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Rezxnor
Posted - 2006.06.27 12:46:00 - [1]
 

So, after helpful advice here yesterday.. I fitted up my new Atron Frigate with a couple of 150m Railguns and some other goodies and did my first kill missions.

The first few were actually pathetically easy. One of which I had to destroy a "habitat" a little base basically I guess. Well, I had time to go do laundry , make tea and get a snack while my ship sat there pecking away at the base like a nat. Finally.. dear lord finally it blew up. wahoo!

So, now I see that I have a level II agent available to me. Woot? My first newb choice now was to "upgrade" one of my guns to some "Scout" railgun. I neglected to pay close attention to the stats, but I actually think it sucks and it was way more expensive. Holds less ammo, worse range, worse speed - but I was fooled by the higher dmg.

Anyway, I head out to a level II mission ( after killing my faction by declining 3 other missions. ). I see 3 packs of some type of drones. I figure drones would be a pushover.

Lets just say I was thanking my lucky stars that I was able to set a waypoint and warp the frak out of there like one shot from getting killed! Actually I am surpised I was even able to warp! I thought I saw a quick warning about my capacitor too?

Oh, and then I come back and tell the agent I that I dont have time for nickel and dime missions, and now she wont talk to me. Owned.

So guess Im not ready for level II missions. And I also guess there are some very overpriced crap weapons out there.

Quick question - a weapons speed - the lower the better right? And how the heck can I kill those bases faster? Reminds me of SWG base killing but oh so much slower.

LORD STEALTH
Posted - 2006.06.27 12:51:00 - [2]
 

Load up closer range ammo, train your skills higher for more damage, etc.. that should help you with the structures at least.




Thelmarr
Posted - 2006.06.27 13:02:00 - [3]
 

Killing buildings: Carry small amount of suitable short range ammo (for example for hybrids this is antimatter).

In regards to guns. You have to weight several issues on their "crappiness". How much they take energy/CPU, their tracking speed (huge damage/firing rate etc are useless if it's always mile behind target), firerate, range, optimal range falloff...

It's all about getting tools which YOU like to use.

Ching Ling
Gallente
Posted - 2006.06.27 13:05:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Ching Ling on 27/06/2006 13:08:11
You're already doing very well, running kill missions in an Atron.

Lvl 2 missions are supposed to be run using bigger classes of ships: Destroyers, Cruisers, Assault Frigates, etc.

Some experienced players claim that then can run lvl 2 missions in a frigate, but that's because they can fit the best equipment, and have trained high levels of skills to fly them.

You can carry various types of ammo in your cargo. And you can switch ammo type while in space. The antimatter ammo gives you most damage at close range.

Vasiliyan
Aliastra
Posted - 2006.06.27 13:17:00 - [5]
 

Hmm, scouts are better than standard railguns, but the larger sizes hold less ammo. It's going to be extremely hard to do level 2 missions in an Atron. It's possible in a Rifter and it is probably possible in a Tristan, although very hard with low skills. The easiest way to survive level 2 missions is to go up to a cruiser and fit a good set of hardeners to it.

Lower rate of fire on a weapon is better. For base killing, load antimatter and sit stationary at your optimal range. It still takes a while until you have high gunnery skills.

GC13
Caldari
Species 5618
R0ADKILL
Posted - 2006.06.27 13:35:00 - [6]
 

Uh... Upgrading to a 'Scout' railgun doesn't downgrade a thing. It's +10% to damage and optimal range compared to the standard version, and leaves everything else the same (well, it uses less CPU).

At first I'd suspect that you upgraded to a larger railgun, but the 150mm is the biggest frigate-sized railgun, and the range would go up on it anyway, even of the ammo capacity dropped.

