open All Channels
seplocked Ships and Modules
blankseplocked Gallente PvE help?
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Author Topic

Raven Hawkins
Posted - 2011.09.04 11:12:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Raven Hawkins on 04/09/2011 11:12:52
Hey guys

I know there are probably thousands of threads but I have looked through 4 pages and I am still unsure of what to do.
I am still pretty new id say... ive been playing for 3 months but with big chunks of inactivity.

I have been doing L4's for a while in my Dominix and although its a great ship, I am stuck at what to do next.

I have read the Dominix is one of the best Gallente PvE ships? is this true? is there a next step?
I really like Gallente ship design and would rather stick with Gallente, even if people feel failguns and blasters are below par.

So whats next? get a navy Domi?
Would I be better off going back down to say a Myrm or something?

Also I dont know if this would be the best place to ask, but what Gallente ship and type of PvE will net me the best isk per hour? because I have limited time on the game ive stuck with L4's as they seem simple and easy.

I havent looked at PvP so dont know if its a good way to make isk but thats for another thread I guess :D

Thanks in advance for your time and any advice you have for me.

Sigh

My current fit is as follows if it helps:

4x 350mm prototype gauss (swap between antimatter/thorium/iridium charges depending on range 25km, 44km, 60km I believe)
2x drone link

3x cap recharger II's
2x Omni trackers

4x n-type hardeners
1x large armour rep II
1x large named repper (not enough pg for a 2nd t2 atm)
1x power relay (cant think of name right now, type d or something?)

I also carry 5x bouncer, 5x garde and 5x ogre

3x CCC rigs

ing SpeedyJ
Gallente
Posted - 2011.09.04 11:51:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: ing SpeedyJ on 04/09/2011 11:54:36
domi > navy domi > rattlesnake
if u are tired of drones learn for golem

edit: and tune your domi fit, there are many good fits on this forum, just use searchWink

Raven Hawkins
Posted - 2011.09.04 12:31:00 - [3]
 

thanks for the quick reply.

I would love to tune my Dominix :D

I have done a search but there doesnt seem to be an advanced search option... It comes up with 2510 results... maybe im typing the wrong thing in?


Lilith Ishanoya
Lai Dai Shipments
Posted - 2011.09.04 12:43:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Lilith Ishanoya on 04/09/2011 12:45:04
There's two types of answer to this, the long version and the TL;DR


The Dominix being the best ship for Gallente says more about the crappy state of Gallente BS than it says about how fantastic the Domi is. Droneboats are very easy to use, safe and you can play them half AFK. But in terms of mission running that's not "best".

That's like saying the best race car is the one that lacks the power to get you in trouble as you won't go fast enough to have a crash or lose control. The BEST race car is fitted for performance over everything, it's SO on the edge of what's still controllable that it takes real effort to make it work. The end result is that it will be faster around that track than "easier" cars.

Thus the actual question is "what, to you, is best". If you want an easy mission runner then a Dominix is great, if you're agreeing to being good at gallente/caldari missions but suck at Amarr/Minmatar missions then the Kronos is very good. If you want a ship that has very fast mission completion times and thus improves your income/standing gains then you're in a bit of trouble for Gallente as they don't have high dps ships that are versatile in their damage type.

Mind you; doing 500 dps, to me at least, is mediocre. There's ships out there who will hit double that and some can even switch their damage types doing it. So if all you've seen is ravens and dominixes and similar, and you've sortof agreed that 500 dps is about the max you can get out of PVE ships then you'll think the Domi is a fine ship, but it's not and it isn't.

If you're ok with being mostly limited to caldari/gallente missions then the Kronos isn't so bad, it's dps isn't fantastic (compared to other powerhouses) but Gall doesn't have a lot to offer to start with. Kronos is a turretship with some drone support. The other option is the Navy Dominix but in order to actually get anything useful out of it (to make up for the price difference) you have to shield tank it and go full gank, so 350/425s in high, mag stabs/TE in low and enough shield tank to not die.

The Shield Ndomi is a very good ship (for gallente) but there's a lot of duality in it as it's now a turret/drone hybrid which plays entirely different from a pure droneboat with some rails put on it (it might not seem that way but trust me, it plays completely different) so you'll need to to get used to it.


TL;DR

Gallente for the most part has crappy mission runners if you're looking for fast completion times, droneboats lose a lot of time because of drone aggro and all that while the Gallente turretships are lacking in so many ways it's just painful, if you stick to kin/therm targets then I'd opt to go for a more turret focussed ship (or the shield Ndomi as a "hybrid").



