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Kyes Torvalis
Posted - 2011.08.26 01:43:00 - [1]
 

I have an idea on how to limit supercaps and titans, in a way that would help to balance the game, while remaining in-line with the "immersion" of the game. These are massive ships, they require immense amount of supplies, fuel, and crew to operate.

The logical extension of that, is that in order to make use of these, you must control the infrastructure(sov)required to supply them. Limit the amount of titans or super caps that an alliance can field (not own), around the amount of space they control. They can field one supercap per system they control, and one titan for every five systems they control. (all numbers are arbitrary, and subject to change)

This might not be the end all, be all fix, but it would certainly limit the ability of any single alliance to drop 50 titans, and 100 supercaps on a single fight, and wtfdoomsday their way to victory, 10 minutes at a time.

*dons his asbestos overalls*

Skinae
Hello Kitty Hug Patrol
Posted - 2011.08.26 02:26:00 - [2]
 

Alliances would split into sub alliances. Increasing the cost of supercaps by 1 billion, which is nothing.

Akuma Tsukai
Amarr
Posted - 2011.08.26 03:38:00 - [3]
 

wont help.
we just need dedicated anti cap weapon which can be installed on smaller ships. Currently say you see reve... nah pathetic archon. Even when its solo (lol) how much ships and of what class do you need to bring to take it down before cavalry arrives?
Currently the only ships of such class are SB but they are designed to kill BS max, so mebbe i dunno, SB cruiser size? or better yet, BC size? (we lack T2 BC anyway). With corresponding changes, anti capital ship torpedo instead of bomb, same launcher, etc...
And then i run out of coke.

Umad Bro Questionmark
Posted - 2011.08.26 03:41:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Akuma Tsukai
wont help.
we just need dedicated anti cap weapon which can be installed on smaller ships. Currently say you see reve... nah pathetic archon. Even when its solo (lol) how much ships and of what class do you need to bring to take it down before cavalry arrives?
Currently the only ships of such class are SB but they are designed to kill BS max, so mebbe i dunno, SB cruiser size? or better yet, BC size? (we lack T2 BC anyway). With corresponding changes, anti capital ship torpedo instead of bomb, same launcher, etc...
And then i run out of coke.



SUPERCAPS ARE MEANT TO NOT BE KILLED BY A GANG OF 3 PUBBIES FLYING AROUND, THATS WHY THEY ARE SUPER CAPS FOR ****'S SAKE

Snarly Pete
Posted - 2011.08.26 03:56:00 - [5]
 

Just take away their jump drives. Easy fix.

Headerman
Minmatar
Quovis
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
Posted - 2011.08.26 04:24:00 - [6]
 

Na, CCPs fix will simply be to keep the cost the same, but reduce the amount of shield/armour it has.

Kiyl
Posted - 2011.08.26 06:32:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Snarly Pete
Just take away their jump drives. Easy fix.


Because dropping 50bil on a ship that is limited to one system is totally worth it...

Pinky Denmark
The Cursed Navy
Important Internet Spaceship League
Posted - 2011.08.26 10:26:00 - [8]
 

LoL dedicated anticapital weapons? Just balance the EHP of supers and Titans and dreads + subcapitals with good tactics and numbers will balance everything out fine...

XGS Crimson
Posted - 2011.08.26 11:27:00 - [9]
 

It's a really tough issue to deal with, They could make specialist anti supercap battleships (black ops) but then that would make them too easy to bring down and no one would bring them to the fight (think of how easy it is to get black ops ships).

I also think the idea of making another capital ship devoted to killing super capitals would not work either as it would result in more capitals on the field.

A good solution that comes to mind for me would be to design either a ship class, or a ship module that is effectivley a titan superweapon, but split down so that smaller ships (black ops) can fit the modules so you wont be able to kill a titan by yourzself, but get 20-30 of these badboys to combine their fire into one beam and you get a superweapon.

Any thoughts?

whaynethepain
Dissident Aggressors
Mordus Angels
Posted - 2011.08.26 11:39:00 - [10]
 

How about mobile destructible cyno jammers?

Cruiser class bombers?

Dunno, last time I fought a cap in my Vigil, it couldn't hit me with it's fighters, so I don't know what's up.

I must ask how the drones sit in the fighter bay?

