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The Mittani
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2006.07.17 12:35:00 - [211]
 

Originally by: KIATolon
Because there isn't really any doubt Mittani.

Everyone knows what's going on here, and people like Lunas insisting they've not lost a fleet battle EVER just reinforces that fact.


Oh, come now Tolon. They're just having fun and being chill, it's all about good fights, and losing 11 cap ships is nothing to guys as rich as this! Their beds are made out out of faction battleships... and they didn't want Cloud Ring in the first place!

Also, everyone knows that they only lost those cap ships due to lag and exploits, because low-sp players could NEVER EVER EVER LA LA LA LA LA I CANT HEAR YOU hold a candle to anything D2 puts forth. So these goons are all cheaters anyway and CCP should give D2 their dreads back.

Am I doing this right?

Richard Face
Caldari
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2006.07.17 12:36:00 - [212]
 

lunas maybe you could make your next video about how the second-most powerful alliance in EVE manages to lose a whole region despite winning every fleet battle? tia

Abdalion


Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2006.07.17 12:43:00 - [213]
 

Originally by: Nez Perces
Looks like goonfleet are here to stay, we might as well get used to them Smile


Yes, so let's please be respectful, stop the killboard discussions, exploit discussions, and maybe good discussion can continue.

Joerd Toastius
Amarr
Octavian Vanguard
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2006.07.17 12:51:00 - [214]
 

Edited by: Joerd Toastius on 17/07/2006 12:52:42
Originally by: Jacinto Naysmith
I've avoided posting in here, but I assume you're referring to the statement of us being outnumbered 3:2 in most of the major engagements? I've been at every battle in which we've killed dreadnoughts defending our POS's, and from what I recall the number in our gang has been significantly lower then half of the number in local. I also don't remember seeing you in local in any of those battles, so I'd question whoever told you that we outnumbered you.


Dude, not to try and take anything away from GS's success in XZH (yes, you guys are holding out a lot longer than anyone expected - props to everyone involved in the GS logistics effort, particularly Hoegaarden by the sounds of it), but fighting outnumbered at your own POS isn't usually considered a particularly bold move. For one thing, most sane alliances would bring every big hitter in the system in to protect a major POS under attack as a matter of straightforward economics - BS are insured, POS aren't. And for another, "gang numbers" (and I'd question the wisdom of calculating these purely by subtracting from local - this can leave you 50+ out in a busy system) fail to take into account things like large turrets, which I assume I needn't remind you aren't exactly slouches in the damage-output deparment.


tl;dr fighting outnumbered at your own POS is not likely to win you or any other alliance many brownie points

Raste
Minmatar
Bulgarian Mafia Squad
Sons of Tangra
Posted - 2006.07.17 12:54:00 - [215]
 

Originally by: Kesslar Znel

The worst thing about Remedial's joke about smoksie was that it wasn't as funny as it should have been.

Seriously, goons love to make fun of dead people. If Remedial died it would be 10 minutes before we'd be photoshopping his autopsy photos. If dead people want us to stop making fun of them they should stop dying.


Why do people describe FYAD when they say they're describing goons?

Snowden Vel
Minmatar
GoonFleet
Band of Brothers
Posted - 2006.07.17 13:00:00 - [216]
 

Originally by: Joerd Toastius

tl;dr fighting outnumbered at your own POS is not likely to win you or any other alliance many brownie points


The reason we're bringing it up is the fact we're being accused of "blobbing" and lag exploits at battles where we've been outnumbered, rather than a desire for brownie points, though I do think our fleet commanders did an excellent job of maximizing the effects of the POS's support.

Alaesa
Caldari
State War Academy
Posted - 2006.07.17 13:05:00 - [217]
 

Originally by: Urikko
Originally by: Alaesa

Now that the goons have exausted their supply of new players I will be interested to find how long it will be before they self destruct.



We have? Wow, how fast we run through 70,000 goons. We haven't hit the tip of the iceberg in new players really.


dont be an idiot.

you have run through all the SA Forum members who want to play eve. I should be more exact here and say most of the SA forum members.


