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blankseplocked FYI: Lilith Veco nee Lilith Thy'nin Disrespects 1v1
 
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Kernel Sander
Epiphyte Mining and Exploration
Combined Planetary Union
Posted - 2006.09.12 20:34:00 - [31]
 

Originally by: Damien Smith
From what we've heard the fight was dishonoured on both sides. Kernal undocked to see what Lilith was flying, then docked and fitted with the exact counter to that ship. Lilith then warped in his alt because he was taking on a nos raven that was slowly killing him with a single cruise missile that he had no way of repairing.

I think both sides have something to answer for.


You asked me for logs, did you ask him for them? Did you ask him for logs from both the primary and alt? I assume he's not stupid enough to submit a false story without scrubbing his logs first, but I'm willing to bet he didn't think to scrub the gang stuff out. If that's in there, you'll see who I ganged, and hopefully even a warp message. I think that will go a looooong way towards disproving his assertion that I got a good long look at his ship and then refit myself.

Kernel Sander
Epiphyte Mining and Exploration
Combined Planetary Union
Posted - 2006.09.12 20:47:00 - [32]
 

I don't suppose a friendly GM could be bothered to check the logs for Pakkonen V Spacelane Patrol Testing Facility for the roughly two hours prior to my ships' destruction (2006.09.08 06:57 game time according to the killmail) and see if I redocked ever? It'd be fun to have some kind of official word on it. Are the game gods watching?

s33ker
COBRA INC
Dark Syndicate.
Posted - 2006.09.12 20:51:00 - [33]
 

LMAO at all you fools, your all tied up in honor and whats right, you ever stop to think that its just a game?? nobody broke/exploited game mechanics and untill they are broke stop crying over a game and get over it...

Tobias Sjodin
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2006.09.12 20:58:00 - [34]
 

Originally by: s33ker
LMAO at all you fools, your all tied up in honor and whats right, you ever stop to think that its just a game?? nobody broke/exploited game mechanics and untill they are broke stop crying over a game and get over it...


If a corps rep is at stake, I think it's best to resolve it the best way possible, don't you?

Rawr Cristina
Caldari
Naqam
Posted - 2006.09.12 20:59:00 - [35]
 

my ship was ransomed by turby. i paid them and they let me go and i even got a nice chat out of them. IMO they're good ppl who keep their word, like most decent pirate corps

tbh u just sound bitter about ur loss and want vengeance

s33ker
COBRA INC
Dark Syndicate.
Posted - 2006.09.12 20:59:00 - [36]
 

perfect example, all tied up in reputation, seriously man its just a game..

Kernel Sander
Epiphyte Mining and Exploration
Combined Planetary Union
Posted - 2006.09.12 22:48:00 - [37]
 

Originally by: Damien Smith
From what we've heard the fight was dishonoured on both sides. Kernal undocked to see what Lilith was flying, then docked and fitted with the exact counter to that ship. Lilith then warped in his alt because he was taking on a nos raven that was slowly killing him with a single cruise missile that he had no way of repairing.

I think both sides have something to answer for.


I WIN! WOOOHOOO VICTORY FOR ME! ETCETERA!

You just lost your argument.

You say I had a Raven setup with 7x NOS and 1x launcher? First of all, i dont know that I could fit that... but that's totally irrelevent, and not the part where I win.

You wanna know where I win? Look at the killmail. Specifically, look at how many NOS's were lost with my ship. Now look at how many launchers were lost with my ship.

If I only had one launcher mounted, how come 5 are reported blown up in the killmail?

Anyone feel like apologizing for accusing me of lying?

mallina
Caldari
SUNDERING
Zenith Affinity
Posted - 2006.09.13 00:01:00 - [38]
 

Originally by: Kernel Sander

I WIN! WOOOHOOO VICTORY FOR ME! ETCETERA!



*gives Kernel a cookie*
grats

Originally by: Kernel Sander

Anyone feel like apologizing for accusing me of lying?



many of us dont like the fact you seem to think the actions of one of our members reflects that of the entire corp. FYI this is the first time anything like this has happened with Turby, so its quite disconcerting to see a topic basically stating that all of TURBY will screw you over in a 1v1/ransom whenever they can, because that's certainly not the case.

