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Cpt Dayn
Posted - 2011.08.16 18:23:00 - [1]
 

I have a question. How well does a Mach speed tank compared to lets say, a tengu? When the tengu is used with an AB for level 4's it reduces the damage by ALOT ye? So how about the Mach, can you gimp your tank and still have enough tank for all level 4's due to the AB?

(By gimping i mean, using a LARGE deadspace booster insted of a X-Large.)

Thanks.

Daniel Plain
Posted - 2011.08.16 18:59:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Daniel Plain on 16/08/2011 19:14:09
from what I know, you can easily do lvl4 missions with a large deadspace booster, assuming you use enough hardeners and avoid unnecessary damage.

edit: I just checked in eft. with a gist b-type large booster, you need ccc rigs and one shield flux coil in the lows to be cap stable with afterburner running and three mission specific hardeners. even against gurista, your tank gets up to almost 300 which, together with the speed tank should be more than enough for most lvl4s.
i did use all5 skills on the other hand i did not use implants.

Syn Fatelyng
Dathmora
Redanni
Posted - 2011.08.16 19:03:00 - [3]
 

A large portion of your tank will come from the ability to frontload incredible amounts of damage, followed secondarily by your speed to reduce incoming damage as well as dictate range. Currently, my midslot selection consists of a 100MN afterburner, 2 mission specific hardeners, one large shield booster and one shield boost amp. That seemingly meager tank is enough to keep you alive while destroying the highest dps rats in a mission and during unexpected emergency situations ABing at 600m/s is more than enough to hamper NPC dps.

However, the Mach is a very active ship compared to the Tengu. Destroying frigates before they are under your gun range, pulsing the shield as needed and remembering to turn it off when you don't, considering a heavy nos to manage capacitor, and managing transversal speeds are just a few examples of what goes into daily Mach running. By comparison, the Tengu speed tank can handle a great deal more mistakes and seems almost afk in contrast to the Mach but with a tremendous reduction in dps.

I'll happily answer any other questions you have.

Malcanis
Caldari
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
Posted - 2011.08.16 19:34:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Cpt Dayn
I have a question. How well does a Mach speed tank compared to lets say, a tengu? When the tengu is used with an AB for level 4's it reduces the damage by ALOT ye? So how about the Mach, can you gimp your tank and still have enough tank for all level 4's due to the AB?

(By gimping i mean, using a LARGE deadspace booster insted of a X-Large.)

Thanks.


A deadspace large will be fine, IMO, especially if you're using a good Afterburner (Domi/RF or better)

The Mach speedtanks pretty well once it gets up to speed. As always with speedtankers, you just have to be very vigilant in killing webber rats.

Cpt Dayn
Posted - 2011.08.16 19:52:00 - [5]
 

Edited by: Cpt Dayn on 16/08/2011 20:11:46
Originally by: Syn Fatelyng
A large portion of your tank will come from the ability to frontload incredible amounts of damage, followed secondarily by your speed to reduce incoming damage as well as dictate range. Currently, my midslot selection consists of a 100MN afterburner, 2 mission specific hardeners, one large shield booster and one shield boost amp. That seemingly meager tank is enough to keep you alive while destroying the highest dps rats in a mission and during unexpected emergency situations ABing at 600m/s is more than enough to hamper NPC dps.

However, the Mach is a very active ship compared to the Tengu. Destroying frigates before they are under your gun range, pulsing the shield as needed and remembering to turn it off when you don't, considering a heavy nos to manage capacitor, and managing transversal speeds are just a few examples of what goes into daily Mach running. By comparison, the Tengu speed tank can handle a great deal more mistakes and seems almost afk in contrast to the Mach but with a tremendous reduction in dps.

I'll happily answer any other questions you have.


The thing that worries me is if i **** up, will the large booster beable to tank the incomming damage? Sure, it depends on how many rats there are around ofc.. But you get my point?

Fitting a Gist A-type large booster + 2 invuls gives me a omni tank at 322, this is what worries me..

If i rather use a Pith b x-l i get a 701 dps omni tank. Tho, then i really have to manage the shield.

Kinda confused, thats why i asked about the AB.