If you want to really get ahead then these are your options; Abaddon/NM/Pally for EM missions (don't discard the Abaddon, it's a fantastic high dps ship for pve if fitted right). overall for everything; Vargur/Machariel (mach is higher dps, Vargur has it easier tanking EM missions). If you want to be decently lazy, maximal adaptability while still having "ok" completion times; CNR (the CNR is NOT on the same page when it comes to completion times as the mach/vargur but it's at least decent).

Notice how I didn't state any T3, not even the Tengu. Tengu is great dps but it's really limited to kin targets. If you have to do sansha missions it's dps drops down to mediocre level again, whereas the CNR can do EM just fine so the CNR is a better overall ship than a Tengu. It's just that Tengus are bling and when it comes to "cool stuff" people tend to throw logic out of the window.

Derath Ellecon
Posted - 2011.09.04 12:48:00 - [5]
 

I fly a fit almost like yours

[Dominix, Current]

350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
Drone Link Augmentor I
Drone Link Augmentor I

Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link
Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link

Imperial Navy Large Armor Repairer
Armor Explosive Hardener II
Capacitor Power Relay II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Capacitor Power Relay II
Armor Thermic Hardener II

Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Large Sentry Damage Augmentor I





Captain Nares
Posted - 2011.09.04 13:15:00 - [6]
 

Learn Matar BS and AC's, get a Mach.

It may deploy 4 sentry drones Smile

Raven Hawkins
Posted - 2011.09.04 14:43:00 - [7]
 

Hey thanks for the replies.

I have been very interested in the mach, purely because its one of the few ships I like the look or that will make use of my current abilities.
The downsides of this will mean ive wasted time training what I have and it will take a while to get into these other ships.

Though if the difference is as you say maybe thats best.

Thanks for the fit you posted, I didnt know about the faction onmi's I shall look into them :D

NoNah
Posted - 2011.09.04 14:58:00 - [8]
 

yes, the domi is the best gallente missionship - however only if you fit it for it. Typically this meams an active shieldtank, sentry damage rigs and six 425mm rails.

You can run it afk aswell however at that point it really doesn't matter what ship you use(rattle, domi, gila or ishtar)

vorneus
Posted - 2011.09.04 15:31:00 - [9]
 

Edited by: vorneus on 04/09/2011 15:33:24
Originally by: Lilith Ishanoya
Edited by: Lilith Ishanoya on 04/09/2011 12:45:04
There's two types of answer to this, the long version and the TL;DR


TL;DR

Gallente for the most part has crappy mission runners if you're looking for fast completion times, droneboats lose a lot of time because of drone aggro and all that while the Gallente turretships are lacking in so many ways it's just painful, if you stick to kin/therm targets then I'd opt to go for a more turret focussed ship (or the shield Ndomi as a "hybrid").

If you want to really get ahead then these are your options; Abaddon/NM/Pally for EM missions (don't discard the Abaddon, it's a fantastic high dps ship for pve if fitted right). overall for everything; Vargur/Machariel (mach is higher dps, Vargur has it easier tanking EM missions). If you want to be decently lazy, maximal adaptability while still having "ok" completion times; CNR (the CNR is NOT on the same page when it comes to completion times as the mach/vargur but it's at least decent).



While some of this makes sense, some of it is plain wrong.

If you're looking for fast completion times out of a T1 ship then you can't beat a full rail & dmg sentries setup. There are a few variants of it - 350mm rails with minimal armor tank, omni's in the mids, or full out gank with minimal shield buffer and 425mm rails.

I'm a fan of a mix of the two myself :D

[Dominix, Mission Gank Domi]
Power Diagnostic System II
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Damage Control II

Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
Ballistic Deflection Field II
Heat Dissipation Field II
Invulnerability Field II

350mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L

Large Sentry Damage Augmentor I
Large Core Defence Field Extender I
Large Core Defence Field Extender I


Garde II x5
Other drones to taste/etc

Been flying that for ages and it blows through missions in no time at all.

-Ed

Edit: 916dps out to ~30km, 130dps passive tank (rat specific) and 18,606 shield buffer.

Lilith Ishanoya
Lai Dai Shipments
Posted - 2011.09.04 16:10:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Lilith Ishanoya on 04/09/2011 16:20:40
Rails have dps issues, can't switch damage types and have split damage types to start with. So when you're not fighting Gallente NPC (or caldari) they will perform even more crappy than rails already do normally.

