open All Channels
seplocked Ships and Modules
blankseplocked Please make the Abaddon a Drone ship =)
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4

Author Topic

Nira Li
Destructive Influence
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2006.07.29 14:09:00 - [31]
 

I want the same bonuses it got atm and a 8/5/7 slot layout, thank you very much

Madcat Adams
Amarr
Romulan Technologies Limited
Posted - 2006.07.29 14:17:00 - [32]
 

Edited by: Madcat Adams on 30/07/2006 12:07:41
Updated OP with ideas from the thread, keep em coming. Very Happy

Also, to those who want to use the Abaddon as a tach/gank platform, might want to look over these pleminary stats. If that cap isn't seriously adjusted, it's gonna be a very short party.

Thanks and credit to HippoKing for these links:
Prelim tier 3 Battleship stats
http://hippoking.bumcheekcity.com/tier3bs.htm
Prelim tier 2 Battlecruiser stats
http://hippoking.bumcheekcity.com/tier2bc.htm

These are ingame links by the way. Wink

*disclaimer* yes these are old stats, they do show the idea the devs are working from though. And if I understand correctly, the links are supposed to update as the database files update on the test server.

Commander Thrawn
M. Corp
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2006.07.29 14:43:00 - [33]
 

that's really what i was hopping for.
and 6/6/7 seems fine to me, or 6/6/8 :)
the turret ship will be fine i guess, not sure about the cap on it though

Udyr Vulpayne
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2006.07.29 14:49:00 - [34]
 

Edited by: Udyr Vulpayne on 29/07/2006 15:09:10
if the abaddon was to become a tier1 drone bs like the domi i would not give it more than 4 medslots. propably sth like 6-4-8 or 7-4-7 depending on what the none-drone related 2nd bonus would be obviously.

as a tier 3 drone boat i wouldnt go higher than 5 meds unless you really want to make it a combined drones + ewar bs. which would propably be a bit too much.


edit:
to clarify my earlier idea with a tier1 abaddon and a tier3 geddon.
the new and improved tier3 geddon would obviously get tier3 improved stats and added slots/turret hardpoints like the proposed abaddon. as this abaddon as per tux-devblog would be a better geddon anyway just giving it the proper name and hull wouldnt be much of a change.
this would however change our tier1 bs into something (drone-bs) thats still usefull even with a tier3 geddon (laser rof ship) around.

Sniser
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2006.07.29 15:50:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: Madcat Adams
Edited by: Madcat Adams on 29/07/2006 14:51:05
If that cap isn't seriously adjusted, it's gonna be a very short party.



stop whining about cap, use cap booster + passive tank and have fun

also those stats are out dated, tuxford told us it in another thread

Dred 'Morte
New European Regiment
Blade.
Posted - 2006.07.29 16:02:00 - [36]
 

Originally by: webkert
Abaddon will be usefull if it gets enough grid/cpu to be fitted properly. However there wont be much use for the apoc once tier 3 bs are out. The cap bonus is completly wasted considering you need a cap injector anyway to run a good tank, and its damage aint very good either. So I'd much rather have the apoc remade to a drone ship.

7 medium slots is too much on an armortanking ship. That would be way to powerfull, atleast with the current state of ecm.

And hopefully if the apoc is remade it will be usefull for solo pvp. Right now amarr doenst have any battleships that are decent for solo.


DIE Evil or Very Mad

Sangxianc
Reikoku
Band of Brothers
Posted - 2006.07.29 16:08:00 - [37]
 

Originally by: BirdBleed
i agree, amarr allready have 2 turret/tank bships, we certainly dont want ANOTHER.

More importantly, who is the girl in your sig?

God Forbid
Amarr
Royal Hiigaran Navy
South Pole Dancers
Posted - 2006.07.29 16:58:00 - [38]
 

Edited by: God forbid on 03/08/2006 20:31:30
yes yes and yes. We DONT Need a gank or a tank bs, DRONE SHIP IT should be.. Razz

Tranklukator's wife
Posted - 2006.07.29 17:54:00 - [39]
 

6/6/6 - 4 turret 4 missle

+10% drone damage and hitpoints
+30% to tracking disruptor optimal. (to make it work at 200km fleet battles with maxxed skills)
+5% to tracking disruptor effectiveness.