Tabet Saens
The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc.
Brutally Clever Empire
Posted - 2006.06.27 13:40:00 - [7]
 

'scouts' ftw! But honestly I find most to be too expensive to be fitting into a frig, esp an atron. Good for you on trying to do L2 missions in a frig. I suggest using the best frig you can get your hands on, and the atron isn't it. I guess for gallente it would be tristan? I've done a few in my rifter and it's alright but you have to be super careful. Which sounds like what you are doing with the waypoint/autopilot trick. Good luck with those L2's.

Caleb Paine
State War Academy
Posted - 2006.06.27 14:01:00 - [8]
 

Edited by: Caleb Paine on 27/06/2006 14:01:13
IMO, buying named modules isn't the way to go for a new player like you, the bang for the buck really isn't balanced. Also, doing lvl 2 missions in a frigate with low SP is kinda hairy, expect to lose a few ships over it. So any fancy/expensive fitting will just ruin your day.

You want to fly frigates for a while I'd upgrade to either an Incursus or better the Tristan, however, that Tristan also uses missiles so you'll need some skills for those. Both will vastly increase your damage output and survivability.

Another option is to get a Destroyer, they're slower, less agile but can fit up to 8 guns and get a nice range bonus. So you'll insta pop frigate rats with it (actually, you just use 4 guns for one rat and the other 4 on the next hehe). The range bonus means you can keep your distance a bit which ups your survivability as the mobs don't hit you (much).

check out the Gallente destroyer, it's dead sexy :)

Jillius
Gallente
Valheru Empire Science and Production Agency
Posted - 2006.06.27 14:29:00 - [9]
 

Train and save up for a cruiser.

Cairo Skerr
Posted - 2006.06.27 15:23:00 - [10]
 

I believe you can decline a mission every four hours without taking a hit to faction.

Also I never tell an agent I can't do a mission, I figure there's a chance I might be able to upgrade myself enough before it expires.

Like doing Worlds Collide (I think thats the right name). First time I did it my Destroyer got obliterated. So I went and bought a frigate, loaded up on the armour plating and armour repairers, fitted an afterburner and a capacitor booster - then it was easy.

Neckbone
Minmatar
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2006.06.27 15:48:00 - [11]
 

Edited by: Neckbone on 27/06/2006 15:51:44
Quote:
Some experienced players claim that then can run lvl 2 missions in a frigate, but that's because they can fit the best equipment, and have trained high levels of skills to fly them.


Every L2 mission including Human Cattle 5/5 in a Rifter.

HI: 3x 150mm Scout AC, 1x Arbalest Rocket
MID: Cold-Gas AB, T1 Webber, F-S9 Med Extender
LO: 3x Shield Power Relay

Applicable skills:
Electronics IV, Engineering IV, Shield Upgrades IV (fitting skills)
Shield Management IV, Shield Operation IV (tanking)
Energy Management IV, Energy Systems Operation IV, Afterburner IV, Fuel Conservation IV (cap efficiency)
Gunnery III, Small Proj III, available secondaries @ I (projectiles)
Missiles III, Rockets I, available secondaries @ I (rockets)

That's under 1 million in skill points; I'd speculate about 750K. So it wasn't that high of a level of skills to get there, is my point.

For the original topic, congrats on getting your feet wet in L1 missions! You'll really find L2 missions more approachable from a tier 3 frigate (one that requires Frigate III). Still, the general guideline is:

L1 - Frigate
L2 - Cruiser
L3 - Battleship
L4 - Gangs

You'll find that most ships can solo most missions in the next level of agent up, and as you get better, learn to recognize biggest threats, and develop better tactics, you can do almost every mission in the next level up. Destroyers do more damage than frigates, but take more damage from larger ships (cruisers+) because of the larger signature. The same goes for Battlecruisers; more firepower than a cruiser, but takes more damage from battleships with it's bloated sig. So consider the Destroyer & Battlecruiser the bullies that got held back a grade out on the playground. They're better at whipping on cruisers than a cruiser, but not developed enough to rumble with the next hull class up.

