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Aotearorian
Posted - 2005.08.08 06:45:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Aotearorian on 16/09/2005 08:28:57
Edited by: Aotearorian on 16/09/2005 08:26:25
Edited by: Aotearorian on 14/09/2005 02:20:16
Edited by: Aotearorian on 14/09/2005 02:18:19
Edited by: Aotearorian on 11/09/2005 13:41:42
Edited by: Aotearorian on 09/09/2005 13:19:29
Edited by: Aotearorian on 07/09/2005 00:10:59
Thread got to long and contains posts that have no relation to actual topic, so I edit a first post to put summary of bugs and issues I accouter when I start to play Eve as a new player. I do not list all the bugs. Just one’s that affected my game play, make me waste my time, get me upset and generally decrease my enjoyment of the game.

Crystal description ---- fixed

Tracking disruptors do not work on NPC.

Refineries always take 5% tax, no matter of standing. Well, all corp. refineries I did mission for. It seems that for older players tax is decreasing and become 0% on +6 standing. -------------- Fixed

Skills like fast talk seems have no effect.

Escrow show only last deal with the same name. Allow an exploit letting people hide a good deal the moment they appear.

Drones when given return command often ignoring it or stopping > 2.5km from the stationary ship, so scoop into drone bay command does not work.

Drones multiply select/scoup to cargo bay. Only first drone will get in.

Target animation will dissapear if you try to target more then one ship in time and in some other cases.
------------- Sort of fixed replaced in lates pach by:

Targeting animation does not dissapear if targeting is imposible, for a reason to long range for example.

Crystals that were used when they were not stacking still do not stack after latest pach.------ Fixed.

Some turets show incorrect amo requrements when packed in hangar.
In my case, many Turets using Medium ammo with show as using small Ammo.
Very unnoing when one does not remember there names by hart.

Dark Shikari
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2005.08.08 07:01:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Dark Shikari on 08/08/2005 07:01:39
It does greatly increased EM damage relative to its overall damage.

The Radio crystal is 100% EM, and the Standard is only about 60% EM.

The Radio does less because its range is longer.

This isn't a bug, its a lack of understanding.

F'nog
Amarr
Viziam
Posted - 2005.08.08 07:01:00 - [3]
 

Longest range weapons do the least amount of damage, so it makes sense that Standard does 8 overall while Radio does 5. Perhaps that's just the devs' way of saying it only does EM damage. After all, English is not their first language, so it's not surprising things don't always make perfect sense when they say something in it. How well can you write Icelandic?

Plus, that's not really a bug, more of a typo. There are far more important things to worry about in the game than how well the description matchs up with reality, as long as it is basically accurate.

Aotearorian
Posted - 2005.08.08 07:08:00 - [4]
 

It is clearly a bug.
Microwave s Modulates the beam of a laser weapon into the microwave frequencies. Improved range. Increased EM damage. EM 4 termal 2

EM damage actially decrease.
Please, correct description would be: Increase range, decrease EM and termal damage.

Do you expect players like me who start to play 2-3 week ago to be able to sort that out?

Please.

wild Ari
Euphoria Released
Minor Threat.
Posted - 2005.08.08 07:45:00 - [5]
 

i dont read descriptions at all.
just check the attributes and you see everything you need to know.
this is one of the most transparent games ever.
everything is documented and can be calculated.

F'nog
Amarr
Viziam
Posted - 2005.08.08 08:17:00 - [6]
 

Actually, I think those skill descriptions are left over from about a year ago, when lasers could be fired without crystals at greatly reduced damage. So, at the time, they were all correct. They just haven't been updated.

It's not really something to get worked up about. As was already stated, the stats are all listed for you to know exactly what's going on. If you stuck only to descriptions, you wouldn't get anywhere in this game, as they tell you very little practical information. They are there for RP reasons, mostly.

Lanfear's Bane
Mining Munitions and Mayhem
R i s e
Posted - 2005.08.08 08:18:00 - [7]
 

If I had a gun that fired the colours of the rainbow and it fired green and blue and I found a crystal to put into it that made it fire yellow, green, blue and indigo I would have increased it's range. Range does not always mean distance. Increased damage could be due to increasing it's EM range and hence increase damage. Your vocabulary is bugged.

Lanfear's Bane.