Jacob Stov
Posted - 2011.08.26 12:39:00 - [11]
 

Reduce EHP of fighter bombers to assault frigate level. I guess this will greatly reduce the popularity of them buggers. Razz

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2011.08.26 12:47:00 - [12]
 

Here is my "supercap fix":

When supercap pilots log in, they get a message asking which station they want the capital components, rigs, fuel, drones and modules that used to comprise their ship placed into. CCP admit that supers were a cool concept that didn't work out in practice. A few hundred super pilots sperge about how their lives are ruined now that they don't have their hideously unbalanced win-buttons.

The rest of us get on with playing a much-improved game.

Dark Pangolin
Caldari
Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse
Posted - 2011.08.26 13:00:00 - [13]
 

How about mobile destructible cyno jammers.

Dr Fighter
Posted - 2011.08.26 13:27:00 - [14]
 

its pretty easy to stem the amount of resource that is needed.

Im supprised any cyno doesnt already have a max mass limit which shuts down the cyno (and the pilot has to use more fuel for another cyno) That could have been an agle in use since the start.

Maybe even have the size of the ship the cyno is on, ups or downs the max mass limit, aka a carrier needed to keep a cyno up for 50 supers on one cyno.

Cooldown of 10 minutes still applies or not depending how testing went etc.

Or have a seperate super cyno for supers, and a dedicated ship to run it on.


Abdiel Kavash
Caldari
Paladin Order
Fidelas Constans
Posted - 2011.08.26 14:31:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Skinae
Alliances would split into sub alliances. Increasing the cost of supercaps by 1 billion, which is nothing.

Yes, because that magically makes five new systems to take sov in appear out of nowhere.

As far as limiting the number of supers available, the OP's idea is one of the less terrible ones. However I don't think that just limiting the number would balance them - if anything it would result in the same controversy as exists around TII BPOs: "only a limited number of people have them and I am not one of them, NERF NERF REMOVE".

Kulmid
Paragon Fury
Cascade Imminent
Posted - 2011.08.26 15:27:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Malcanis
Here is my "supercap fix":

When supercap pilots log in, they get a message asking which station they want the capital components, rigs, fuel, drones and modules that used to comprise their ship placed into. CCP admit that supers were a cool concept that didn't work out in practice. A few hundred super pilots sperge about how their lives are ruined now that they don't have their hideously unbalanced win-buttons.

The rest of us get on with playing a much-improved game.


It's like the person in the room who says what we don't want to hear, but we know it's true.

Verity Sovereign
Posted - 2011.08.26 16:49:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: XGS Crimson
I also think the idea of making another capital ship devoted to killing super capitals would not work either as it would result in more capitals on the field.


At least it wouldn't be a repeat of Star Craft's "Carriers = instant win" mechanic.
I like the idea of turning Dreads into a Carrier killing monster.
Dreads are still vulnerable to BS's and the like due to terrible tracking.

If dreads in could track well enough to hit carriers, but still miss BS and smaller - and have the DPS to obliterate carriers, I think it could work.
I think it would need to be done by tweaking the XL gun sig resolution, and the carrier+super carrier sig radius.

Carriers kill BS and smaller.
Dreads kill Carriers
BS and smaller kill dreads.

(and its even more complex when you look at what kills what in the BS and smaller category).

If one side comes with just Carriers, you bring dreads, and wipe them out.
If one side brings just dreads (or mostly dreads), you bring no capitals at all, and wipe them out.
If one side brings no capitals at all, you bring carriers, and wipe them out
If one side brings a mixed force... uhh bring a bigger mixed force? see if the force isn't quite evenly mixed, try to vary the ratios of ship types you bring?

Balance!

Zakua Corbin
Posted - 2011.08.26 17:35:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Verity Sovereign
Originally by: XGS Crimson
I also think the idea of making another capital ship devoted to killing super capitals would not work either as it would result in more capitals on the field.


At least it wouldn't be a repeat of Star Craft's "Carriers = instant win" mechanic.
I like the idea of turning Dreads into a Carrier killing monster.
Dreads are still vulnerable to BS's and the like due to terrible tracking.

If dreads in could track well enough to hit carriers, but still miss BS and smaller - and have the DPS to obliterate carriers, I think it could work.
I think it would need to be done by tweaking the XL gun sig resolution, and the carrier+super carrier sig radius.