Anyway, you lost your L2 from failing the mission, which lowered your standing a bit. After flying some L1's it will open back up. My best advice is work to Frigate III (I imagine you already are) and stick with the L1's. After you get to Frigate III you can start dabbling with them again, and don't be ashamed to ask for help from other frig pilots in your starter corp! L2 missions are no pushover, and they are most dangerous when you underestimate was 10 frigs lobbing light missiles at you, or 10 mercenaries pelting you with EM lasers, etc. Cruisers can mount monstrous tanks that laugh at most L2 missions, while Frigates can move really fast and use range and/or transversal to reduce the incoming damage.

EDIT - I did every L2 mission *except* Human Cattle 3+ with a fully T1 fitted Rifter, no named modules.

Haruto
Gallente
The Kairos Syndicate
Transmission Lost
Posted - 2006.06.27 16:16:00 - [12]
 

What may be your best bet if you really want to go out and do those L2's before you get into your Vexxor (or any other cruiser) would be to outfit a destroyer with some good long range rails, and a decent afterburner. As soon as you enter the mission area simply go the other way and hit the AB, you should be able to get to your optimal, and can then sniply snipe to your hearts content, quickly popping them all 1 at a time with little to no damage. If this works you con ignore any aspect of tanking and fit modules to improve your speed and guns, thus making it even faster to kill and getting you out of thier range faster.

However nothing makes it easier then getting into your cruiser and taking them out the good ole' fasioned way.

Currently I am overkilling L2's in my Brutix while I finish outfitting it for L3 missions, which out guns and out tanks easily. However you must go with the best option available, and a quick moving sniper boat is your best option until you get into larger ships, or better skills.

GPerson
Gallente
Firebird Squadron
Terra-Incognita
Posted - 2006.06.27 18:26:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Neckbone
Still, the general guideline is:

L1 - Frigate
L2 - Cruiser
L3 - Battleship
L4 - Gangs


Sorry Neckbone, but in my opinion, that is flat out wrong.
L1-Frigate
L2-Cruiser
L3-Battlecruiser
L4-Battleships(Some gangs, but only on the harder missions)

Doing L3's in a Battleship s the most mind-numbingly boring thing I can think of in this game, and to top it off, several battleships are less effiecient then their battlecruiser counterparts at L3's.

Vasiliyan
Aliastra
Posted - 2006.06.27 23:53:00 - [14]
 

Just went and tested this: it is certainly possible to do some level 2 missions in a Tristan, although you have to be VERY careful with incoming missile volleys. Human Cattle is probably best avoided; I only tested stage 1 and got out fine once I fitted the T2 rep. Silence the Informant is the other one that will cause trouble.

2x 125mm railgun (Antimatter)
2x rocket launcher (enemy specific, usually foxfire or thorn)
AB, Web, Cap Recharger (web may not be essential)
2xEnergised plating (enemy specific, basic will do for not-HC)
Small Armor Repairer II (could make do with I-A or such for not-HC)

Shivalynn
Minmatar
Posted - 2006.06.28 10:29:00 - [15]
 

I've just started doing L2 missions myself. I can do most of the them in my Thrasher (Minnie Destroyer). Some require me to warp out quite a bit. "Silencing the Informer" comes to mind. I do find I have to sometimes go get my Rifter to take out some of the faster ships if I get webbed, my skills only allow me to fit a couple Artillery cannons on the Destroyer, so I usually run with 4-5 150mms and 2-3 Artillery, with a Limos Missile launcher.

I usually skip Human Cattle also. I can't seem to tank the incoming missile damage before I get into range (again my skills are still being worked on). Any tips on handling massive barrages of missiles?

