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seplocked Ships and Modules
blankseplocked No need to balance ships
 
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Irenia
Posted - 2003.07.28 03:47:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Irenia on 28/07/2003 03:55:20
Saw the post on Raven/apo/arma balancing

Why do they need balancing?

It is a common fact that ships with most turrent points and most stablizers kill npc pirates fast. Missiles? who uses missiles ?

Missiles and missile launchers are very balanced since they aren't really being considered weapons after all, have you ever seen a damage mod for a missile launcher? Have you seen a damage mod for laser/hybird/projetle weapons? There are large/medium/samll laser/hybird/projetle weapons on the market for sale whereas there are a total 5 kind of missile launchers. The answer is obvious, missiles aren't weapons, there isn't even a thing u can fit in low slots to increase damage or Rof or a market where u could find a missile launcher thats big enough to compare with large weapons.

Further more the heaviest launcher is H-50, uses about 60 cpu and 50 powergrid. It is the biggest missile launcher in game. The biggest laser/hybird/projetle weapons use about same cpu but about 30 times more powergrid.

It is all very balanced. Raven can have only 4 turrents max when apoc can have 8. So if a Raven fights against an apoc it has half the fire power of an apoc? No, wait , raven can fire missiles ! the only way to stop turrent fire is to blow the ship which is firing up. To stop missiles from doing damage u only need to make sure u blow the missile boat up and warp away since missile boats don't have many turrents. Large turrents shoot very far away. Cruise missiles fly 600 m/s. It only takes the missiles 50 seconds to fly 30k if their target doesn't move at all. What if the apoc doesnt stay idle and use smartbombs?

If missiles are considered weapons then the ships that use them as primary weapons wouldn't be combat ships. And it is very fun to fit shield hardeners and shield boosters and take twice as much damage as you ship can do and feel uber and said: "Hey ! I lasted 30 seconds before my capacitor dried up and you pod killed me!, how come u still have ur shield up?! u dont even have shield hardeners?! Ah right u had 8 turrents and u spent your capacitor in doing damage than taking damage. How about the missiles? I fired A LOT OF them. Ahhhh, u were moving ! It is cheating to move away from missiles u know! they don't hit if u move !" Raven is perfectly balaced, just not for fighting anything that is bigger a Maller and it will be fine. It is the top of line combat ship of Caldari after all.

Kestrel is the best caldari ship. It can fire cruise missiles at the same rate as a battleship( reloading time is actually faster than a launcher's loading speed in case u didnt know). it can fire 4 cruise missiles at the same time. So 3 kestrels can outdamage a Raven. 12 cruise missiles at a time.

Who needs Raven? npc caldari state police ! npc caldari pirates !

Stop dreaming and get real and start using Amarr super laser gun ships(Large laser cap use 5% per lvl), Gal super drone hybird gun ships(Large hybird dmg 5% per lvl), Minmatar super projetle gun. ships(5% dmg/RoF large projetle perlvl). Why? because u can have 100%+ dmg mod and 100%+ RoF with turrents.

Caldari ships are the best, really, missiles always do the same damage no matter what ship u are in. If u don't believe they are the best you must be a good player.








Darkwolf
Caldari
TOG Empire
Combat Mining and Logistics
Posted - 2003.07.28 04:17:00 - [2]
 

Well, that was possibly the most incoherent page of drivel I have ever had the misfortune of not being able to avoid reading.

Unable to form a response to that mishmash of conflicting opinions and useless syntax, I shall remain silent.

Takeda Seikiri
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2003.07.28 04:28:00 - [3]
 

umm, yea. i think you missed the point of the original thread about ship balancing.

he said that the Raven is underpowered relative to the other battleships and missles do not even anything out as they are comparatively weaker and there are not battleship class launchers.

i'm not sure what your rambling was about. as far as i could tell, you were describing how to defend against missles??

definitely not sure where the kestrel came into play as that's a frigate. and we were talking about battleships?

anyways...


Digital Sin
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2003.07.28 04:55:00 - [4]
 

i like his thoughts. i can kind of get the slight hint that he is possibly nudging at the idea that missiles currently SUCK. what is this, you have 5 rounds per H50, each round takes time to get there, they collide with each other so you have to space them out, they are slow, they can get vaped by a gun, a defender or a smartbomb, they can cause deadly (to you) splash damage on a gate, and you have to drop 10,000 isk a shot even IF you produce them from a blueprint.


i have missile launcher level 5 and a caracal, a kestrel, and i am debating the raven (currently fly an apocalypse) the kestrel does LOADS of damage, if you can get it in without it getting nuked. fat chance. the caracal is ok, but just a kestrel with bigger stats basically. the raven is the big bad momma of caldari, which should (by definition) wipe the floor with other ships 1v1. no cap usage, 6 med slots, high shields and good technological balance.


in reality it feels like you are rolling marbles at ants and hoping they hit. missiles are so damn slow i dont even use them anymore. i mean what is this, 300m/s for a torpedo? if i use any other gun, the enemy is DEAD before the torp arrives! it looks like we will never attack stationary objects so forget that logic. cruise missiles arent much better, you cant fire them fast at all. now, if you could get this thing to fire nonstop, and i MEAN nonstop (just click all on, let them go) without a missile exploding and causing a nuclear domino effect all the way down, then it would be fun.


currently to me using missiles is like walking up to someone and saying "ok, now i am going to take this anvil and drop it on your head. it will kill you, but i really need you to stand RIGHT here, and dont move. thanks."

Guardian334
Posted - 2003.07.28 18:07:00 - [5]
 

If missiles aren't 'weapons' the same as turreted weapons, then it's Bulls*** to base racial cruisers around missile tubes (Minmatar)

Either fix missiles so they're valuable and viable, or change Minmatar hulls to give us back the useless missile slots.


 

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