Kernel Sander
Epiphyte Mining and Exploration
Combined Planetary Union
Posted - 2006.09.13 00:24:00 - [39]
 

Edited by: Kernel Sander on 13/09/2006 00:27:35
Originally by: mallina
*gives Kernel a cookie*
grats

many of us dont like the fact you seem to think the actions of one of our members reflects that of the entire corp. FYI this is the first time anything like this has happened with Turby, so its quite disconcerting to see a topic basically stating that all of TURBY will screw you over in a 1v1/ransom whenever they can, because that's certainly not the case.


You're right, you know.

My original assessment was that under the circumstances, it made more sense to assume the worst - I certainly didn't trust any of you after that little escapade.

However, in my subsequent dealings, both with your CEO and the guy who became my contact (Damien), I certainly have been given enough pause to rethink the logic of that kind of blanket statement. The, for want of a better term "verdict," seems remarkably halfassed, but I cannot argue that their chagrin over the affair is honest. So I find myself kind of wondering what to do about it.

My inclination is to gas the thread and hope this is, as many of you maintain, anomalous. If it's not, then I worry that someone else who can ill afford to lose their BB might get lured into a 1v1 that their opponent has no intention of fighting fairly. Dunno. I kind of wish you guys had turned out to just not care about the insinuation Sad

That not being the case, I'm still trying to figure out what the right move is.

Pestillence
Revelations Inc.
Shroud Of Darkness
Posted - 2006.09.13 01:12:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: s33ker
LMAO at all you fools, your all tied up in honor and whats right, you ever stop to think that its just a game?? nobody broke/exploited game mechanics and untill they are broke stop crying over a game and get over it...


So breaking your word is alright?

On the net, and in EvE, trust is hard earned and easily lost.

Words like yours can tar your whole corp with a bad reputation, something which Damien is doing an admirable job of protecting.



Samirol
Love is Hate
Posted - 2006.09.13 01:53:00 - [41]
 

Originally by: Pestillence
Originally by: s33ker
LMAO at all you fools, your all tied up in honor and whats right, you ever stop to think that its just a game?? nobody broke/exploited game mechanics and untill they are broke stop crying over a game and get over it...


So breaking your word is alright?

On the net, and in EvE, trust is hard earned and easily lost.

Words like yours can tar your whole corp with a bad reputation, something which Damien is doing an admirable job of protecting.



i think this is one of those "my quotes don't represent my corp" comments

dailyhazard
Caldari
Team Cool
Posted - 2006.09.13 07:43:00 - [42]
 

Originally by: s33ker
perfect example, all tied up in reputation, seriously man its just a game..

What you fail to see is, that reputation is the game, without reputation you have nothing, being feared is not only something to feel good inside about. But also something that gains you things such as contracts.
Now, whether he refitted or not, that is what happens when someone is based in the station you are camping. A 1v1 was accepted, if he was bothered about this, then he should have just refused the 1v1.

Kaira Awe
Posted - 2006.09.13 13:06:00 - [43]
 

Wow, TURBY keep digging huh?


Captain Hudson
Caldari
Federal Defence Union
Posted - 2006.09.13 14:08:00 - [44]
 

I Like Turby. they provide good fun now and again Very Happy

Belhorn Battlebeard
Minmatar
PPN United
Ev0ke
Posted - 2006.09.13 14:36:00 - [45]
 

Edited by: Belhorn Battlebeard on 14/09/2006 18:54:10
LoL @ the alt (2 posts up) stickin his oar in where it's not wanted.

It seems there is something a little untoward with this whole topic, therefore my suggestion is that we all "agree to disagree" - TURBY may be pirates, but we still care about our corp's reputation. WHATEVER happened here, which I suspect will never be clear, was a one-off and will not be happening again.

jimmyjam
Gallente
Sinner Among Saints
Exquisite Malevolence
Posted - 2006.09.13 14:44:00 - [46]
 

So What If Someone Can Control accounts at Once Does
That Result In A Break Of A 1v1. I Myslef Avoid This by Not
Doing 1v1.Or Ransoms for That Matter.Twisted Evil

Idaeus
Posted - 2006.09.13 15:31:00 - [47]
 

I too like TURBY. I shot them and they shot me, though I can't recall any ship losses (other than that of former corp mates). Always had a pleasent chat afterwords.

