open All Channels
seplocked Missions & Complexes
blankseplocked Level 4 Missions + A Raven .. A Joke
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Pages: 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 7

Author Topic

Reku
Posted - 2005.04.01 00:50:00 - [121]
 

Edited by: Reku on 01/04/2005 00:54:41

Oh the irony... Most of whining coming from players who cant even do level 4 missions (checked some standings of this thread posters).

Seem like everyone should do mining in 0.0 space as its such huge 'risk' and requires skill. Wait... It doesn't and on top of that its BORING. Yes mining in 0.0 is still mining and is boring. Having instas/safe spots and log-off when everything else fails does NOT make mining in 0.0 risky.

Now for all you pirates who want more targets. Boohoo. It doesn't matter if CCP made isk roids to 0.0 that would drop huge amount of isk when mined and people would still not move to 0.0 space. Some people simply don't enjoy pvp in eve and cant blame them as its mostly huge blob waiting at gate to gank anyone and when things get hot for them they use instas to jump next 10 systems and log-off. Like friend of mine said 'pirating in eve is all about making the other guy take the risk while you take reward'. Gate campers don't take risk while guy who comes from gate does.

Want to populate 0.0? Let players build their own (conquerable) empires there from sentries to own market and production. Instead nerfing level 4 agents there should be different kind of reward from 0.0 space.

Slithereen
Amarr
Posted - 2005.04.01 01:56:00 - [122]
 

Edited by: Slithereen on 01/04/2005 02:01:30

Quote:
If you don't understand that you SHOULD NOT be able to earn as much money doing PVE as you should be able to doing PVP then this is the wrong game for you. Whether you do PVP isn't my concern, I don't really care, what does concern me if how people are screaming for this game to be more and more PVE focused.


Ironically, it is the trend for games like this to be increasingly PvE focused, more like EQ and other games because that is the bulk where players---and the money---are going now. PvP shards have been only for the minority and never matched the numbers in PvE only servers. It is a business decision one has to make where there are bank loans to pay, families to feed... CCP may have hit the realization that the situation with 0.0 space isn't going to earn them their daily bread.

And yes, it is this is SIM space online. I have finally accepted what EVE is truly all about, not what it pretends to be and what other players imagine it to be.

If you want a real game that focuses on PvP, where PvP actually makes more money than PvE, try a MMO I used to play: www.shatteredgalaxy.com.

In the game, true PvP combat actually adds more experience to your units, while more conquered terrain means more money to your faction, which is divided for its players, which means more money to you.

EVE is miserably structured from the very beginning that miners, traders and agent runners will always make more money than pure PvP'ers, many of whom I know remains relatively poor. At the same time, there are way too many escape hatches in the game, docking, safespotting, insta-BMs... Even PvP'ers have to engage in much PvE tasks to earn money. The typical EVE player, including most people who claim to be PvP'ers are really 3/4 PVE'ers and 1/4 PvP when it comes to their online time usage.


mahhy
MASS
Posted - 2005.04.01 09:56:00 - [123]
 

Edited by: mahhy on 01/04/2005 10:02:02
Originally by: X'Alor
And all that spuage of caca has to do with

Level 4 Missions + A Raven .. A Joke

How?????????


Rolling Eyes

I'm simply replying to some of the points made in the thread regarding the fact that the amount of income in level 4 missions is insanely high compared to their risk. THey are also an insanely high source of ISK/hour as compared to 0.0 space. I was merely suggesting that perhaps since CCP obviously doesn't want to nerf level 4 missions, they instead focus on creating higher ISK/hour, better rewards per risk, in 0.0 space. Then all the level 4 mission runners can make their isk in peace and the people who try and fight to live in 0.0 have higher rewards. The way it should be.

