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DHB WildCat
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.08.16 19:10:00 - [61]
 

Small scale pvp is guerilla warfare style pvp. One way that would help this tremendously is this.

1) Reverse nano nerf.... and bring back 90% webs. Also reduce sensor strength and lock range by 20% accross the board aside from frig class ships.

WHY? Nano gives ships a chance to engage and leave when the enemy brings 2 billion people. Now the reduced scan res and range will force these nano ships and most all ships for that matter to come into or near web range or sacrifice tank / ew mods for sensor boosters.

Then the webs - 90% webs means gallente will be able to use blasters again! Also its a counter to the nano for all four races.

2) Sniping - sniping in eve is dead right now! So nerf probing.

WHY? 99% of eve pvp happens on a gate or at a station. You know that is correct. So for a small gang to pvp they usually have to go enemy space. Enemy (WILL) have probes on the gates and stations ready to go when they know enemy forces are incoming. As such, your small gang ships will be scanned down and probed in under 8 seconds. If you are warping into a sniping spot on a gate or station, predeployed probes will have your spot AS YOU LAND! So nerf probing time wise and give snipers a chance to come in, hit and warp out. There are tons of other counters to this btw other than probes but require some skill.

Also nerfing probes would negate the need for unprobable ships that yes even we hate with all passion!

3) Some how you will have to bring hotdrops into line as well. Be it a spool up timer for cynos or some other means, however a small gang will be decemated when they have 40 Black ops, or 50 supers dropped right on top of them because its so cheap for titans to use their DD's, or for any cap to use fuel that cost wise its meaningless to drop onto tiny targets.

Also why we are at it, can we nerf jam drones!? They are uber op. Also reduce jams period to ten seconds, this way you can still be jammed but with a 20 second cycle timer then you have 10 seconds to lock and defend yourself before you are jammed again, or a g ood jammer will cycle jam, but this way some skill is involved.

There are many other fixes to this, but these are what come to mind right now.

Wild

Kaar
Rionnag Alba
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2011.08.16 19:29:00 - [62]
 

Huuuuuuuuuuuuuge list of interesting things to discuss about 0.0 mechanics and combat...but not a single word on local chat?

Really??
ugh

Zarnak Wulf
Posted - 2011.08.16 19:31:00 - [63]
 

Originally by: DHB WildCat
Small scale pvp is guerilla warfare style pvp. One way that would help this tremendously is this.

1) Reverse nano nerf.... and bring back 90% webs. Also reduce sensor strength and lock range by 20% accross the board aside from frig class ships.

WHY? Nano gives ships a chance to engage and leave when the enemy brings 2 billion people. Now the reduced scan res and range will force these nano ships and most all ships for that matter to come into or near web range or sacrifice tank / ew mods for sensor boosters.

Then the webs - 90% webs means gallente will be able to use blasters again! Also its a counter to the nano for all four races.

2) Sniping - sniping in eve is dead right now! So nerf probing.

WHY? 99% of eve pvp happens on a gate or at a station. You know that is correct. So for a small gang to pvp they usually have to go enemy space. Enemy (WILL) have probes on the gates and stations ready to go when they know enemy forces are incoming. As such, your small gang ships will be scanned down and probed in under 8 seconds. If you are warping into a sniping spot on a gate or station, predeployed probes will have your spot AS YOU LAND! So nerf probing time wise and give snipers a chance to come in, hit and warp out. There are tons of other counters to this btw other than probes but require some skill.

Also nerfing probes would negate the need for unprobable ships that yes even we hate with all passion!

3) Some how you will have to bring hotdrops into line as well. Be it a spool up timer for cynos or some other means, however a small gang will be decemated when they have 40 Black ops, or 50 supers dropped right on top of them because its so cheap for titans to use their DD's, or for any cap to use fuel that cost wise its meaningless to drop onto tiny targets.

Also why we are at it, can we nerf jam drones!? They are uber op. Also reduce jams period to ten seconds, this way you can still be jammed but with a 20 second cycle timer then you have 10 seconds to lock and defend yourself before you are jammed again, or a g ood jammer will cycle jam, but this way some skill is involved.

There are many other fixes to this, but these are what come to mind right now.

Wild


Agree with nerfing probes or at least having an electronic counter to probes. Perhaps a destroyer function. We're always trying to give destroyers function dontcha' know! No to the nano nerf reversal. The blanket nano nerf was bad in the same way a blanket reversal would be. Some ships are more then fast enough. Giving them more speed would make them OP. Others (Gallente) need to be revisited with mass and speed boosts.

Also no to blanket 90% webs. You can make a case for dedicated blaster boats getting a web strength bonus. You can also argue for web scripts. But a blanket web boost would obsolete many ships that were actually made viable by the web nerf.

