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El'hith
Gallente
The Phoenix Enclave
Posted - 2006.10.26 13:14:00 - [31]
 

Originally by: Mysterlee
Edited by: Mysterlee on 26/10/2006 11:02:27
Edited by: Mysterlee on 26/10/2006 10:54:53
The reason I think the Hyperion, Abaddon and Maelstrom have turned out so bad is because CCP is trying to give them roles that are already filled.

I personally think the hyperion should become a sensor dampening bs. 8-7-4 slot layout with 5 turret hardpoints and 4 missile hardpoints, 5% large hybrid damage and 5% sensor damp effectiveness per level, it should have a limited grid but plenty cpu.

The maelstrom should become a fast and agile armour tanking autocannon ship. 8-5-6 slot layout with 8 turret hardpoints, 5% large projectile damage and 7.5% armour rep amount per level. The Tempest should also be switched to an 8-6-5 slot layout to make it a shield tanking artillery ship.

The abaddon should become a big arbitrator but not so good that it outclasses the dominix. 8-6-5 slot layout with 5 turret hardpoints and 5 missile hardpoints, 10% laser cap reduction (or 10% drone damage) and 5% tracking disruptor effectiveness per level with a 200m3 drone bay.

The Rokh could also do with losing a turret hardpoint, as it is its damage output comes to close to the Megathron when using rails yet it has 50% more range allowing it to use higher damage ammo than the Megathron thus outdamaging it at equal range.



/Signed (in blood)

Philip Sterling
Fat J
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2006.10.26 13:32:00 - [32]
 

I realise that fleet battles are only one aspect of pvp and eve, but that's where i think most of people's issues lie with the new battleships. Personally, i think the tier 3 ships are pretty well ballanced except for a few relatively minor things.
A. Abbadon needs increased capacitor capacity.
B. The hyperion needs slightly more power grid.
As far as fleet setups go, we may not see many changes. The abbadon is only a hair better than the geddon. basically, it will maybe stand a chance of warping out if it's called primary. Minmitar pilots will probably still fly tempests, but if they switch to the maelstrom, it won't be much of an upgrade. Gallente pilots will still fly the megathron for the long range fleets. The ship that's really going to change things is the Rokh. Currently, most long range BS fleets do not include pilots that can't fit T2 guns. they simply wouldn't have the range. Any BS you kill in one of these battles will cost a good deal to replace. With the rokh, we now have a tech 1, fully insurable ship that anyone will be able to train for in days, that will be able to join long range fleet battles with a fully tech 1 setup and still play at the 150-180k range. Every new player will be told to train caldari ships. they can fit out a torp raven after only a few weeks of playing the game and have an easy time ratting and making isk in 0.0. then they can take an extra 4-5 days to train gunnery 5 and have a ship that's arguably the best ship in the game for long range fleet battles. I'm even considering fitting out a rokh with T1 guns myself so that when i'm called primary I won't lose a penny. War in eve is all about who can maintain their expenses, and the rokh is going to make it very easy.

Swamp Ziro
Ultimate Betrayal.
Vera Cruz Alliance
Posted - 2006.10.26 13:42:00 - [33]
 

Maelstrom Bonus Idea :

*Numbers are obviously exagerrated for better understanding*

Bonus 1 : 50% PENALTY to ROF per level. (Yes, PENALTY, as in, longer time between shots)

Bonus 2 : xx% Bonus to weapon damage. (appropriate for dps to remain constant despite the rof penalty)



End result:

-DPS remains CONSTANT throught the BS skill levels
-ROF is gradually getting slower and slower up to 250% slower.


So, at 500 dps, and possibly around 40 secs between shots (exagerrated example) we would be looking at a 20k alpha strike.


So, what do you think? Ofcourse, numbers are exagerrated.