Its all connected, and its not my problem that you're too blind to see that.

mahhy
MASS
Posted - 2005.04.01 09:58:00 - [124]
 

Originally by: X'Alor
you people are something else. biatching about something most of you don't even do.

and ultimately it comes down to whining about player interaction.


flaming removed - Sherkaner

1.) Perhaps this isn't my only character?
2.) Perhaps I have lots of corp mates or other friends in the game who DO run level 4 missions and tell me all about?

capt
Posted - 2005.04.01 11:12:00 - [125]
 

Originally by: mahhy

1.) Perhaps this isn't my only character?
2.) Perhaps I have lots of corp mates or other friends in the game who DO run level 4 missions and tell me all about?


Perhaps you do not realise that a lot these stories that are told to you by "corp mates" or "friends" are embellished to say the least......Rolling Eyes

Quote:
Are you mentally defective?


I think Sherkaner is on a holiday and other mods are neglecting the mission forum because this and other remarks (from other people) in other posts could sure use some *snipping*.

I still think this post needs to be locked, it is the same discussion all over again from the previous posts. You might as well copy paste everything and you wouldn't know the difference......

(ppppfffffrrrrrrt I feel another one of these emails about "if your not happy with the forum moderation blablabla coming up")

Arbitos
GamCorp
Posted - 2005.04.01 11:14:00 - [126]
 

Originally by: Typherin laidai
Originally by: Arbitos
Originally by: Typherin laidai
And bfr I get the "ooOoo its just the Raven" comments... what a load of crap. his 2 month old m8 is doing exactly the same in an Apoc.

Typherin


No disprespect but your talking complete sh*t about the APOC. For a start he would need Torps or Cruises to lvl 3/4 to deal with the pesky Intys if they get to close, thats a bit of training with low level learning skills.

He'd need decent cap skills to tank all spawns, he'd need to train the prerequists to uses hardners as well. without a decent AMARR BS level wouldn't get the massive tanking advantage of the Apoc. He would need the Energy weapons thingy skill that cuts down energy used by energy turrets. He'd also need armour repairer at a reasonable level.

He'd need good tracking skills or he wouldn't hit sh*t, To actually do any damage he'd need fairly decent level in Large Energy Turret, good Rapid Firing, reasonable Surgical strike etc. The ability to use T2 dmg mods would be very useful too.

Even if your goal in life was purely to fly an APOC for LVL 4 in 2 months, then you would not be able to do Silence the informant Solo or probably most others, you would fail on the first level. You would either:

a) not be able to tank the dmg as them skills were too low.

b) not even get close to breaking the Supreme Parasites tank as all skills invested in the above.

Your also implying that the guy would be training all these skills with no points in learning, which doesn't help. Or let me guess your m8 all got all Adv learning to lvl 4 and trained for the APOC in 2 months Shocked

Next time you want to start a contraversial thread that gets lots of replys, please as least don't make stuff up to make a point, because you evidently have know nothing about Apocs and Gunnerys skills and you certainly do not have a 2 month old pal that Solo's all LVL 4's in one.

Nuff Said

Shocked


I think I made it quite clear that they where skipping the deadspace missions (somewhere or other). So learn to read please. and yes I also said i dont think they have trained theyre learning skills . . or if they have not too a high level.

Learn to read please

Typherin


Soz, missed that. However most of the normal ones he wouldn't be able to do either, I was just absing it on he would die on the DS ones.

The normal ones he would be warping in and out so much and killing so little he would be better off mining with 3 Miner II's to make money. Surely saying something is too easy, but you can really do it, have to skip levels and can't earn **** doing it is not a valid point.

0.0 space isn't dangerous if you have a few Safe spots and keep moving? You don't acheive a lot but can do with a 1 day old player, doesn't make it worth doing tho.


mahhy
MASS
Posted - 2005.04.01 11:57:00 - [127]
 

Originally by: capt

Perhaps you do not realise that a lot these stories that are told to you by "corp mates" or "friends" are embellished to say the least......Rolling Eyes


Of course... all the people *I* talk to about the missions they do are lying and embellishing. All the people in this and so many other threads defending level 4 mission are what then?

What a laugh. The facts are there for anyone to see...

