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Vincent Athena
Posted - 2011.08.29 15:04:00 - [61]
 

You need to remember why e-uni conducts itself in wars the way it does.

Its goal in a war is to end the war as quickly as possible so it can back to teaching eve in its entirety, not just teaching war. To do this it wants to make the war as little fun as possible for the attacker. This means denying them kills, so they do lockdown, except for war fleets. It also means war fleets are huge to insure a fast kill, so they do blobs in war.

If you do not like the teaching of these tactics, then the best way to keep e-uni from using lockdown and blobs is to insure they never have a war.

Poetic Stanziel
Gallente
Macbeth Transport and Freight LLC
Posted - 2011.08.29 15:29:00 - [62]
 

Edited by: Poetic Stanziel on 29/08/2011 15:30:04
Originally by: Xolani1990
Poetic, I really think you should start writing for EVE News 24 yourself, with the level of journalistic competency and integrity you encapsulate.

First of all, not a journalist, nor do I claim to be.

I write on topics that interest me.

What was told to me might have been slightly exaggerated, but the point that EVE University wants to have NPC Corporation mechanics applied to it, so as to avoid wardecs, is accurate.

Kelduum himself backs this up:
  1. He states he communicates regularly with CCP on games issues that could make EVE University's corporate existence easier. That is his job after all, as CEO of EVE University. His job is to further the goals of the University and make the game better for his students/employees.

  2. He states that he compiled, for CCP, a list of game mechanic changes that could be made that would facilitate making EVE University's corporate existence easier.

  3. He states that in the list was the suggestion of adding EVE University to an NPC "faction".

I think he backed up the main issue in the article: EVE University as a semi-NPC corporate entity.

The only question is how seriously did CCP take the suggestion, and how much conversation has there been (or is still ongoing) in that direction.

Naradius
DEATHFUNK
Posted - 2011.08.29 16:00:00 - [63]
 

Originally by: AnzacPaul
This is probably the worst idea i've ever heard.

Which is exactly why CCP will do it.


You just cant argue with this reasoning!

Smoking Blunts
Posted - 2011.08.29 16:02:00 - [64]
 

it shouldnt be an npc corp.
if ccp wants an npc training corp it should staff it itself and pay people to train people.
all teh nex income could be well spent.

dont get me wrong eve uni is great, but its great as a player run corp. it shoudl not get special treatment cos ccp are so ****ing lazy they wont do the job themselves


Goddess Ishtar
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.08.29 16:36:00 - [65]
 

Originally by: Poetic Stanziel
I write on topics that interest me.

Based on your post history you seem to have an unhealthy obsession with Eve University.

Ranger 1
Amarr
Ranger Corp
Posted - 2011.08.29 16:46:00 - [66]
 

Edited by: Ranger 1 on 29/08/2011 16:48:00
Obviously this won't happen for EVE Uni, but personally I wouldn't mind a bit if in a limited fashion players could become part of the NPC corp management and have some minor influence on them. In fact, it would be very interesting if there was the potential for NPC corps to wage war on each other if a vote in favor of it was passed by a majority of the membership.

Poetic, perhaps you should pursue a career in journalism. You took a footnote in a long list of idea's thrown out for discussion and managed to make it "sound" like offers have been made and plans are being discussed.

If you took the time to be a bit more certain of your facts you could be the next Geraldo RiveraExclamation Smile

Karash Amerius
Sutoka
Posted - 2011.08.29 17:40:00 - [67]
 

I think the "problem" with wardecs vs E-UNI is not the mechanics per say, its the E-UNI WSOP. Its very stifling to the new players there to sit in station while one man corps grief their playtime. They can have all sorts of policies in place to deal with it, or encourage alts, but regular (new) players will still get fed up with it, regardless of the bureaucracy involved to mitigate it.

Poetic Stanziel
Gallente
Macbeth Transport and Freight LLC
Posted - 2011.08.29 19:00:00 - [68]
 

Edited by: Poetic Stanziel on 30/08/2011 08:44:10
Originally by: Goddess Ishtar
Originally by: Poetic Stanziel
I write on topics that interest me.