DeadDuck
Amarr
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2006.07.29 18:08:00 - [40]
 

just keep it like it is or if you wanna change something .. 8-5-7 Cool

White Ronin
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2006.07.29 18:47:00 - [41]
 

Originally by: Tranklukator's wife
6/6/6 - 4 turret 4 missle

+10% drone damage and hitpoints
+30% to tracking disruptor optimal. (to make it work at 200km fleet battles with maxxed skills)
+5% to tracking disruptor effectiveness.

Too many benefits for a T2 ship.
Follow the lines of the Arbi as it is T1 and not a curse/pilgram which is t2.
Plus, the +30% is outrageous, not to mention you include a effectiveness bonus on top of it.

Try this.
+10% drone hit points and drone damage/BS level
+5% Tracking Disrupter effectiveness/BS level


Slots 6/6/6 is ok but really you need to get a 7th mid slot to be comparable to others in bs quality. Remember this is NOT a typical Amarr design so have it have decent speed for a BS just not outstanding and above average midslots. Also keep its armor points the lowest of all the BS and the worst shield. This will keep it balanced so it must use its head to survive as they wont shield tank and have a very hard time armor tanking.
I might even throw in a negative like :
x3 cap usage for ECM if you felt it must be contained to its racial or to non 'broke' Ewar.
But anyway.
Anyway, just an idea.

Luric Vizjier
The Legion of Spoon
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2006.07.30 00:53:00 - [42]
 

Abaddon won't need a tank, just fill it with tachs, eccm, tracking mods, and 1600 plates and it is a deathmobile.

Berrik Radhok
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2006.07.30 01:59:00 - [43]
 

6/8/6 slot layout

10% bonus to drone stuff per level
5% bonus to tracking disruptor effectiveness and optimal range per level

4 turret slots 2 missile slots

take an axe to it's CPU

problem solved

Pepperami
Rionnag Alba
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2006.07.30 02:11:00 - [44]
 

I, like others, want my amarr bs choice to have variety.. Please give us a drone ship.

Or give the Abaddon the Geddon's bonus and make the geddon a dedicated drone boat.. Just please give us something other than lasers/lasers/lasers choice :(

Great Artista
Caldari
Veto.
Veto Corp
Posted - 2006.07.30 04:56:00 - [45]
 

Lasers are boring. Why on earth would we want improved geddon?

Drones, IMO, is the thing that amarr needs.

Rafein
Posted - 2006.07.30 06:43:00 - [46]
 

6/8/6, 5 turrets. 5% bonus to drone damage per level (10% is for gallente) 5% tracking disrupter optimal range.

Madcat Adams
Amarr
Romulan Technologies Limited
Posted - 2006.07.30 12:05:00 - [47]
 

As a drone ship it will most likely have one less slot than the 20 that the tier 3 look to be getting. Also curious as to why the tracking disrupter bonus over the armour bonus? It's an intriguing idea, please elaborate why that would be better than the staying power of +5% resits. Smile

Perry
Amarr
The X-Trading Company
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2006.07.30 12:58:00 - [48]
 

Easy, Apoc loses Cap Bonus and gains Resistsbonus.

Abaddon gets the Arbitrator Bonus (Drone/Trackingdisruptor), ccp gave it the Name of the Lord of Locusts and make it a boring turret ship i dont get it Confused

Fitting should be derived from Arbi:

Arbi / Abaddon

High 4 / 6 (should stay 6, Arbi doenst uses Highs to do damage)
Med 4 / 6 (at least 5, max 7)
Low 4 / 7 (at least 6, max 7)

-> 19 Slots, one less then 20 because of drones

Turrets 2 / 4
Launcher 1 / 2

-> doubles Arbitrator stats

Lower overall HP then Geddon, less speed the Apoc (-5m/s), less dronebay then Domi (200m), less Cap/Recharge, less Fitting then Geddon, compareable to Domi (abit more cause of beams higher reqs).

Should be balanced.

Ithildin
Gallente
The Corporation
Cruel Intentions
Posted - 2006.07.30 13:09:00 - [49]
 

Everyone who is serious about Amarr getting a tier 3 drone battleship needs to pod themselves until they've got no skills left, then go play WoW - where devs don't give a flying **** about racial identity (they're releasing paladins for the Horde, for example and for those who care).