It was the surprising openness with them (and other pirates) that made me throw off the shackles of running security for my former corporation (a dreadfully dull task) and earn my fortune in the blood of others.

dralid
Aliastra
Posted - 2006.09.13 15:49:00 - [48]
 

Originally by: Belhorn Battlebeard
Wow, Kaira! An alt trying to rock the boat, ROFL!
Leave this discussion to the grown-ups hey ;-)

It seems there is something a little untoward with this whole topic, therefore my suggestion is that we all "agree to disagree" - TURBY may be pirates, but we still care about our corp's reputation. WHATEVER happened here, which I suspect will never be clear, was a one-off and will not be happening again.


But we cannot trust TURBY again after this can we? (Trust as in keeping their word)

Murukan
Minmatar
Posted - 2006.09.13 15:52:00 - [49]
 

Tbh this thread doesn't look to well on turby. You guys first start off by saying how you're totally going to get to the bottom of this and how your word is everything. Then you end the thread saying "lol don't pvp if you can't stand losing a raven sux 2 be u."

DarkElf
Veto.
Veto Corp
Posted - 2006.09.13 16:21:00 - [50]
 

Originally by: Murukan
Tbh this thread doesn't look to well on turby. You guys first start off by saying how you're totally going to get to the bottom of this and how your word is everything. Then you end the thread saying "lol don't pvp if you can't stand losing a raven sux 2 be u."



Unfortunately i have to agree here. It seems that respectable corps like Turby always say that if any member dishonours a 1v1 they will be dealt with seriously. it seems here that that has happened and after an attempt to explain it was proven incorrect you seem to be trying to breeze over it now.
My faith in Turby has been shaken lightly by the lack of action or response in light of the new words from the victim but i still believe this is not the kind of thing every member would be guilty of.

DE

Gariuys
Evil Strangers Inc.
Posted - 2006.09.13 16:48:00 - [51]
 

Originally by: Belhorn Battlebeard
Wow, Kaira! An alt trying to rock the boat, ROFL!
Leave this discussion to the grown-ups hey ;-)

It seems there is something a little untoward with this whole topic, therefore my suggestion is that we all "agree to disagree" - TURBY may be pirates, but we still care about our corp's reputation. WHATEVER happened here, which I suspect will never be clear, was a one-off and will not be happening again.


Hey that would be fine... if not for the whole... TURBY doesn't dishonor 1on1s, we keep our word thing you had going on the first page. There's good reason to doubt that statement, and saying now "let's agree to disagree" doesn't really cut it to be honest. Not that I give a damn. But I'm telling you that if you care about your rep, this isn't a good course of action, or rather inaction.

ian666
Minmatar
Virtual Democracy
C0VEN
Posted - 2006.09.13 16:52:00 - [52]
 

On a serious note, if everything said about another person\corp on the forums is taken seriously then whats been said over the years about corps are cheating, using logging tricks, taking peoples ships unfair is all true and everything posted is proven facts.

People in the heat of the moment use slander to try and make a point with Kernel Sander not giving me or Tribs any fourm of evidence or posting it in his original post e.g logs? then we can only accept what our corp mate has said as being right, as any other CEO's would do trust his fellow mates until otherwise proven.

Name calling with out any evidence is just slander lets be honest I don't feel this will cause anyone any problems trusting Turby as our reputation for trust has always been impeccable and we expected from time to time when you do upset people e.g taking there ships that there retaliation as part of the deal some people take it well some others don’t.

As stated before that if this was a problem then Kernel Sander should have come direct to my self or Tribs before getting everyone’s backs up pointing fingers and really should have shown some evidence without any all it these accusations are nothing more then an attempt to bad mouth Turby.



Gariuys
Evil Strangers Inc.
Posted - 2006.09.13 17:02:00 - [53]
 

Originally by: ian666
On a serious note, if everything said about another person\corp on the forums is taken seriously then whats been said over the years about corps are cheating, using logging tricks, taking peoples ships unfair is all true and everything posted is proven facts.

