a warning that items still inside will be destroyed if i proceed with salvage?

Why are questions never answered.

It just is.

Saria Mysdrial
Amarr
ORE-TECH
CERBERUS INDUSTRIAL ALLIANCE
Posted - 2006.11.26 18:52:00 - [147]
 

Originally by: Arbenowskee
why do i have to empty the wreck before i can salvage it?

why just not get a warning that items still inside will be destroyed if i proceed with salvage?


To prevent griefing. Since salvaging doesn't do flagging the way can looting does. If you could salvage w/o emptying the wreck first, you could salvage someone elses wrecks (and destroy their loot) w/o their permission and they couldn't blow you up for it.

Crystalyne
The Arrow Project
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2006.11.27 22:12:00 - [148]
 

OK .. tried this as well .. frankly not that big of a deal. This is similar to Hacking or Archeology in COSMOS missions. At least here you can blow up the rig after looting/salvaging so it won't clutter the interface. Frankly, when I rat .. I mark BS and named rat cans and blow up the rest to get them out of the way. In missions .. I loot everything anyway - cuz I use the mins to build ammo and ships. An extra 10 minutes in cleanup per mission level if I want the salvageable components is not going to be big.

As for rig component rarity... not a big deal ... ever try to build a COSMOS BPC? These take rare components too and they should be rare to have. Rigs should NOT be for everyday ship attachments. These are premium items that should require work.

As for Skills needed. Noobs don't need to worry. There is a new profession template that will give them everything you need to run the salvager (or at least get you very close) .. yes the other topic of starting SP. So this should not be an issue for Noobs. Bigger issue for veterans that didn't train survey up .. but that's no biggie it's only a 5 day cycle.

Just my thoughts

Havok Pierce
Gallente
Aperture Harmonics
K162
Posted - 2006.11.29 05:28:00 - [149]
 

Originally by: Skarraza
Originally by: Sphynx Stormlord
It would be great if they could also cut down on the number of clicks. A shortcut for "drag everything to my cargo" would be awesome.

CTRL+A (select everything in the window) helps somewhat.

Rivur'Tam
Posted - 2006.11.29 05:51:00 - [150]
 

Looting now is just a tedious chore.

1) There is no way to tell from the overview what's been previously looted without wasting the ammo to destroy the wreck.
2) You're forced to loot/jet just to be able to salvage.
3) Wrecks cloud the overview, even when you'd rather not bother.
4) When looting, you now have an extra click to close the loot window.

For the love of all things holy, add a 'loot all/close window' button to the lootable portion of the wreck. Make the lootable wrecks (not looted, not salvaged) a seperate option on the overview from salvagable wrecks (looted, not salvaged). Large missions are just so tedious now, it's hardly playable.


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