(Btw this is the fourth time i'm saying that numbers are exagerrated, so help me god if you come here and say "Omg 50%!?!?! LOLO"

Iyanah
Minmatar
Tuikoax
Posted - 2006.10.26 13:48:00 - [34]
 

Originally by: Mysterlee
Edited by: Mysterlee on 26/10/2006 11:02:27
Edited by: Mysterlee on 26/10/2006 10:54:53
The reason I think the Hyperion, Abaddon and Maelstrom have turned out so bad is because CCP is trying to give them roles that are already filled.

I personally think the hyperion should become a sensor dampening bs. 8-7-4 slot layout with 5 turret hardpoints and 4 missile hardpoints, 5% large hybrid damage and 5% sensor damp effectiveness per level, it should have a limited grid but plenty cpu.

The maelstrom should become a fast and agile armour tanking autocannon ship. 8-5-6 slot layout with 8 turret hardpoints, 5% large projectile damage and 7.5% armour rep amount per level. The Tempest should also be switched to an 8-6-5 slot layout to make it a shield tanking artillery ship.

The abaddon should become a big arbitrator but not so good that it outclasses the dominix. 8-6-5 slot layout with 5 turret hardpoints and 5 missile hardpoints, 10% laser cap reduction (or 10% drone damage) and 5% tracking disruptor effectiveness per level with a 200m3 drone bay.

The Rokh could also do with losing a turret hardpoint, as it is its damage output comes to close to the Megathron when using rails yet it has 50% more range allowing it to use higher damage ammo than the Megathron thus outdamaging it at equal range.


I've not had the chance to test yet, but i have read alot of the comments on the forums, and from what i've seen, I tend to agree with this post, the new ships don't seem to have a specific purpose, or role to fill, whereas the older ships, and the new battlecruisers seem to slot in nicely with their bretheren.

but then, this is what testing is all about - finding bugs, but also finding potential issues and viewing the wider effects of new content on the gaming environment.

The Armin
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2006.10.26 13:51:00 - [35]
 

Abaddon is useless, it tries to do what the Apoc does or the Geddon does but it suck and fail miserably at both. Give it a role, or make it either uber gank/tank. 5% dmg and 10% cap reduction guns would do the trick I think, but that woulda made the geddon useless. Better off giving it a role, yeah. Drone and Tracking Disruptor bonuses, one more mid, one less highslot. 7/5/7 ftw. MWD/Scram/Web and 2 Tracking Disruptors ? :P

Helmut 314
Amarr
Unladen Swallow Research Institute
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:00:00 - [36]
 

Why not use the Maelstrom as a platform focused on 1200mm arties instead ? Make the ROF bonus 10%, cut the grid a bit since were talking about a shield tanker here and leave just enough to fit 8 1200:s. and a semi-decent tank.




Drake Mezcal
Quam Singulari
Session Changes
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:02:00 - [37]
 

To be honest, and i dont know if any1 else agrees, but i totally disagree with putting a shield boost bonus on the Minmatar tier 3.

If u want it to tank, give it a armor bonus, or even no defence bonus at all.


Freakdevil
Aliastra
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:06:00 - [38]
 

I used a Hyperion against a Megathron last night.

It did ok but not great but thats partially my fault for a crappy setup and not killing his heavys first when I had him jammed (2hrs sleep 4TL). Ship is decent and drone bay isnt a factor, but I am confused why we have another Blaster boat or maybe Mega was never suppose to be one?

Once Singularity is more stable I will test it extensively as Blaster boats are my fav BS.

Tip: Seems you cannot blow up the ship without risking being stuck (cannot eject or warp)

Guurzak
Minmatar
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:06:00 - [39]
 

There's extensive discussion of possible replacements for the Maelstrom's boost bonus in this thread. One proposal that received widespread (but not unanimous) support would be to change the bonus to +10% shield hitpoints per level.

The core of the issue is that boosting:

-requires a mid slot
-requires time


In fleet battles, you cannot afford either. Fleet ships need sensor boosters and tracking comps to do their job; they should not have to use a valuable slot to access their ship bonus. (Especially so since a resist-bonus ship gets its bonus "free" with no special equipment required.)

