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blankseplocked oh no ... another T3 mining barge ...
 
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Vanessa Vansen
Posted - 2011.08.22 20:25:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Vanessa Vansen on 23/08/2011 11:10:52
Edited by: Vanessa Vansen on 23/08/2011 05:37:42
ok, time to open another thread about T3 mining barges Very Happy
Why? simply, there are none, but there should be (from my point of view)

the setup ...
  1. Industrial ("offensive") subsystem
  2. the first three subsystems should lead to a similar yield than the corresponding exhumer but with faster cycles
    1. ore prospector (resembles Hulk)
      • 3 high slots
      • Able to equip Strip Miner and Ice Harvester turrets.
      • 4.91% reduction in Strip Miner duration per level.
    2. Icebreaker (resembles Mackinaw)
      • 2 high slots
      • Able to equip Strip Miner and Ice Harvester turrets.
      • 10.625% reduction in Ice Harvester duration per level.
    3. mercoxit prospector (resembles Skiff)
      • 1 high slot
      • Able to equip Strip Miner and Ice Harvester turrets.
      • 15.65% reduction in Strip Miner duration per level.
      • 20% reduced chance of Mercoxit gas cloud forming per level
    4. Gas Harvester
      • 5 high slots
      • 100% bonus Gas Cloud Harvester yield but 25% penalty to gas harvester duration
      • 5% reduction in Gas Cloud Harvester duration per level.

  3. "Electronics" subsystem
    1. Harvester/Miner Range
      • 5% bonus to range of strip miners/ice harvester/gas cloud harvester per level. (max. targeting range should be able to cover that with maximum skills)
    2. Survey Range
      • 50% bonus to range of survey scanner per level
    3. Emergent Locus Analyzer
    4. see corresponding T3 cruiser sub system
    5. ???
      • sorry, no good idea at the moment

  4. "Engineering" subsystem
  5. 3000m3 Cargo hold (maybe more), 25m3 drone bay, 25 Mbit/sec drone bay, 2 low slots, 4 medium slots
    1. Covert Reconfiguration
      • Can fit covert ops cloaks.
      • -96% to -100% reduced CPU need for cloaking device per level.
    2. Ore Packing
      • 4000m3 Ore Hold per level.
    3. Warp Stabilizing
      • +0.4 warp strength per level.
    4. Drone Upgrade
      • 5m3 drone bay per level.
      • 5 Mbit/sec bandwidth per level.

Defensive and Propulsion similar to corresponding Tengu subsystems, warfare processor -> foreman processor with bonus on Mining Foreman Links.

Due to shorter duration of the cycles the m3/per minute corresponds to the existing exhumers but the yield of single cycle is pretty low. Hence, a smaller cargo hold should do when strip miner/ice harvesters are staggered. Due to more cycles in the same time the crystals will deplete faster.

edit:
- increased the cargo hold to 3000m3, just enough for a great secure can
- included the low and medium slots

Vanessa Vansen
Posted - 2011.08.22 20:35:00 - [2]
 


Geormike Deninard
Posted - 2011.08.22 20:41:00 - [3]
 

As a full-time miner, i accept this. We, miners need more tools to play with.

Hugo Smith
Posted - 2011.08.22 21:33:00 - [4]
 

[Loki, Dia Casúr]

Miner II
Miner II
Miner II
Miner II
Miner II
Miner II
Small Tractor Beam I

Pithum C-Type Medium Shield Booster
Pith B-Type Shield Boost Amplifier
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Republic Fleet 10MN Afterburner

Co-Processor II
Co-Processor II
Co-Processor II
Co-Processor II

Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I

Loki Defensive - Adaptive Shielding
Loki Offensive - Projectile Scoping Array
Loki Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst
Loki Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir
Loki Electronics - Tactical Targeting Network


Warrior II x5
Mining Drone II x5

T3 mining barge right there ^ (Yes ive acually flown this, i was very drunk)

Nyarlothotep
The Blue Dagger Mercenery Agency
Posted - 2011.08.23 00:55:00 - [5]
 

Offensive
e. Drone Miner - reduce time drones take to mine and increase drone cargo capacity
f. Moon Miner - why not use it for ninja moon mining?

Electronics
b. Survey Range - increase range and lower cap use
d. Upgrade Coordinator - 20% per level increase to bonus given by all mining and drone upgrades

Vanessa Vansen
Posted - 2011.08.23 04:52:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Hugo Smith
[Loki, Dia Casúr]
...

T3 mining barge right there ^ (Yes ive acually flown this, i was very drunk)


Nice way of fitting a Loki, but not a T3 mining barge.

Originally by: Nyarlothotep
Offensive
e. Drone Miner - reduce time drones take to mine and increase drone cargo capacity
f. Moon Miner - why not use it for ninja moon mining?

Electronics
b. Survey Range - increase range and lower cap use
d. Upgrade Coordinator - 20% per level increase to bonus given by all mining and drone upgrades


Ninja moon mining sounds interesting.
I would adjust the Upgrade Coordinator in a way that it does not increase the yield, e.g. make it reduce the side effects of the upgrades.