Reku
Posted - 2005.04.01 12:23:00 - [128]
 

Originally by: mahhy
Originally by: capt

Perhaps you do not realise that a lot these stories that are told to you by "corp mates" or "friends" are embellished to say the least......Rolling Eyes


Of course... all the people *I* talk to about the missions they do are lying and embellishing. All the people in this and so many other threads defending level 4 mission are what then?

What a laugh. The facts are there for anyone to see...

Come back once you have enough standing to do even one level 4 agent and tell how easy isk it is.

Anyone who dont have standing enough to do level 4 agent themself shouldnt be complaining about it before they have done week or two of these.

Threat
Minmatar
Fat Lip Inc.
5th Rule of Kintaro Alliance
Posted - 2005.04.01 13:47:00 - [129]
 

yes everyone that posts on these forums is totally honest, just like when they submit kill mails.

People, by nature, are prone to exageration. Next time they do a mission go on it with them. See for yourself.

If the mission is too easy use a different ship, or try it solo (ie alnoe, all by yourself, without an alt helper, etc.). More and more we are finding out from some the moist vocal whiners, in their own words, that they have either never done them themselves or have an alt or friend helping them.


capt
Posted - 2005.04.01 14:11:00 - [130]
 

Originally by: mahhy

What a laugh. The facts are there for anyone to see...


All bow to the mighty mahhy the greatest authority regarding agents and missions of EVE.

Your standings don't even allow access to a lvl 3 agent. The character you are using to post with such authority about mission probably hasn't run a mission in it's miserable life.

Either post with your mission running character to prove you at least have some hands on experience because now you have ZERO credibility when it comes down to talking about missions.
So you've heard from "friends" and "corpmates" this and that about missions......
Well When I was in highschool I "heard" from "friends" that they were dating supermodels..........Rolling EyesLaughing

every week day I play EVE for like 3-4 hours a day and in weekends up to 12 hours a day depending on personal life obligations and I am not making the billions some people claim mission runners are earning.
I never decline a mission, I do them all, being elephantine haul or silence the informant or whatever, I do it.

If you are right and you seem to be speaking with such authority, then I guess I should be petitioning CCP for all the billions I should have earned by now and that I never got....... I clearly must have some sort of bug only effecting MY earnings.........Rolling Eyes

Threat
Minmatar
Fat Lip Inc.
5th Rule of Kintaro Alliance
Posted - 2005.04.01 14:48:00 - [131]
 

I must have the same bug capt.

But of course I know a guy who knows this other guy that swears his corp mate made 10 billion last week running missions in Oursulant. He completed each mission in an average of 15 minutes in his assult Ibis and got over 100,000 T2 comps, 6 dread seige launchers, 50 rare tags, and now has 3 Caldari Navy ravens. Since he had civilian lasers on he didn't even have to use ammo. He posted here earlier but it was with an alt so no one would know who he was.

Bleakheart
Caldari
Posted - 2005.04.01 15:58:00 - [132]
 

Originally by: Dianabolic
Originally by: Bleakheart
Absolute, eh? Let's have some facts supporting this statement then...


I'm not talking about your gaming, Bleakheart, I'm talking about the basic philosophy the dev's have stated they are following time and time again which is entirely based around risk vs reward.

You mine trit, no risk, little reward.
You mine Mercoxite, massive risk (not only from players but also from the gas cloud and NPC's), massive rewards.

You do agent missions in safe sector space and you earn more per hour than a mercoxite miner, that isn't balanced, GET IT?

It's not exactly rocket science, I fear trying any harder is a waste of my time. If you don't understand that you SHOULD NOT be able to earn as much money doing PVE as you should be able to doing PVP then this is the wrong game for you. Whether you do PVP isn't my concern, I don't really care, what does concern me if how people are screaming for this game to be more and more PVE focused.

Go play sims online if that's what you want. Or even better, play sims offline.


On the contrary, you mine trit, you're making a helluva lot of money now. I have personally witnessed a sale for 3.8 isk/unit on the market in The Citadel region. (see? this is an actual statistic based in factual evidence.) Mercoxite? Never seen the stuff. Don't know what it produces, don't care, I don't mine. Period. I also do not PvP, from all accounts you're lucky to find someone to do a little one on one with. And I'm not in to jumping through gates to find unsuspecting campers to brawl with.

