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blankseplocked So...about those *EMERGENCY* CSM Meeting Minutes...
 
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Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
Posted - 2011.09.02 08:14:00 - [151]
 

Originally by: Sullen Skoung



There is bound to be a douche bag everywhere. Judging the rest of the devs on the actions of 1 man is simple minded though.

It is easy to see what is going on at CCP though. The devs operate under a system that has poor internal communication, and a system that is very much based on how much the top guys like your face if you want to get ahead. And the top brass, and owners of CCP is only thinking profit, nothing else.

It is easy to blame the devs, since they are the ones who posts here from time to time. You ever see Hilmar make a post here these last years? He sends his minions to the flames.

Most of the devs simply want to make a living, and make a cool game while they are at it. But if the system in CCP is so poor as I think it is, well you see the result.

SexxxSlave
Posted - 2011.09.02 17:28:00 - [152]
 

Originally by: Thornat
Edited by: Thornat on 02/09/2011 08:09:43
The CSM or someone at CCP should just leak the minutes and let **** hit the fan. In all honesty the more CCP is humbled the better it will be for the game in the long run. Right now CCP believe themselves to be these super successful, untouchable entity that has the best sandbox game on the market leaving them in a position of infinite clout which they can use anyway they see fit. They need to have the rug pulled from under them and brought down to earth so perhaps they might realize that their success is firmly in the palms of the players and we decide wether or not they have a future.

Every day there are fewer and fewer people logging into Eve and every day more and more long time friends are playing less and less, some leaving outright. Its a sad state of affairs and the whole thing is just one big ****ing contest between the community and CCP, a contest which will result in everyone loosing simultanously. Their is no victory for the community if CCP and Eve fail as both a company and as a game, and certainly their is no victory if CCP gets their way and the community abandons them.

The failure of CCP management right now is so vivid and outragous I'm really suprised that heads aren't rolling. This situation needs to be resolved definitively, CCP needs to re-affirm their commitment to the game, re-organize their plans and start thinking like players not businessmen. If they do that, they might just make all that money they are hoping on making, but as long as they continue to **** of the community and people continue to leave the game nothing they do or say matters. They have to cataroize this bleeding wound and you start by publicy apologizing, showing some humility and making a new commitment to do better, following that up by sticking to the commitment.

CCP managers need to get their **** together fast before this whole thing goes to a point beyond saving.




QFT

Trolls Troll
Posted - 2011.09.03 03:49:00 - [153]
 

Minutes CCP? You has them?

Living Dead Girl
Posted - 2011.09.03 04:15:00 - [154]
 

Originally by: Thornat
Edited by: Thornat on 02/09/2011 08:09:43
The CSM or someone at CCP should just leak the minutes and let **** hit the fan. In all honesty the more CCP is humbled the better it will be for the game in the long run. Right now CCP believe themselves to be these super successful, untouchable entity that has the best sandbox game on the market leaving them in a position of infinite clout which they can use anyway they see fit. They need to have the rug pulled from under them and brought down to earth so perhaps they might realize that their success is firmly in the palms of the players and we decide wether or not they have a future.

Every day there are fewer and fewer people logging into Eve and every day more and more long time friends are playing less and less, some leaving outright. Its a sad state of affairs and the whole thing is just one big ****ing contest between the community and CCP, a contest which will result in everyone loosing simultanously. Their is no victory for the community if CCP and Eve fail as both a company and as a game, and certainly their is no victory if CCP gets their way and the community abandons them.

The failure of CCP management right now is so vivid and outragous I'm really suprised that heads aren't rolling. This situation needs to be resolved definitively, CCP needs to re-affirm their commitment to the game, re-organize their plans and start thinking like players not businessmen. If they do that, they might just make all that money they are hoping on making, but as long as they continue to **** of the community and people continue to leave the game nothing they do or say matters. They have to cataroize this bleeding wound and you start by publicy apologizing, showing some humility and making a new commitment to do better, following that up by sticking to the commitment.

CCP managers need to get their **** together fast before this whole thing goes to a point beyond saving.