Snowden Vel
Minmatar
GoonFleet
Band of Brothers
Posted - 2006.07.17 13:10:00 - [218]
 

Originally by: Alaesa
dont be an idiot.

you have run through all the SA Forum members who want to play eve. I should be more exact here and say most of the SA forum members.




Well it's official, guys. Better scrap the next newbie drive.

John Moscroft
Amarr
The Pile of Exotic Dancers
Arkane Dominion Alliance
Posted - 2006.07.17 13:11:00 - [219]
 

Originally by: Alaesa
Originally by: Urikko
Originally by: Alaesa

Now that the goons have exausted their supply of new players I will be interested to find how long it will be before they self destruct.



We have? Wow, how fast we run through 70,000 goons. We haven't hit the tip of the iceberg in new players really.


dont be an idiot.

you have run through all the SA Forum members who want to play eve. I should be more exact here and say most of the SA forum members.




Goons are a renewable resource. There are no recruitment problems.

Abdalion


Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2006.07.17 13:15:00 - [220]
 

Originally by: Fi T'Zeh
Cmon lets see if we can bankrupt Lunas before the day is out folks.


Discussion of killboards and pasting links to killboards is considered off topic and could be considered trolling.

PS: No owl images either.

The Mittani
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2006.07.17 13:18:00 - [221]
 

Originally by: Snowden Vel
Originally by: Alaesa
dont be an idiot.

you have run through all the SA Forum members who want to play eve. I should be more exact here and say most of the SA forum members.




Well it's official, guys. Better scrap the next newbie drive.


It's true! There are seventy thousand SA members, each and every one of them has tried EVE and decided it wasn't for them. We're out of goons, it's over, veldspar, jita.

Dark Shikari
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2006.07.17 13:20:00 - [222]
 

For many months people have complained about BoB members spamming threads in a swarm.

I think someone has usurpsed their position Laughing BoB's gonna be mad Laughing

Richard Face
Caldari
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2006.07.17 13:37:00 - [223]
 

I have written a haiku

D2 builds thirty dreads
What is a bee to do now?
Jita, veldspar, etc

actually D2 is probably two syllables but whateva

Inanna Sumer
Gallente
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2006.07.17 13:41:00 - [224]
 

Originally by: Dark Shikari
For many months people have complained about BoB members spamming threads in a swarm.

I think someone has usurpsed their position Laughing BoB's gonna be mad Laughing


This can hardly be unexpected, after all GoonFleet's core membership is comprised of people who paid $10 USD to post on an internet forum Cool.

Originally by: The Mittani
'Established Alliances find things, GoonSwarm loots things.'

I wonder how many will get this reference, we can't all be minmatar I guess Wink

Happydayz
Caldari
Syndicate Liberation Army
Posted - 2006.07.17 13:44:00 - [225]
 

Originally by: Nez Perces
by the most part they seem an educated bunch, contrary to my original pre-conception of them being a swarm of mindless noobs.




It's a fallacy to equate being new in game with being new in life.

You're not guilty of this, but I have seen numerous posts on this forum where "elder" players talk down to newer ones as if they were children. Or, having more veteran players assume that they are smarter then people starting off just because they started playing Eve back in '03/'04. The irony is that I would wager that statistically speaking the age distribution is probably about even as to when people first started playing eve, with maybe even a slight bias towards those joining later being older on average. Would be interesting to see CCP's membership data on this assuming that they collect it.

The annoying thing about all these flames is that I'm sure everyone could have a rip-roaring good time getting drunk together. But it would be funny in a sort of junior high school way if during the next fan fest all the corps just hung out together in their own little clique.

Joerd Toastius
Amarr
Octavian Vanguard
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2006.07.17 14:04:00 - [226]
 

Originally by: Snowden Vel
Originally by: Joerd Toastius

tl;dr fighting outnumbered at your own POS is not likely to win you or any other alliance many brownie points


The reason we're bringing it up is the fact we're being accused of "blobbing" and lag exploits at battles where we've been outnumbered, rather than a desire for brownie points, though I do think our fleet commanders did an excellent job of maximizing the effects of the POS's support.


Oh, sure, your POS defence strategies have been pretty good. Even given complaints about grid issues etc which could just be put down to very smart positioning, you've acquitted yourselves very well there. I just don't feel that POS defense fights are really relevant to discussions about fighting outnumbered, because it seems slightly unfair to ignore the starbase. But eh, ymmv.