Also, oblique attacks on my intelligence are so much more effective than factual evidence, how? Where were you last month when there were two new threads on this subject every second week? Because as for "..screaming for this game to be more and more PVE focused.", you need a history check. Seriously. It's not the carebears running level 4 missions in secure space screaming about anything, it's you and your ilk. Spin harder, you might have convinced your mates, but you sure aren't convincing anyone who actually runs them.


Dianabolic
Reikoku
Posted - 2005.04.01 18:23:00 - [133]
 

I've not insulted your intelligence in any way, bleakheart. I've said it's not rocket science, I assume you think it IS rocket science and have taken that as an insult. That's a shame.

So, let's take your post:

Originally by: Bleakheart
On the contrary, you mine trit, you're making a helluva lot of money now. I have personally witnessed a sale for 3.8 isk/unit on the market in The Citadel region. (see? this is an actual statistic based in factual evidence.) Mercoxite? Never seen the stuff. Don't know what it produces, don't care, I don't mine. Period. I also do not PvP, from all accounts you're lucky to find someone to do a little one on one with. And I'm not in to jumping through gates to find unsuspecting campers to brawl with.


I normally pay 3isk for trit. Even at 3isk per unit, given the twisted state of minerals at this time, you can earn almost as much mining that as you can whilst mining gneiss in 0.0. You see, that's also based on those lovely "facts" and you know what the problem is? The guy who is mining gneiss is taking far more of a risk than the guy who is mining gneiss, are you REALLY saying to me that that is how it should be?? Because, if you are, words fail me, because I find the concept of "completely safe gives you the same reward as 100% dangerous" as absolutely ludicrous, to say the least.

Originally by: Bleakheart
It's not the carebears running level 4 missions in secure space screaming about anything, it's you and your ilk. Spin harder, you might have convinced your mates, but you sure aren't convincing anyone who actually runs them.


You're DAMN RIGHT that it's "me and my ilk" who are screaming. I've done lvl 4's, I've made lots of isk on them, but the most recent patch was called EXODUS. You know WHY people haven't "EXODUS'd", Bleak? BECAUSE THERE IS NO REASON TO! Because people take the path of least resistance to earn as much isk as possible.

That means lvl 4's, empire. I don't want them to "nerf" agent missions. I want the risk reward put back in to balance, I want them to BOOST 0.0.

Anyone who denies that the current balance is complete fubar need only look at the numbers of pilots in empire to the number of pilots in 0.0 and then try to recall how many MORE pilots were in 0.0 pre-exodus.

Then say "exodus" 10 times and you might actually GET IT.

RollinDutchMasters
Gallente
Ordnance Delivery Services Inc.
Posted - 2005.04.01 19:21:00 - [134]
 

Originally by: Dianabolic
I've not insulted your intelligence in any way, bleakheart. I've said it's not rocket science, I assume you think it IS rocket science and have taken that as an insult. That's a shame.

So, let's take your post:

Originally by: Bleakheart
On the contrary, you mine trit, you're making a helluva lot of money now. I have personally witnessed a sale for 3.8 isk/unit on the market in The Citadel region. (see? this is an actual statistic based in factual evidence.) Mercoxite? Never seen the stuff. Don't know what it produces, don't care, I don't mine. Period. I also do not PvP, from all accounts you're lucky to find someone to do a little one on one with. And I'm not in to jumping through gates to find unsuspecting campers to brawl with.


I normally pay 3isk for trit. Even at 3isk per unit, given the twisted state of minerals at this time, you can earn almost as much mining that as you can whilst mining gneiss in 0.0. You see, that's also based on those lovely "facts" and you know what the problem is? The guy who is mining gneiss is taking far more of a risk than the guy who is mining gneiss, are you REALLY saying to me that that is how it should be?? Because, if you are, words fail me, because I find the concept of "completely safe gives you the same reward as 100% dangerous" as absolutely ludicrous, to say the least.