As far as the time factor goes: your hitpoint buffer is what keeps you alive in fleets, not your boost rate. Your ship is either in warp or in wreckage before you boost more than 2-3 cycles, and in those 2-3 cycles the boost bonus is not providing a meaningful benefit in terms of total hitpoints gained. Boost bonuses only help when you are taking extended moderate-dps damage where you are boosting over a fairly long duration, which is not what happens in fleet standoffs.

So, if the role for the ship is still intended to be a toughened fleet sniper, the bonus absolutely must be changed to something appropriate for that role: either shield resists, shield hits, or some other form of passive survivability buffer.

On the other hand, the bonuses for the ship are excellently designed for a closerange autocannon boat, so if you're committed to the shield boost bonus, reduce the ship's mass and let it go head to head with the Hyperion.

Melamori
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:23:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: Swamp Ziro
Maelstrom Bonus Idea :

*Numbers are obviously exagerrated for better understanding*

Bonus 1 : 50% PENALTY to ROF per level. (Yes, PENALTY, as in, longer time between shots)

Bonus 2 : xx% Bonus to weapon damage. (appropriate for dps to remain constant despite the rof penalty)



End result:

-DPS remains CONSTANT throught the BS skill levels
-ROF is gradually getting slower and slower up to 250% slower.


So, at 500 dps, and possibly around 40 secs between shots (exagerrated example) we would be looking at a 20k alpha strike.


So, what do you think? Ofcourse, numbers are exagerrated.


(Btw this is the fourth time i'm saying that numbers are exagerrated, so help me god if you come here and say "Omg 50%!?!?! LOLO"


mwahahaha got ur idea Twisted Evil fat destroyer =)
actually this should be extra ship class BS sized ship or near 700 sig semi-capital, which have -500% ROF abd +500% damage, like a single shoot gun or walking gun. it lock, shoot once and warp out =) i belive a lot of folovers will be of such ship class, but ganking on gates will be hard...
well it need penalty to not be used by pirates in empire ( maybe can shoot only on war opponents?
LaughingLaughingLaughing

Grinkur
Doomheim
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:26:00 - [41]
 

Edited by: Grinkur on 26/10/2006 14:27:31
Originally by: Mysterlee
Edited by: Mysterlee on 26/10/2006 11:02:27
Edited by: Mysterlee on 26/10/2006 10:54:53
The reason I think the Hyperion, Abaddon and Maelstrom have turned out so bad is because CCP is trying to give them roles that are already filled.

I personally think the hyperion should become a sensor dampening bs. 8-7-4 slot layout with 5 turret hardpoints and 4 missile hardpoints, 5% large hybrid damage and 5% sensor damp effectiveness per level, it should have a limited grid but plenty cpu.

The maelstrom should become a fast and agile armour tanking autocannon ship. 8-5-6 slot layout with 8 turret hardpoints, 5% large projectile damage and 7.5% armour rep amount per level. The Tempest should also be switched to an 8-6-5 slot layout to make it a shield tanking artillery ship.

The abaddon should become a big arbitrator but not so good that it outclasses the dominix. 8-6-5 slot layout with 5 turret hardpoints and 5 missile hardpoints, 10% laser cap reduction (or 10% drone damage) and 5% tracking disruptor effectiveness per level with a 200m3 drone bay.

The Rokh could also do with losing a turret hardpoint, as it is its damage output comes to close to the Megathron when using rails yet it has 50% more range allowing it to use higher damage ammo than the Megathron thus outdamaging it at equal range.


An Abaddon with those stats would be overpowered. Imagine a dominix with one mor mid for more EW and missile hardpoints.

Grinkur
Doomheim
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:30:00 - [42]
 

The hyperion right now is a decent blasterboat. It does less dmg than the Mega but tanks a lot better. It is more vulnerable to NOS (due to the lack of an extra high slot) but has a spare mid.