Jeez this is dead on. +1

Sullen Skoung
Posted - 2011.09.03 04:21:00 - [155]
 

Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
Originally by: Sullen Skoung



There is bound to be a douche bag everywhere. Judging the rest of the devs on the actions of 1 man is simple minded though.




someone wanna translate this? I get that he's calling me a douche bag... the rest not so clear

Enkidu Uruksen
Wakizashi Renaissance
Posted - 2011.09.03 06:05:00 - [156]
 

Originally by: Sullen Skoung
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
Originally by: Sullen Skoung



There is bound to be a douche bag everywhere. Judging the rest of the devs on the actions of 1 man is simple minded though.




someone wanna translate this? I get that he's calling me a douche bag... the rest not so clear

That bit is not about you. He's saying t20 was a douche bag, there are bound to be douche bags everywhere, and that not all the devs are nasty cheaters like t20 was at that time. If you said the behavior of t20 was proof that all devs are evil, then he's calling you simple minded.

Florestan Bronstein
24th Imperial Crusade
Posted - 2011.09.03 06:23:00 - [157]
 

Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 03/09/2011 06:25:04

players usually employ a very broad definition of "dev"

it seems hat the douchebags sit in (upper) management and are not really "developers" - but in general everyone still refers to these guys as "devs"

I don't think anybody really blames the poor codemonkeys (no disrespect intended) that do their best to write decent code subject to all the requests, restrictions, deadlines, ... pushed on them by management and PMs.

Decisions about what features to implement in how short a time, whether to refactor ugly old code, what bugs are blocking a release and which can be fixed later(TM), ... are not decisions made by your regular dev.

Sullen Skoung
Posted - 2011.09.03 09:31:00 - [158]
 

Originally by: Enkidu Uruksen
Originally by: Sullen Skoung
Originally by: Sidus Isaacs
Originally by: Sullen Skoung



There is bound to be a douche bag everywhere. Judging the rest of the devs on the actions of 1 man is simple minded though.




someone wanna translate this? I get that he's calling me a douche bag... the rest not so clear

That bit is not about you. He's saying t20 was a douche bag, there are bound to be douche bags everywhere, and that not all the devs are nasty cheaters like t20 was at that time. If you said the behavior of t20 was proof that all devs are evil, then he's calling you simple minded.



ah so someone cant take a joke. good to know.
Im on 2 5-500 Lortab every 6 hrs due to broken bones. my mind works slowly

SexxxSlave
Posted - 2011.09.03 16:53:00 - [159]
 

sup CCP, where are these minutes? We're pushing three months now...

IskPlease
Posted - 2011.09.03 17:42:00 - [160]
 

Originally by: SexxxSlave
sup CCP, where are these minutes? We're pushing three months now...


Wohoo, just 15 months to go...

Tomas Sean Connery
Posted - 2011.09.03 19:13:00 - [161]
 

Originally by: IskPlease
Originally by: SexxxSlave
sup CCP, where are these minutes? We're pushing three months now...


Wohoo, just 15 months to go...



I thought 5 years was the new 18 months... So 4 years 9 months?

Cailais
Amarr
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
Talocan United
Posted - 2011.09.03 19:57:00 - [162]
 

Just leak the minutes. Who cares what CCP wants in its PR?

C.

Nin Kimrov
Minmatar
Kenzi Arms and Munitions
Posted - 2011.09.03 20:18:00 - [163]
 

That would be a hit if the csm leaked the first version of the minutes. Whatever would be the nda break. CCP banning the csm would be like shooting in their own foot.

BuckStrider
Nano-Tech Experiments
Posted - 2011.09.03 21:09:00 - [164]
 

Originally by: Cailais
Just leak the minutes. Who cares what CCP wants in its PR?

C.