Originally by: Bleakheart
It's not the carebears running level 4 missions in secure space screaming about anything, it's you and your ilk. Spin harder, you might have convinced your mates, but you sure aren't convincing anyone who actually runs them.


You're DAMN RIGHT that it's "me and my ilk" who are screaming. I've done lvl 4's, I've made lots of isk on them, but the most recent patch was called EXODUS. You know WHY people haven't "EXODUS'd", Bleak? BECAUSE THERE IS NO REASON TO! Because people take the path of least resistance to earn as much isk as possible.

That means lvl 4's, empire. I don't want them to "nerf" agent missions. I want the risk reward put back in to balance, I want them to BOOST 0.0.

Anyone who denies that the current balance is complete fubar need only look at the numbers of pilots in empire to the number of pilots in 0.0 and then try to recall how many MORE pilots were in 0.0 pre-exodus.

Then say "exodus" 10 times and you might actually GET IT.
Dear mods. Saying anything negitive about lvl 4 missions is trolling. Please ban dianabolic because hes making me cry.

Cmdr Sy
Appetite 4 Destruction
The Firm.
Posted - 2005.04.01 19:22:00 - [135]
 

Some reasons Exodus didn't work out are...

1) POSs don't work as advertised. At the moment they're a hobby that pays for itself if you're lucky.

2a) Chokepoints into 0.0 remain few in number, something which is supposed to change soon (TM). I've had plenty of easy ganks at P3EN-E (who hasn't?), there really isn't much chance for most Empire corps to pass through that, unless they join an alliance, and 2b) alliances tend to tell you to get lost.

3) NPC stations in 0.0 are uncommon and agents there are still nothing special.

4) Boosting Empire agents came out months in advance of all of the above.

So, the solution is to stop bashing Empire L4s and instead to keep asking for extra POS features, boosts to 0.0 agents (quantity, quality, rewards, etc) and for the map redraw to include a few more chokepoints.

Trust me, I would fully support 0.0 agents becoming massively more rewarding, but only if people stop moaning about Empire L4s.

The real reason there is an apparent "imbalance" is that one feature came out far in advance of a whole load of new content. Request the new content.

Bleakheart
Caldari
Posted - 2005.04.01 23:15:00 - [136]
 

Edited by: Bleakheart on 01/04/2005 23:18:36
Kinda excitable, ain't ya? :P

Joking aside, uhm... Naw never mind, I think you'll blow a gasket...

Slithereen
Amarr
Posted - 2005.04.02 00:56:00 - [137]
 



If---

Most 0.0 systems get some conquerable stations.

Fill the stations with agents that give worthy missions.

Reduce the cost of operating a POS.

Provide much more access to 0.0 using more highways and entry points.

You are going to have a true Exodus into deep space.

The above measures will also turn PvP from a choke point gank setup to a territorial one. [Looking at EVE, CCP has absolutely zero clue how to create true territorial combat can be created in a game.]


Galk
Gallente
Autumn Tactics
All the things she said
Posted - 2005.04.02 01:36:00 - [138]
 

Edited by: Galk on 02/04/2005 01:37:36
Originally by: Slithereen


If---

M
Provide much more access to 0.0 using more highways and entry points.






No thanks.


Iv'e respected your opinion since the back end of 2003, that one it appears your giving in.

0.0 is the backwater, why the heck should it be colonised in the same way empire space is........

It's up to the players to make it there home if they truely want it.

Par example, the way shinra was took over period basis... there's naff all there, but there took that exodus and made it there home.

unlike most alliances, they stand and fight there ground.

It's called want for the better gain.

They work for there cause....

Unlike some of the alliances, they want it on a plate.

mahhy
MASS
Posted - 2005.04.02 05:10:00 - [139]
 

Edited by: mahhy on 02/04/2005 05:10:16
Originally by: capt
Your standings don't even allow access to a lvl 3 agent. The character you are using to post with such authority about mission probably hasn't run a mission in it's miserable life.


Laughing

Have you actually read what I've posted?