Based on your post history you seem to have an unhealthy obsession with Eve University.
*shrug*

I was with E-Uni for 3 months. What else was I going to write about? It's not like E-Uni actually develops relationships with other corps that I could have written about. The E-Uni principle is to keep as low a profile as possible, lest people wardec them. It's all about the wardecs, ya know! :)

dum dumdum
Posted - 2011.08.30 00:22:00 - [69]
 

Originally by: Bluecollar Tweaker
This is the biggest LOL of all time. I always thought Incarna was a feature made just for EUNI and now we have lolproof. Heh, and even more so epic comedy because Keduum AND Silent Brick have both decided to throw down on the OP troll. You two are so full of yourselves... the lols just never end.

Bottom line is this: Eve University is only important to themselves. They've been trying to get the game customized to their needs for years. They want everyone to believe they're here to help the game but the large majority of teachers/staff in the corporation have never played the game any other way; they've been in Eve University this whole time. The point is, what they teach is stale. Eve University is still egohurt over what happened to Big Blue and they are still playing the same game: LOCKDOWN. You want to see a fiefdom? Join Eve University... bunch of grown men trying to control the game of other people.

I hope CCP gives them special privilege. It will be the final nail in the coffin for me, but at the same time CCP will get the education corporation they deserve, one that will teach everyone to be nice, mine, and above all else, don't undock... use that great new feature.


+1

now to the OP.




















thats the sound of not a single f*** was given

Do you seriously think that anyone in eve (bar the uni carebears) cares about the uni. As previously stated the uni wants to play the game of "Carebears online". I mean the uni bloc voted in the recent crowdsurfing for several things which make absolutely no difference to most of the players of eve (bar the uni). I mean medal changes ...Neutral

Do you seriously think that anyone gives one about the people in charge of eve uni? Most the directors dont even login the game bar once a week for their mining ops. The reason they have the positions of power in the uni is because they never left the uni in the first place. PvP doesnt really exist in "carebears online".

Admiral last pvped in 2007, still thinks he is a big shot and he is rightly so if you compare him to the carebears in the uni. Anyone with a real passion for pvp leaves the uni asap ofc (see above point about directors and never leaving the uni). The POS bash that never happened was hilarious especially when you realise that the Fail Admiral did so in retaliation to some troll leaked to EN24 which called him impotent ... thats the best way to prove yourself in PvP ... take a huge blob to shoot something that doesnt fight back and then gtfo. Another medal to the admiral. The fact that this guy is in control of the pvp side of Eve Uni is laughable (The corpse collector should be).

But back to the topic poetic ... you dont seem like a bad guy. I glanced on your blog to see that you wanted to help the uni. However please realise that the uni doesnt want change or any help. The uni wants to stay the same and teach and play "carebears online" and anyone who doesnt adhere to this gets ostracised and kicked pretty sharpish.

Be happy that you no longer have to adhere to double standards, be under the control of people who are less experienced that you or station spin in retaliation to war decs.

Welcome to EvE and congratulations for undocking out of station "carebears online".

Khanh'rhh
Sudden Buggery
Situation: Normal
Posted - 2011.08.30 01:10:00 - [70]
 

This post is lol-worthy to anyone who spends any time in the #tweetfleet.

At least one in 50 tweets (in total) is her spamming links to her blog (she manages about 10 in the posts here!) which are incessant suppositions and rambles about things "she heard" or "knows from someone who knows" -- essentially trying to sound important and knowledgeable about issues she knows **** all about.

As a final nail into the coffin of any credibility, she deletes any comments on her blog that she doesn't agree with, or point out errors in the post (such as rampant hear-say) There were several on this article alone. I know, I posted one of them.

That said, the suggestion that this (and only this) corp should get any special treatment is ludicrous to the extreme. I am glad to see E-Uni directors / members bashing it down as nothing they've had a part of. I would contest that E-Uni in general is a terrible organisation of power-tripping carebears who REALLY need to find something better to do than force new players to stay docked, but that's not the discussion here.