In general if you compare net dmg (Damage you do to your oponent in excess of its repair capacity vs Damage you take) it is at pair with the Mega.

However due to its limited power grid and very very tight cpu it has very little room for alternative setups. Even 5 or 10 more CPU would help a lot.


Also, if you unnerf the targeting range it could be a good sniper. The Megathron would still be an excellent all out combat battleship, plus it is cheaper, so i don't think that unnerfing the targeting range in the hyperion would hurt the Mega.

Right now it has only one or 2 usefull setups (electron blasters or ion blasters) wereas most other battleships can fit long range or short range guns.

ElweSingollo
The Higher Standard
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:33:00 - [43]
 

Originally by: Hansoloo
has anyone tested the new amarr BS sniping range, becouse I was getting ready to (befor the server went down)..

I was fitted for short range, with the the 100km targeting range, with the guns I was using (with out a sniping setup), I was hitting at 100km just fine for 200 damge per gun fitted with radios.

I would love to see someone with real sniping skills get a hold of her and really test her out.


161k optimal with a snipe setup on the Abbadon full rack of Tach 2's Aurora Ammo... gleam optimal of something stupid like 25k (oh thats not with max support skills but I have the 5% bonus to optimal at lvl 5).

Swamp Ziro
Ultimate Betrayal.
Vera Cruz Alliance
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:34:00 - [44]
 

Originally by: Melamori
Originally by: Swamp Ziro
Maelstrom Bonus Idea :

*Numbers are obviously exagerrated for better understanding*

Bonus 1 : 50% PENALTY to ROF per level. (Yes, PENALTY, as in, longer time between shots)

Bonus 2 : xx% Bonus to weapon damage. (appropriate for dps to remain constant despite the rof penalty)



End result:

-DPS remains CONSTANT throught the BS skill levels
-ROF is gradually getting slower and slower up to 250% slower.


So, at 500 dps, and possibly around 40 secs between shots (exagerrated example) we would be looking at a 20k alpha strike.


So, what do you think? Ofcourse, numbers are exagerrated.


(Btw this is the fourth time i'm saying that numbers are exagerrated, so help me god if you come here and say "Omg 50%!?!?! LOLO"


mwahahaha got ur idea Twisted Evil fat destroyer =)
actually this should be extra ship class BS sized ship or near 700 sig semi-capital, which have -500% ROF abd +500% damage, like a single shoot gun or walking gun. it lock, shoot once and warp out =) i belive a lot of folovers will be of such ship class, but ganking on gates will be hard...
well it need penalty to not be used by pirates in empire ( maybe can shoot only on war opponents?
LaughingLaughingLaughing


Yes, something like that, minus the destroyer vulnerabilities =)

Rezerwowy Pies
Caldari
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:38:00 - [45]
 

Originally by: Ishina Fel
The Megathron also has more powergrid, which is quite important when trying to fit a full complement of large railguns (15500 base for 7 rails versus 15000 base for 8 rails).

sure, but you should remember that for example Heavy Armor Rep T2 for Megathron needs 2300 powergrid, but XL Shield Booster for Rokh need ONLY 550 pg.

Originally by: Ishina Fel
A Megathron can also field 5 heavy drones (2 for the Rokh) to support it if the encounter is under 50km.

Rokh have 10200\8400 shield\armor, Megathron have 4969\5313 shield\armor. Any other brilliant ideas??

FawKa
Gallente
x13
Raiden.
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:39:00 - [46]
 

Well...

Hype needs 5% blaster dmg instead of normal 5% hybrid
Rokh needs 10% railgun range instead of generel hybrid bonus
- both because of role and because the Rokh will be a better blaster ship than the real blastership as it is now.

Hype needs more dronebay, more speed and I bet more agility. Looks a bit screwd powergrid wise to, tbh and I would rather have a lowslot instead of the last med slot. In fact, it looks a bit like a gigantic deimos with the same issues. Cant fit much, no real dronebay and a need for speed.
From my vision the Hype isnt a blastership before the Rokh get a real role based bonus to rails. Wont happen? :)

-


Amarr tier 3 needs an cap bonus as they cant have much running more than 1 min.

