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Nalshiga Dshoayo
Posted - 2006.11.26 16:16:00 - [1111]
 

Originally by: Aki Yamato
You always must choose between ofence and defence..



that tells me you missed the point or you simply dont get the problem discussed here.
point is: you CANNOT choose between offense and defense, because strong offense is simply not an option on the NH. it is NOT possible.
it IS however possible on other command ships which have similar tanking abilities. (keep the 710 powergrid of the NH in mind)

Aki Yamato
Posted - 2006.11.26 16:48:00 - [1112]
 

Originally by: Nalshiga Dshoayo
Originally by: Aki Yamato
You always must choose between ofence and defence..

Drake is now very strong ship, but not overpowered, not overnerfed.
Adventage of NH above Drake is greater CPU witch allows fit launcher rigs easily (witch is bit difficult on drake).

BTW I agree with 7th turret on Hurry


I have no problems fitting the drake with 7 tech II launchers. and that 30 more cpu dont make up for the 140(!) more powergrid and 1 more rig slot.

You saw a New NH ? You are compering ald and broken ship (with 90% firepower of cerberus). So lets wait for new NH and then we can compare ....

Atar
Perpetua Umbra
Brotherhood Of Steel
Posted - 2006.11.26 16:50:00 - [1113]
 

Originally by: Leandro Salazar
I can't believe they really have the gall to give the Drake back its 7th launcher and NOT the hurricane its 7th turret. Thats like holding up a big sign saying 'We offically hate Minmatar'.
What's next, Drake gets back its RoF bonus and Hurricane gets back its 50 PG to balance that? Evil or Very Mad


To True! I just cannot understand how we are saying give a 7th turret back and TAKE AWAY all launchers how that will ever unbalance the hurricane is beyond me, we are asking to take away damage, becasue now we can have 6 turrets and 2 launchers. The idea here isn't more damage it's one weapon type, I have 9mil in gunnery I don't want to or should need to train up missiles too, carry around 2 types of ammo (4 damage type for missiles) For god sake give us a one weapon ship. This isn't whining this is common sense!

Leandro Salazar
Quam Singulari
Posted - 2006.11.26 21:23:00 - [1114]
 

Heck if there is a hidden rule with CCP that Minmatar ships must never be great, take away all missile slots and the 8th high on top of it. But please give us the 7th turret.

Kagura Nikon
Minmatar
Emptiness.
Posted - 2006.11.27 09:05:00 - [1115]
 

I think we must accept CCP does not want to any minmatar ship to be able to win 1v1 against any other ship of same class.


So give us at least a way to use our ships! Don't want to give us our weapons? So give us 15 more ms on speed. Than we ccan run away from the much more powerfull BC from other races....

Akiman
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2006.11.27 12:38:00 - [1116]
 

Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Heck if there is a hidden rule with CCP that Minmatar ships must never be great, take away all missile slots and the 8th high on top of it. But please give us the 7th turret.


yeah why not u give the 7th missile slot to drake anyway...why not?...WHY NOT?!?

Ysolde Xen
The Causality
Electus Matari
Posted - 2006.11.27 13:27:00 - [1117]
 

Well I'm guessing it's all in code freeze now bar a last couple of small bugfixes. A shame that the Hurricane lost it's original artillery-capable concept to become an armour-tanking variant of the Cyclone.

WTB Artillery ship that isn't a Tempest.

Draycar Hazaran
Uninvited Guests
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2006.11.27 13:40:00 - [1118]
 

Erm....you can always fit a Thrasher with 280s and grief shuttles all day Mad

Nalshiga Dshoayo
Posted - 2006.11.27 14:45:00 - [1119]
 

Edited by: Nalshiga Dshoayo on 27/11/2006 14:49:00
Originally by: Aki Yamato
Originally by: Nalshiga Dshoayo
Originally by: Aki Yamato
You always must choose between ofence and defence..

Drake is now very strong ship, but not overpowered, not overnerfed.
Adventage of NH above Drake is greater CPU witch allows fit launcher rigs easily (witch is bit difficult on drake).

BTW I agree with 7th turret on Hurry


I have no problems fitting the drake with 7 tech II launchers. and that 30 more cpu dont make up for the 140(!) more powergrid and 1 more rig slot.

You saw a New NH ? You are compering ald and broken ship (with 90% firepower of cerberus). So lets wait for new NH and then we can compare ....


YES OF COURSE I AM TALKING ABOUT THE "NEW" one. which is SAME as old one with a RoF bonus. puts it 8% above drake in damage output.
I am not a person like you obviously are, who talks about stuff he/she does not have a clue about.
you just have to log on to singularity to fly one. (if you have the skills - which you dont have, otherwise you would know what a piece of crap that expensive slug really is.)

Azuse
Veto.
Veto Corp
Posted - 2006.11.27 15:33:00 - [1120]
 

Edited by: Azuse on 27/11/2006 15:35:51

The public deployment of kail with the current build tomorrow really makes you question the decision given the balancing issues.