You can't deploy drones till you have decent aggro, if you use sentries (which you should) you can't move. If you need to kill frigates you have to pull in your sentries and launch lights, dropping your overall dps by a ton. A ship that uses drones for support can keep firing on the main big guys while his drones take care of the small crap, a droneboat has to switch out it's main dps to do that. All in all it's not brilliant in any sort of way. But as said, together with a Kronos it's the best Gallente has to offer.

If you compare that to the Amarr line up, they do massively more DPS at much better ranges but they are ofcourse limited to EM/thermal. So they do more DPS already but have similar damage type issues.

If you compare it to a Vargur or Mach they do way, WAY more dps than the gallente ships, AND they can select their damage types, AND it all fits easily AND their guns don't use cap. It's just no comparison, gallente ships are very limited in their applied dps, their damage types (if you want to do more than just drones), their fitting and their cap use. In short; gallente is below par.


Originally by: vorneus
If you're looking for fast completion times out of a T1 ship then you can't beat a full rail & dmg sentries setup


The Abaddon wants to have a word with you :) Also, he's asking about what progression there is for him, and there just is none. If you want to do more dps with faster completion times while not being shoehorned into kin/therm too much then the only logical answer (sadly) is Minmatar.

frederendan
Posted - 2011.09.04 19:16:00 - [11]
 

Get a vindicator and do incursions.
Get a thanatos and do sanctums.
Get an ishtar and do deadspace complexes.

These 3 things will make you rich.

Tauranon
Gallente
Weeesearch
Posted - 2011.09.04 22:35:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Lilith Ishanoya
Edited by: Lilith Ishanoya on 04/09/2011 16:20:40
Rails have dps issues, can't switch damage types and have split damage types to start with. So when you're not fighting Gallente NPC (or caldari) they will perform even more crappy than rails already do normally.


way overstated as a problem shooting npc's. Angels usually have 30% resist to explo (the hole) and 40% to kin/therm for example. The domi has plenty of type selectable damage.

Quote:



You can't deploy drones till you have decent aggro, if you use sentries (which you should) you can't move.




by aggro, you mean fired 1 volley from your guns. by not move you mean, have to move back to the sentries, or bring one set of heavies and one set of sentries for missions with long traverses. ie everything you just said is wrong if you have the slightest insight into the mission before you enter.

Quote:



If you need to kill frigates you have to pull in your sentries and launch lights, dropping your overall dps by a ton. A ship that uses drones for support can keep firing on the main big guys while his drones take care of the small crap, a droneboat has to switch out it's main dps to do that. All in all it's not brilliant in any sort of way. But as said, together with a Kronos it's the best Gallente has to offer.




If you start firing from a decent range, both the sentries and the rails will do full dps on frigate hulls - especially as they are npc's and will burn directly towards you. ie: for every frigate that gets/starts under my sentries, about 10 of them get fried in a single salvo of drone/railfire. To be using lights on battleship hulls with 125mb drone bays, means the owner had to forgo even bringing 5 sentries.

Quote:


If you compare that to the Amarr line up, they do massively more DPS at much better ranges but they are ofcourse limited to EM/thermal. So they do more DPS already but have similar damage type issues.




They have worse damage type issues than a dominix. Kin/therm combo is almost never the worst thing to fire, and a greater proportion of the dominix damage is type selectable through drones.

With 350's, at 35, I need to switch to plut, at 47, thorium, at 60 iridium. I have to do a similar thing with gardes, for wardens or bouncers (depending on target npc) at around 45kms, and they'll reach 80 without much bother (control range limit). ie in practice, a dominix can be made to do full dps from 15 to 30, with only slight degrading till 45, and then the steady degrading till 80.

It really isn't that bad a profile. other ships have to make difficult choices for drone dps and have a drone range hole as a result.

Quote:

If you compare it to a Vargur or Mach they do way, WAY more dps than the gallente ships, AND they can select their damage types, AND it all fits easily AND their guns don't use cap. It's just no comparison, gallente ships are very limited in their applied dps, their damage types (if you want to do more than just drones), their fitting and their cap use. In short; gallente is below par.



It would be extremely dissapointing if a dominix was better than all of the marauders and all of the faction battleships. I can't see that this is a valid criticism of a cheap t1, tier1 battleship.

Quote:


Originally by: vorneus
If you're looking for fast completion times out of a T1 ship then you can't beat a full rail & dmg sentries setup


The Abaddon wants to have a word with you :) Also, he's asking about what progression there is for him, and there just is none. If you want to do more dps with faster completion times while not being shoehorned into kin/therm too much then the only logical answer (sadly) is Minmatar.