Rikeka
Eye of God
Posted - 2011.08.30 01:52:00 - [71]
 

Hope is not true.

EVEUni is awesome, but this would bring a lot of issues.
And NPC corps should have their tax increased, not reduced.

Marius Labo
Gallente
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.08.30 02:55:00 - [72]
 

Edited by: Marius Labo on 30/08/2011 02:56:13
Originally by: Khanh'rhh

That said, the suggestion that this (and only this) corp should get any special treatment is ludicrous to the extreme. I am glad to see E-Uni directors / members bashing it down as nothing they've had a part of. I would contest that E-Uni in general is a terrible organisation of power-tripping carebears who REALLY need to find something better to do than force new players to stay docked, but that's not the discussion here.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, albiet it should be an informed opinion. I agree that the Uni should not receive any special treatment. I am not informed in the number of other larger corps that get wardecced by 1 (or a few) man corps but it would be interesting to see a comparison. When the Uni gets decced by a reasonably serious corp for PvP it can be quite fun. I do have to say that the conception that the Uni forces new (I suppose you mean all the membership, we do have many who are not so new) to stay docked up is incorrect. Our rules/wsop allow members to drop corp without penalty and return when the war is over, or even prior. The Uni gives all it's pilots the freedom to choose. We just ask that if they remain that they follow the rules. I had one pilot convo me asking permission to undock and move a ship that wasn't within the wsop. Naturally I couldn't do that, but the solution was that he dropped corp, moved his ship, and then we processed him back in. Really the only members that aren't "allowed" to drop are staff. During the faildecs, such as the last one, many Unistas undocked and carried on doing missions in fleets, and incursions. In fact Poetic herself participated in many.

As you read through our wsop it's quite obvious that the point is to bring a wardec to a close so that normal operations can continue.

Well the Uni isn't for everyone and we're definitely not everyone's favorite. You're definitely allowed your viewpoint that we're a terrible organization of power-tripping carebears. There are just thousands of pilots who have passed through the Uni that would disagree with you, and probably a few hundred that would agree.

Marius Labo
Student Relations Manager
EVE University

Puk Gaai
Posted - 2011.08.30 03:08:00 - [73]
 

Edited by: Puk Gaai on 30/08/2011 03:08:30
is this change for real?

dum dumdum
Posted - 2011.08.30 03:13:00 - [74]
 

Edited by: dum dumdum on 30/08/2011 03:14:59
Originally by: Marius Labo
Edited by: Marius Labo on 30/08/2011 02:56:13
Originally by: Khanh'rhh

That said, the suggestion that this (and only this) corp should get any special treatment is ludicrous to the extreme. I am glad to see E-Uni directors / members bashing it down as nothing they've had a part of. I would contest that E-Uni in general is a terrible organisation of power-tripping carebears who REALLY need to find something better to do than force new players to stay docked, but that's not the discussion here.


Well the Uni isn't for ANY NON CAREBEAR PILOTS YOUNGER THAN A FEW MONTHS OF AGE and we're definitely NO ONES's favorite OTHER THAN OUR OWN. You're definitely allowed your viewpoint that we're a SAD organization of power-tripping carebears. There are just thousands of pilots who have passed through the Uni that would AGREE with you, and probably a few hundred that would DISAGREE.

Marius Labo
CareBear Relations Manager
EVE University



fixed that for you

Poetic Stanziel
Gallente
Macbeth Transport and Freight LLC
Posted - 2011.08.30 06:37:00 - [75]
 

Originally by: Khanh'rhh
At least one in 50 tweets (in total) is her spamming links to her blog (she manages about 10 in the posts here!) which are incessant suppositions and rambles about things "she heard" or "knows from someone who knows" -- essentially trying to sound important and knowledgeable about issues she knows **** all about.
You are probably correct. I will reduce the amount of "Hey, look at my blog" spam.

Quote:
As a final nail into the coffin of any credibility, she deletes any comments on her blog that she doesn't agree with, or point out errors in the post (such as rampant hear-say) There were several on this article alone. I know, I posted one of them.