F'nog
Amarr
Viziam
Posted - 2005.08.08 10:13:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Lanfear's Bane
If I had a gun that fired the colours of the rainbow and it fired green and blue and I found a crystal to put into it that made it fire yellow, green, blue and indigo I would have increased it's range. Range does not always mean distance. Increased damage could be due to increasing it's EM range and hence increase damage. Your vocabulary is bugged.

Lanfear's Bane.




Anybody else understand this one? I'm lost.

Jenny Spitfire
Caldari
Posted - 2005.08.08 10:21:00 - [9]
 

Edited by: Jenny Spitfire on 08/08/2005 10:21:45
Originally by: F'nog

Anybody else understand this one? I'm lost.


He is saying "range" means variety or an assortment, whereas "distance" means length and therefore, range may not neccessarily be the same as distance. bleh... ;p

F'nog
Amarr
Viziam
Posted - 2005.08.08 12:31:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
Edited by: Jenny Spitfire on 08/08/2005 10:21:45
Originally by: F'nog

Anybody else understand this one? I'm lost.


He is saying "range" means variety or an assortment, whereas "distance" means length and therefore, range may not neccessarily be the same as distance. bleh... ;p


Well, since the item stats use Range, I'm gonna go with that then.

Dark Shikari
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2005.08.08 13:46:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Aotearorian
It is clearly a bug.
Microwave s Modulates the beam of a laser weapon into the microwave frequencies. Improved range. Increased EM damage. EM 4 termal 2

EM damage actially decrease.
Please, correct description would be: Increase range, decrease EM and termal damage.

Do you expect players like me who start to play 2-3 week ago to be able to sort that out?

Please.

No, EM damage increases.

As I said, EM damage is 5/8 of the standard crystal, but 2/3 of the microwave crystal. Thats a boost.

The microwave crystal does less damage overall due to longer range.

Deja Thoris
Invicta.
Rooks and Kings
Posted - 2005.08.08 15:51:00 - [12]
 

Descriptions leave a bit to be desired.

Get over it.

Shoot further = less damage

There I've summed it up/

Jelosavich
Posted - 2005.08.08 19:51:00 - [13]
 

Bug + bug + bug + bug = 4*bug

There, I've summed it up

Aotearorian
Posted - 2005.08.09 00:24:00 - [14]
 

You know, folk, insted of defending this kind of bugs you should go true all eve and try to find them and report them. You should have bag your developers with this kind of bug reports untill they fix it.

This kind of bugs have bigger effect on game then something like you new hahaor/roxor stuff display energy time incorrectly.

This kind of thinks are what new players see and that they put off!

I am very put of trying to sort out what kind of turet Medium beam laser is? Why it called medium, but in small turets? Is it small turet for skill/ship bonuses or medium turet?

Well, after a week I am now resonably sure it is a small turet, but there no reason I should be confused like that. The same term should never be used for different meaning in the same contex!

I am not going to report that thinks, I am just trying to fit my destroyer.
More bugs I notised:

After finish tutorial and storyline mission story line agent refer me to an other agent. Well, I close dialog expecting this agent to appear in my agent list. It did not. I spend an hour returning to my agent and trying to talk to him for no avail. This is definatly broken and later I see the same comlains from other new players in the forum.

Insted of fixin your rahor/hahor stuff, fix the simple thinks. 99.9% of player would probably never run POS, but probably 100% of new players will do tutorial and try to undestand what stuff does!


Racknan
Posted - 2005.08.09 01:48:00 - [15]
 

Um, turrent sizes are easy to firgure out. Check out the required skills. Small, Medium, or Large.

Also, who ever said you can't have a Medium Sized Small laser? or a Large small Laser?

It's simply an extra word defining how big the weapon is within the larger catogory.

Descriptions don't tell you squat about just about everything. Check the real info - the stats and requirements.

Dark Shikari
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2005.08.09 02:13:00 - [16]
 

Edited by: Dark Shikari on 09/08/2005 02:14:09
Originally by: Aotearorian
You know, folk, insted of defending this kind of bugs you should go true all eve and try to find them and report them. You should have bag your developers with this kind of bug reports untill they fix it.


But its not a bug, so they shouldn't "fix" it.

Quote:

This kind of bugs have bigger effect on game then something like you new hahaor/roxor stuff display energy time incorrectly.

This kind of thinks are what new players see and that they put off!