*Edit* I am also thinking about a vargur again, but then i'll prolly be permajammed by the damn guristas. (i'm thinking tankwise now:))

Syn Fatelyng
Dathmora
Redanni
Posted - 2011.08.16 21:14:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Cpt Dayn
The thing that worries me is if i **** up, will the large booster beable to tank the incomming damage? Sure, it depends on how many rats there are around ofc.. But you get my point?
There's only ever one problem I have, and that's webbing frigates. Disposing of them is rather easy, however. You can one-volley frigates at 20k range and beyond, and carrying 5x Tech II light drones will make short work of anything close range. Apart from that, I full-room pull things like Worlds Collide and have no issues after vaporizing the frigates and a few battleships.
Quote:
Fitting a Gist A-type large booster + 2 invuls gives me a omni tank at 322, this is what worries me..
Never judge a tank by omni fit. Fit your hardeners for the mission and your tank will typically increase by a factor of two. Against damage like missiles and close-range battleships, the afterburner is going to shine on reducing that incoming dps.

At worst, and as I mentioned, if things become too hectic the Mach is fast enough with an AB that getting out of danger is trivial so long as you nuke the webbing frigates first.

It's not a ship for the lazy, and not a ship for EFT. In the hands of someone attentive and knowledgeable about the ship however, you won't find a faster and more efficient mission runner.

Cpt Dayn
Posted - 2011.08.16 21:23:00 - [7]
 

Edited by: Cpt Dayn on 16/08/2011 21:28:48
Originally by: Syn Fatelyng
Originally by: Cpt Dayn
The thing that worries me is if i **** up, will the large booster beable to tank the incomming damage? Sure, it depends on how many rats there are around ofc.. But you get my point?
There's only ever one problem I have, and that's webbing frigates. Disposing of them is rather easy, however. You can one-volley frigates at 20k range and beyond, and carrying 5x Tech II light drones will make short work of anything close range. Apart from that, I full-room pull things like Worlds Collide and have no issues after vaporizing the frigates and a few battleships.
Quote:
Fitting a Gist A-type large booster + 2 invuls gives me a omni tank at 322, this is what worries me..
Never judge a tank by omni fit. Fit your hardeners for the mission and your tank will typically increase by a factor of two. Against damage like missiles and close-range battleships, the afterburner is going to shine on reducing that incoming dps.

At worst, and as I mentioned, if things become too hectic the Mach is fast enough with an AB that getting out of danger is trivial so long as you nuke the webbing frigates first.

It's not a ship for the lazy, and not a ship for EFT. In the hands of someone attentive and knowledgeable about the ship however, you won't find a faster and more efficient mission runner.


Alright, its seems like you know what you are talking about mate.

So, my mids will look like:
Gist A-Type Large SB
Cal Navy AMP
2x hardners
Rep fleet AB.

I'll just have to pay attention i guess :)

Fitting a heavy deadspace nos makes you capstable for what its worth, are people just pulsing the AB? As i see it i will run it as much as i can?

And btw, thanks for your help!

Syn Fatelyng
Dathmora
Redanni
Posted - 2011.08.16 21:39:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Cpt Dayn
So, my mids will look like:
Gist A-Type Large SB
Cal Navy AMP
2x hardners
Rep fleet AB.
Looks solid, but something to consider: Gist A-type repairs less but uses less capacitor. Pith A-type uses more capacitor and repairs more. I use the Pith A-type because, in my experience, when I HAVE to turn it on it 1. Isn't for very long while I melt the battleships and 2. During that short period of time it is on, my nos is on to offset the extra cap usage.

That's the part that'll get you into the most trouble; if your capacitor skills are weak, the Gist makes sense but only until you've maxed out those cap skills. Yes, you still keep an eye on your capacitor and on your shield booster, but not NEARLY as much as an X-Large. Remember, a Mach's first line of defense is the blistering dps and by that, you don't need to be anywhere near cap stable.

I'm happy I could help, but here's some food for thought: Logging onto the SiSi test server is trivial these days, and you could fully fit up a Mach and test it out first hand with various configurations.

Feel free to strike up a conversation in game if you want to flesh anything more specific out regarding Mach usage.

Mavnas
Posted - 2011.08.16 22:31:00 - [9]
 

With a Medium Pith A Booster, you can manage a cap stable 469 omni tank. (Obviously more if you take the time to shift hardeners).

Guillame Herschel
Gallente
NME1
Posted - 2011.08.16 22:55:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Cpt Dayn
I have a question. How well does a Mach speed tank compared to lets say, a tengu? When the tengu is used with an AB for level 4's it reduces the damage by ALOT ye? So how about the Mach, can you gimp your tank and still have enough tank for all level 4's due to the AB?


DG Large is what I've used. Most missions do not require even a single boost. The Mach has over 11K HP just in shields, before any hardeners.


 

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