Minmatar seems psycho. But its okay, I dont think its broken - the other ones are.

Grinkur
Doomheim
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:40:00 - [47]
 

Originally by: Rezerwowy Pies
Originally by: Ishina Fel
The Megathron also has more powergrid, which is quite important when trying to fit a full complement of large railguns (15500 base for 7 rails versus 15000 base for 8 rails).

sure, but you should remember that for example Heavy Armor Rep T2 for Megathron needs 2300 powergrid, but XL Shield Booster for Rokh need ONLY 550 pg.

Originally by: Ishina Fel
A Megathron can also field 5 heavy drones (2 for the Rokh) to support it if the encounter is under 50km.

Rokh have 10200\8400 shield\armor, Megathron have 4969\5313 shield\armor. Any other brilliant ideas??


XL Shield Booster 2 > 2 x Large Armor reparier 2, so it is 550MW vs more than 4600.

Grinkur
Doomheim
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:40:00 - [48]
 

Edited by: Grinkur on 26/10/2006 14:41:21
Originally by: Rezerwowy Pies
Originally by: Ishina Fel
The Megathron also has more powergrid, which is quite important when trying to fit a full complement of large railguns (15500 base for 7 rails versus 15000 base for 8 rails).

sure, but you should remember that for example Heavy Armor Rep T2 for Megathron needs 2300 powergrid, but XL Shield Booster for Rokh need ONLY 550 pg.

Originally by: Ishina Fel
A Megathron can also field 5 heavy drones (2 for the Rokh) to support it if the encounter is under 50km.

Rokh have 10200\8400 shield\armor, Megathron have 4969\5313 shield\armor. Any other brilliant ideas??




XL Shield Booster 2 + SBA > 2 x Large Armor reparier 2, so it is 551MW vs more than 4600.

Dreamdancer
Minmatar
Blancmange Interstellar Kilts
Archaean Cooperative
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:41:00 - [49]
 

Personally I think the new battleships should have filled positions not already taken.

The Caldari one did just that. The other 3? Well to be honest they are a waste of pixels.

Varing opinions on what each race needs, but certainly not another laser ship for the Amarr, a projectile gunboat for the Minmatar or a blaster ship for the Gallente.

The Raven is generally consider one of the best mission running ships in the game. As it can be setup to tank well and just switch out the missiles being used to match the damage type needed for the mission.

Every race has ships that use missiles but not to the extent the Raven does. Why force Min, Gall or Amarr to train in Caldari? Give them each a boat setup to match or counter the Raven. Follows the storyline easy enough. "Seeing the effectiveness of the Raven other races were quick to develop their own versions"

My .02 ISK

Dixon
Caldari
Hells Donkeys
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:46:00 - [50]
 

I never like these giant arbitrator ideas. 200m3 dronebay? Those heavys would be popped instantly and then you're left with some mediums and lights, the dominix needs it's dronebay to prevent people from targeting its drones - the arbibaddon would need that too.

But if the ship is to be changed (and it looks like it is) I'd like to see it get a 10% nos bonus like the Bhaalgorn and a classic 10% cap reduction on lasers - if you want a EW boat then you must realize that tracking disruptors aren't really hot on a bs vs bs scale but a nosferatu is always a pain in the ass.

BTW: change the apocs crap cap bonus to a resist or an optimal one.

Ithildin
Gallente
The Corporation
Cruel Intentions
Posted - 2006.10.26 14:52:00 - [51]
 

Originally by: Mysterlee
Edited by: Mysterlee on 26/10/2006 11:02:27
Edited by: Mysterlee on 26/10/2006 10:54:53
The reason I think the Hyperion, Abaddon and Maelstrom have turned out so bad is because CCP is trying to give them roles that are already filled.

