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Lymfada
Minmatar
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2003.09.16 05:16:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Lymfada on 16/09/2003 05:16:24
Let's start by saying im a soldier, and proud member of Oracle. I know nothing of politics nor do I care. I try to understand my enemy, the Amarr, but just don't get it. I keep hearing how we are wrong for trying to free our people. How we should come back to the fold. It's pretty simple as I see it, The Amarr enslave peoples namely mine and then try to justify it as a religious right. Then when the brave souls rise up and say no more we are labeled as pirates. I keep reading about how a peace must be sought and how the killing must stop. It's pretty easy FREE THE SLAVES. You have to know its wrong. I mean look at it like this what if the amarrian race was enslaved. Could you really sit by and let your brothers/sisters, mothers/fathers, sons/daughters live a so-called life of slavery. We did not ask for this task but you the Amarr have forced it on us. We all want peace but there will never be any peace or semblance of one until all our people are freed.

Lymfada
What does not kill you makes you stronger

Fetty Chico
Minmatar
Posted - 2003.09.16 05:53:00 - [2]
 

I got one question..
if you proud of being in Oracle..why you aint showing your tag?

other wise..I agee with ya fully

Hardin
Amarr
Imperial Dreams
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2003.09.16 08:18:00 - [3]
 

You poor misguided Minmatars...

Don't you know that slavery is just a stop on the road to your enlightenment?

As Oracle have shown the Minmatar race has some potential but you are not the finished article yet.

You talk of slavery yet I see it more as a process of training and 'uplifting' the Minmatar to their true potential.

As a Ni-Kunni I can attest that although this process may be initially painful it is to your long term benefit.

Rejoin the Empire, be our slaves and you will be doing your race a favour in the long term!

It is a pity more Minmatar don't see this Twisted Evil

Idonis Maxamillion
Posted - 2003.09.16 11:38:00 - [4]
 

I don't call you Minmatars pirates becouse your really terrorists, CONCORD has helpped keep the peace but your attacks in our space Have branneded you with thses name, if you don't follow the politics then don't get invovled with them.... STOP POSTING!

Idonis Maxamillion, of
Dark Seraph,
A loyal Amarrian Company

AnIntrepidCosmonaut
Caldari
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2003.09.16 11:39:00 - [5]
 

The Amarr have addicted their slaves to some drug. (the name of it has slipped my mind) to keep them obedient and dependant. If a slave does not get a hypo full of this drug in -let's say 48 hours- the slave dies a slow and painful death.

So even if you would succeed in rescueing slaves by force, they would not be able to enjoy their freedom for long.


Reil Shashanna
Amarr
Seven Corp
Posted - 2003.09.16 12:06:00 - [6]
 

Lies! Vitoc is our gift to the slaves, a reward for hard work.

When they feel if coursing through their veins, they experience rapture.

Hippey
Minmatar
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2003.09.16 12:16:00 - [7]
 

I must be losing my mind, I see every Amarr as a slaver. Slaver = Amarr. Amarr = slavers. You are all SO dead.

Cleric Tycho
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2003.09.16 12:26:00 - [8]
 

Quote:


So even if you would succeed in rescueing slaves by force, they would not be able to enjoy their freedom for long.




All freed slaves are given the help they need to remove themselves from the grip of Vitoc. In time they regain their strength and are ready to seek vengance against their former oppressors.

Sarkos
Minmatar
Posted - 2003.09.16 13:12:00 - [9]
 

Edited by: Sarkos on 16/09/2003 13:13:01
My old advisary Hardin. When you speak of the Amarr educating the Minmatar people, you are so correct. Before the coming of the Amarr and the enslavement of my people, we were a peaceful race. We lived a simple life in the harmony of our homeworld Matar, a natural paradise. Our science was advanced enough to propel us into space and give us warp and jump capable ships.

With the exeption of the Brutor, we were not a violent people. Violence is what the Amarr have taught us. Violence and distrust. Under the Amarr enslavement we also learned the lesson of unity and commitment to our race, and the lesson of hatred. During the rebellion we learned to fight and kill.