Dominix is fastest route for a player that wants to be a carrier pilot, as it will do l4s with pitiful gunnery skills, and fairly quickly for people with level 4 large hybrids and level 3 supports (ie tiny skill investment).

McRoll
Minmatar
Heatseekers
Posted - 2011.09.04 22:58:00 - [13]
 

Dont give up on Gallente so quickly. Yes, the Domi is your best bet in PvE but your current Domi fit and skills are far from good. There is lots of room for improvement and if I were you, I'd finish skills for that ship before crosstraining, better be good at something than mediocre or bad in many areas.

Here's a Navy Domi that does around 800 DPS with top skills and sentries, which isnt too shabby and you can use those skills in the Ishtar as well, which is one of the best complex runners out there.

[Dominix Navy Issue, pve]
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Large Armor Repairer II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II

LiF Fueled I Booster Rockets
Omnidirectional Tracking Link I
Omnidirectional Tracking Link I
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

350mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L
Dual 250mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L
Dual 250mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L
Dual 250mm Railgun II, Antimatter Charge L

Large Sentry Damage Augmentor II
Large Anti-Kinetic Pump I
[empty rig slot]


Warden II x5

Lilith Ishanoya
Lai Dai Shipments
Posted - 2011.09.05 12:44:00 - [14]
 

Edited by: Lilith Ishanoya on 05/09/2011 12:45:25
Quote:
way overstated as a problem shooting npc's. Angels usually have 30% resist to explo (the hole) and 40% to kin/therm for example. The domi has plenty of type selectable damage.


Bit of Spreadsheet FU shows the following (using generic NPC resists):

AM does 55% against gur, 65% against Serp and 45% against Angels
PP does 50% against gur, 62% against Serp
FUS does 57% against Angels

Result:

- ACs can keep on par against Guristas decently well compared to hybrids and do just fine against Serpentis (to be expected ofcourse, but stating any way)
- ACs deal 25% more to Angels than Hybrids
- also, ACs are on par with lasers against sansha

25% difference against Angels is a HUGE amount, like a lot.

Then we get to Drones which can indeed do different damage types but it's not that simple as all racial drones have different damage, range and tracking (not to mention speed when not using Sentries)

In other words; Gallente have far more issues.


Quote:
by aggro, you mean fired 1 volley from your guns. by not move you mean, have to move back to the sentries, or bring one set of heavies and one set of sentries for missions with long traverses. ie everything you just said is wrong if you have the slightest insight into the mission before you enter.


Yes, lets entirely forget about those missions that aggress drones or have multiple waves, it's all extra effort that costs extra time. And moving back to sentries in a slow ship wastes time, which means lowering overall completion speed.

Quote:

If you start firing from a decent range, both the sentries and the rails will do full dps on frigate hulls - especially as they are npc's and will burn directly towards you. ie: for every frigate that gets/starts under my sentries, about 10 of them get fried in a single salvo of drone/railfire. To be using lights on battleship hulls with 125mb drone bays, means the owner had to forgo even bringing 5 sentries.


Yup, true... mostly. You're exaggerating though. Still, SOME gets through and lets not forget about missions where everything starts short range. Result; unless everything is perfect (...) you will HAVE to drop your sentries in order to take care of the spider drones and other annoying crap. Which means loss of dps and time.


Quote:
resist stuff
Correct, however you forget about the fact that The Amarr ships do way more dps at good ranges, will have way more tracking, only need 2 ammo types and can switch instantly. I'm not going to state that it makes up for having to kill Angels, that would be silly, but the pros severely outweigh the cons in many situations.

Quote:
It would be extremely dissapointing if a dominix was better than all of the marauders and all of the faction battleships. I can't see that this is a valid criticism of a cheap t1, tier1 battleship.


Fully agree there, however the Abaddon pulls it off just fine (although not tier1). Thing is that the OP asked about progression, ie he's looking to improve which almost always will mean dishing out isk on bling ships/fitting (once you've optimised/maximised your current fit)

Quote:
Dominix is fastest route for a player that wants to be a carrier pilot, as it will do l4s with pitiful gunnery skills, and fairly quickly for people with level 4 large hybrids and level 3 supports (ie tiny skill investment).


OP isn't asking about carriers, he's asking about optimising his lvl 4 mission performance.