I personally think the hyperion should become a sensor dampening bs. 8-7-4 slot layout with 5 turret hardpoints and 4 missile hardpoints, 5% large hybrid damage and 5% sensor damp effectiveness per level, it should have a limited grid but plenty cpu.

The maelstrom should become a fast and agile armour tanking autocannon ship. 8-5-6 slot layout with 8 turret hardpoints, 5% large projectile damage and 7.5% armour rep amount per level. The Tempest should also be switched to an 8-6-5 slot layout to make it a shield tanking artillery ship.

The abaddon should become a big arbitrator but not so good that it outclasses the dominix. 8-6-5 slot layout with 5 turret hardpoints and 5 missile hardpoints, 10% laser cap reduction (or 10% drone damage) and 5% tracking disruptor effectiveness per level with a 200m3 drone bay.

The Rokh could also do with losing a turret hardpoint, as it is its damage output comes to close to the Megathron when using rails yet it has 50% more range allowing it to use higher damage ammo than the Megathron thus outdamaging it at equal range.

Yes, indeed! Agreed very heartily on Abaddon, Maelstrom and Hyperion!

Although the Abaddon could actually perform well with -10% cap use and 8 turret hardpoints, so there's no real need to limit it's tirretyness. And the Hyperion'd not need a (more) limited grid (than currently) if you reduce it's hardpoints thus.

I'd love to be primary in that Hyperion

As for the Rokh, I really think it's a bit early to say whether it needs it's hardpoints cut. It does 8 hybrid turret damage versus the Megathron's 8.75. It's 5% shield resistance bonus is what truely makes it good, however. For this it pays with worse agility and powergrid.
Problem is we'll need some fleet battles to properly evaluate the Rokh, and SiSi just don't allow for those.

MECTO
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2006.10.26 15:12:00 - [52]
 

make minm tier3 - ac boat

give gall tier3 more grid

rokh w/o changes - its good

abaddon - needs some real rethinking.. its not even in alpha stage Neutral

Almarez
Setenta Corp
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2006.10.26 15:16:00 - [53]
 

I agree with the Abaddon not being a very useful ship, albeit very cool looking. I think the ship would be very good if the rof bonus were changed to a damage bonus. The reason I say this is because it would give you the ability to cause the damage of a Armageddon with the tank ability of an Apoc. So I see it as a more viable 1v1 pvper with these changes. As it stands now I think it will be like the Armageddon with possibly slightly better tanking abilities...maybe. Why not give it a NOS range bonus like the Curse...that along with ROF or damage bonus (preferably damage) would make it an awesome ship.

MECTO
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2006.10.26 15:22:00 - [54]
 

Originally by: Almarez
Why not give it a NOS range bonus like the Curse...that along with ROF or damage bonus (preferably damage) would make it an awesome ship.

heavy nosf with boni = this are EXXTREEEMEEEE

ehm, i mean - NO Smile

maybe just give a abaddon 5% Dmg to Proj. weapons?

and subsc like: Amarr Maked Ultimate Close Range Tanking Uber Ship to destroy minmatar heretics one and for all times? YARRRR!!

Kaeten
Hybrid Syndicate
Posted - 2006.10.26 15:22:00 - [55]
 

Originally by: Jim McGregor

The problems as a autocannon platform

* Its a bit too slow. I feel the dps is pretty good, but only up close. One medium slot will automaticly be used with MWD, but the large mass and low base speed will make it difficult to reach the target to do its job.

The problems as a mission runner

* Not better than the Raven, but this is pretty much the case for every other ship out there. So except the fairly low artillery dps, it will be OK at missions. Here the rof bonus is more useful than a DMG bonus, and also the shield boost bonus is pretty good.


Take a look at the mega thats been here for 3 years and, exact same problems anyone?

Ithildin
Gallente
The Corporation
Cruel Intentions
Posted - 2006.10.26 15:30:00 - [56]
 

2 pointers:

1. Don't balance ships around a concept that is scheduled for a fix/nerf (i.e. don't balance ships around nosferatus)
2. The Maelstrom is almost 12 kilotons heavier than the Megathron or Tempest.

