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Aiya Adoria
Posted - 2006.05.07 02:42:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Aiya Adoria on 07/05/2006 02:44:01
If all you had to fit on a POS was

1-2 Corp hangar arrays
1 Moon Harvestor
1 Ship Maintenance
2 Coupling Arrays (or a silo if possible and a coupling array)

And the rest, of any racial type POS was total defenses. With no budget in expense for arrays or mods. What would you fit to dissuade an attack from a large force with friendlies available and in friendly territory.

IE: Minmatar with X number Artilleries + 1 of each ECM etc.

Ashvul
Amarr
XenoTech
The Fonz Presidium
Posted - 2006.05.07 06:32:00 - [2]
 

the ultimate anti support ship tower would be an amarr large with webber/disruptor batteries and as many artillery cannons as you can fit. guns will switch targets after 30 seconds, so against a bunch of BS you'll want a tower that will kill them in one hit; the minmatar tower's ROF bonus won't let the guns fire twicer per targetting cycle.

James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2006.05.07 12:55:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: Ashvul
the ultimate anti support ship tower would be an amarr large with webber/disruptor batteries and as many artillery cannons as you can fit. guns will switch targets after 30 seconds, so against a bunch of BS you'll want a tower that will kill them in one hit; the minmatar tower's ROF bonus won't let the guns fire twicer per targetting cycle.


I'm curious about that ROF statement. Surely with a 30 second cycle, and a 22.5s RoF they'll fire twice at the same target?

B0rN2KiLL
MicroFunks
Green Alliance
Posted - 2006.05.07 15:00:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: James Lyrus
Originally by: Ashvul
the ultimate anti support ship tower would be an amarr large with webber/disruptor batteries and as many artillery cannons as you can fit. guns will switch targets after 30 seconds, so against a bunch of BS you'll want a tower that will kill them in one hit; the minmatar tower's ROF bonus won't let the guns fire twicer per targetting cycle.


I'm curious about that ROF statement. Surely with a 30 second cycle, and a 22.5s RoF they'll fire twice at the same target?


no.


but a large arti, well, 3 large arties got a good chance of poping a battleship in 1 hit

Aiya Adoria
Posted - 2006.05.07 15:49:00 - [5]
 

So Amarr Large tower and Predominantly Large Artilleries?

How effective are:

ECM? (seems like a good way to keep alot of ships out of damaging you but only in a caldari tower?)
Dampeners?
Hardeners (25% on 40mil shields seems nice)

And should you mix gun sizes?
Having 3 Large 5 Medium and 8Small would be like having 5 Large roughly in damage but if they cycle targets they would spread out alot that way. More then Having just Large guns.

Ashvul
Amarr
XenoTech
The Fonz Presidium
Posted - 2006.05.08 23:32:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: Ashvul on 08/05/2006 23:37:34
its good to have a few large, a few medium, and a few small, as well as a few small, fast tracking guns other than artillery for backup. don't bother with ECM because it will knock out one target at a time, and if you are trying to oneshot ships, it doesnt really matter if they can lock your tower or not. plus if the tower gets knocked into reinforced, the ecm will stop working.

Originally by: James Lyrus
I'm curious about that ROF statement. Surely with a 30 second cycle, and a 22.5s RoF they'll fire twice at the same target?


22.5 + 22.5 = 45s, which is more than 30 seconds, so no they will not fire twice.

GameraChan
GoonFleet
Posted - 2006.05.09 06:03:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Ashvul
22.5 + 22.5 = 45s, which is more than 30 seconds, so no they will not fire twice.


Could you explain how this works? It seems like it would fire once, have a 22.5s cooldown, then fire again, which is 2 shots in under 30 seconds.

Karille
Gallente
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams
Posted - 2006.05.09 14:54:00 - [8]
 

The way i would see that happening is that it would fire twice at the first target, but then because the cycle times and the rate of fire times dont match up it would only fire once. That is until they came into sync like they were in the first cycle then you would get 2 shots out of it.

ShadowStrike
Shadow Tech Industries
Posted - 2006.05.10 11:07:00 - [9]
 

does all weapons fire at the same target until the POS switch to another target after its 30 sec cycle?

Lone Dragon
UA Industry
Red Alliance
Posted - 2006.05.10 12:10:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Lone Dragon on 10/05/2006 12:15:19

The best way to protect your POS is to put up a Caldari tower and load the tower with shield hardener modules. Put up at least 4 EM, 4 Explosive, and 2 Kinetic hardeners. The tower already has 25% kinetic and 50% thermal shield resistances. The more hardeners, the better. Add a few warp disruption batteries and some large guns too.

A Caldari tower has more shields than all the other control towers. A fleet of battleships pounding on the tower will probably give up in frustration.

Even a 10 man fleet of dreads will take hours to get the POS into reinforced mode instead of the normal 30 minutes for an unhardened tower. Getting an average hit of 1000 instead of the normal 8000+ really makes taking out a POS a lenghty process.

As a dread pilot, I cringe when I know we are going up against a shield hardened Caldari tower. The longer you are having to sit at a tower, the better the chance of hostiles showing up.