Haniblecter Teg
Gallente
F.R.E.E. Explorer
The Initiative.
Posted - 2006.07.17 14:21:00 - [227]
 

Originally by: Inanna Sumer
Originally by: Dark Shikari
For many months people have complained about BoB members spamming threads in a swarm.

I think someone has usurpsed their position Laughing BoB's gonna be mad Laughing


This can hardly be unexpected, after all GoonFleet's core membership is comprised of people who paid $10 USD to post on an internet forum Cool.

Originally by: The Mittani
'Established Alliances find things, GoonSwarm loots things.'

I wonder how many will get this reference, we can't all be minmatar I guess Wink



I'm reminded of why im on tribalwar.com instead of SA.com soo many times over its re****ulous.

Whiskey Juvenile
Caldari
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2006.07.17 14:53:00 - [228]
 

Originally by: Raste
Why do people describe FYAD when they say they're describing goons?


Because goons trying to be FYAD superstars while venturing forth into the great unwashed Internet is a way of life, apparently.

Sir Tificate
Minmatar
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2006.07.17 15:30:00 - [229]
 

Originally by: Raste
Why do people describe FYAD when they say they're describing goons?


I think it is mainly because FYAD is the easiest part of SA to vilify and point out just how awful the entire SA community is (mainly because it is easy to misinterpret out of context of the entire boards). Subforums like Debate and Discussion (where alot of the heavy hitting GF members came from) or Pet Island just isn't as evil in the eyes of most people. I mean, could anyone really get mad about a forum that posts blind cat rescue stories?

Sugoda Mookinson
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2006.07.17 15:45:00 - [230]
 

Originally by: Inanna Sumer
Originally by: Dark Shikari
For many months people have complained about BoB members spamming threads in a swarm.

I think someone has usurpsed their position Laughing BoB's gonna be mad Laughing


This can hardly be unexpected, after all GoonFleet's core membership is comprised of people who paid $10 USD to post on an internet forum Cool.

Originally by: The Mittani
'Established Alliances find things, GoonSwarm loots things.'

I wonder how many will get this reference, we can't all be minmatar I guess Wink
funny on so many levels, matter of fact thats going in my sig someway somehow, and as a minmatar i can tell you i stay looting things Very Happy

to d2 and everyone else that has been involved with our war in the north, its been great fun and i look forward to seeing more, new and creative ways of making each other explode.

as for the swarm and our tactics, i'll say this much i dont think we'd have received this much attention if we always lost, people dont talk about losing tactics ad nausem or whine about losers invading their space.

aktivate schieldbooster!

Calenth
Amarr
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2006.07.17 15:50:00 - [231]
 

Edited by: Calenth on 17/07/2006 15:53:52
Edited by: Calenth on 17/07/2006 15:51:33
Originally by: Sir Tificate
Originally by: Raste
Why do people describe FYAD when they say they're describing goons?


I think it is mainly because FYAD is the easiest part of SA to vilify and point out just how awful the entire SA community is (mainly because it is easy to misinterpret out of context of the entire boards). Subforums like Debate and Discussion (where alot of the heavy hitting GF members came from) or Pet Island just isn't as evil in the eyes of most people. I mean, could anyone really get mad about a forum that posts blind cat rescue stories?


To explicate this for those who aren't goons:

SA == SomethingAwful.com, which is the site where the Goons in Goonfleet come from.

FYAD == (un-postable acronym). A subforum on SA where everything that would get you banned or suspended on other parts of the SA forums is allowed -- flaming, non-worksafe content, etc. Every post in FYAD actually decreases your post-count ticker, so long-term FYAD posters will have negative postcounts. Sortof the information-age equivalent of a leper colony.

Debate and Discussion == the politics and debate subforum on SA. Most of Goonfleet's initial recruiting was done here, which is why so many Goonfleet directors and former directors are law students or even actual lawyers.

Pet Island == the subforum for threads about cute animals. There were enough threads about bunnies, rabbits, "omg look at this picture of my puppy," etc. on SA that the moderators had to set up a special subforum just for that.