And then we get to the most simple yet important bit about droneboats; "Target > shoot ze missiles/turrets" is a whole lot easier, faster and less annoying than "target>gain aggro> drop drones/sentries> pull sentries in to move or drones back for aggro".

You try to paint an overly optimistic picture at times, which I assume (and we all know what that means) could be translated to "defending one's own race/playstyle choice rather than keeping to verifyable facts". You're not wrong as such, just... optimistic :D

Lady Go Diveher
The Independent Troll Society
Posted - 2011.09.05 13:46:00 - [15]
 

Slap a shield buffer on any of:

* Vindicator
* Megathron
* Megathron Navy Issue

and go run some incursions. More fun than level 4 missions and a good fleet will hover over 100mil an hour.

It's one situation where blasters are pretty awesome.

Pookoko
Posted - 2011.09.05 15:46:00 - [16]
 

Upgrade from Domi isn't another ship, but it's T2 Sentries, T2 Heavies and T2 Railguns + Drone Interfacing V.

Also, Domi > Abaddon for new players who may want to explore the universe more rather than confining themselves to Amarr space.

I fly Mach, Tengu and Nightmare for missions depending on rats & my mood, so yes I'm aware there are pimp mission boats that's better than other vanila T1 mission BS, but Domi is still a fantastic ship - and remember it's a Tier 1 T1 BS which costs <50mil.

Cyniac
Gallente
Twilight Star Rangers
Posted - 2011.09.05 16:04:00 - [17]
 

I'd say your first point of progression is within the Domi itself to try out different ways to work with it.

Several of the issues which have been pointed out (range, killing frigs etc) can be mitigated to a large extent by being a bit more creative with your setups - I happen to be strong in drone skills and definitely weak in gunnery which leads me to use some rather unconventional (but effective for me setups) such as:

Domi - Drones all the way

5x resists (normally EANM 2x mission specific hardeners)
1x Ammatar Navy Large Armor repper (it really does make a difference)
1x Cap power relay (I know I know - but hey it helps)

1x Heavy cap booster (Cap booster 400)
1x Target painter II
3x Omnidirectional tracking links (Fed navy for more fun)

2x Drone link augmentors
4x 350mm Prototype 1 Gauss Gun

2x Sentry damage drone augmentor

650 damage with my skills EFT claims it can to nearly 700 with perfect skills (though you'd also use different guns then)

Two things this setup does VERY well -

1) Project damage - Garde II optimal range is over 50 kms - Bouncers will sweep the field

2) Hit small targets - you can pop orbiting frigs at 12 kms with your Gardes easily, you can pop orbiting frigs at 5-7 kms too but you may want to use light drones then.

This setup benefits greatly from using a Navy Domi which makes for easier fitting and better targeting range (easy for the Navy Domi to project damage from 100 to point blank with sentries).


As for what to do next, it depends a lot on what you want to do with the ship - Navy Domi -> Rattler is the normal progression for mission running but drone ships excell at all kinds of PVE not just mission running. Getting used to the Ishtar for low/nullsec plexing for instance is also a very viable (and interesting) activity - decide where you want to go and find the best tool to get you there.

r0selan
Kasar Infinae
Posted - 2011.09.05 18:49:00 - [18]
 

with 3 (and even 2) fed omni, heavy drones eat frigs at breakfast, and kill them faster than light ones, overall if frigs orbit close

[Dominix Navy Issue, Forest Potatoe import 6]
Tracking Enhancer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Dark Blood Armor Kinetic Hardener
Dark Blood Armor Kinetic Hardener
Dark Blood Armor Thermic Hardener
Dark Blood Armor Thermic Hardener
Core X-Type Large Armor Repairer

Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link
Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
350mm Prototype I Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
Drone Link Augmentor I

[empty rig slot]
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Sentry Damage Augmentor I

Ogre II x5
Garde II x5


Then I switched to 2 hardeners for most missions, and replaced them with another mag stab and tracking enhancer.

Then I switched for a mach, and never looked back.

Ormus Vinge
Posted - 2011.09.05 21:12:00 - [19]
 

First of all, you should always use Turrets + Drones on a Domi if you fly active. I had a nice Domi I used before the Machariel, which was fitted against all other Forces then Serp/Guri: ( For those I used Rails )


[Dominix Navy Issue, Level 4 ]
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Republic Fleet Tracking Enhancer
Republic Fleet Tracking Enhancer
Damage Control II
Dark Blood Power Diagnostic System

Federation Navy Omnidirectional Tracking Link
Gist C-Type X-Large Shield Booster
[empty med slot]
[empty med slot]
[empty med slot]
Federation Navy 100MN Afterburner

800mm Repeating Artillery II, EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, EMP L
800mm Repeating Artillery II, EMP L

Large Sentry Damage Augmentor I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I


Garde II x5


Tank depends on how much you like to spend, but 400 Missionspec. tank is ok.