Mittens can't leak them. They haven't been approved yet by CCP or White Tree burned the originals with gasoline

Haradriel Tian
Posted - 2011.09.03 21:14:00 - [165]
 

Originally by: Thornat
Edited by: Thornat on 02/09/2011 08:09:43
The CSM or someone at CCP should just leak the minutes and let **** hit the fan. In all honesty the more CCP is humbled the better it will be for the game in the long run. Right now CCP believe themselves to be these super successful, untouchable entity that has the best sandbox game on the market leaving them in a position of infinite clout which they can use anyway they see fit. They need to have the rug pulled from under them and brought down to earth so perhaps they might realize that their success is firmly in the palms of the players and we decide wether or not they have a future.

Every day there are fewer and fewer people logging into Eve and every day more and more long time friends are playing less and less, some leaving outright. Its a sad state of affairs and the whole thing is just one big ****ing contest between the community and CCP, a contest which will result in everyone loosing simultanously. Their is no victory for the community if CCP and Eve fail as both a company and as a game, and certainly their is no victory if CCP gets their way and the community abandons them.

The failure of CCP management right now is so vivid and outragous I'm really suprised that heads aren't rolling. This situation needs to be resolved definitively, CCP needs to re-affirm their commitment to the game, re-organize their plans and start thinking like players not businessmen. If they do that, they might just make all that money they are hoping on making, but as long as they continue to **** of the community and people continue to leave the game nothing they do or say matters. They have to cataroize this bleeding wound and you start by publicy apologizing, showing some humility and making a new commitment to do better, following that up by sticking to the commitment.

CCP managers need to get their **** together fast before this whole thing goes to a point beyond saving.



This is spot on.

Veengere
Posted - 2011.09.03 21:16:00 - [166]
 

Originally by: Florestan Bronstein
Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 03/09/2011 06:25:04

players usually employ a very broad definition of "dev"

it seems hat the douchebags sit in (upper) management and are not really "developers" - but in general everyone still refers to these guys as "devs"

I don't think anybody really blames the poor codemonkeys (no disrespect intended) that do their best to write decent code subject to all the requests, restrictions, deadlines, ... pushed on them by management and PMs.

Decisions about what features to implement in how short a time, whether to refactor ugly old code, what bugs are blocking a release and which can be fixed later(TM), ... are not decisions made by your regular dev.


They are part of the development of the game. Actually the upper management decides more of what is done to the game then the hired code monkey. So yes they are Devs.

Mag's
the united
Negative Ten.
Posted - 2011.09.03 21:21:00 - [167]
 

Originally by: Thornat
The CSM or someone at CCP should just leak the minutes and let **** hit the fan. In all honesty the more CCP is humbled the better it will be for the game in the long run. Right now CCP believe themselves to be these super successful, untouchable entity that has the best sandbox game on the market leaving them in a position of infinite clout which they can use anyway they see fit. They need to have the rug pulled from under them and brought down to earth so perhaps they might realize that their success is firmly in the palms of the players and we decide wether or not they have a future.

Every day there are fewer and fewer people logging into Eve and every day more and more long time friends are playing less and less, some leaving outright. Its a sad state of affairs and the whole thing is just one big ****ing contest between the community and CCP, a contest which will result in everyone loosing simultanously. Their is no victory for the community if CCP and Eve fail as both a company and as a game, and certainly their is no victory if CCP gets their way and the community abandons them.

The failure of CCP management right now is so vivid and outragous I'm really suprised that heads aren't rolling. This situation needs to be resolved definitively, CCP needs to re-affirm their commitment to the game, re-organize their plans and start thinking like players not businessmen. If they do that, they might just make all that money they are hoping on making, but as long as they continue to **** of the community and people continue to leave the game nothing they do or say matters. They have to cataroize this bleeding wound and you start by publicy apologizing, showing some humility and making a new commitment to do better, following that up by sticking to the commitment.

CCP managers need to get their **** together fast before this whole thing goes to a point beyond saving.

This. But they won't change, because certain types at the top believe they are so right.

Originally by: Two step
I am a CSM, and I am posting on my main.
GTFO exploiter, you have no credibility.