- level 4s in 0.5+ give a ton of isk for much less risk than even 0.1-0.4, let alone 0.0 space.
- CCP really seems to not want to nerf level 4s

With those 2 points in mind, make 0.0 more attractive. Its a pretty simple proposition. One that in fact protects level 4s from being nerfed.

Originally by: capt
I clearly must have some sort of bug only effecting MY earnings


I don't care about your earning. I care about earnings in 0.0 being massively higher than they are in Empire. The way it should be. The way its not right now.

I suggested some fixes to that without even mentioning nerfing level 4s.

Cmdr Sy
Appetite 4 Destruction
The Firm.
Posted - 2005.04.02 05:54:00 - [140]
 

By way of example...

I just did a IV-12 BS respawn (Gone Berserk) solo, in a 0.8, in an Armageddon.

Time taken was 1h 20m, including scooping cans (loot was straight to refine). Spawns totalled 1x750k, 3x500k, 8x90k. Total 2.97m. Agent pay was around half a mil including bonus, and 430 LP. I lost a bunch of drones which cost roughly a quarter mil to replace, so profit was around 3.2m.

3.2m in an hour and 430 LPs, I can get from a III+16 agent I have, also in a 0.8. Specifically, the Serpentis Extravaganza, which pays the same and gives 1073+ LPs, or a couple of viral agent attacks, whatever they are called, a couple of mil and around 650 LPs each.

This is a real omgwtf example and comparison! I have done this sort of thing with a group of corp members, and we can pwn stuff like this in minutes and rake in ISK quite decently. Solo...you have got to be kidding me. This really is not great money.

Now I know that comparing a low-pay L4 kill with a high-pay L3 kill may not be fair, but it's nothing compared to a complex in low-sec space where I can easily make 10m per hour, and regularly do. I've not done a L4 deadspace solo yet, but from what I've seen in corp ops, I'm pretty sure it's not going to be that great. I'm actually not doing agents so much for the money any more, but for the standing and refine tax break.

Seriously, if you are really doing L4s solo and think you are making great money, try doing it in a group. Or do a low-sec complex, 5/10, 6/10. You will see you are mistaken.

TDA Shadow
Caldari
CHON
THE R0NIN
Posted - 2005.04.04 09:00:00 - [141]
 

Edited by: TDA Shadow on 04/04/2005 09:05:40
Edited by: TDA Shadow on 04/04/2005 09:04:17
Come on, there r ppl who dont wanna do PvP. Let them do their lvl4 missions in raven. Does it do anything to you? NO. Every MMORPG is about freedom of choice. You can do whatever you wanna do. It suppose to be fun. Some ppl have fun shooting other ppl, some shoot NPCs and dont want to get involved with other ppl. Some ppl mine (other like me find mining extremely boring :) ) Not much fun if you wanna do missions (and you cant do easy missions all the time and some one in 0.4 from 250km pods you (there r ppl who find fun in doing this, their choice)

Is it about ISK that those ppl make from those missions without much trouble? And so what? They find enjoyment in it, so let them me. I personaly find non DS lvl4 missions boring :)

Findail
The New Era
C0NVICTED
Posted - 2005.04.04 10:09:00 - [142]
 

All I've been seeing so far is pirates moaning that level 4 missions need to be moved to low sec space. Why? So a small group can gank a few other players? But if those players bring friends to gank pirates, what then? Wars? More moaning on forums?

Its common knowledge that an ship set up for NPC'ing is no good for PvP... and vice versa. Level 4's are pretty hard to solo now... if you're so uber that you find it real easy, well, thats what complexes are for. After all, where do you earn more isk? A 5/10 complex, or a level 4 mission?

At the end of the day its a game i.e. its mean't to be fun. Who cares if it does/doesn't favor pirates/carebears? I thought the idea was for a wide cross-section of the gaming community to have fun while playing online....