This fit does 940 DPS.


Osfrid
Posted - 2011.09.05 21:19:00 - [20]
 

The main advantage about the dominix is one of the best "cost effective" BS, don't pimp it !

Don't be also fooled by high dmg EFT fit... (yes 1k+ dps up until 50km is very easy to achieve)
350/425mm start to suffer from tracking issue under 35-40km and that's where you Garde II hit the most.

The dominix is good because it can tailor 500-600 DPS at all range against "all" target and that's why he's great. (with perfect skill, you can expect 800+ DPS at 40-45km which is "great")

Under 10-15km or if you need to move, it shoots all size of ship with Heavy drone *5 if T2, or *4 with a flight of 5 light drone if T1 (garde hit at 5k+ against cruiser size and 12km+ against frig size with 2 omni... but without web ou TP, DPS isn't optimal) => no cap/ammo used which is good, that's where you need the most tank to survive.
From 10-15km to 40km, Garde II will do the job with progressive increase in dmg from yours guns
Above 40km, you'll need to switch to dmg specific long range sentry (warden/bouncer/curator), thus producing less DPS... but that's where your railguns are for, keeping an average good DPS up until drone control range.

500-600 DPS don't seems impressive... but you won't do anything more from CNR even with TP fitted on cruise size or smaller (which is about 60% of the ship encountered in L4...), especially with a cheap T2 fitting.

The standard fitting found seems to be:
Quote:
[Dominix, PvE AT 5xgun]
Large Armor Repairer II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II

Omnidirectional Tracking Link I
Omnidirectional Tracking Link I
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

350mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L
350mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L
350mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L
350mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L
350mm Railgun II, Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L
Drone Link Augmentor I

Large Sentry Damage Augmentor I
Large Sentry Damage Augmentor I
[empty rig slot]


Garde II x5
Warden II x5
Wasp II x5


200-300+ cap stable tank to allow more time to kill support (BC size and smaller) and 450+ DPS for a few minute to fight the heavy hitter (can switch the 2 MFS for better tank/cap stability)
Without PDU or powergrid implant, you'll need AWU V to fit that without gimping something but that's finally the cheapest PvE goal you could achieve.

If you really want an upgrade beside dominix, then you should look toward the maelstrom (AC fitting against angel/serpentis/drone/mercenary, artillery against sansha/gurista) which is sure more that twice the price tag fully fitted, but it will be very worth it on the way to the machariel.

Tauranon
Gallente
Weeesearch
Posted - 2011.09.05 23:09:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Lilith Ishanoya

ACs deal 25% more to Angels than Hybrids



its the racial target. Again note most actual dominixes do more damage with drones, and drones can and are selected for type.

Quote:


Yes, lets entirely forget about those missions that aggress drones or have multiple waves, it's all extra effort that costs extra time. And moving back to sentries in a slow ship wastes time, which means lowering overall completion speed.




It literally takes 2 seconds to bay and refield sentries, and if you are sniping, snipe the ships that didn't redbox up first. A lot of the aggro situations also only occur to people with less dps, as people with greater dps kill the targets before they leash, and in missions, its common for my drones to never lose shields even if they do get aggroed and I don't bay them.

Quote:


Yup, true... mostly. You're exaggerating though. Still, SOME gets through and lets not forget about missions where everything starts short range. Result; unless everything is perfect (...) you will HAVE to drop your sentries in order to take care of the spider drones and other annoying crap. Which means loss of dps and time.




You are now being ridiculous. It doesn't take 5 minutes to kill 2 spider drones with dominix bonused light drones on a ship with 2 omnis. Matter of fact with full skills and 2 omnis, even ogres will hit them.

Its a tiny penalty and is made up for in damp and jam missions, where the dominix is just plain old superior. Also if you are bringing a full pack of lights on your non dominix, that must mean you have given up at least one sentry or heavy, and do not reach peak dps. Dominixes don't make that tradeoff.

Quote:


OP isn't asking about carriers, he's asking about optimising his lvl 4 mission performance.