Every additional 10 minutes that a dread takes to kill your POS is an additional cycle of siege fuel needed to be brought in making it a logistics nightmare and an even more costly op.

Nvali
Ars ex Discordia
GoonSwarm
Posted - 2006.05.12 17:28:00 - [11]
 

Each weapon picks its own target (and cycles every 30s). POSes do not (normally) concentrate fire.

Garrin Lasyn
Gallente
Woopatang
Primary.
Posted - 2006.05.12 18:18:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Nvali
Each weapon picks its own target (and cycles every 30s). POSes do not (normally) concentrate fire.


Personally I think that is BS. If you want you should have the choice, each gun pick it's own target OR have the POS concentrate fire.

If I was a POS owner I'd want it to concentrate fire. Then when a fleet of dreads come for a visit, it is a real fight. The dread might very well survive the first strike but the POS cycles to someone else, can the dread repair enough to survive a 2nd strike or a 3rd strike? Will it have to warp and repair off the battlefield?

That would make more sense to me...but that is just MHO.

Xianthar
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2006.05.12 22:52:00 - [13]
 

if you think very carefully....there is a way to make a POS focus fire on one target..

-xian

SengH
Black Omega Security
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2006.05.13 04:01:00 - [14]
 

I think the lame alternative would be fitting 125 cruise missile batteries on an amarr tower( someone tried it on sisi and it fit ) and watching the opposing dreads lag out as they warped in :P. Although that would be ALOT of cruises to have to haul in lol. Id hate to be the one who has to reonline everything too if someone forgot to fuel it.

Audrea
Evolution
IT Alliance
Posted - 2006.05.13 05:28:00 - [15]
 

Dont bother with ECM/EW, pointless on any tower.
The BoB small tower in V2-VC2 prooved that (even against dreads, since nowdays nobody sends 1-2 dreads, but 10+).

If you need hours to assemble a defending force to defend the tower, then by all means hardeners should be priority, but if u are able to assemble the fleet in say 20 mins, then dont bother with hardeners, and instead put up more Citadel torpedoes, Large beams/artillery or whatever.

Put 4 warp disruption battareys, each on the edge of the force field on diffrent directions.
(Tbh I am not sure why ppl use multiple warp disruption arrays, as POS fires only on one target... Rolling Eyes)

Ashvul
Amarr
XenoTech
The Fonz Presidium
Posted - 2006.05.14 01:31:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Garrin Lasyn
If I was a POS owner I'd want it to concentrate fire. Then when a fleet of dreads come for a visit, it is a real fight. The dread might very well survive the first strike but the POS cycles to someone else, can the dread repair enough to survive a 2nd strike or a 3rd strike? Will it have to warp and repair off the battlefield?


I actually did the math on this once. There is no way to overcome the repair rate of a siege mode dread with tower defenses. (unless the dread pilot really really sucks at fitting ships)

Audrea
Evolution
IT Alliance
Posted - 2006.05.14 11:47:00 - [17]
 

Edited by: Audrea on 14/05/2006 11:47:22
Originally by: Ashvul
Originally by: Garrin Lasyn
If I was a POS owner I'd want it to concentrate fire. Then when a fleet of dreads come for a visit, it is a real fight. The dread might very well survive the first strike but the POS cycles to someone else, can the dread repair enough to survive a 2nd strike or a 3rd strike? Will it have to warp and repair off the battlefield?


I actually did the math on this once. There is no way to overcome the repair rate of a siege mode dread with tower defenses. (unless the dread pilot really really sucks at fitting ships)


Can u subtract and let us know how much extra DPS is needed to break the siege mode dread tank? assuming 100% military POS (Large arti/citadel torps).

EDIT: And assuming the dread uses deadspace hardeners ugh

Nyphur
Pillowsoft
Posted - 2006.05.14 12:45:00 - [18]
 

The best defence for your POS is to be quiet, be in the middle of nowhere and not **** anyone off. That or have a force of 400 ships ready to defend when it comes out of siege mode. There is simply no way to make a POS able to destroy a dread when in siege mode. People toy about with pulse lasers and artilleries to kill them before they enter siege mode, as they exit warp, but we all know that they warp an expendable ship in a few seconds earlier than the dreads in order to take the first hit and give the dreads time to enter siege mode.

ShadowStrike
Shadow Tech Industries
Posted - 2006.05.14 17:20:00 - [19]
 

what about a 0.5+ empire POS then? where dreads can't go? i guess torpedoes batteries would be better than citadel torpedoes batteries for these as torpedoes do more damage to battleships than citadel torpedoes and you can fit 2x more for the same cpu and pg

what would be the best defense for such an empire POS?

War Drumb
Posted - 2006.05.15 19:30:00 - [20]
 

Ummm your rate of fire post seems to be wrong. If you count the 1st shots as zero time then the 2nd shot will happen in about 23sec. If the tower cycles targets every 30 sec then you should get 2 shots cycle.

So something must br wrong in the numbers you guys are posting.



 

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