Sonya Rayner
Fairlight Corp
Rooks and Kings
Posted - 2006.06.28 11:30:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: GPerson
Originally by: Neckbone
Still, the general guideline is:

L1 - Frigate
L2 - Cruiser
L3 - Battleship
L4 - Gangs


Sorry Neckbone, but in my opinion, that is flat out wrong.
L1-Frigate
L2-Cruiser
L3-Battlecruiser
L4-Battleships(Some gangs, but only on the harder missions)

Doing L3's in a Battleship s the most mind-numbingly boring thing I can think of in this game, and to top it off, several battleships are less effiecient then their battlecruiser counterparts at L3's.


i remember doing some l3 missions in an inty, however imo AF would be far more effective :)

Sonya Rayner
Fairlight Corp
Rooks and Kings
Posted - 2006.06.28 11:37:00 - [17]
 

Edited by: Sonya Rayner on 28/06/2006 11:39:28
Originally by: Shivalynn
I've just started doing L2 missions myself. I can do most of the them in my Thrasher (Minnie Destroyer). Some require me to warp out quite a bit. "Silencing the Informer" comes to mind. I do find I have to sometimes go get my Rifter to take out some of the faster ships if I get webbed, my skills only allow me to fit a couple Artillery cannons on the Destroyer, so I usually run with 4-5 150mms and 2-3 Artillery, with a Limos Missile launcher.

I usually skip Human Cattle also. I can't seem to tank the incoming missile damage before I get into range (again my skills are still being worked on). Any tips on handling massive barrages of missiles?


for l2 missions i prefer using a drone carrier cruiser (such as Arbitrator or Vexor) with a 5 medium drones (owns every frig that ever tries to shoot me). Actually don't even require targeting baddies (max the first one if drones are too lazy to start attacking - once thay've started nothing can stop them). And for the missions with more cruisers i'd use three heavy drones :D

note: if you have not enough skills for the drones, these cruisers still would do it, since they give +10% drone HP, dmg and mining amount bonuses ber cruiser skill level.

Varis
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2006.06.28 11:56:00 - [18]
 

Yep. lvl2 missions are quite possible in frigates, even with low skills, but they need to be very well fitted out frigates, and it takes a lot of ammo/time in some cases. I use a Rifter all the time for 0.0 lvl2 missions, have been since i hit about 1.5 million sp...

I sometimes wich there was a drone carrying minnie cruiser i could use for lvl2 though :)

Neckbone
Minmatar
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2006.06.28 20:19:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: GPerson
Originally by: Neckbone
Still, the general guideline is:

L1 - Frigate
L2 - Cruiser
L3 - Battleship
L4 - Gangs


Sorry Neckbone, but in my opinion, that is flat out wrong.
L1-Frigate
L2-Cruiser
L3-Battlecruiser
L4-Battleships(Some gangs, but only on the harder missions)

Doing L3's in a Battleship s the most mind-numbingly boring thing I can think of in this game, and to top it off, several battleships are less effiecient then their battlecruiser counterparts at L3's.


I was repeating the general guideline that is given out to new players, because this is the new player forum. Myself, I find running L2's in a FRIGATE mind-numbingly boring save for just a few missions! (Human Cattle, Murderer to Justice, The Seven, that's most of the really cool ones.) Does that mean I should list L2's as recommended for Frigates?

I've flown three L3 missions in my Rifter, and most of the others I've done so far (only about 10 or 12 under my belt now) in a Rupture & Cyclone, split pretty even. But for someone just wanting a ballpark what they should plan to take in without being great... I think my list is pretty accurate. If someone can do it with a weaker ship, THEY'LL KNOW. I'd rather not tell someone I was running L2's in my Rifter at 750K skill points and have them try it and get slaughtered.

GC13
Caldari
Species 5618
R0ADKILL
Posted - 2006.06.28 20:28:00 - [20]
 

Level threes are disgustingly easy in a Ferox, even if you have diddly for skills involved. And when I say diddly, I mean Shield Operation 4 and Battlecruisers 4 (both of these are rather important), but otherwise just Shield Management 2 and about a hundred thousand SP in missiles.

(Okay, sue me, I had Drone Interfacing 4 so I could rip frigates to shreds, but I don't think it was that vital.)


 

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