Carriers loom heavy over gallente (particularly drone) progression. It has to be said to put progression issues in a reasonable context. If you play well the domi does missions fast, and the end game for the progression of its skill set is hardly hard done by. The mach is much more of a dead end in context of the whole game.

Quote:


You try to paint an overly optimistic picture at times, which I assume (and we all know what that means) could be translated to "defending one's own race/playstyle choice rather than keeping to verifyable facts". You're not wrong as such, just... optimistic :D




Nope, I've just played the ship enough to recognise that it responds well to being played properly. There is no reason it should be significantly slower than other ships over a mix of missions, even if yes there is more things for the pilot to do.Rolling Eyes

If we are talking wh's then thats another matter as IMO sleeper ai is too prone to drone aggro which does unfairly target drone ships in general.


RoyAraym
Gallente
Capital Construction Research
Pioneer Alliance
Posted - 2011.09.06 00:06:00 - [22]
 

Listen to an "old" Gallentean, brotha':

forgot "bs-sized" ships (even if a Dominix is a perfect choice to start).

You should have good drone skills from "her": move to tech.2 drones (up to Heavies). Skill to "cruiser 5", skill after that "Heavy Assault Ship 5", buy an Ishtar.

<hi>
2x tractor beam
2x salvager II
1x a civilian gun (no ammos needed, only to get aggros from npcs - dock in any station, without any of your ship in there, in pod: get the gun from your new free rookie ship)
<med>
1x AB
any cap rechargers you can, and still able to use an "utility slot" (still cap, drone mods, any you could like
<low>
2x med armor repairers II (improve it with storyline ones, or better, just to have lesser cpu fitting issues, eventually, to fitt an 800's tungsten plate, or fitt just any other available 800's)
and TANK (1x 800 plate, hardners, avoid DMG controls - better an EANM: you relay only in armor and ship speed)
<rigs>
cap and/or trimarks
<drones>
heavies for NPC's bs/bc/cruisers
lights for NPC's frigs

Use:
- permarun your both armor reps and AB
- shoot with your civilian gun NPCs to get the aggro
- deploy you lights and wipe out NPC's scrambling drones/frigs/destroyers (to avoid to be stuck scrammed from frigs too)
- deploy your heavies and wipe out BCs and cruiser first (better tracking/sig on you)
- then wipe out BSes: their dps is minimal, orbiting them at 7.5km, because NPC are horrible in their gun's tracking/sig
- tractor and salvager DURING fight (no ammos needed in a civilian gun = empty cargohold = almost a full room of salvaged parts and loot)

Tips:
Ab's velocity factor (speed tanking)+ Ishtar's small sig radius (signature tanking) could let the "smiling boat" take just 20-30 real hp damage from ANY ship, a lot less than your 2x reps repair.
Just not let you be webbed by frigs: speed (around 500m/s with an AB) is VITAL to survive to the heavier NPC's gunships. So the tip to destroy them first...
A ship like that can tank (orbiting them at 7.5km - better combination to have full speed and smaller orbit) 6-7 BS easily (or outrun them, to not be hit), but could get (eventually) more damage from cruiser sized guns, so the "second targets" should be those, rather than the bigger ships.

I'm lazy, and on mine i fitt a "rainbow ship" (70-80% on all res) and same "raibow drones (1x five small drones set for each race, 2/3x each heavies) cuz I'm moving a lot from space to space, in all four empires, so I could switch damage types on the run (eventually)...

... but if you are running mission in the same spot for long time, you could improve your speed using specific rat type hardeners and drones.

An Ishtar (fully fitted) has better average speed in missioning (if you have not an alt) even than a single Kronos, at lesser than 1\4 of the Kronos' hull cost (no fitting, ship only).

... obviously, if you like also salvaging/looting.
For speed-run missions (just for bounties-LP points) is not the best, but if you like to recover your wrecks, with an Ishtar like that, trading occasionally your loot/salvaged items (and reprocessing t.1 items for better minerals amount), you can obtain around 30-40 millions isk x hour/missioning.

Works on almost any lv.4...
... but you could be in trouble in Worlds Collide missions, initially, cuz in a room you will be webbed immediatly at zero speed (not panic in there: destroy immediately frigs and ALSO point a direction away from any aggro, running AB and reppers... you can take distance just at the armor lower limit...) or, eventually, resume your old dominix (she has no problem at all there).