People in the heat of the moment use slander to try and make a point with Kernel Sander not giving me or Tribs any fourm of evidence or posting it in his original post e.g logs? then we can only accept what our corp mate has said as being right, as any other CEO's would do trust his fellow mates until otherwise proven.

Name calling with out any evidence is just slander lets be honest I don't feel this will cause anyone any problems trusting Turby as our reputation for trust has always been impeccable and we expected from time to time when you do upset people e.g taking there ships that there retaliation as part of the deal some people take it well some others don’t.

As stated before that if this was a problem then Kernel Sander should have come direct to my self or Tribs before getting everyone’s backs up pointing fingers and really should have shown some evidence without any all it these accusations are nothing more then an attempt to bad mouth Turby.





Problem is, that he most certainly doesn't sound like a bitter whiner that wants to vent/slander after losing in a fair fight to me.

And I completely understand trusting your corpmate to tell the truth and honour a 1on1 cause that's corp policy, would do the same. But 2 of your corpmates made having faith in that a little hard with their rude and unproductive replies.

A simple post saying you asked your corpmate and he swears that he didn't dishonor the 1on1 anymore then the otherside ( which was stupid to begin with, if he checked your ship/setup and then fitted accordingly he should have blown off the 1on1, cause of gaining a unfair advantage ) would have been a lot better, even if going ahead with it anyway and then bringing in backup is plain and simple dishonoring a 1on1 and really logs aren't required to prove that.

Damien Smith
The Insane Tormentors
Posted - 2006.09.13 17:05:00 - [54]
 

Well this has turned into a bit of a cluster**** hasn't it?

I originally got involved in this thread purely to pass the info on about what'd happened, seeing as I'm probably the only self-confessed forum ***** out of the corp. It's now escalated to involve pretty much all of us. Needless to say that we now all look like a bunch of muppets and probably deservedly so. TribalBleb while probably not being as vocal as he could have been in this thread, has made it quite clear to everyone in the corp that crap like this won't be tolerated from any of us, so don't be thinking he's not done anything about it.

Regardless of why the 1v1 was broken, the fact remains that it was, so I'm going to reimburse him for his loss and hope that he, and everyone else won't assume that this incident is anything other than a one off.

Thanks to all those who stuck up for us, and I hope that those people still think enough of us to do the same again, if the need arises.

Gariuys
Evil Strangers Inc.
Posted - 2006.09.13 17:27:00 - [55]
 

Originally by: Damien Smith
Well this has turned into a bit of a cluster**** hasn't it?

I originally got involved in this thread purely to pass the info on about what'd happened, seeing as I'm probably the only self-confessed forum ***** out of the corp. It's now escalated to involve pretty much all of us. Needless to say that we now all look like a bunch of muppets and probably deservedly so. TribalBleb while probably not being as vocal as he could have been in this thread, has made it quite clear to everyone in the corp that crap like this won't be tolerated from any of us, so don't be thinking he's not done anything about it.

Regardless of why the 1v1 was broken, the fact remains that it was, so I'm going to reimburse him for his loss and hope that he, and everyone else won't assume that this incident is anything other than a one off.

Thanks to all those who stuck up for us, and I hope that those people still think enough of us to do the same again, if the need arises.


End of story, well solved, and I'm sure the op will be happy about the reimbursement, but just a post like this does it for me.

DarkElf
Veto.
Veto Corp
Posted - 2006.09.13 18:26:00 - [56]
 

Originally by: Damien Smith
Well this has turned into a bit of a cluster**** hasn't it?

I originally got involved in this thread purely to pass the info on about what'd happened, seeing as I'm probably the only self-confessed forum ***** out of the corp. It's now escalated to involve pretty much all of us. Needless to say that we now all look like a bunch of muppets and probably deservedly so. TribalBleb while probably not being as vocal as he could have been in this thread, has made it quite clear to everyone in the corp that crap like this won't be tolerated from any of us, so don't be thinking he's not done anything about it.

Regardless of why the 1v1 was broken, the fact remains that it was, so I'm going to reimburse him for his loss and hope that he, and everyone else won't assume that this incident is anything other than a one off.