This is sort of true. Though I've only ever deleted three comments. Two were of the "Aren't you a precious little ***" variety, and yours wasn't much better. I have some negative comments on the blog, but they're at least intelligently written. :)

Provence Tristram
Posted - 2011.08.30 07:04:00 - [76]
 

Edited by: Provence Tristram on 30/08/2011 07:09:55
Edited by: Provence Tristram on 30/08/2011 07:09:20
Edited by: Provence Tristram on 30/08/2011 07:07:40
Originally by: Bluecollar Tweaker
Bottom line is this: Eve University is only important to themselves. They've been trying to get the game customized to their needs for years. They want everyone to believe they're here to help the game but the large majority of teachers/staff in the corporation have never played the game any other way; they've been in Eve University this whole time. The point is, what they teach is stale. Eve University is still egohurt over what happened to Big Blue and they are still playing the same game: LOCKDOWN. You want to see a fiefdom? Join Eve University... bunch of grown men trying to control the game of other people.


The true irony is this is the same -- legitimate -- criticism that has been fielded against real-life universities for decades; that their professors have little real-life experience, and are in many cases less real-world savvy than even some of their more enterprising or intelligent students (one needs only look at people like Bill Gates and Mark Zuckerberg [much as I loathe the latter] to understand that one good idea > than any lesson you can learn in college).

Instead of teaching people to be practical participants in society, they instead teach them to be good gears in the machine of the college world; and those two skillsets could hardly be more opposed. I believe that such complaints leveled against EUNI are fair -- I don't know if their hand-holding really accomplishes much of anything. You can learn most of the basic things you need to know about EVE in under a month. After that, membership in a good, real corp is going to go a lot further towards polishing a person as a player than continuing to languish in EUNI. By all accounts, 90% of the 'real' game in EVE happens in nulsec. A corporation that spends its time dodging war declarations and hiding in 0.8+ space isn't doing much of a service to its members at all.

Quote:
I hope CCP gives them special privilege. It will be the final nail in the coffin for me, but at the same time CCP will get the education corporation they deserve, one that will teach everyone to be nice, mine, and above all else, don't undock... use that great new feature.


It might be hoped the CCP has learned, at least temporarily, to keep their collective hands off the hot stove. This idea doesn't seem popular, and could create yet another scandal. That's the last thing CCP wants or needs right now. *If* there was any truth behind these rumors, this thread might have killed all momentum such a proposal ever had.

Daquaris
Ghosts of Ragnarok
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.08.30 07:37:00 - [77]
 

B0RT is my noobcorp.

Just sayin.

BoodaBooda
Minmatar
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.08.30 07:39:00 - [78]
 

What does my corp get for single-handedly launching the EVE careers of thousands of reddit.com members, and promoting the game through media and external-community discussion?

Oh right, nothing.

Sultry Sinner
Posted - 2011.08.30 07:45:00 - [79]
 

Originally by: BoodaBooda
What does my corp get for single-handedly launching the EVE careers of thousands of reddit.com members, and promoting the game through media and external-community discussion?

Oh right, nothing.


~~MY CEO~~

Daquaris
Ghosts of Ragnarok
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.08.30 07:46:00 - [80]
 

Originally by: Sultry Sinner
Originally by: BoodaBooda
What does my corp get for single-handedly launching the EVE careers of thousands of reddit.com members, and promoting the game through media and external-community discussion?

Oh right, nothing.


~~MY CEO~~


~~CEO OF MY HEART~~

Theodoric Darkwind
Gallente
PonyWaffe
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.08.30 08:09:00 - [81]
 

and the best part about this is it was one big troll.

Poetic spouted off some hearsay, uni directors pretty much tell him he got trolled and he burns what little credibility he had left trying to claim that things Kelduum has said as a joke were in fact serious.


BoodaBooda
Minmatar
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.08.30 08:12:00 - [82]
 

YOU OWE ME, CCP



You owe me

theDisto
Posted - 2011.08.30 08:15:00 - [83]
 

So the idea of this change would be not to teach Eve Uni graduates about war decs?