ArchenTheGreat
Caldari
Pulsar Nebulah
Army of Lovers.
Posted - 2005.04.04 10:18:00 - [143]
 

Originally by: XSKULLX

hell my main character has 14 million skill points and still cannot do the silence the informant mission solo. ive got 3 million sps in engineering, caldari bs lvl 5, torpedo lvl 5 so anyone who thinks a 1 or even 2 month old character can do these missions are either highly stupid or very gullable and uninformed in which case i got some ocean front property to sell in the genisis region of space and theres no land anywhere near it


I find it strange because I have a little more than 4 million points and can do Extravaganza solo even with bonus level. Maybe it's because I am using low quality agent. Don't know. But I don't have BS lvl5 nor Torpedos lvl5. I think you should stop shooting everything after warping in and carefully choose setup. Doing it solo requires some thinking (no pun intended), you can't do it in rush.

Dianabolic
Reikoku
Posted - 2005.04.04 10:19:00 - [144]
 

Originally by: TDA Shadow
Come on, there r ppl who dont wanna do PvP. Let them do their lvl4 missions in raven. Does it do anything to you? NO.


Actually, it does, because we can't compete with the isk income - it pushes the cost of pretty much everything out of our reach.

capt
Posted - 2005.04.04 11:15:00 - [145]
 

Edited by: capt on 04/04/2005 11:15:52
Originally by: mahhy

I don't care about your earning. I care about earnings in 0.0 being massively higher than they are in Empire. The way it should be. The way its not right now.



Hmmm I think you are really misinformed on this one. Last time I checked you could still make hideously more isk/day mining for zyd or mega in 0.0 space than you could ever earn doing (lvl4) missions in empire.Exclamation

Claiming otherwise is just plain shenanigans......ugh


Dianabolic
Reikoku
Posted - 2005.04.04 11:39:00 - [146]
 

Originally by: capt
Edited by: capt on 04/04/2005 11:15:52
Originally by: mahhy

I don't care about your earning. I care about earnings in 0.0 being massively higher than they are in Empire. The way it should be. The way its not right now.



Hmmm I think you are really misinformed on this one. Last time I checked you could still make hideously more isk/day mining for zyd or mega in 0.0 space than you could ever earn doing (lvl4) missions in empire.Exclamation

Claiming otherwise is just plain shenanigans......ugh




Nope, wrong, incorrect. The only ore that comes close to providing the isk reward per hour of some lvl 4 missions (that are in 1.0 SAFE SPACE<<< THIS BIT IS VERY IMPORTANT) is mercoxite.

mahhy
MASS
Posted - 2005.04.04 13:38:00 - [147]
 

Originally by: capt
Edited by: capt on 04/04/2005 11:15:52
Originally by: mahhy

I don't care about your earning. I care about earnings in 0.0 being massively higher than they are in Empire. The way it should be. The way its not right now.



Hmmm I think you are really misinformed on this one. Last time I checked you could still make hideously more isk/day mining for zyd or mega in 0.0 space than you could ever earn doing (lvl4) missions in empire.Exclamation

Claiming otherwise is just plain shenanigans......ugh



Its not the amount, its the difference.

Basically, look at it this way:

Since Exodus, 0.0 has had no increase in ISK/hour making potential that I'm aware of. Same NPCs, same bounties, same ore, etc. No big changes in ISK/hour potential.

Empire on the other hand, specifically safe 0.5-1.0 has had a huge increase in relatively easy and safe ISK/hour potential, in the form of level 4 missions and minerals from drone compounds, etc.

The actual maximum isk/hour you can make in either is irrelevant, it doesn't matter if 0.0 is greater, or empire is great. The problem is the difference is smaller. That removes incentive to even try to go to 0.0. Why would anyone want to go live in 0.0 when the new ISK making potential of empire space is so much closer to (and some believe actually exceeds) 0.0 potential?

Its a central theme to Eve that generally you need to risk more to reap more rewards. Its more or less impossible to argue that level 4 missions in 1.0 space are more dangerous than NPC hunting/mining in 0.0 because you simply cannot be attacked by players in 1.0 if you choose not to be, whereas in 0.0 you can be.