Ineka
Gallente
Center for Advanced Studies
Posted - 2011.09.06 00:50:00 - [23]
 

Short is short: PVP and/or PVE = train minmatar

CQFD

You're welcome

Lilith Ishanoya
Lai Dai Shipments
Posted - 2011.09.06 11:32:00 - [24]
 

Edited by: Lilith Ishanoya on 06/09/2011 11:34:07
Quote:
its the racial target. Again note most actual dominixes do more damage with drones, and drones can and are selected for type.


So? Against their racial target Gallente you do like 5% more damage compared to ACs. Given the fact that you can run into Angel missions and perhaps people having to move around in this universe, or even end up in a 0.0 alliance that's simply in angel teritory I'd say that's a pretty big plus, whichever way you put it.

Quote:

It literally takes 2 seconds to bay and refield sentries, and if you are sniping, snipe the ships that didn't redbox up first. A lot of the aggro situations also only occur to people with less dps, as people with greater dps kill the targets before they leash, and in missions, its common for my drones to never lose shields even if they do get aggroed and I don't bay them.


Sure you can diminish it but again, it's easier to fire your turrets/missiles while also moving towards the next gate rather than sitting still because of your sentries and managing their aggro. It's just less efficient.

Quote:
You are now being ridiculous. It doesn't take 5 minutes to kill 2 spider drones with dominix bonused light drones on a ship with 2 omnis. Matter of fact with full skills and 2 omnis, even ogres will hit them.


Very true, but you still have to drop your sentries, launch your ogres, have them get to the target, stop MWDing and THEN they start hitting it. All time lost.

Quote:
Its a tiny penalty and is made up for in damp and jam missions, where the dominix is just plain old superior.


In this you are absolutely correct, that's a great advantage.

Quote:
Also if you are bringing a full pack of lights on your non dominix, that must mean you have given up at least one sentry or heavy, and do not reach peak dps. Dominixes don't make that tradeoff.


You might want to check the dronebay and bandwidth situation on the Mach before making assumptions like that. Apart from that, Mach kills SO fast it's hardly worth it to have anything but sentries on the field (other than lights).

Quote:
Carriers loom heavy over gallente (particularly drone) progression. It has to be said to put progression issues in a reasonable context. If you play well the domi does missions fast, and the end game for the progression of its skill set is hardly hard done by. The mach is much more of a dead end in context of the whole game.


Since when did you get to decide what the end game is? And again, he's asking to optimise his lvl 4s, stick to that.

Quote:
Nope, I've just played the ship enough to recognise that it responds well to being played properly. There is no reason it should be significantly slower than other ships over a mix of missions, even if yes there is more things for the pilot to do


It's not BAD but it's not as easy to use, nor as fast through missions as a turret/missile boat (assuming the same DPS numbers) simply because you lose time on handling sentries/drones. What is so difficult about agreeing to that?

Quote:
If we are talking wh's then thats another matter as IMO sleeper ai is too prone to drone aggro which does unfairly target drone ships in general.


Actually, if you go to a C3 you can duo with 2 RR Domis just fine, the bigger sleepers hardly touch drones.

Raven Hawkins
Posted - 2011.09.07 09:53:00 - [25]
 

Wow, so many replies Shocked

Okay well after reading them all, ill stick with the Domi until I can use an Ishtar then ill probabaly do some complexing or whatever its called haha, I have at least a month until then (cruiser V) so ill do plenty of research before hand :D

Thanks very much everyone. I dont want to go down the route of a carrier btw. I dont find the HUGE ships appealing in any way. I may even stick to just cruisers, unless they make Megas even better? :P

I have no intention of shield tanking any time soon, most of the armour skills I have been using are at V and swapping to shield now seems like a waste.

Thanks again :D

Kilrayn
Posted - 2011.09.07 14:53:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Raven Hawkins
Wow, so many replies Shocked

Okay well after reading them all, ill stick with the Domi until I can use an Ishtar then ill probabaly do some complexing or whatever its called haha, I have at least a month until then (cruiser V) so ill do plenty of research before hand :D

Thanks very much everyone. I dont want to go down the route of a carrier btw. I dont find the HUGE ships appealing in any way. I may even stick to just cruisers, unless they make Megas even better? :P

I have no intention of shield tanking any time soon, most of the armour skills I have been using are at V and swapping to shield now seems like a waste.

Thanks again :D


You won't regret getting that Ishtar. Sold my Domi almost immediately after getting it. The really nice thing about it is that with cruiser 5 as a pre-req, you'll be getting the max drone damage ship bonus. My ogres are almost at 500 dps by themselves. Oh, and its a cruiser, no more slow ass aligning/travel Laughing


 

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only