Yes, the Amarr have tought us many things. Now, as we strike back, we hear stories of how barbaric and savage we are. How we fight like animals as we battle to have our people freed. Well, remember we were a peaceful people. What we are today we owe to the teachings of the Amarr. Now it is time for the student to teach the instructor.


Hippey
Minmatar
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2003.09.16 14:24:00 - [10]
 

Well said indeed Sarkos. And since the student should be better then the teacher, I will return their teaching of pain, with my teaching of death!

Bad Harlequin
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2003.09.16 14:27:00 - [11]
 

Quote:
You poor misguided Minmatars...

Don't you know that slavery is just a stop on the road to your enlightenment?

So Hardin turns out to be a "Station Slave" trying to get all us poor "Asteroid Field Slaves" to realize how good we got it.... riiiiight Rolling Eyes Twisted Evil

Discorporation
Amarr
Evolution
Band of Brothers
Posted - 2003.09.16 14:27:00 - [12]
 

Quote:
Well, remember we were a peaceful people. What we are today we owe to the teachings of the Amarr. Now it is time for the student to teach the instructor.



Laughable.

The clan wars the Minmatar had surpass the early Udorian - Amarr wars in violence and bloodshed.

We did our opponents the favour of subjugating them and eventually incorporating them into the Empire. Your people are still as divided as before.

Cleric Tycho
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2003.09.16 14:46:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: Cleric Tycho on 16/09/2003 14:47:40
Bloody early histories are true of many cultures, but what came out of that was a more peaceful and tolerant society until we were touched by the Amarr Empire.

However Sarkos was right, you have helped foster our sense of unity and committment towards our people, and yet you claim we are as divided as before?

Hah, you will witness how 'divided' we are Discorporation when the combined forces of the Minmatar people crush your failing empire.

Discorporation
Amarr
Evolution
Band of Brothers
Posted - 2003.09.16 14:57:00 - [14]
 

You are divided into more factions then there are clans. Part of you suckle at the breast of the Gallentean Federation, nursed on complacency, fed with smut and covered in grime. A part of you pretends to matter in the grand scheme of all things, forming a little empire of your own, carefully nested between the Gallente and Caldari Empire. Another part play at being the rebellious teenager, young upstart gone to risk their very lives trying free some distant, drug-addled relative bending to its masters's will. You have no unity, you are fractured and thus will fall to a greater force.

Wether that be our Empire or the corruption of the Gallanteans, or perhaps the biovats of the jove, time will tell.


Adrial
Gallente
Posted - 2003.09.16 15:37:00 - [15]
 

I say Free the slaves, Freedom is a right, and the amarr know that. I can stand by no longer and allow the Amarr enslave peoples who have rights. Join up brothers and sisters Join up and weild the power of freedom and one day you will be free. The Shame that the amarr may need to loose there blood, but Even more shame in the slavery. I do not support my Federations stand on the side of the amarr, Freedom to the Minimatar!

All who wish to stand with me, let us stand!

Discorporation
Amarr
Evolution
Band of Brothers
Posted - 2003.09.16 16:24:00 - [16]
 

Surely, if we'd agree, we'd not enslave people in the first place?

Hafthor
Gallente
The Fated
E.Y
Posted - 2003.09.16 16:28:00 - [17]
 

Edited by: Hafthor on 16/09/2003 16:32:28
Quote:

The Amarr have addicted their slaves to some drug. (the name of it has slipped my mind) to keep them obedient and dependant. If a slave does not get a hypo full of this drug in -let's say 48 hours- the slave dies a slow and painful death.

So even if you would succeed in rescueing slaves by force, they would not be able to enjoy their freedom for long.



Actually only a small portion of the billions of slaves are addicted to Vitoc(<-name of drug). It is used only on those slaves who are needed for precise work on ships and in construction.

More info can be found here --->

Slaves and slavers

Vitoc

------------
Amarrian society is very different from the other empires. Generally it surprises people how barbaric their society really is.

More info can be found here --->

Dam-Torsad

A look at Amarrian religion

Amarr succession

The reality of life for an Amarrian subject

I wholeheartedly agree with letting all slaves go. However I think it is impossible for the Amarr empire to do so without crumbling from within. Therefore a peaceful solution to this dilemma is nigh on impossible. The only thing currently standing in the way of full out war is emperor Heideran VII's political prowess.