I'm not against this change as it doesn't effect me but bear in mind what this would mean.

Poetic Stanziel
Gallente
Macbeth Transport and Freight LLC
Posted - 2011.08.30 08:22:00 - [84]
 

Edited by: Poetic Stanziel on 30/08/2011 08:32:11
Well, that was fun.

A bit of short-lived vindictive fun. Kelduum b!tched that I was kicked because I'd increased his workload (in reality it was his whiny staff who increased his workload), so figured, as a parting gesture, I'd increase the whine from his subordinates three-fold for a few days. :) If there is one thing the Uni hates, it is being the center of any negative attention, it defeats the purpose of being low-profile. (That EN24 troll, as bad and illiterate and unfocused as it was, had the Uni in an angry whirl for days.)

That, and he kicked me for a fairly innocuous post that criticised the need for covert ops certifications in the UNI (counter-productive and contradictory.)

Did I blow something out of proportion? Yes. Definitely. Isn't that what trolling is all about? The idea of E-UNI becoming part of an NPC faction/alliance was second hand info, but I knew it was true at the heart (if the exact details were likely to be muddled/exaggerated.) I knew it to be something Kelduum had mentioned to his director/management troops. (Kelduum loves to keep his people informed on his direct dealings with CCP.) Unlike the EN24 troll, at least I knew there was something factual at the heart of it. The Uni hates leaks of that sort more than anything else.

This thread couldn't have maintained itself for much more than a page of posts ... until Kelduum posted. That was total win, since he pretty much verified himself that he had indeed sent off such a suggestion to CCP. (He should have remained silent.) Once he had posted, it was easy to re-quote him in such a way as to control and direct the conversation into one specific area ... E-UNI as unwardeccable. And yes, he probably didn't take his suggestion to CCP very seriously (I wonder, though, how seriously CCP, the corporation of bad decisions, took the suggestion?)

If there's anything EVE Online players cannot stand, it is the idea of any group of players getting special privilege from CCP.

The extra bonus win was Silentbrick's post. (That dude should not be allowed to speak for the Uni. He's the worst director the Uni has, is never online, and wears his e-peen title like a crown of gold.) Dude, should have at least read his boss' post first.

Good fun. My little snit/tantrum is over. I'm still proud to have been a Unista. I still think the University has a valuable role to play in EVE Online. And the University still has a great number of excellent people (minus a number of no-show directors and managers. The UniWiki states the Uni is a meritocracy, but it is far from it.)

I still think Kelduum is a pretty great guy. I still believe he'd be a great representative for CSM7. The only director at the Uni who is involved with the Uni on a daily basis.

Anyhow, good fun for a couple days. With the new forums coming, this thread will be dead soon enough.

There's still the question of why Kelduum would have thought moving the Uni into an NPC faction/alliance might be a good idea (yeah, he does hate wardecs), and how seriously CCP took the idea. But if it was something CCP might have been considering, hopefully it is no longer on the table.

Personally, I still think wardec prices should be increased ... or at least an option to re-bribe CONCORD to end a war. The Uni's wardec problems aren't so much the wardecs themselves as a) they are dirt cheap, and b) the Uni WSOP. The Uni could solve half its problems by creating a more flexible WSOP (they've gone someway towards that with their Relaxed WSOP, but not far enough.)

Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.

As an aside, it would be helpful for developing good Uni policy if someone were to set aside 10B ISK and dec the Uni for 6 months straight. They couldn't stay bottled up that long, and if they did, it would decimate their membership. They'd have to implement change to survive.

Poetic Stanziel
Gallente
Macbeth Transport and Freight LLC
Posted - 2011.08.30 08:55:00 - [85]
 

Originally by: Theodoric Darkwind
Poetic spouted off some hearsay, uni directors pretty much tell him he got trolled and he burns what little credibility he had left trying to claim that things Kelduum has said as a joke were in fact serious.

