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blankseplocked The Introduction of lvl 2 stuff, good or bad ?
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Posted - 2003.07.09 02:32:00 - [1]

Will the introduction of lvl 2 equipment/weapons/modules throw the balance of this game out the window ?

First I assume that lvl 2 stuff will be introduced in NPC pirate loot. As it stands now pretty much only the big Corps and Pirates are out in the low sec areas and they will be the ones who get the lvl 2 drops first. But it won't be long before the masses get ahold of that stuff.

If you look at what would happen if say lvl 2 miners and lvl 2 cargo expanders are introduced. Corp's will be able to mine more ore into ships holds faster and in larger number. How will this effect the eco ? Will it drive prices down even farther ? Will it make you able to make more cash faster and faster with standard NPC prices ? The effect might be that items like ships which require the largest amount of minerals easyer to make in larger numbers, resulting in cheaper and cheaper prices. This also might effect the speed in which this game is going, as in too fast now in how easy it is to get into cruisers and battleships are even being turned out faster.

We have gone through a lot of balancing weapon wise. Will better weapons that only a few can get give some an edge in battle that none will be able to compete with ? With the large number of different modules that can be used, will the likely hood of even more bugs be thrown into the mix effect the game in a large way.

With the value of the isk atm be even worth less when better stuff comes along. As it stands now we make so much cash that even high prices for items doesn't mean a whole lot as we really have nothing to spend it on after awhile.

As a solo player from day 1 I have been able to make a fair amount of cash ingame and still have more than I can spend. I even used a mule account for mining, and even mining Omber solo with a Maller and a Bestower can get 100k Omber in one night with out to much difficulty. Omber may seem low end ore to many but thats about 4 mil a night or so in high sec systems with no threats at all but a few NPC pirates that 1 laser on a Maller makes quick work of.

I know that many including myself want the next lvl of ships/equipment, but will it throw all this into the crapper when we can strip mine solo low sec systems faster and faster with less and less effort.

Just a thought here, and I hope that none of that stuff is ingame atm with out being tested and tested bigtime.

Jash Illian
Light Brigade Industries L.L.C.
Posted - 2003.07.09 02:34:00 - [2]

I wouldn't expect them to be all that distorting...

Overdrive Injector System I:
Volume: 5m3
Mass: 50kg
Tech Level: 2
Speed Bonus: 30m/s
Agility Bonus: 0.03%
Cargo Capacity Bonus: -15%

Posted - 2003.07.09 02:36:00 - [3]

Tech level 2 items ARE in the game. I have found several, and they are NOT a big increase over level 1 items. Having these will not make anyone over powering.

Posted - 2003.07.09 03:43:00 - [4]

hmm ok trying to figure some of this out as I cannot get into game with main account.

When I was mining with 2 accounts, 1 Maller with 4 XeCL Drilling beams and 1 Bestower with 1 XeCL Drilling beam I was pulling in 5 x 47 units or 235 units per pull. That allowed me to fill up a Bestower with Expaned Cargo in like 14-15 minutes for around a little bit more than 11k worth of Omber. Close to 45k or so Omber in one hr.

If I had Miner II's which pull in 60 units per pull according to data base.
Thats 5 x 60 units or 300 units per pull, just under 1 third increase. So something like 10 minutes to fill up a Beastower or 55-60k Omber in one hr.

Now look at Cargo Expanders.

Basic Cargo Expander - 15%
Expanded Cargo I - 18%
Expanded Cargo II - 21%

Now there are some loot that even give more. So looking at under 10 minutes to fill a Bestower givening even more ore per hr. Thats not a bad increase for a solo miner. Big Corp's can go even faster with many mining.

Thats my concern, meaning I can make around 1.5 mil more per hr mining Omber solo, very easy no risk.

Posted - 2003.07.09 03:48:00 - [5]

Yes, big corps can 'go faster'. They have more people. That is the advangate to joining a corp, and not going solo. Everyone in the game has a chance to use anything in the game. Saying that it is unfair that the big corps can use it faster is NOT a valid gripe.

Posted - 2003.07.09 03:58:00 - [6]

No I wasn't saying at all that is is unfair to the big Corp. What I was saying is that solo players can mine more, faster making more cash. It creates an upward spiral with more and more cash being put into a system that is allready overloaded with cash. As it stands now I make more cash than I know what to do with as there is no real money sinks in this game. Three Cruisers, three frigates, one indy, all the BP's I want so I have no real need to buy anything anymore.

Posted - 2003.07.09 04:07:00 - [7]

It's simple and I think stated before with the nerfing of all the level 1 stuff. Everyone said just wait for higher tech to come out.

Your post starts what was predicted. Therefore once it is found that there might be an advantage to have something better or more efficient it will get nerfed back to the stone ages. Along with further nerfing of their predecessor's (and skills)to make it look like higher tech actually has some advantages over lower tech.

History will continue to repeat.

In the end unless there is very little difference between lvl 1 and lvl 5 the same arguement will be brought up time and time again. Sad isn't it?

Uber equiped will always outstrip standard equiped. The cry's go out and the nerf bat swings to quiet the masses.

Posted - 2003.07.09 04:22:00 - [8]

That is so true Pyroe. However I wasn't really talking about nurfing anything, but more over careful consideration before things are added and the effects they might have on things like the eco and the ability to mass large amounts of cash so quickly being solo.

As for combat I have done no PvP after release so the ones who do that are better to judge.

I remember seeing way back when and even in a post here that only the rich should be able to buy the high end stuff. This is what large Corps are. But I have to take a step back and look at myself, being solo able to by a BS at the going rate of 70 mil now with only a few nights of even mining Omber. With lvl 2 stuff being able to do that faster kinda makes me wounder.

Maarek Steele
GalTech Heavy Industries
Posted - 2003.07.09 04:49:00 - [9]

Barrack, i have a beta mod cargo expander which is 25% bonus to cargo space.

Ends Journey
Posted - 2003.07.09 05:28:00 - [10]

Efficiency and inflation are the qestions.

On the topic of inflation its difficult to know if the money supply is increasing faster than the availibity of new goods and new players. However a very great deal of money is flowing into the market, and at a glance I dont' see very many ways for CCP to pull that cash back off the market if they need to without drastically altering supply and demand for minerals. Ulitmately all ISK derives from either killing or selling goods to NPC's for cash. With currest NPC demand for minerals at prices higher than players will pay for them there is a massive influx of new cash that is not being spent on NPC items. One thing is fairly certain CCP is monitoring inflation and will endevour to control it, in some fashion or other. Understanding how CCP intends to implement inflation control is key. I personally expect they'll botch it, because an economy is a slippery beast.

On the topic of efficiecy every item that has a BP on the open market is becoming very efficient. Competition is tight and supply is good. I think we can expect the prices on these goods to drop to a lvl that reflects the real cost of mining the minerals to a huge company which is FAR less than npc prices for the same goods. Monopolys seem to be the future however and CCP seems to condone them with regard to BPs. Those corps that get a rare and valuable BP will be the real moneymakers. These monopolized goods will remain inefficient and therefore very profitable. Basically if the BP is widely avaible you can plan on not making very much profit, if the BP is a rare drop it can be the source of massive profits for the corp that posseses them.

Edited by: Ends on 09/07/2003 05:30:41


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