IFF (that's "if and only if") Amarr get a drone ship, then it will be Armageddon. And IFF that happens, then the Hyperion will be made a drone ship. And IFF that happens, the Dominix will be remade into something else. And IFF that happens, they'll also need a new model for the Supreme Parasites or whatever they are called.

You see, an Amarr drone ship is about as likely as a Gallentean missile ship with double damage bonus and 8 launchers (making it better than any missile ship the Caldari will ever have). Drones aren't Amarrian.
There's plenty of more analogies I can make in order to illustrate how proposterous a non-Gallentean top-tier drone ship would be.

Originally by: Arbitrator description
The Arbitrator is unusual for Amarr ships in that it's primarily a drone carrier.

If this doesn't say it all, then I don't know what does.

I'm not saying that drone ships should be restricted to Gallente only, I am saying that if there exist a non-Gallentean drone ship in a ship class, then the Gallentean version in the same class must be higher tier and therefore stronger (not necessarily in all ways, but in *most* ways). Pretty much how it is between Vexor and Arbitrator, even though an EWar bonus is very, very, potent with a drone ship.

Perry
Amarr
The X-Trading Company
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2006.07.30 13:13:00 - [50]
 

Wts Ritalin 10isk

Udyr Vulpayne
Amarr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2006.07.30 16:48:00 - [51]
 

Originally by: Ithildin
Everyone who is serious about Amarr getting a tier 3 drone battleship needs to pod themselves until they've got no skills left, then go play WoW - where devs don't give a flying **** about racial identity (they're releasing paladins for the Horde, for example and for those who care).



not having your wow-experience i cant really comment on whatever blizzard wants to do with their game and i dont really see how thats supposed to be be important for the abaddon. let me instead suggest that you go ahead and read this thread before you go all crying around about how your gonna lose your precious dominix (hint: you are not).

regarding the racial identity: i agree it would be nice if amarr could just be using lasers only, field massive fleets that win by using technical and numerical superiority and enslave other players. however i dont think that would be easy to implement or create lots of interesting fights.

Originally by: Arbitrator description
The Arbitrator is unusual for Amarr ships in that it's primarily a drone carrier.


i see you chose to quote only the part of the arbis description that is actually true. propably a good idea.
while i agree that the arbi is unusual compared to our other ships it is also essential to our fleets and if you compare it with our other cruisers it also manages to come out on top quiet easily. so i'm wondering why exactly we should not get a battleship sized drone carrier when the cruiser sized one has proven to be quiet powerful and we already have 2 laser based battleships for all our turret needs.

also note that while the arbi is an exception thats precisely what amarrian ships need. a few alternatives to purely lasers based ships in order to be not completely predictable / counterable for pvp reason. other possibilites to get that result would be creating a dedicated ewar, missiles, projectiles or hybrid bs. and if you take a close look at those possibilites you may notice that in contrast to a droneboat we dont already have an ewar, missile, projectile or hybrid cruiser as a vital part of our fleets.

should you come up with a better way to give amarrians more versatility when it comes to bs-pvp go right ahead and post it here. maybe try to avoid just coming up with a better version of our already existing battleships though as we already got that solution from tux and i'm not convinced that it really comes through with the "new role" the tier3 bs were said to get earlier.

Originally by: Ithildin

I'm not saying that drone ships should be restricted to Gallente only, I am saying that if there exist a non-Gallentean drone ship in a ship class, then the Gallentean version in the same class must be higher tier and therefore stronger (not necessarily in all ways, but in *most* ways). Pretty much how it is between Vexor and Arbitrator, even though an EWar bonus is very, very, potent with a drone ship.


ah seems you managed to calm down a bit further down your post. i happen to agree with what you post there though i dont think the higher tier == better rule needs to be all that strict. for example an amarrian tier2 or 3 drone bs with just the default drone bonus and the suggested 200m3 dronebay doesnt seem like much of a problem if you go ahead and give the domi a 2nd dronebonus as well. just because it would be of a higher tier doesnt have to mean that its 2 or 3 times as powerful as the domi.

also:
an amarian tier3 drone bs with the arbis bonuses and 7 or 8 midslots as suggested earlier in this thread is pretty clearly over the top as that would combine very good ewar, drones and tankablitily into one ship. on the arbi itself at least the ewar and tanking departments are not high at the top end of cruisers.