Carriers kill BS and smaller.
Dreads kill Carriers
BS and smaller kill dreads.

(and its even more complex when you look at what kills what in the BS and smaller category).

If one side comes with just Carriers, you bring dreads, and wipe them out.
If one side brings just dreads (or mostly dreads), you bring no capitals at all, and wipe them out.
If one side brings no capitals at all, you bring carriers, and wipe them out
If one side brings a mixed force... uhh bring a bigger mixed force? see if the force isn't quite evenly mixed, try to vary the ratios of ship types you bring?

Balance!

This is good stuff

Pharos Pharos
Posted - 2011.08.26 19:50:00 - [19]
 

This is honestly one of the best ideas I've heard for limiting supercap proliferation, but it's still horribly flawed.

This will simply result in alliances gobbling up as much so sov as they can to maximize the amount of supercaps they can have, pushing out smaller alliances, and once they have a monopoly to defend their sov no one else will be able to create a supercap fleet that can counter the established entities.

Katarlia Simov
Minmatar
Cowboys From Hell
Posted - 2011.08.26 23:42:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Verity Sovereign
Originally by: XGS Crimson
I also think the idea of making another capital ship devoted to killing super capitals would not work either as it would result in more capitals on the field.


At least it wouldn't be a repeat of Star Craft's "Carriers = instant win" mechanic.
I like the idea of turning Dreads into a Carrier killing monster.
Dreads are still vulnerable to BS's and the like due to terrible tracking.

If dreads in could track well enough to hit carriers, but still miss BS and smaller - and have the DPS to obliterate carriers, I think it could work.
I think it would need to be done by tweaking the XL gun sig resolution, and the carrier+super carrier sig radius.

Carriers kill BS and smaller.
Dreads kill Carriers
BS and smaller kill dreads.

(and its even more complex when you look at what kills what in the BS and smaller category).

If one side comes with just Carriers, you bring dreads, and wipe them out.
If one side brings just dreads (or mostly dreads), you bring no capitals at all, and wipe them out.
If one side brings no capitals at all, you bring carriers, and wipe them out
If one side brings a mixed force... uhh bring a bigger mixed force? see if the force isn't quite evenly mixed, try to vary the ratios of ship types you bring?

Balance!


I totally agree that this equal balance.

However, POS need to be tweaked substantially in order to make it all really work.

If dreads do epic damage against carriers and supercaps, then under current mechanics, they will also be doing epic dps to POS, and while that is not necessarily a bad thing since POS bashes are bull**** anyway, it needs to be taken into account. Tbh, I'd say do the tracking/sig stuff, and then give dreads a role bonus along the lines of 'however much% more damage to capital ships'. Alternatively, rework their siege mode bonuses to get the desired anti-POS effect, and the non-siege ship only works against caps. Something like that anyway. Thus, dreads stay where they are in terms of POS bashing ability but are still anti-cap boomsticks.

Basically, my worry is that if dreads have substantially higher damage output against POS/structures than they have now, they will be rivaling supercaps, and with dreads being so evil against supers, there wouldn't be much point in taking super caps out to pretty much any situation. Yes, dreads tank less, but the cost like 2% of a super. Anyways, if people stop taking supers out to bash structures, the only places you'll ever see supers is either soloing people in low sec or in the scale of fight where a regular fleet can fight them, and then we have a whole other problem with dreads being too awesome.

SO yeah. Just a tweak against structures plz.

Otherwise, this man speaks sense.




Zylithi
Caldari
Strange Energy
Gentlemen's Agreement
Posted - 2011.08.27 01:20:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: XGS Crimson
It's a really tough issue to deal with, They could make specialist anti supercap battleships (black ops) but then that would make them too easy to bring down and no one would bring them to the fight (think of how easy it is to get black ops ships).

I also think the idea of making another capital ship devoted to killing super capitals would not work either as it would result in more capitals on the field.

A good solution that comes to mind for me would be to design either a ship class, or a ship module that is effectivley a titan superweapon, but split down so that smaller ships (black ops) can fit the modules so you wont be able to kill a titan by yourzself, but get 20-30 of these badboys to combine their fire into one beam and you get a superweapon.

Any thoughts?


I endorse this.

