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Nichomachus
Posted - 2011.08.23 18:26:00 - [1]
 

So which is used for what? What are strengths and weaknesses?

I would be using for hauling out of a WH, to market and back. Would like to be able to fit as much as possible, obviously, whilst remaining safe.

Maz3r Rakum
Gallente
The Imperial Fedaykin
Posted - 2011.08.23 18:57:00 - [2]
 

Want to be "safe" without a scout? Cloaky Hauler. If you have a scout, and must carry as much as possible use the Tanky hauler. However the tanky hauler won't be very safe in high sec due to gankers.

Aamrr
Posted - 2011.08.23 19:17:00 - [3]
 

Deep space transports are pointless. They can't warp in a bubble, and the warp stabs don't do anything against a hictor's infinipoint.

If you want to haul something safely, you don't really have a choice. It has to be a cloaky hauler.

Derath Ellecon
Posted - 2011.08.23 21:04:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Aamrr
Deep space transports are pointless. They can't warp in a bubble, and the warp stabs don't do anything against a hictor's infinipoint.

If you want to haul something safely, you don't really have a choice. It has to be a cloaky hauler.


I would agree.

I'm currently in a WH with a low sec static. So I am often running stuff in and out via low sec. I will always use my Viator (cloaky transport) for the small stuff. But when I am making a big fuel run, I often use an Iteron mkV just because its maybe 1-2 trips instead of 10. First I will scout the system while i make my runs in the Viator.

I have tried to make a DST work but I just cant justify it. I still get half the cargo of an itty 5, with twice the align time. Yes the Warp stabs might help if I encounter a solo point gatecamp (with a couple exras in the lows). But I would still have to make double the trips.


Aamrr
Posted - 2011.08.23 21:08:00 - [5]
 

One thing to consider is that the deep space transports have enough powergrid to fit a MWD naturally. You'll still need a scout until you get to empire space, but the MWD+Cloak trick helps protect you once you get there.

The point remains though: Don't use a DST below 0.5 sec status without a scout. And just because your scout didn't see anything doesn't mean that there wasn't a cloaky on grid waiting for something tastier (this is especially common in w-space).

Derath Ellecon
Posted - 2011.08.23 22:01:00 - [6]
 

I do the MWD clock trick in the itty 5, which has double the cargo and aligns twice as fast as the occator. Yea it would pop faster if caught but I have to make half the trips. Either way it still makes the DST a hard sell

Aamrr
Posted - 2011.08.23 22:09:00 - [7]
 

Fitting a MWD to an itty 5 requires at least two T2 RCUs and a T1 ACR. So fitted, an Itty V gets 20.6k m3. A fully expanded occator can hold 35.5k m3, and can fit a MWD while doing so without issue.

Are you sure the Itty V gets more cargo space in a cloak/MWD configuration?

Maz3r Rakum
Gallente
The Imperial Fedaykin
Posted - 2011.08.23 22:16:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Aamrr
Fitting a MWD to an itty 5 requires at least two T2 RCUs and a T1 ACR. So fitted, an Itty V gets 20.6k m3. A fully expanded occator can hold 35.5k m3, and can fit a MWD while doing so without issue.

Are you sure the Itty V gets more cargo space in a cloak/MWD configuration?



Occator max cargo fit will be able to carry more than a max cargo fit itty V, can fit a reasonable tank (to prevent suicide ganks), and still do the cloak mwd trick. While I use my Viator much much more, the Occator does prove super useful, IE when carry POS fuel or 2 fully fit BC's. At least as far as low sec goes, it is pretty difficult to get tackled on a gate short of a disconnect.

Aamrr
Posted - 2011.08.23 22:30:00 - [9]
 

A well-run lowsec camp can and should catch anyone trying the MWD+cloak trick. Irrelevant of the ship you're using, it gives an interceptor 10 seconds to fly to your last coordinate and uncloak you. Sensor boosted hictor makes quick work of any warp stabs you might have, built in other otherwise. Sentries won't protect you from the interceptor, since the interceptor doesn't need to shoot you to uncloak you.

Fortunately, there aren't many "well-run" lowsec camps, so you could probably get away with it. I wouldn't make a habit of it, however.

Modikus
Posted - 2011.08.23 22:39:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Modikus on 23/08/2011 22:40:37
Cloaky is the way to go for safety. Bt if you need/ want the impel can haul almost as much as an itty V and can use the mwd trick np. I think it's 32k m3 (full cargo expanders). It just really expensive in comparison and has a cool paint job with sweet blue tail flames.

Got caught by a proteus once in this. My luck he was fit with a scram and disruptor... So much for that +2 warp strength. Laughing

Good for wh ops. Hauling ore from belts. Those pesky SB's cant touch it. But still high risk for anything else.

Derath Ellecon
Posted - 2011.08.24 04:47:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Aamrr
Fitting a MWD to an itty 5 requires at least two T2 RCUs and a T1 ACR. So fitted, an Itty V gets 20.6k m3. A fully expanded occator can hold 35.5k m3, and can fit a MWD while doing so without issue.

Are you sure the Itty V gets more cargo space in a cloak/MWD configuration?


I'm sure I am doing it wrong then (1 size too small mwd). But it still seems to work. I have only encountered one bad gate in it so far (single pirate) and got through.

Aamrr
Posted - 2011.08.24 06:04:00 - [12]
 

Last I had tested it, that didn't do the trick -- but then, my skills were significantly worse back then. If you're having trouble with not being fully aligned when your MWD clicks off, try training spaceship command, evasive maneuvers, or acceleration control.

Oscasre
Amarr
Posted - 2011.08.24 15:10:00 - [13]
 

The Tanky Transports need to be immune to bubbles ...... remove the +2 Warp Cores so
its not overpowered.

Derath Ellecon
Posted - 2011.08.24 16:48:00 - [14]
 

So is the +2 make them a total warp core strength of 3? I was reading that by default all ships have a base of 1. I guess the basic question is whether by default they have the ability to thwart a single scram.

Sader Rykane
Amarr
The Dark Space Initiative
Revival Of The Talocan Empire
Posted - 2011.08.24 19:34:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Maz3r Rakum
Want to be "safe" without a scout? Cloaky Hauler. If you have a scout, and must carry as much as possible use the Tanky hauler. However the tanky hauler won't be very safe in high sec due to gankers.


[Impel, Try and kill me]
Armor EM Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Damage Control IInull
800mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
400mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I

[empty med slot]

[empty high slot]

Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I


However if speed isn't an issue just use an orca.

Proper Orca = 250k+ EHP


Aamrr
Posted - 2011.08.24 21:42:00 - [16]
 

A DST warps in 10 seconds with a MWD. An Orca warps in 10 seconds with a MWD. A DST, in theory, should have enough EHP to dissuade people from shooting it. An Orca drops nothing when it gets ganked, and has more EHP than the DST anyway.

The DST has precisely two advantages: It can align while cloaked, and it has a smaller mass so you don't rip wormholes a new one every time you do a fuel run.

Outside the very specific application of w-space hauling, I'm not exactly seeing a compelling argument for the DST here -- particularly not in hisec.


 

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