The bc are either overpowered or underpowered, k the drake doesnt do nighthawk dammge (but its lost its real ablilitys vs. frigs) and the myrn is chronically underpowered, its easy to see why you dont want a bc to carry 5 heavys, itll be the same as the ishtar with more tank (but it doesnt matter that the brutix has been out dammaging and out tanking the demios for a year, a decent dronebay is unthinkable in a ship dependant on drones. Had anyone been playing close attention to the test server they would have notticed most of the dead myrns died after loosing their drones and had similar dammage to most vexors).

Same with the bs, the rokh is a superb sniper at 250/300km, youll also find it fantastic at 12km with blasters and full tank. Compair this with the hyperion, again its a decent sniper, better than the thron if you fit right (oh the irony) it losses 25m drone space (so only 4 heavys vs. thorns 5) it also gain an extra turret, which we all love because it also has the throns grid and fitting 7 turret on that is almost impossible without an rcu i.e compramising tank so to compensate you take away 2 lows making it harder to fit, genius. So its got a rep bonus, great so we fit 2 reps and have 4 slots to tank, plus our rcus, and the iceing on the cake of course is that 8 guns leaves no room for nos (and a blaster, no matter how deluded the piolt is, wont run on boosters alone if its using hardeners and theres not much options with those lows). p.s. the thorns still outdammages it, and with these rigs plus 2 additional lows it also out tanks it now.

So in summary weve got now ships tha dont know what therye ment to be, cost 50 mil more (80 if the insurace is accurate) and do less dammage across all the races, exept caldari which are now the ranged race with the best blasters.

GRIM REAPERjib
Posted - 2006.11.27 19:09:00 - [1121]
 

OMFG its harbinger NOT harbringer, that being said. the myrm is crap. im an experienced drone user and just to make it clear, u need more drone space. drones arent that good you all, + it needs time to get to its target and are pretty vulnerable too.

Kaden Seer
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2006.11.27 19:29:00 - [1122]
 

I vote for Hurricane's 7th turret, otherwise it's unfair to Minnie.

haq aan
Minmatar
Hauling hogs
Posted - 2006.11.27 21:13:00 - [1123]
 

Originally by: Kaden Seer
I vote for Hurricane's 7th turret, otherwise it's unfair to Minnie.


We minnies get used to be suck.

Lets see what was the last changes :
+25 m3 drone bay , +1 turret to Myrmidon (less than 1 week left for revelations)
+1 launcher to Drake (1 day left for revelations)

I dnt be suprised if i see 8th launcher on Drake , or 250 m3 drone bay + hybrid dmg bonus on Myrmidon while just 5 mins left for deployment.Exclamation

2SecondsTilMidnight
Posted - 2006.11.27 22:31:00 - [1124]
 

Edited by: 2SecondsTilMidnight on 27/11/2006 22:35:23
Edited by: 2SecondsTilMidnight on 27/11/2006 22:32:26
Do you guys have like 0 missle skills or something? With -1 turret from before, you can fill that in with a missle launcher. Dps wont be as high but it wouldn't be terribly low as if you had 6 turrets 0 launchers.

Edit: I am for a 7th turret though, I just don't think it is as crappy as most people make it out to be.

Edit #2: And incase some of you argue that the drake could've used a turret in place of the lost launcher, good luck fitting a medium sized turret with drake's pg.

Leandro Salazar
Quam Singulari
Posted - 2006.11.28 01:55:00 - [1125]
 

Well one problem is that even IF we like the Hurricane as is, we cannot afford to admit that. When the original Hurricane was well received, Tux went like 'Oh lookie the minnies like the Hurricane, it must be overpowered' and it got nerfed. Now I will always rather whine even about a ship that I like rather than saying it is fine. And I am probably not the only one. The original Hurricane was NOT overpowered, it was simply good. Didn't see more than normal complaints about the Hurricane from other race users either, which kinda proves the point. As opposed to the Drake which really was overpowered and got a lot of flak from all non-Caldaris and even some Caldaris for that.

CenturinSG
Posted - 2006.11.28 17:11:00 - [1126]
 

Originally by: Leandro Salazar
Well one problem is that even IF we like the Hurricane as is, we cannot afford to admit that. When the original Hurricane was well received, Tux went like 'Oh lookie the minnies like the Hurricane, it must be overpowered' and it got nerfed. Now I will always rather whine even about a ship that I like rather than saying it is fine. And I am probably not the only one. The original Hurricane was NOT overpowered, it was simply good. Didn't see more than normal complaints about the Hurricane from other race users either, which kinda proves the point. As opposed to the Drake which really was overpowered and got a lot of flak from all non-Caldaris and even some Caldaris for that.


And then they wonder why everyone whines. Rolling Eyes

Kagura Nikon
Minmatar
Emptiness.
Posted - 2006.11.29 10:14:00 - [1127]
 

Well i would like to congratulate the winners of this competition. The gallente once more proved to bethe best whiners and turned the tables to have the best BC while shoting in all directions to be able to nerf others for no reason. The Ammar with a reasonable level of forum warrior skills used for long on THE UBER AMAR WHINE THREAD.. got a reasonable ship too.

Caldarai alsmot were got by suprise, but at last moment were able to save a bit of their BC.

And once more minmatar proved to be the worst whiners of eve. Comoe on, matars need to try harder! Well maybe next year? I hope we can at least avoid that when we geta Tech 2 Battleship we get a typhoon with extra bonuses to target painter and capacitor usage on lasers.


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