White Ronin
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2006.07.30 18:06:00 - [52]
 


Originally by: Ithildin


I'm not saying that drone ships should be restricted to Gallente only, I am saying that if there exist a non-Gallentean drone ship in a ship class, then the Gallentean version in the same class must be higher tier and therefore stronger (not necessarily in all ways, but in *most* ways). Pretty much how it is between Vexor and Arbitrator, even though an EWar bonus is very, very, potent with a drone ship.

No, you are saying that no other race should bother cause the Gal should have the best drone ships for any occasion.
But thats not the way it is currently. And a load of poo also.

Currently the Gal droneship design is a union between hybrids and drones with a good tank. More of a fighter then anything else. Very 'Navy-ish'
The Amarr designed a differant droneship. One that did not focus on turrets to help the drone damage but focused instead on E-War.
Well, the Cat is OUta the Bag now. Cause the Arbi is a better ship im alot of peoples opinion.
And to say that the Amarr would ignore the success that they have had with this ship or that they would not try to implement it for other ship classes as it fills 2 roles... is saying they are brain dead. Of course they are gunna carry a successful ship design as far as they can and the Arbi is a VERY successful ship design.

Listen, if you can convince the Devs to start acting like Gal actually have the corner on the 'uberDroneship' market then you my friend are a hero. Cause they dont.
If ANYTHING, the GAL are blaster specialists cause they have more ships that can use this weapon effectively then drone based ships.

Till then their is more logical reason for them to have them then not.

Madcat Adams
Amarr
Romulan Technologies Limited
Posted - 2006.07.31 00:30:00 - [53]
 

Edited by: Madcat Adams on 31/07/2006 00:31:43
Creating a bigger Arbi that has the exact same bonus would serve to replace the Arbi though. Why not make a different set of bonus so that there is a use for both drone boats in a fleet?

Caesar Galactus
Amarr
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2006.07.31 03:24:00 - [54]
 

Originally by: Madcat Adams
Edited by: Madcat Adams on 31/07/2006 00:31:43
Creating a bigger Arbi that has the exact same bonus would serve to replace the Arbi though. Why not make a different set of bonus so that there is a use for both drone boats in a fleet?


Does an Apoc replace a Maller which replaces a Punisher? Do the Geddon and Zealot replace the Omen? Does the Arbitrator replace the Crucifier? Does the Crusader replace the Executioner? All of our ships are just bigger versions of their little brethren, and all of our ships still have a place on the battlefield, as dictated by logistics, skill, and financial constraints. For example, I rat 0.0 just fine in an Arbitrator, which means that I probably wouldn't risk a hypothetical drone-boat Abaddon (which is 25x more expensive) for exactly the same task.

Berrik Radhok
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2006.07.31 03:32:00 - [55]
 

Originally by: Madcat Adams
Edited by: Madcat Adams on 31/07/2006 00:31:43
Creating a bigger Arbi that has the exact same bonus would serve to replace the Arbi though. Why not make a different set of bonus so that there is a use for both drone boats in a fleet?


Drone optimal range over the damage mod would make it more unique.

Nyxus
Amarr
Fat J
-Mostly Harmless-
Posted - 2006.07.31 04:03:00 - [56]
 

Originally by: Ithildin
Everyone who is serious about Amarr getting a tier 3 drone battleship needs to pod themselves until they've got no skills left, then go play WoW - where devs don't give a flying **** about racial identity (they're releasing paladins for the Horde, for example and for those who care).

You see, an Amarr drone ship is about as likely as a Gallentean missile ship with double damage bonus and 8 launchers (making it better than any missile ship the Caldari will ever have). Drones aren't Amarrian.
There's plenty of more analogies I can make in order to illustrate how proposterous a non-Gallentean top-tier drone ship would be.

Originally by: Arbitrator description
The Arbitrator is unusual for Amarr ships in that it's primarily a drone carrier.

If this doesn't say it all, then I don't know what does.