Thanks to all those who stuck up for us, and I hope that those people still think enough of us to do the same again, if the need arises.


Well i don;t know about anyone else but that was the kind of post i was waiting for, what i'd expect from a corp as good as Turbulent. Not just the re-imbursement but the sentiment. Nice work damien.

DE


Kernel Sander
Epiphyte Mining and Exploration
Combined Planetary Union
Posted - 2006.09.13 19:04:00 - [57]
 

Edited by: Kernel Sander on 13/09/2006 19:15:23
Originally by: ian666
People in the heat of the moment use slander to try and make a point with Kernel Sander not giving me or Tribs any fourm of evidence or posting it in his original post e.g logs? then we can only accept what our corp mate has said as being right, as any other CEO's would do trust his fellow mates until otherwise proven.


Ian: I have been in daily contact with either Damien or your CEO. I have submitted local chat logs for a span of 3 days, private message logs for the day of the fight, my PvP setup (which was *NOT* some lame-ass uberNOS setup as lilith claims), my combat logs from the fight and everything else asked for. I even offered to send my chracter XML file because I am pretty certain my character couldn't fit the number of NOS I am accused of having. When confronted by more reasonable people than you, I have even adjusted the title of this thread to more accurately reflect events, even though I personally believe your entire corp bears some culpability in this matter.

If you have not seen any of this information, then it is because your CEO has not deemed fit to show it to you. That is an internal problem, not mine, and you should take it up with them, not me.

Originally by: ian666
Name calling with out any evidence is just slander lets be honest I don't feel this will cause anyone any problems trusting Turby as our reputation for trust has always been impeccable and we expected from time to time when you do upset people e.g taking there ships that there retaliation as part of the deal some people take it well some others don’t.


I love the irony in this paragraph.

Originally by: ian666
As stated before that if this was a problem then Kernel Sander should have come direct to my self or Tribs before getting everyone’s backs up pointing fingers and really should have shown some evidence without any all it these accusations are nothing more then an attempt to bad mouth Turby.


No I shouldn't have come to you. I had never heard of you. I had never heard of TURBY before. My first contact with TURBY was a dishonored 1v1, and if you want a better reputation in EVE, maybe you shouldn't hire members who dishonor 1v1's. That's really all there is to this story.

From what I have learned of TURBY since, you are a very old and very wealthy corporation. My corp is very young, very small and poor, but if one of my corpmates dishonored a 1v1 my corp would publicly apologize for the dishonor and deal very harshly with the perpetrator regardless of what it cost us in fighting strength or treasure. And we would EXPECT to be blasted in the forums for it. You would see none of the ridiculous bloviating crap I've gotten from you. Your corporation hires people who dishonor 1v1's, and then your corpmates lie about it and slander the victim. That's the simple truth and can be proven by, well, reading your post. You want that to not be the truth? Keep quiet about it until the facts are out, seek information from those in your corp who are obviously better informed, and don't recklessly spread accusations.

This entire thread is about the reputations of Turbulent and myself, as it should be. With a few regretable exceptions I have tried not to be baited by the frankly ridiculous accusations your team has thrown at me. You are, in this matter, a representative of your corporation, and your comments are making your corporation look ridiculous.

(editted to reflect that my reputation is also on the line, as it should be. If I am lying about my part in this, then I am guilty of everything I accuse Turbulent of, and more)

crash003
Gallente
Core Contingency
Posted - 2006.09.13 19:48:00 - [58]
 

so... now that turby doesnt have any reputation anymore...ive got 1 question for you kernal sanders...


want a 1v1?

Kernel Sander
Epiphyte Mining and Exploration
Combined Planetary Union
Posted - 2006.09.13 20:54:00 - [59]
 

This situation has been resolved. Both the thread title and the original post have been modified to reflect that fact, for more information, please see the original post.

Belhorn Battlebeard
Minmatar
PPN United
Ev0ke
Posted - 2006.09.14 19:00:00 - [60]
 

Originally by: Kernel Sander
If you have not seen any of this information, then it is because your CEO has not deemed fit to show it to you


Just FYI mate, ian666 is also CEO.


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