It wasn't a joke suggestion, though. Kelduum is not in the habit of sending off a list of suggestions to CCP, along with a special section labelled HUMOURS. Kelduum's not in the habit of wasting CCP's time. It was a serious suggestion, even if Kelduum didn't place much stock in CCP taking it seriously. If CCP had taken it seriously (they may have to some degree, who knows), I'm sure he would have been happier than hell. No more wardecs. Kelduum (and most of the membership) would love a University that couldn't be wardecced non-mutually. You know it. And I know it.

Jovan Geldon
Gallente
Lead Farmers
Kill It With Fire
Posted - 2011.08.30 09:51:00 - [86]
 

Please move this trash to CAOD, it hurts my eyes

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2011.08.30 10:06:00 - [87]
 

Originally by: BoodaBooda
What does my corp get for single-handedly launching the EVE careers of thousands of reddit.com members, and promoting the game through media and external-community discussion?

Oh right, nothing.


You did it from nullsec so it doesn't count

Written Word
Written Word's Tax Haven
Posted - 2011.08.30 10:13:00 - [88]
 

I was wondering when this was going to go "I wus just trollin gaiz" route

Kelduum Revaan
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.08.30 11:01:00 - [89]
 

Originally by: Poetic Stanziel
Kelduum would love a University that couldn't be wardecced non-mutually.

You keep repeating this, as if you are attempting to convince yourself it is fact.

Here are the actual facts:
- I swapped the Uni to NBSI after almost seven years of it being NRDS.
- I moved the HQ to be closer to a lot of losec hang-outs.
- I spent many hours rewriting the war rules to be clearer, and less restrictive.
- I am often disappointed that people fail to bring the PvP after spending their money.
- I have stated, many, many times that wardecs against an appropriate force are great.
- Yesterday I finally launched a new E-UNI killboard with 'achievements' for PvP kills, as many studies have shown it's a good motivator.

PvP is good, Wars are good.

Wars where there is nobody to fight are boring for both sides, and I would love CCP to look at a way to dissuade or otherwise negate these one day.


Coming up next week from Poetic: E-UNI members all get given a new battleship with 100% resists and filled with PLEX, and Uni Directors all get GM modules and the ability to teleport around.

Poetic Stanziel
Gallente
Macbeth Transport and Freight LLC
Posted - 2011.08.30 11:49:00 - [90]
 

Edited by: Poetic Stanziel on 30/08/2011 12:06:26


Originally by: Kelduum Revaan
Coming up next week from Poetic: E-UNI members all get given a new battleship with 100% resists and filled with PLEX, and Uni Directors all get GM modules and the ability to teleport around.


Nah, you deserve your teleporting super-powers. ;)

As for wars being good ... ask for one ... from an ex-Unista alliance. I brought the possibility of one to your attention. All your managers and directors shot it down. They are your mouthpieces, no? If you ACTUALLY think wars are good, then arrange a good one. Overrule your carebears and do it. Don't stretch it into some 3-month long bureaucratic debate. It's easy to say you like wars, but when is the last time you arranged a mutual wardec (a lot of good corps that would bring a good fight.)

Director versus student fights are meaningless. (Though, it is about the only time you'll see more than two directors online at the same time. They love showing their awesomeness by shooting down 3M skillpoint students.)

And you moved HQ because you were originally too close to Jita and getting wardecced too often. You moved to an out-of-the-way locale. Less Uni visibility. Less wardecs.

You switched to NBSI after ILN's Battlegroup 1 threatened to revolt.

As for the new killboard, since it isn't hooked into EVSCO (and you've stated it won't be), it is a good way to further insulate the Uni from the rest of the game.

The WSOP rewrite is much clearer. It was a good investment of your time doing that. Less restrictive? Not really. You added the ability to do incursion fleets during Relaxed WSOPs (which was a good addition) and the ability to run wormholes at any time (although due to the Covert Ops Certification, this makes running wormholes impractical, and I know of no one who did during the last two wars ... I was going too ... but was told I could not use my Helios to scan down wormholes or use them to scout the wormholes themselves ... so I decided against it ... it's straight dumb to do wormhole scouting in a T1 frigate with an Improved Cloak II.)


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