I'm not saying that drone ships should be restricted to Gallente only, I am saying that if there exist a non-Gallentean drone ship in a ship class, then the Gallentean version in the same class must be higher tier and therefore stronger (not necessarily in all ways, but in *most* ways). Pretty much how it is between Vexor and Arbitrator, even though an EWar bonus is very, very, potent with a drone ship.


Ithildin I would agree with you on "preserve racial identity" except for 2 things.

  1. The Rokh with 8 turrets and is Caldari shows that gameplay>>>racial backstory.


  2. All other Tier 3 BS getting 8 turrets when according to backstory Amarr are the "turret specialists" shows that gameplay>>>>backstory.


While I agree that the Abaddon as a drone carrier shouldn't eclipse the Domi, it can easily be made an 8 midslot ship with drone bonuses and tracking disruptor bonuses with only enough dronebay to fit 5 heavies and 5 lights and be balanced. Just as the Arbi is balanced with the Vexxor. FFS all the other tier 3 bs are getting 6 mids AND filling in "holes" in thier respective fleets. If the Abaddon can't be a drone boat then make it 8/8 turrets/missiles.

For gameplay reasons Amarr need some variety to thier BS. We need a ship that actually fills the gaping "holes" in our fleets. For gameplay we need the Abaddon not to completely eclipse the Apoc and Geddon and render them pointless, or considerably less usefull than they are now.

Can you see that the Abaddon as currently sugggested does this exactly? It add *NOTHING* to the Amarr fleet, while rendering 2/3's of the Amarr BS pointless as it does everything they can do, and better when properly set up.

Gameplay>>>>backstory

Nyxus

Jahria Jaeger
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2006.07.31 07:08:00 - [57]
 

If any race should get a drone ship its the minnies, with them being bum buddies with Gallente and all

Rastaf
Solarflare Heavy Industries
Pure.
Posted - 2006.07.31 08:18:00 - [58]
 

Originally by: Nira Li
I want the same bonuses it got atm and a 8/5/7 slot layout, thank you very much


Im with Nira hereExclamation

Pesadel0
the muppets
RED.OverLord
Posted - 2006.07.31 08:25:00 - [59]
 

Edited by: Pesadel0 on 31/07/2006 08:26:33
Originally by: Ithildin
Everyone who is serious about Amarr getting a tier 3 drone battleship needs to pod themselves until they've got no skills left, then go play WoW - where devs don't give a flying **** about racial identity (they're releasing paladins for the Horde, for example and for those who care).

IFF (that's "if and only if") Amarr get a drone ship, then it will be Armageddon. And IFF that happens, then the Hyperion will be made a drone ship. And IFF that happens, the Dominix will be remade into something else. And IFF that happens, they'll also need a new model for the Supreme Parasites or whatever they are called.

You see, an Amarr drone ship is about as likely as a Gallentean missile ship with double damage bonus and 8 launchers (making it better than any missile ship the Caldari will ever have). Drones aren't Amarrian.
There's plenty of more analogies I can make in order to illustrate how proposterous a non-Gallentean top-tier drone ship would be.

Originally by: Arbitrator description
The Arbitrator is unusual for Amarr ships in that it's primarily a drone carrier.

If this doesn't say it all, then I don't know what does.

I'm not saying that drone ships should be restricted to Gallente only, I am saying that if there exist a non-Gallentean drone ship in a ship class, then the Gallentean version in the same class must be higher tier and therefore stronger (not necessarily in all ways, but in *most* ways). Pretty much how it is between Vexor and Arbitrator, even though an EWar bonus is very, very, potent with a drone ship.


Completely agree i mean do you guys want a missile boat to?I know lets give the minmatar a 8 slot mini raven with 2 bonus to missiles and 7 mid slots?Hell why don't we make caldaris have a drone carrier also?

Luric Vizjier
The Legion of Spoon
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2006.07.31 08:29:00 - [60]
 

Making the Abaddon a droneship is an insult, there is no honor in it. The Amarr will only stand for direct confrontation and win by either outlasting or quickly striking down our enemy. There is no workaround to a true battle, any Amarrian pilot knows this.

~Captain Luric Vizjier


Pages: 1 [2] 3 4

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only