Gemberslaafje
Vivicide
Posted - 2011.08.23 07:17:00 - [7]
 

yay for being linked <3

Velicitia
Gallente
Open Designs
Posted - 2011.08.23 10:26:00 - [8]
 

why an ICE penalty to the "gas harvester" setup? Just make it unable to fit strips.

With as good as the "Icebreaker" setup is, you need some form of cycle time penalty by default (similar to the Mackinaw)... you're also missing a +100% yield bonus.

Draahk Chimera
Interstellar eXodus
Posted - 2011.08.23 11:10:00 - [9]
 

I'm not an industrialist myself but I will give a small opinion anyway. Why not, if they are going to make an ORE t3 anyway, make it alot more "modular" with subsustems for cargo (t3 industrial), tractors and salvagers, ship maintanance bay and so on. A t3 cruiser can do the job of a hac, command ship, logistics cruiser or recon. In my view any t3 ORE should have the same choices to do anything "industrial".

Vanessa Vansen
Posted - 2011.08.23 11:16:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Velicitia
why an ICE penalty to the "gas harvester" setup? Just make it unable to fit strips.

With as good as the "Icebreaker" setup is, you need some form of cycle time penalty by default (similar to the Mackinaw)... you're also missing a +100% yield bonus.

My faul, copy-paste error. corrected.
Bonuses are computed to resemble the bonuses off hulk, mack and skiff. Just that it is achived by improving the cycle duration. I hope that the calculations are correct.

Vanessa Vansen
Posted - 2011.08.23 11:20:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: Draahk Chimera
I'm not an industrialist myself but I will give a small opinion anyway. Why not, if they are going to make an ORE t3 anyway, make it alot more "modular" with subsustems for cargo (t3 industrial), tractors and salvagers, ship maintanance bay and so on. A t3 cruiser can do the job of a hac, command ship, logistics cruiser or recon. In my view any t3 ORE should have the same choices to do anything "industrial".

That would be welcome, too. Just that CCP will take care (somehow) that it's not possible to obtain a covert ops orca

Velicitia
Gallente
Open Designs
Posted - 2011.08.23 11:40:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Vanessa Vansen
Originally by: Velicitia
why an ICE penalty to the "gas harvester" setup? Just make it unable to fit strips.

With as good as the "Icebreaker" setup is, you need some form of cycle time penalty by default (similar to the Mackinaw)... you're also missing a +100% yield bonus.

My faul, copy-paste error. corrected.
Bonuses are computed to resemble the bonuses off hulk, mack and skiff. Just that it is achived by improving the cycle duration. I hope that the calculations are correct.


TBH, not sure what your goal is with the cycle time...

currently for ice:
Hulk is 3%/level of exhumers
Mack is 5%/level of exhumers


Vanessa Vansen
Posted - 2011.08.23 12:51:00 - [13]
 

The idea was to reduce the cargohold, so that a cov ops T3 barge won't be able to have a bigger cargohold than a blockade runner. You could achive it with the current exhumer bonus as well, as long as there is enough space to hold the yield of a single cycle. Currently, that is the yield of the skiff.

Vanessa Vansen
Posted - 2011.08.23 15:00:00 - [14]
 

Ok, I changed the sub-systems slightly.
The bonus of the industrial modules correspond now to the exhumer bonus, i.e. more yield instead of faster cycles.

  1. Industrial ("offensive") subsystem
  2. the first three subsystems should lead to a similar yield than the corresponding exhumer but with faster cycles
    1. ore prospector (resembles Hulk)
      • 3 high slots
      • Able to equip Strip Miner and Ice Harvester turrets.
      • 15% better yield for Strip Miner (covers Mining Barge Skill Bonus)
      • 3% better yield for Strip Miners per level. (covers Exhumers Skill Bonus)
    2. Icebreaker (resembles Mackinaw)
      • 2 high slots
      • Able to equip Strip Miner and Ice Harvester turrets.
      • 100% bonus Ice Harvester yield but 25% penalty to ice harvester duration
      • 5% reduction in Ice Harvester duration per level.
    3. mercoxit prospector (resembles Skiff)
      • 1 high slot
      • Able to equip Strip Miner and Ice Harvester turrets.
      • 15% better yield for Strip Miner (covers Mining Barge Skill Bonus)
      • 60% bonus to Mercoxit Mining Crystal yield multiplier per level
    4. Gas Harvester
      • 5 high slots
      • 100% bonus Gas Cloud Harvester yield but 25% penalty to Gas Cloud Harvester duration
      • 5% reduction in Gas Cloud Harvester duration per level.