Jason Thorn
Posted - 2006.10.26 15:30:00 - [57]
 

In my opinion the main problem about tier 3 amarr bs it's not the amarr bs by itself, but the insane cap usage of every kind of laser without any SIGNIFICANT advantage.

To say it in a better way: once the bonus of cap usage was indirectly a bonus to damage as laser did more damage than other weapons but drain more cap. Train amarr skills and you'll have a damage bonus with good cap consuption. (seems an indirect version of gallente bonus)
Then tux nerfed frequency cristals to make the pulse laser make nearly the same damage of other weapons without considering every aspect of the thing.

Before i get flames: yes, i know i don't have ammo usage, good tracking and so on, but i'm not talking about comparing it with other guns, i'm just looking at pure numbers and while they show some minor advantages (but even minor disavantages like only em end therm damage) they do not show any major advantage to balance the major drawback of great cap usage

Fix them and you'll get a damn fine abaddon too.

/me run and gets a flamesuit.

Roloco
Posted - 2006.10.26 15:32:00 - [58]
 

I agree with most of the people on here about the Abbadon, I mean the Amarr already have multiple heavy armored multi turreted battleships, ones good at slugging it out (Armageddon) and the other is a more tactical armor tank (Apocalypse), so with these two being so close already what’s one more in between? Just another boring waste.... the amarr are in desperate need of some diversity. Amarr have been known to "copy" other races ships and try to emulate them as good as they can, kinda like the Arbitrator. Personally I think it would best if it was a drone ship, though not as good as the Domi (say at least about 250m3 drone space?) but with a bit more fire power with its 8 turrets, (and no it doesn’t need to be able to fit 8 tachys b/c that would just be another arma or apoc) armor, and tanking ability, like a level 3 amarr battleship should have and I think that should diversify it more. Just think of how the Amarr would have built it if they tried to copy a Dom the amarrian way in a lvl3 Bship (just like they did with the arbitrator) of course slot load out would have to be tinkered with... Idea

The Armin
Shiva
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2006.10.26 15:36:00 - [59]
 

Originally by: Mysterlee

Edited by: Mysterlee on 26/10/2006 10:54:53
The reason I think the Hyperion, Abaddon and Maelstrom have turned out so bad is because CCP is trying to give them roles that are already filled.

...........

The abaddon should become a big arbitrator but not so good that it outclasses the dominix. 8-6-5 slot layout with 5 turret hardpoints and 5 missile hardpoints, 10% laser cap reduction (or 10% drone damage) and 5% tracking disruptor effectiveness per level with a 200m3 drone bay.




Originally by: Grinkur

An Abaddon with those stats would be overpowered. Imagine a dominix with one mor mid for more EW and missile hardpoints.


I kinda agree, why on earth some people wants to put missile hardpoints on Amarr T1 ships surprises me Confused 200m3 dronebay is perhaps a bit excessive, cause we shouldn't be better in drones than Gallente. 175m3 should be plenty, I'll even be satisfied with 150m3. Since our Arbi already has the 10% dmg hp tracking I don't mind giving the new BS that bonus. The secound bonus, should be ewar. Our ewar is Tracking Disruptors, so 10% to optimal, falloff, and efficienty should do.

The Abaddon today is 8/4/7

I would suggest either a 7/5/7 slot layout or 8/5/6. Eventually, if we should really get some love(Very unlikely), we would get a 6/6/7 or 7/6/6 layout. I do however not see it happen but 5 mids would satisfy me :P (I think we _do_ need 5 mids for this to be a drone/e-w ship)

Ithildin
Gallente
The Corporation
Cruel Intentions
Posted - 2006.10.26 15:51:00 - [60]
 

As long as the Abaddon doesn't get a drone damage bonus, it can have as much drone bay as it pleases - it's not going to threaten the Dominix' position as top drone using battleship.


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