Tassitus Mallinar
Caldari
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2006.07.17 16:07:00 - [232]
 

Edited by: Tassitus Mallinar on 17/07/2006 16:13:06
Originally by: Calenth
Edited by: Calenth on 17/07/2006 15:53:52
Edited by: Calenth on 17/07/2006 15:51:33
Originally by: Sir Tificate
Originally by: Raste
Why do people describe FYAD when they say they're describing goons?


I think it is mainly because FYAD is the easiest part of SA to vilify and point out just how awful the entire SA community is (mainly because it is easy to misinterpret out of context of the entire boards). Subforums like Debate and Discussion (where alot of the heavy hitting GF members came from) or Pet Island just isn't as evil in the eyes of most people. I mean, could anyone really get mad about a forum that posts blind cat rescue stories?


To explicate this for those who aren't goons:

SA == SomethingAwful.com, which is the site where the Goons in Goonfleet come from.

FYAD == (un-postable acronym). A subforum on SA where everything that would get you banned or suspended on other parts of the SA forums is allowed -- flaming, non-worksafe content, etc. Every post in FYAD actually decreases your post-count ticker, so long-term FYAD posters will have negative postcounts. Sortof the information-age equivalent of a leper colony.

Debate and Discussion == the politics and debate subforum on SA. Most of Goonfleet's initial recruiting was done here, which is why so many Goonfleet directors and former directors are law students or even actual lawyers.

Pet Island == the subforum for threads about cute animals. There were enough threads about bunnies, rabbits, "omg look at this picture of my puppy," etc. on SA that the moderators had to set up a special subforum just for that.


And the GF forums don't have the same posting rules when it comes to FYAD content as SA does, so it bleeds into our everday posting habits.

EDIT: And for those of you commenting about coherent post styles, we generally tend to follow the forum posting rules found here: Inappropriate link removed -Abdalion

Nez Perces
Amarr
Metatron Inc.
Posted - 2006.07.17 16:29:00 - [233]
 

Edited by: Nez Perces on 17/07/2006 16:32:14


Originally by: Tassitus Mallinar


EDIT: And for those of you commenting about coherent post styles, we generally tend to follow the forum posting rules found here: Inappropriate link removed -Abdalion

well if these are the rules you guys abide by..

I can only say welcome to this section of the EVE-online forums, hopefully quality of posting across the board will increase, cause sometimes there is some real garbage knocking around here...






Minhjaal
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2006.07.17 16:34:00 - [234]
 

Originally by: Joerd Toastius
Originally by: Snowden Vel
Originally by: Joerd Toastius

tl;dr fighting outnumbered at your own POS is not likely to win you or any other alliance many brownie points


The reason we're bringing it up is the fact we're being accused of "blobbing" and lag exploits at battles where we've been outnumbered, rather than a desire for brownie points, though I do think our fleet commanders did an excellent job of maximizing the effects of the POS's support.


Oh, sure, your POS defence strategies have been pretty good. Even given complaints about grid issues etc which could just be put down to very smart positioning, you've acquitted yourselves very well there. I just don't feel that POS defense fights are really relevant to discussions about fighting outnumbered, because it seems slightly unfair to ignore the starbase. But eh, ymmv.


Be that as it may, its the fights at the POSes that are the ones that really count when taking control of a system. You dont usually see dreads with an escort force hanging out at planets, after all. Now, if we did we might actually answer the call to meet at a planet for a fleet engagement...Very Happy

Abdalion


Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2006.07.17 16:36:00 - [235]
 

Please don't post links to outside websites where even the rules page contains profanity.

And how about following our forum rules instead of somewhere elses?

Linkage to Rules

Sir Tificate
Minmatar
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2006.07.17 16:41:00 - [236]
 

Originally by: Nez Perces

well if these are the rules you guys abide by..

I can only say welcome to this section of the EVE-online forums, hopefully quality of posting across the board will increase, cause sometimes there is some real garbage knocking around here...



Well I know people like to make fun of the $10 registration fee, but that is exactly why we have it. It is a disincentivization for cruddy posting. Without it, you reprimand someone, and then what? If they get banned they just register a new account and all it costs them is the 2 minutes it takes to set it up. With the fee however you generally are encouraged to take a bit more time with the posts. So forums like the Eve ones, where stuff like "u" is seen all the time, is quite different than ours, and somewhat irritating, but childish to comment on in other threads so I just ignore it. And besides, given the amount of time and entertainment I recieve from the forums, it is more than worth the fee.