I hope you're put off--we don't want people complaining about things that are perfectly fine playing EVE.

Quote:

I am very put of trying to sort out what kind of turet Medium beam laser is? Why it called medium, but in small turets? Is it small turet for skill/ship bonuses or medium turet?

Well, after a week I am now resonably sure it is a small turet, but there no reason I should be confused like that. The same term should never be used for different meaning in the same contex!

I am not going to report that thinks, I am just trying to fit my destroyer.


Thats not a bug, thats how it is. Turret sizes = small/medium/large/XL, weapon sizes = light/medium/heavy/superheavy/ultraheavy/etc. A weapon might be a dual barrel light, and be a small turret, or a quad barrel light, and be a medium.

Quote:

More bugs I notised:

After finish tutorial and storyline mission story line agent refer me to an other agent. Well, I close dialog expecting this agent to appear in my agent list. It did not. I spend an hour returning to my agent and trying to talk to him for no avail. This is definatly broken and later I see the same comlains from other new players in the forum.


This is an old bug. You're free to go do what you want after the storyline agent.

Quote:

Insted of fixin your rahor/hahor stuff, fix the simple thinks. 99.9% of player would probably never run POS, but probably 100% of new players will do tutorial and try to undestand what stuff does!


Actually, I'd say the majority of EVE players have at least used a POS. In fact, there is currently a massive problem because too many people are running them. There are over 1000 at the moment, probably run or used by on average 5-10 players each. That means 1/5 of EVE is currently running a POS, or at least using one.

Also, the EVE dev team has multiple parts. One part is the bugfixing team--another part is the content team. You can't make the content team fix bigs--they don't even know how to code. If you want a bug fixed, REPORT IT, by all means.

Aotearorian
Posted - 2005.08.15 01:40:00 - [17]
 

I desided to list bugs here that I accounter as a new player that effect my gameplay.
In this case I spend a lot of time training skills, that do not work.

Seems I do not have that mach skill, that significally effect my game play.

Tracking distraptors do not work on NPC.

Dark Shikari
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2005.08.15 01:49:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Aotearorian

Tracking distraptors do not work on NPC.


Yeah, and neither do nosferatus (they drain cap but don't stop them from using items).

Jammers didn't work until a few months ago, dampeners do nothing.

These aren't bugs however--this is entirely intended.

Aotearorian
Posted - 2005.08.15 02:36:00 - [19]
 

That is clearly a bug.

If a have a module and it has description, it should work as description say.

Otherwise, put description: "Does not work on NPC". That is better then current system, but still will be a bug.

It will create a 2 games, P-P game and NPC game. If I have a module I use in p-p, I should be able to use it why npc'in and otherwize.
To say it is not a bug is to give one group people advantage on other depended on there game style. If I am ratting in 0.0 I should be able to equip my ship with modules that work on rats and on other players.

Dark Shikari
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2005.08.15 03:18:00 - [20]
 

Edited by: Dark Shikari on 15/08/2005 03:22:26
Originally by: Aotearorian
It will create a 2 games, P-P game and NPC game.

No, it already has, and that is ENTIRELY INTENDED.

Even if all modules worked on NPCs, it would still be entirely different, because players are intelligent and use varying setups, ECM, and tactics, while NPCs don't.

Its only a bug if it wasn't intended. If CCP did it on purpose, it is NOT A BUG!

Just because you don't like it doesn't make it a bug.

MooKids
Caldari
The Graduates
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2005.08.15 03:53:00 - [21]
 

CCP removed the use of EW on NPCs because it made fighting them entirely too EASY.

People were able to farm NPC BSes using cruisers or in some cases, frigates. A single Battleship could jam an NPC to fight aanother one, effectively removing any risk. They wanted to make the game fun and exciting, not turn into a grind quest.

Aotearorian
Posted - 2005.08.15 03:53:00 - [22]
 

Again, seens you do not read. If it is intended, description should say: "Does not work on NPC."

Description does not say that - a bug!

MooKids
Caldari
The Graduates
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2005.08.15 04:00:00 - [23]
 

Well that wouldn't exactly fit in with the RP aspect.

Besides, you are complaining about minor things. Hell, I would consider the whole corp tax thing more important than this. Just let it go and be happy.

By the way, your name wouldn't happen to be Geoff, would it?