And soon he will be no more.

Hardin
Amarr
Imperial Dreams
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2003.09.16 16:46:00 - [18]
 

Quote:
Well said indeed Sarkos. And since the student should be better then the teacher, I will return their teaching of pain, with my teaching of death!


As I said, your races education was incomplete.

At the moment I would rate your race as:

"Have potential but fail to apply theselves in class. Must try harder..."

If you come back into the Amarr fold we will help you pass with honours - once we have suitably 'adjusted' you.


Sqalevon
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2003.09.16 21:20:00 - [19]
 

Hardin,
we might have been brought on our knees by the Amarr but instead of the Ni-Kunni we arent going to give up, *cough* if u cant beat them, join them * cough* we will stand strong once more !

Sulla
Amarr
1st Praetorian Guard
Vigilia Valeria
Posted - 2003.09.16 23:36:00 - [20]
 

Greetings esteemed foe Sarkos,

Having faced you and your loyal pilots since the early days of this rebellion in the First Praetorian Guard, and now PIE, I have always found your words to be well reasoned and of great interest. However, as would be expected they are contrary to my position as soldier of Amarr.

It's generally my habit to let Hardin's usual eloquence speak for my crew and myself as we attend to our duty in the Emperor's service but if you will grant me a moment of your time I felt compelled to enter this interesting,but ongoing, philosophical debate between our races.

The subject of slavery in the Empire and it's history, is deep and multifaceted. It seems a number of your pilots in this thread have insulted the Ni-Kunni as weak and beneath contempt for their acceptance of the role they now play in the Empire.

I find that attitude amusing considering how many Ni-Kunni, first on the duty roster of the 1PG, and now PIE, have demonstrated they are quite strong enough to forcefully eject a great many of your pilots into the void of space clothed only in a life pod. I urge all Minmatar to look again at the Ni-Kunni as the worthy example they truly are. A race that has passed through the refining fires of Amarrian servitude in generations past to become now a critical member of the same Empire that once enslaved them.

As opposed to some of my race I see the Minmatar not as worthless animals fit only to serve as slaves but like the Ni-Kunni, a race capable of joining the Empire as they also are refined in time.

The same spirit that drives your rebellion I hope some day to see channeled into the Empire's service. The Minmatar in slavery are like good steel in the furnace undergoing the smith's hammer. That steel feels the pain of the fire and rightfully resists every blow of that hammer, I would expect no less. However when that sword is finished and removed it becomes a useful tool in the right hands.

The question in the balance is will the Minmatar sword reach the greatness that ultimately awaits them in the Empire or will they choose a lesser path outside the Emperor's divine care.

It seems the Universe loves irony and at present has reserved a particularly unique one for the Minmatar race. No matter what position the Minmatar choose to occupy...loyal Empire member....or implacable Empire foe they will have to live with the fact it was only by the hand of the Amarrian people they reached either destiny.

My respects again Sarkos to you and the Oracle pilots. My bridge crew are always slightly more focused at an Oracle sighting and many of your ship signatures when identified are almost seen as old friends not just capable foes.
Fortune follow you and yours.

Sulla,

Commanding in the divine Emperor's service
Glory to the Empire
Valeria Victrix!





Golan Trevize
Amarr
Body Count Inc.
Posted - 2003.09.17 05:10:00 - [21]
 

Well said my old friend well said.


Hardin
Amarr
Imperial Dreams
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2003.09.17 08:15:00 - [22]
 

Indeed Sulla had expressed my thoughts far better than I ever could!Smile

Sqalevon
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2003.09.17 13:00:00 - [23]
 

Quote:
The question in the balance is will the Minmatar sword reach the greatness that ultimately awaits them in the Empire or will they choose a lesser path outside the Emperor's divine care.

It seems the Universe loves irony and at present has reserved a particularly unique one for the Minmatar race. No matter what position the Minmatar choose to occupy...loyal Empire member....or implacable Empire foe they will have to live with the fact it was only by the hand of the Amarrian people they reached either destiny



The question is, should we be thankfull for the destiny u Ammarians forced upon us. We will never be "loyal Empire members" as long as u dont threat us as equals.
Quote:
For the Minmatars, the most important thing in life is to be able to take care of yourself on your own

Or on the other hand "implacable Empire foe" that is what u made of us, u created this enemy by enslaving our brothers and sisters
Quote:
At one time they had a flourishing empire with a level of mechanical excellence never before or since seen anywhere. Later, however, they had to endure centuries of enslavement, toiling and dying for the benefit of foreign masters.