Katarlia Simov
Minmatar
Cowboys From Hell
Posted - 2011.08.27 01:52:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Zylithi
Originally by: XGS Crimson
It's a really tough issue to deal with, They could make specialist anti supercap battleships (black ops) but then that would make them too easy to bring down and no one would bring them to the fight (think of how easy it is to get black ops ships).

I also think the idea of making another capital ship devoted to killing super capitals would not work either as it would result in more capitals on the field.

A good solution that comes to mind for me would be to design either a ship class, or a ship module that is effectivley a titan superweapon, but split down so that smaller ships (black ops) can fit the modules so you wont be able to kill a titan by yourzself, but get 20-30 of these badboys to combine their fire into one beam and you get a superweapon.

Any thoughts?


I endorse this.


To be honest, I think that this is the most likely 'fix' to be implemented. They said somewhere that black ops are going to become cap hunters, but at the same time not awesome against everything else.

Just as pure speculation, I would guess it'll be a continuous beam weapon with hilarious bad tracking and sig, and with a combined with a target painter type effect. So, one beam hitting a cap doesn't do a whole lot, but you get a damage jump with each additional beam (up to whatever point) hitting the target.

With twenty or more beams on target, each black ops is doing say 3k dps only to supercaps. 1500dps to regular caps. Below that point, the damage is lower ofc.

Less than say ten black ops, and you may as well use regular gank fit BS, but once you get past the sweet spot you get a really good bonus.

It'd similarly be nice for black ops to be usable to pos bash tbh.

But yeah... I fully endorse black ops being made really good at something, and I similarly fully endorse a black ops death beam.

Thorian Baalnorn
Posted - 2011.08.27 06:34:00 - [23]
 

Originally by: Katarlia Simov
Stuff


The only problem with this is you have a ship that cost as much as a carrier but will have even less EHP. It will still be weak to DD and drones/fighters. Which really solves no problem at all.

1) Give dreads a mini doomsday. Exactly like the DD except:
A) Cycles every 5 minutes
B) Does 100k damage per shot.
C) Amplified by Siege Cycle(625%)
D) Damage based only on sig rad of target( no structures).
*Above 10,000 sig rad damage is always 100%.
*Below 10k the damage is dependent on sig rad size( scaling to 10k). A dread with a sig of 3000 would receive about 30% of the damage( about 200k in siege mode). A BS might receive in the neighborhood of 3-8% depending on the ship and its setup.Thus the goal here is to make dreads useful against SCs and ok (using MiniDD) against other caps but not very effective against subcaps.

This alone would greatly improve both the situation with dreads and with SCs. Dreads would be your fleet size SC killers. Then take the black ops BS and expand the class into a covert cap/super cap hunter.

Then to fix black ops:

1) Black ops BS- same as now but:
* Immune to DD( but not Mini DD[see above])
* Cannot be targeted by Fighters or Fighter Bombers( Built in Electronic Counter Measure). Can still be targeted by drones.
* Can Fit BS size Anti Capital Turrets/Launchers( new weapon see below).
* Can jump other black ops classes with it.

2) Black Ops Command BC.
* Cost about 350 mil.
* Similar stats to T2 command ships.
* Immune to DD( but not mini DD)
* Cannot be targeted by fighters or fighter bombers.
* Can use the Capital Hunter Warfare Link( new module)
* Can fit CR/BC size Anti Cap Turrets/Launchers.

3) Black Ops Ewar T2Cruiser:
* Immune to DD.
* Cannot be targeted by fighters or fighter bombers.
* Cost about 150 mil.
* Can fit CR/BC size Anti Cap Turrets/Launchers.
* Can fit Anti Cap Ewar modules ( new module)
* 5% more resist to primary tank than HACs,

4) Black OPs Capital Assassin( Black ops t2 stealth bomber):
* Same basic build as SBs
* Uses BS size anti capital weapons( cannot use normal torps)
* Immune to DD.
* Cannot be targeted by fighters or fighter bombers.
* Cost about 40 mil.
* -5% sig rad per black ops level.