Dark Shikari
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2005.08.15 04:35:00 - [24]
 

Originally by: Aotearorian
Again, seens you do not read. If it is intended, description should say: "Does not work on NPC."

Description does not say that - a bug!

But CCP has said they don't work, and they don't.

They didn't make a mistake in the coding that caused it to not work. It was never programmed to work in the first place.

Aotearorian
Posted - 2005.08.15 04:41:00 - [25]
 

It is not a minor. How I can know does a modul work and what it does if I can not use it 99% of the time?

Let me spell it out for you again.
My time:
step 1:
reading description thinking, cool, i can decrease range of NPC and finally do this darn mission. I can trop this darn 300 hp/hit turets hitting me from god knows where and kill ships.
step 2: ok, no, I need to get skill and prerequisites and train them.

Buy skill = time + money = time ^2
Train skills = time

getting modules = time + money
Fitting my ship = time

Using it and seeing no effect, barelly warping out = time

Trying again, thinking I am doing something wrong = time
decided to test on easy NPC = time
Finally realising it does not work = time + Getting upset + getting upset + getting upset.

Writing about it here and asking question = time

Writing again and explaining why it is a bug and need to be fixed ASP = time

Wandering, can I believe any description in Eve and should I bother because after spending mounth getting skills and money to do stuff it would not work?

Dark Shikari
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Posted - 2005.08.15 04:54:00 - [26]
 

Edited by: Dark Shikari on 15/08/2005 04:55:51
Responding to stupid posts = time.

Stop posting, save me some time.

MooKids
Caldari
The Graduates
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2005.08.15 05:16:00 - [27]
 

Edited by: MooKids on 15/08/2005 05:16:54
You know, if you are getting this worked up over a minor issue (and it is a minor issue), then I wonder how you will handle the big things. Like having your ore "stolen" or getting podded in .4 and below space.

You have learned the facts and now you can move on. No need to get so upset over it.

Besides, you are the ONLY person I have ever seen even mention this.

Take a breath, relax, and move on.

EDIT: Forgot to ask, have you filed a bug report then since it is such a "big deal"?

Aotearorian
Posted - 2005.08.15 05:38:00 - [28]
 

Thinks you mention are what is this game is about. I expect this kind of think to happened. I am now a Newbie in P-P games. I actially grow up on mach harshe p-p game then Eve ever is/was. Meridian59, did you hear about that?
It was first ever graphic 3d Multiplayer game with a persistent world, realised in 1996 by 3do. 3do made mess out of it. It is still exist, run by a small company.
In that game if you killed, you loose everything on you + 1% of your skills. No clones.
In original form there was no storage, so, you carry all your items with you.

What I am saying about beeen spoiled is that: If item description say it does that, it would do that! Not when a blue moon look over my sholder. If ability say it does that, it would do that. You can read description and plan your actions. And if your item does not work in that case, you will get a message - no effect. In case of tracker, log file give message that it working.

I am expected to treated fairly by the game. Not to be trapt in wasting my time on thinks whitch would not work.

If no one else mentioned this, is probably because they do not think themself. it is clearly extrimelly powerfull module in current form, if it work, offcause.

MooKids
Caldari
The Graduates
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2005.08.15 06:03:00 - [29]
 

Originally by: Aotearorian
If no one else mentioned this, is probably because they do not think themself.


Or they just don't care and don't want to turn it into a personal crusade over a minor issue.

If it is SO important, then file a bug report or shut up.

Aotearorian
Posted - 2005.08.15 08:01:00 - [30]
 

Edited by: Aotearorian on 15/08/2005 08:02:27
well, do you want this game to continue to attract a new players or not?

If you do not, that please, continue with your current attitude that the bugs, misliading or false in game information is a minor issue.

I lost a weekend on this issue, that finished in prostration. Seens it is just a next point in line of simular problems existing in the game, this unhappy state just tend to increase exponentially. Right now I am talking about it, because I still like a lot about the game. You should be scared when I stop talking, because I would simply be gone, as probably thouthend of others.

Developers seems to cutter more and more for veteran, along the way removing gameplay elements from a new players. I would be probably stick to cruiser for next 1/2 year. Get learning skills up would probably take about that amount of time. So, L3 missions are not avalible. Gte some supper hurdeners? How do I know they work agains NPC? May be they do not and they demant L 5 in Mechanic or something?


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