As for the Ni-Kunni i think it is sad that they forget the history of their people and now help the slavers in their queste for slaves and isk. They should know better and fight for a better future for the slaves still out there. I know Ni-Kunni have learned and earned much with the help of Amarr, but should that mean that they forget that the help they got is payed with the death and blood of thousands of slaves.

Bad Harlequin
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2003.09.17 13:22:00 - [24]
 

Quote:
Greetings esteemed foe Sarkos,
...

Very pretty words, sir. But the merely demonstrate more fully the ongoing confusion in the Amarrian mind of "Strength" with "Martial Prowess," "Combat Experience" or even "Battles Fought and Won." These things alone are not strength.

Quote:
It seems a number of your pilots in this thread have insulted the Ni-Kunni as weak and beneath contempt for their acceptance of the role they now play in the Empire.


*sigh* old son, i hear the honest confusion in your voice, and I shall attempt to explain.

Weakness of spirit cannot be compensated for with the barrel of a gun.

This is something that, it seems, 90% of the population cannot grasp, as a lack of character is smoothed over with authority and firearms.

But weakness of spirit, of conviction, of soul! Ah! These things are celebrated by the Masters who would rule you!

Duty is important, but these things are not duty.
Loyalty is vital, but these things are not loyalty.

They are renamed and called "honor" and "forging in the fire" and other phrases and words of power designed to stir your heart and patrotic feeling into forgetting the reality of your oppression.

What, I wonder, would the Ni-Kunni do if the Amarr fell tomorrow? Would they forge their own destinies? Or seek new masters to serve?

After all, a honed military mind functions well under orders. It takes initiative but knows it place. Such people are highly succeptible to control and the appearance of the authority...

So don't worry, my dear foe. When you speak of "weakness," it refers not to your shiny pretty ships of gold and blood, but your minds and spirits. And no one is EVER beneath contempt.

Always glad to help clarify,

- BH Twisted Evil

Sulla
Amarr
1st Praetorian Guard
Vigilia Valeria
Posted - 2003.09.17 15:06:00 - [25]
 

Greetings Captains Squalevon and Harlequin

I'm always encouraged when Minmatar enter into a discussion on the great divide of servitude between our races....even if they frequently miss the more subtle, but none the less critical points as you have done.

Much to my disappointment even as I send this communique a shuttle is impatiently waiting to take to me to a two day meeting of officers at Fleet Ops and will be unable to continue this discourse for a few days. I'm sorry to say Admirals look unkindly on lowly Captains such as myself causing them the slightest inconvenience.

It seems there is much I could I correct in your responses that will require another day. Suffice it to say though one of the greatest mistakes the Minmatar continully make, as you have also done, is to constantly refer to the Ni-Kunni as slaves in the present tense. They have left that status far behind them and daily demonstrate in every corner of the Empire their strength in "Spirit" and "Martial Valor".

You portray the Amarr as a people constantly despising our inferiors...we may very well deserve that impression. If however that is the case then the "Strength" of the Ni-Kunni "Spirit" is that much more amplified for they have looked the Amarrians in the eye as our slaves and earned our respect and freedom as our comrades in arms and service to the Divine One.

I ask again can, the Minmatar show equal stregth to walk that same road or will they fall by the wayside seeking quick and easy answers to their questions ?

Be well Captains.

Sulla,

Commanding in the Divine Emperor's service.
Glory to the Empire
Valeria Victrix !

Bad Harlequin
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
Posted - 2003.09.17 15:59:00 - [26]
 

So in other words, you taunt us like a schoolyard foe telling us we can only be "brave" or "strong" in your eyes if we all be good, hard-working little slaves and take it like men while "earning" your respect as your beasts of burden, until such time as you feel like treating us like only-slightly-inferior, oh THANKEE Massa!

Thank you for proving my point.


 

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