5) Black Ops T2 Capital Heavy Interceptor.
* Cost 40 mil.
* Immune to DD.
* Cannot be targeted by fighters or fighter bombers.
* T2 Assault frig hull/ stats.
* Class bonus: 25% boost to AB and MWD speed.
* 350-450 m3 cargo hold ( for mobile warp disruptors)
* Ship Bonus: Immune to friendly mobile warp bubbles( Can warp out of bubbles if the source of the bubble has the same alliance ticker). this includes HIC and Dictor bubbles.
* cannot use anti cap weapons
* Can use anti capital warp scrambler( new module)


Cont.

Thorian Baalnorn
Posted - 2011.08.27 06:37:00 - [24]
 

Cont

Modules
----------------------------

Anti Cap weapons:
* 30 second firing cycle.
* Same PG,CPU, cap requirement of the largest T2 weapon of that class.
* Designed against large slow moving targets. Not very effective against sub caps.
* Ammo is in line with other racial ammo.
* Can Fit multiple cannons on a ship.
* Can only fit to Black ops class ships.
* All damage bonuses apply including skills, implants, and damage/tracking mods.
-Damage:
~ BS- 7.5k per cycle(250 DPS per cannon base
~ CR/BC- 4k per shot cycle (133 DPS base)

Capital Hunter Warfare Link:
*Can only be fitted to black op command BC.
*Increases Damage output of Anti cap weapons by 10%.
*Increases Optimal of Anti Cap weapons by 25%.

Black Ops Anti Cap Ewar Modules- Note: These modules can only be used against caps and super capitals.Note 2: You must be getting bonuses from the Capital Hunter Warfare Link to use these against super capitals.Note 3: Super Caps are not Immune to this type of Ewar.
---------------------
*Caldari- Anti Capital Multispectural Jammer
-10% chance of jamming per cycle regardless of ships sensor strength.
-20km optimal with 10km falloff.
-20 sec cycle
-jams for 10 seconds if successful.

*Amarr- Tracking disruption
-Reduces tracking by 20%
-Reduces optimal and falloff by 20%
-10 sec cycle time.
-30km optimal with 15km falloff

*Gallente- Sensor Dampening
- Targeting Range -20%
- Scan Res -20%
- Optimal 30km with 15km falloff.
- 10 sec cycle

*Minnie- Stasis Webifier( yeah i know this dont really serve a purpose against enemy caps but got to stay with the racial theme)

- Speed -60%
- cycle 10 seconds
- Range of 15km.


------------------

Anti Capital Warp Scrambler

*Can only be used on Black Ops T2 Capital Interceptor
*Can scramble capitals and supercapitals only( super caps are not immune to this type of scrambler)
*Scram Strength of 2 points.
*15 KM range.
*10 second cycle



.......That should help reblance things and make some useless ships more useful.......

Cpt AngelNova
Amarr
Licentia Ex Vereor
Posted - 2011.08.27 09:33:00 - [25]
 

My Carrier just Crapped itself but that said.

Thorian Baalnorn

YOu have some great ideas in your post and i can only hope CCP takes note of This, There defenatly needs to be more to Black ops...even if only th Black ops Battleships.

Regards

Aamrr
Posted - 2011.08.27 10:27:00 - [26]
 

Edited by: Aamrr on 27/08/2011 10:27:28
The issue I have with that is how it would affect normal capitals. Carriers and dreads are reasonably well balanced. Introducing an anti-capital ship might counter the supercaps...but it could also nerf normal capitals into oblivion, too.

I'd prefer something that "abuses the sensitive electronics that protect supercapitals from conventional electronic warfare," or similar techno-babble. If you insist on building a ship to counter supercapitals, make sure that only counters the supercapitals. God knows dreadnoughts don't need another nerf.

Dado Prso
Posted - 2011.08.27 11:06:00 - [27]
 

Edited by: Dado Prso on 27/08/2011 11:06:55
25% hp reduction, remove all drones bar fighters/fb

Katarlia Simov
Minmatar
Cowboys From Hell
Posted - 2011.08.27 17:09:00 - [28]
 

Originally by: Aamrr
Edited by: Aamrr on 27/08/2011 10:27:28
The issue I have with that is how it would affect normal capitals. Carriers and dreads are reasonably well balanced. Introducing an anti-capital ship might counter the supercaps...but it could also nerf normal capitals into oblivion, too.

I'd prefer something that "abuses the sensitive electronics that protect supercapitals from conventional electronic warfare," or similar techno-babble. If you insist on building a ship to counter supercapitals, make sure that only counters the supercapitals. God knows dreadnoughts don't need another nerf.


