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Hunters Agency
Firmus Ixion
Posted - 2003.10.24 13:37:00 - [1]

Edited by: Harpoon on 24/10/2003 13:39:33
I am playing Eve since 5 months. And since this time, there is one discussion, which dominates every forum I know. It’s the discussion about “In which extend piracy should be possible in this game?”

On one hand you have the peacefull trader/miner/producer, who don’t want to loose his ship in 30 seconds, or even before his screen has loaded. Ofcourse, this part of the population stands against most aspects of piracy. In the eyes of some of them, the grievance starts as soon as someone is shooting at another player.

On the other side, you have the players who decided to choose a career as a pirate. If you ask them, there is nearly no chance to do live as a pirate. They have to decide between being killed by Sentrys/CONCORD in many parts of the universe, or to move deep into 0.0 space where there is nearly no traffic.

If you ask me, both types of players are needed. Without one of them, Eve would be boring as hell, or it would change into a FPS.
Therefore, I want to suggest a new “aggression system”. This system is far from being perfect. Maybe it is also full of flaws I havent thought of. But as I know the mentality on this forum quite well, I am sure you will be more than happy to point out every aspect I might have forgotten.

What do I have in mind? Well, in a nutshell, my suggestion says:

Make it less of a crime to SHOOT at a ship, but make it more dangerous to DESTROY a ship!

Please imagine an aggression-system where you DON’T get a security hit for using ECM gear on a player in a 0.7 or lower system.

Please think of an aggression-system where you DON’T get a security hit for shooting at a player in a 0.7 or lower system. CONCORD might appear after some minutes, but maybe they wont.

On the other hand…

You will get a MASSIVE security hit for DESTROYING a ship.

You will be HUNTED by CONCORD forces if you destroy a ship. Of course this would not be an “Insta-Kill-Fleet”. It will be a force strong enough, to leave the pirate no other choice than to warp away/leave the system. Even in neighboring systems, he will not be able to stay out of trouble. If he wants to be secure, he has to leave the entire region. After a few days he may be able to return.

What do I expect from this?

1. More interaction between pirates and their prey. I am sure, a player doing a precisely timed cargo-run or an agent mission WILL pay a few million ISK to be able to carry on with their business. Otherwise, he has no other chance than to stay scrambled and webbed, or be forced to log out for some time.

2. This bastard don’t want to pay? Well, strip off his valuable (and very expensive!) armor. If he has no repairer equipped, this will lead to a huge bill for repairs. He may think of giving half of this money to the pirates to avoid damage.

3. The prey starts to talk smack in local? He better not do this. Because he cant be sure if the pirate decides to take the risk and finally blows up his ship.

4. Less Grievers. Killing every ship in sight will lead to your destruction. A pirate has actually think twice before pulling the trigger. Will shooting off his armor make him pay? Is the cargo worth the risk to even destroy the vessel? Will I escape CONCORD after that? Where could I run and hide, until I am safe to enter this region again?

5. No more camping a system 23/7 for weeks. Pirates have to stay mobile, continually changing their camping spot.

I would appreciate it, if ALL of you (Pirates/Traders/Miners, etc.) could give me your opinion about this.

darth solo
Celestial Apocalypse
Posted - 2003.10.24 13:47:00 - [2]

Edited by: darth solo on 24/10/2003 13:52:04
I dont think you are bringing up anything that hasnt been discussed before my friend, many times.

I really do think people should read the back of the box before accepting the agreement, to see if EVE is trully for them.

Correct me if im wrong, but doesnt it say something like this.

" Dauntless fleet commander, or the most nefarious pirate ever to terrorize the galaxy- be and do anything you'd never dare imagine"

"conspire with thousands of others to bring the galaxy to its knees, or go it alone and share the glory with no one"

I dont agree in lagging jumpin points, but its in the game and we now have to learn to adapt. If you cant maybe EVE isnt for you?Cool.

Get my point?.