AnzacPaul
Perkone
Posted - 2011.09.04 04:33:00 - [168]
 

Bumping this cause I can

Major Stallion
The Money Shot Inc.
Posted - 2011.09.04 05:39:00 - [169]
 

Originally by: AnzacPaul
Bumping this cause I can

AnzacPaul
Perkone
Posted - 2011.09.04 10:56:00 - [170]
 

Trebor has made a blog with his thoughts, to add to seleenes and mittani


http://treborofthecsm.blogspot.com/

Ramalamadindong
Posted - 2011.09.04 11:26:00 - [171]
 

Any chance we could get these before the winter expansion?

Living Dead Girl
Posted - 2011.09.04 11:31:00 - [172]
 

Edited by: Living Dead Girl on 04/09/2011 11:31:51
Something tells me I'd probably like to see the CSM's first draft (minus NDA stuff of course) over anything CCP releases.

Ravcharas
GREY COUNCIL
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2011.09.04 12:15:00 - [173]
 

Crowd Control Productions

oematoema
Posted - 2011.09.04 12:16:00 - [174]
 

Originally by: Living Dead Girl
Edited by: Living Dead Girl on 04/09/2011 11:31:51
Something tells me I'd probably like to see the CSM's first draft (minus NDA stuff of course) over anything CCP releases.


I'd even consider buying a monocle if we could also see the CCP-edited version of that draft.

Ione Hawke
Posted - 2011.09.04 13:54:00 - [175]
 

Heh, have CSM and CCP independently release their own minutes/ view on things with the disclaimer that it is only their view. I am sure we as a community can discern the truthTM from these two views :)

Or will NDA and such prevent the CSM from releasing minutes without CCP signing off on them?

Cozmik R5
Minmatar
Dock 94
Posted - 2011.09.04 13:59:00 - [176]
 

This morning on Twitter, from CCP Tardsauce (awesome name BTW):

"We will release the #CSM6 minutes for the #tweetfleet when the #CSM agrees to make them contain nothing that might make @CCPGames look bad."

I lol'd. Thanks for making my day Tardsauce!

Barbelo Valentinian
Gallente
The Scope
Posted - 2011.09.04 14:11:00 - [177]
 

Originally by: AnzacPaul
Trebor has made a blog with his thoughts, to add to seleenes and mittani


http://treborofthecsm.blogspot.com/


That's an excellent post: very revealing, while still maintaining the proper decorum.

Eclorc
Posted - 2011.09.04 14:36:00 - [178]
 

Originally by: Barbelo Valentinian
Originally by: AnzacPaul
Trebor has made a blog with his thoughts, to add to seleenes and mittani


http://treborofthecsm.blogspot.com/


That's an excellent post: very revealing, while still maintaining the proper decorum.



Well, that blog says it all really.

I've got less than a week left on my account time now, have only been feeding skillqueue for all this time in vain hopes of something turning around with CCP's stance on things.
Yeah, deluded I know.
I like the WIS/Ambulation/Incarnal thing, want to see it expand to full station.
MT store - in this subscription game simply stinks. I won't believe CCP will resist the temptation for game-changing stuff later. Boosters like Quafe Zero will be their next move.
Bye Eve, you were a great friend until you changed. I know I won't be missed.
I'll be back if Nexon store leaves the game. Fat chance.

Ciar Meara
Amarr
Virtus Vindice
Posted - 2011.09.04 16:38:00 - [179]
 

Originally by: Eclorc
Originally by: Barbelo Valentinian
Originally by: AnzacPaul
Trebor has made a blog with his thoughts, to add to seleenes and mittani


http://treborofthecsm.blogspot.com/


That's an excellent post: very revealing, while still maintaining the proper decorum.



Well, that blog says it all really.

I've got less than a week left on my account time now, have only been feeding skillqueue for all this time in vain hopes of something turning around with CCP's stance on things.
Yeah, deluded I know.
[...]
Bye Eve, you were a great friend until you changed. I know I won't be missed.
I'll be back if Nexon store leaves the game. Fat chance.



Same here, I have until november.

RougeOperator
Posted - 2011.09.04 16:59:00 - [180]
 

The Flat number is going to go down slowly as peoples prepaid time expires. I myself sadly have like 9 months of time left cause i bought a year just before incarna came out and feel like a fool for doing so.


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