  3. "Electronics" subsystem
    1. Harvester/Miner Range
      • 5% bonus to range of strip miners/ice harvester/gas cloud harvester per level. (max. targeting range should be able to cover that with maximum skills)
    2. Survey Range
      • 50% bonus to range of survey scanner per level
    3. Emergent Locus Analyzer
    4. see corresponding T3 cruiser sub system
    5. Improved Mercoxit Mining
      • 20% reduced chance of Mercoxit gas cloud forming per level

  4. "Engineering" subsystem
  5. 4500m3 Cargo hold (that should do), 25m3 drone bay, 25 Mbit/sec drone bay, 2 low slots, 4 medium slots
    1. Covert Reconfiguration
      • Can fit covert ops cloaks.
      • -96% to -100% reduced CPU need for cloaking device per level.
    2. Ore Packing
      • 4000m3 Ore Hold per level.
    3. Warp Stabilizing
      • +0.4 warp strength per level.
    4. Drone Upgrade
      • 5m3 drone bay per level.
      • 5 Mbit/sec bandwidth per level.

Defensive and Propulsion similar to corresponding Tengu subsystems, warfare processor -> foreman processor with bonus on Mining Foreman Links.


Gemberslaafje
Vivicide
Posted - 2011.08.23 15:04:00 - [15]
 

Make sure you have a looksee at my old Niseag idea as well - while it's ages ago i thought that up, I usually try and do some research and balancing :P

not saying that this idea is any worse YARRRR!!

Vanessa Vansen
Posted - 2011.08.23 16:26:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: Gemberslaafje
Make sure you have a looksee at my old Niseag idea as well - while it's ages ago i thought that up, I usually try and do some research and balancing :P

not saying that this idea is any worse YARRRR!!


The link to your Niseag idea is already in the 2nd post :D

Gemberslaafje
Vivicide
Posted - 2011.08.23 17:52:00 - [17]
 

Originally by: Vanessa Vansen
Originally by: Gemberslaafje
Make sure you have a looksee at my old Niseag idea as well - while it's ages ago i thought that up, I usually try and do some research and balancing :P

not saying that this idea is any worse YARRRR!!


The link to your Niseag idea is already in the 2nd post :D

Yeah, wasn't sure if you were linking it for linkin sake or rly checked it out :P

Vanessa Vansen
Posted - 2011.08.23 19:34:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: Gemberslaafje
...
Yeah, wasn't sure if you were linking it for linkin sake or rly checked it out :P


I did check it out but I forgot the content while starting this thread.

Well, I hope CCP is going to introduce something like this sooner or later.

Would be a great thing for nomadic people, especially if it would become possible to refit in POS or via ship main. bay.

Ceelah
Posted - 2011.08.23 20:15:00 - [19]
 

Edited by: Ceelah on 23/08/2011 20:43:03
NO.

The prices of ice, ore, and everything else are already out of whack. If you add a bigger and better ore muncher to the game it will be a matter of a few months before everyone will have one of those too and the prices will go down even further.

Supply and demand: Increase the supply of something (ore) and eventually the demand will go down, thus lowering the unit price as well.

Also, why the hell would you give the damn botters an even better bot?

NO to T3 Mining Barges.

Vanessa Vansen
Posted - 2011.08.23 20:54:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: Ceelah
Edited by: Ceelah on 23/08/2011 20:43:03
NO.

The prices of ice, ore, and everything else are already out of whack. If you add a bigger and better ore muncher to the game it will be a matter of a few months before everyone will have one of those too and the prices will go down even further.

Supply and demand: Increase the supply of something (ore) and eventually the demand will go down, thus lowering the unit price as well.

Also, why the hell would you give the damn botters an even better bot?

NO to T3 Mining Barges.


Hmm, in terms of yield the ship would only be slightly better, since you could fit 3 mining drones rigs. If you don't count drone yield in, it will be the same.
But I have to confess that it would make a good tool for botters in terms of being able to withstand more damage and trying to sneak your bot into 0.0 to mine ABC ores in a very quite area ...
Well, that could be handled by keeping the defense subsystems low, so that you can't perma tank rats in 0.0 or low sec.

How does that sound to you?

Ceelah
Posted - 2011.08.23 21:15:00 - [21]
 

Edited by: Ceelah on 23/08/2011 21:15:38
I fully agree with the need to enhance the in game experience of industrialists. Miners pay a subscription and should have new shinies as much as any other profession.

However, right now there are too many imbalances and exploits in game. CCP needs to reign in the bot epidemic and effectively return the in game balance of resources and regions. I'm sorry, but IMO T3 can wait.

Great ideas in this thread though.

Rees Noturana
Red Rock Mining Company
Posted - 2011.08.23 21:33:00 - [22]
 

Originally by: Ceelah
Edited by: Ceelah on 23/08/2011 21:15:38
I fully agree with the need to enhance the in game experience of industrialists. Miners pay a subscription and should have new shinies as much as any other profession.

However, right now there are too many imbalances and exploits in game. CCP needs to reign in the bot epidemic and effectively return the in game balance of resources and regions. I'm sorry, but IMO T3 can wait.

Great ideas in this thread though.


Everyone seems to skip over that part that most miners know that harvesting more doesn't mean higher profits. We are not looking for a super T3 Hulk to go sit nice and safe in high sec. We'd like a more flexible alternative to the Hulk. Something other some fat, slow barge that is easy prey. T3 industrial modules only make sense which combined with other changes. Like moving mining to the exploration system and giving us a chance in low sec.


 

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