Easy Target
Brutor Tribe.
Posted - 2003.10.24 14:33:00 - [3]

EVE is a player driven ecconomy...

people make money for making the ships that people then try their best not too lose...

end of the day... a battleship... lets say 60 mill for arguements sake... mining that would take... say 30 hours... u arent gonna want to lose 30 hours of work in minutes... or i wouldnt anyways....

therefore, pirating will take off if...
a) Concord die a horrible death
b) Ship prices drop...
c) sentry guns get removed or seriously nerfed
d) insurance gets improved...

why the above wont happen...
a) i agree n00bs need to be kept safe... so we have to have some sort of security force...
b) it is player driven... it has to tally with mineral prices + profit... if NPC sellers undercut the ship building profession dies... not good from any side of the arguement.. if we remove the high mineral prices/demand for the ships miners sell less....
c) removed... No... people need to be able to travel round in reasonable safety for trading, etc etc. Nerfed... u will get people camping the gates in battleships with all types of shield hardner on camping all gates as they can hold off the sentries... so this wont work for the good of all concerned...
d) improve insurance.... yes... i dont see why not... 2 mill for a rupture.... fair price for 3 weeks... how about that price when/if u die u get back the ship when u dock... AND all equipment on the ship... only prob this causes is ship builders suffer... so why not make it the insurance money if claimed goes to the ship builder... regular income for them...

to me that would make more people stay and fight even if it wasnt a dead cert they were gonna win... lets face it... u pay for insurance anyways... if u die... u dock... u get the ship back and all the equip on it...

at the end of the day with ships as hard to get ((for the average corp/player) i`m not talking about the mega corps who can bang out battleships like i can bang out frigates) it will not be so PvP is regular...

all in my opinion...


Posted - 2003.10.24 15:38:00 - [4]

I think harpoon's idea might just be the best solution i've seen in a while.

Could use a little tweaking or better explanation here and there, but essentially this would make the game so much more interesting.

Posted - 2003.10.25 00:15:00 - [5]

Yeh we need a gradiated security system. Currently theres is 0.0 and 1.0, nothing in between really and thats not right.
I had an idea a while back that it would be good to make concord "patrol" systems.

Basically the police werent always there to act if a fight happens; In a 0.1 the police would only be there 1 in evey 10 minutes. in 0.8 it would be 8 out of 10 minutes. The police would also show up as beeing in the system so that any pirate activities or PvP would have to be carefully timed or face the wrath of concorde. Would make for more intresting ambush planning.

Posted - 2003.10.25 02:17:00 - [6]

for all intents and purposes sec level 1.0-0.5 wrt security is 1.0 swifty merciless justice. All the sec level of a system indicates is what ore you will find there.

Hugely ****ed up IMO and the devs seem unwilling to change it Confused

Symeonis Porphory
Philosophi Lapis
Posted - 2003.10.25 18:50:00 - [7]

I had an idea a while back that it would be good to make concord "patrol" systems.

Basically the police werent always there to act if a fight happens; In a 0.1 the police would only be there 1 in evey 10 minutes. in 0.8 it would be 8 out of 10 minutes.

I've been thinking about something like this as well, but a bit more random. (So you cannot 'count out' whether CONCORD will appear any time soon). Also, the patrols would react to crimes.

I think this would make a better representation of security levels, and force pirates to be a bit more tactical (for example, letting go small prey to avoid early detection)

Chai N'Dorr
Selectus Pravus Lupus
Posted - 2003.10.26 11:23:00 - [8]

Don't mind losing a ship... it's part of the game. But what I do mind is losing my ship before I even know what the heck is going on.

I want to be able to at least fire a shot back, or fire my AB's before I am dead. If I get killed making this decision, fair enough.

(a run in with Stavros comes into mind where I AB'ed the hell outta there to the gate while he was pounding away on my Vigil... speed won that time, adrenaline racing, heck of a minute!).

What CCP needs to figure out is what is causing all this lag and how to make things so that it is not such a (winning) factor in this game.

I'd love to fight pirates, but I want to fight (or be killed by them) them on an equal non-laggy basis.

Till CCP makes this happen, I'll (try to) stay outta fights unless it's against Eve System.

Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2003.10.27 02:13:00 - [9]

1. Fix the lag
2. Improve the insurance system
3. Fix the lag
Then we can talk about other improvements


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