On top of all that theres a LOT of anecdotal evidence to support the idea of a shrinking gap between Empire and 0.0 ISK/hour potential, namely the HUGE influx of players into Empire and the huge increase in mission running thats pretty easily visible in the main mission systems.

How can people not see that thats a problem that needs to be "fixed" somehow? CCP don't want to nerf level 4 missions, so they need to do some serious work with 0.0.

Trader Klyde
Gallente
Posted - 2005.04.04 14:00:00 - [148]
 

What Mahhy said is the key here...

Instead of nerfing things constantly, make other areas more fun by boosting them. IE: put more stations in 0.0 with full services. Maybe even make them NPC stations which would allow players to dock regardless of who controls the area. Put level 4 or level 5 agents in them, this would attract more mission runners, hell, it would attract more people period.

0.0 space is too hard to get to ATM with the choke points being held by pirates or alliances, once there are more gates leading into 0.0, there also needs to be more reason to go there... Since most of the systems with stations are closely guarded and contested for, and way too few to start with, the "Exodus" will never happen.

I do agree though that the best level 4 agents should never have been in the highest security systems, other than maybe courier type agents anyway. Wink

Hyey
Posted - 2005.04.04 15:24:00 - [149]
 

Point in case. First off im a lucky lucky SOB so I get ridiculous loot dropps in any case :p

Now a few months back I decided to try lvl 4 agents for the first time and grind it for 3 days straight at about 6-7 hours or so.

My final earnings were 220mil isk in bounties/rewards
2 more BS because the minerals I refined were enough for them.
About 45mil in loot sales.

I have since switched to full 0.0 NPC hunting because quite frankly looking for that rare officer spawn is more fun than having it given to you. IN a full 1 and a half weeks

70mil isk in bounties
200mil isk in loot (named launcher blah blah.)

... thats it... THATS IT

I made ALOT more in 3 days than in 1 week. nuff said

Ruffio Sepico
Minmatar
Hidden Agenda
Deep Space Engineering
Posted - 2005.04.04 16:48:00 - [150]
 

Originally by: mahhy
On top of all that theres a LOT of anecdotal evidence to support the idea of a shrinking gap between Empire and 0.0 ISK/hour potential, namely the HUGE influx of players into Empire and the huge increase in mission running thats pretty easily visible in the main mission systems.

How can people not see that thats a problem that needs to be "fixed" somehow? CCP don't want to nerf level 4 missions, so they need to do some serious work with 0.0.


There is also a question about supply the players with what they want. You know the people who pay the bills? There is also a question about have a game to play vs not have any EVE at all.

If you want to move empire dwellers to 0.0 it will kind of be like 60 lvl chars running amock on lvl 20 chars in WoW and the result will be more horrible in EVE as the effects of it is way more disasterous. And the excuse would be, well dont go to 0.0 if you can't handle it.

If you want 0.0 space to be settled, you cant have people run about bang you over the head just for the pure fun over it, then moan there is no one to shoot at later when people find out they rather want to stay out of 0.0.

True, you need to have 0.0 made more rewarding, but even you made 0.0 double as rewarding as it already is, it wouldnt move the casual players out there. Because no matter if golden apples did grow on roids out there the casual players dont want to end up in pvp and get killed.

So the rewards of 0.0 will still be mostly to harvest for the pvp crowd.
They made Empire better to live in, but when was last time Empire got upped in terms of fun and change of living? Dont say r&d agents and tech2 comps from lvl3 agents, because the best r&d agents seems to be in low end of space, and you get tech2 comps from agents in low end of space as well.

When a huge share of the player base start grow tired of Empire and no changes in things to do, and dont want to go to 0.0 because the risk of lose what they already have is to huge. What is the cure then? You need to increase the fun in Empire to keep the players rather than lose them to other games.

There is a big friggin picture to behold here, just moan about how rewarding level 4 agents isn't leading anywhere, just let the devs work with the game and go with it. EVE is a living game going through changes and who evolve over time. You can't expect things stay the same forever, then it just stagnate and dies.


Pages: 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 7

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only