Nez Perces
Amarr
Metatron Inc.
Posted - 2006.07.17 16:52:00 - [237]
 

Edited by: Nez Perces on 17/07/2006 16:54:45


Sorry abdalion, was not my intention to suggest that our forum rules are inadequate, simply that in general it seems that these Goon guys approach the forum with a slightly different (more professional?) attitude which may have a good influence on the rest of us (the users that is).

I could be wrong ofc...









Abdalion


Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2006.07.17 17:05:00 - [238]
 

Originally by: Nez Perces

Sorry abdalion, was not my intention to suggest that our forum rules are inadequate, simply that in general it seems that these Goon guys approach the forum with a slightly different (more professional?) attitude which may have a good influence on the rest of us (the users that is).

I could be wrong ofc...


Wasn't worried about your reply, was concerned with the quoted link.

We welcome all users to the forums, and encourage them to abide by the rules.

And, I don't think you are going to be wrong. An educated posting population with good intent is a good thing.

The Mittani
Caldari
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2006.07.17 17:09:00 - [239]
 

Originally by: Nez Perces

Sorry abdalion, was not my intention to suggest that our forum rules are inadequate, simply that in general it seems that these Goon guys approach the forum with a slightly different (more professional?) attitude which may have a good influence on the rest of us (the users that is).

I could be wrong ofc...


Think of it as a stupidity tax. On SA, if you post something like 'hurr hi2u gf hf gg ppl tbh to be perfectly honest u suX0r', you'll get banhammered so fast you'll get whiplash.

So if you stick around, you swiftly learn how to press the shift key and capitalize (FYAD nonwithstanding) and how not to act like a drooling AOL kiddie, lest you be out your :10bux:. Darwinism in action.

Anyway, I suspect that most of the eve-o community is rather surprised to see that we are actually quite literate and intelligent, thank you, now that we're allowed to post and aren't represented by idiotic alt-posters. Admittedly, we have a politically incorrect sense of humor and are HORRIBLE AWFUL NEWBIES who dare attack 'established alliances', but we're hardly the fools eve-o has been blithely making us out to be for the past year.

Joerd Toastius
Amarr
Octavian Vanguard
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2006.07.17 17:14:00 - [240]
 

Edited by: Joerd Toastius on 17/07/2006 17:19:01
Originally by: Minhjaal
Originally by: Joerd Toastius
Originally by: Snowden Vel
Originally by: Joerd Toastius

tl;dr fighting outnumbered at your own POS is not likely to win you or any other alliance many brownie points


The reason we're bringing it up is the fact we're being accused of "blobbing" and lag exploits at battles where we've been outnumbered, rather than a desire for brownie points, though I do think our fleet commanders did an excellent job of maximizing the effects of the POS's support.


Oh, sure, your POS defence strategies have been pretty good. Even given complaints about grid issues etc which could just be put down to very smart positioning, you've acquitted yourselves very well there. I just don't feel that POS defense fights are really relevant to discussions about fighting outnumbered, because it seems slightly unfair to ignore the starbase. But eh, ymmv.


Be that as it may, its the fights at the POSes that are the ones that really count when taking control of a system. You dont usually see dreads with an escort force hanging out at planets, after all. Now, if we did we might actually
answer the call to meet at a planet for a fleet engagement...Very Happy


I refer you back to my previous answer. True? Yes. Relevant to the discussion? No. We're talking about who is prepared to fight outnumbered, not who is good at fighting at a POS which, I have already acknowledged, the Goons are good at. But it's not relevant to discussion of whether or not this fleet or that fleet is prepared to engage a force of superior size.

{edit} It's not a particularly big deal, either way. I don't rate suicidal FCs particularly high in most cases, unless it's Spar (corp member) because his Leeroys are too funny to pass up. Just making the simple point that saying "we engage outnumbered when we have a POS to back us up" is not, as you quoted me saying, going to earn you any pats on the back for being particularly brave or cunning.


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