Its not like caps don't just die to regular fleets atm. A few neuts and some dps and down they go. You can confidently fight a siongle carrier with say 6-10 guys if you come prepared.

Also, I think it goes without saying that the cap hunter weapons are sig radius dependent, and there is a major jump between supercaps and regular caps. They aren't just supposed to be super dps weapons.

Anyways, I thoroughly support the cap hunter idea.

Aamrr
Posted - 2011.08.27 18:14:00 - [29]
 

I'm just asking you to consider something here. Are capital ships the problem, or are supercapitals? And if supercapitals are the problem, why are you introducing something that hunts capital ships?

Any time you introduce a new species to an ecosystem, you get consequences. Some are intentional, certainly, but there are unforeseen ones as well. And the more complex the ecosystem, the more consequences arise. CCP is having enough difficulty balancing the capital ship ecosystem as it is. Is introducing another predator really the best way to handle this?

Thorian Baalnorn
Posted - 2011.08.27 19:10:00 - [30]
 

Originally by: Katarlia Simov
stuff


Right, They would mainly be a anti supercap weapon on normal ship. They would scale down a bit better than a mini DD( on the dread). say 7500 sig rad for max damage on BS size weapons and 5000 sig rad for max damage on CR/BC size weapons.This means they would do about 1/2 damage to normal caps depending on the cap and setup of course.


Also to note these ships are expensive. I dont want normal caps to be a good counter to them because then you have super caps with carrier support to take care of them. My ideal vision here is A black ops fleet hunting with the dreads with the mini DD above on standby. Find the enemy cap/SC fleet and light a cyno for dread/carrier fire support. This, i envision would be for larger fleets. While the black ops would hunt solo and small groups without cap support. Because we all know people use their caps now for money making. Would also be good for those who lag behind a fleet cyno jump because they werent paying attention. Like sharks following boat waiting for someone to fall overboard:)


I also thought about adding another Ewar module that was not racial and was also unique and could only be used on supercaps. And that is this:

Anti Super Capital Harmonic Destabilizer :
* Can only be fit to Black ops EWAR cruiser.
* Must be receiving bonuses from Capital Hunter Warfare Link to work.
* Only works on Super capital class ships.
* Lowers current resistance on shield, armor, and hull by 10% ( IE: SC has 80% EM resist to armor, this lowers it to 72%. SC pilot turns off hardner and now has 70% resist to EM, this lowers it to 63%)
* Will not work on a target already affected by this effect.( thus no stacking)
* Range of 20km ( no falloff)

But then i create the problem of having a command ship that is going to be heavily targeted. So to fix this:

Defense Resonator: Causes shield and armor harmonics to resonate and amplify.
* Can only fit to Black ops Command Ships.
* Must have an active Capital Hunter Warfare Link that you are receiving bonuses from.
* Increases all shield and armor resistance to 95% regardless of previous resist percent.
* Cannot fire weapons while this active.
* Cannot run any type of reppers while this is active including cap boosters.
* Cannot control drones while this is active( they may however still fight just no new instructions)
* Cannot use AB or MWD and cannot warp or jump systems ( cyno bridge or gate)
* Can move at normal ship speed.
* Can target.
* Passive Cap and shield regen is reduced to 50% of current.
* Cannot receive remote rep,cap transfers.
* All harmful effects( Scrams, webs, nuets, jammed, etc) can still affect command ship.
* Duration is 10 seconds and it autocycles( you have to turn it off manually)

So basically what i did here was make it so that dedicated command ships couldnt be as easily instapoped. Now you have a massive tank on T2 BC. But all that BC can do is give bonuses and allow the operation of SC EWAR mods. It is also not difficult to counter with a few nuets. As you just have to cause the the mod to shutoff and then commence to popping or bring overwhelming force. What it does prevent is a sniper fleet from taking it out at 80 KM and from being insta popped.
Ideally i would like to see, in this case, the module have a reasonable cap usage. So its not difficult to shut it down with a few neuts but at the same time a smallish cap booster will allow it to come right back up again. A command ship that plays the role i gave this one should be powerful defensively so it command longer than 10 seconds in a fight but also be useless for everything else while commanding but not impossible to take out.


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