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.08.16 20:00:00 - [64]
 

Edited by: Tippia on 16/08/2011 20:01:43
Originally by: Newt Rondanse
Am I "at keyboard" for that window? No.
Actually, yes you are. That's the whole point: you have to be at your keyboard to make yourself known. You can't leave it 23.5/7 and let local do the job of keeping people informed so they can work themselves into a lather of paranoia. And again, your work-around assumes that there will still be a local channel. I'm not talking about putting it into delayed mode — I'm talking about removing it, so you can't pop in once an hour to scare people with your at-keyboard:ness either.
Quote:
Removing local chat completely has the problem of cutting communication channels. In a multiplayer game that is bad.
…except that, what on earth is ever said in local that is of any value? Is it ever used as an actual communications channel anywhere except maybe in Jita (where the communication is 99% “please fall for my scam”)? All I ever see outside of that in it is taunts, smack-talk, and — less relevantly to this topic, in highsec — carebears promising eternal vengeance on “loot thieves”. Outside of the main highsec hubs, it has long since ceased to be a communications channel — it's all about intel.

The actual communication is already solved. The inhabitants of the system will have corp/alliance chat + intel channels + whatever else they set up at their disposal. Visitors can track down individuals and harass them offer their opinion through those means. I suppose some "GF":s will be lost, but meh… Hell, pretty much all the alliances I've been in have had a semi-strict “no talking in local” policy.

Newt Rondanse
Posted - 2011.08.16 20:07:00 - [65]
 

Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Newt Rondanse
Am I "at keyboard" for that window? No.
Actually, yes you are. That's the whole point: you have to be at your keyboard to make yourself known. You can't leave it 23.5/7 and let local do the job of keeping people informed so they can work themselves into a lather of paranoia. And again, your work-around assumes that there will still be a local channel. I'm not talking about putting it into delayed mode — I'm talking about removing it, so you can't pop in once an hour to scare people with your at-keyboard:ness either.
Quote:
Removing local chat completely has the problem of cutting communication channels. In a multiplayer game that is bad.
…except that, what on earth is ever said in local that is of any value? Is it ever used as an actual communications channel anywhere except maybe in Jita (where the communication is 99% “please fall for my scam”)? All I ever see outside of that in it is taunts, smack-talk, and — in highsec — carebears promising eternal vengeance on “loot thieves”. It has long since ceased to be a communications channel — it's all about intel.

The inhabitants of the system will have corp/alliance chat + intel channels + whatever else they have at their disposal. Visitors can track down individuals and harass them offer their opinion through those means. I suppose some "GF":s will be lost, but meh…

I have seen it used to make and break alliances, now a lot of that was smacktalk, but it happens.

Local chat is a valuable part of the game, it's "hailing frequencies". I can see not having automatic intel embedded in it, but the ability to say "I am here" is a necessary part of a multiplayer game.

Otherwise you don't even get the chance to meet people you don't already know. Maybe you consider it an acceptable tradeoff, but it is the one change I can see them making to the game that would make me seriously reconsider whether they deserved my money.

Jack Tronic
Posted - 2011.08.16 21:48:00 - [66]
 

Originally by: DHB WildCat
Small scale pvp is guerilla warfare style pvp. One way that would help this tremendously is this.

1) Reverse nano nerf.... and bring back 90% webs. Also reduce sensor strength and lock range by 20% accross the board aside from frig class ships.

WHY? Nano gives ships a chance to engage and leave when the enemy brings 2 billion people. Now the reduced scan res and range will force these nano ships and most all ships for that matter to come into or near web range or sacrifice tank / ew mods for sensor boosters.

Then the webs - 90% webs means gallente will be able to use blasters again! Also its a counter to the nano for all four races.

2) Sniping - sniping in eve is dead right now! So nerf probing.

WHY? 99% of eve pvp happens on a gate or at a station. You know that is correct. So for a small gang to pvp they usually have to go enemy space. Enemy (WILL) have probes on the gates and stations ready to go when they know enemy forces are incoming. As such, your small gang ships will be scanned down and probed in under 8 seconds. If you are warping into a sniping spot on a gate or station, predeployed probes will have your spot AS YOU LAND! So nerf probing time wise and give snipers a chance to come in, hit and warp out. There are tons of other counters to this btw other than probes but require some skill.

Also nerfing probes would negate the need for unprobable ships that yes even we hate with all passion!

3) Some how you will have to bring hotdrops into line as well. Be it a spool up timer for cynos or some other means, however a small gang will be decemated when they have 40 Black ops, or 50 supers dropped right on top of them because its so cheap for titans to use their DD's, or for any cap to use fuel that cost wise its meaningless to drop onto tiny targets.

Also why we are at it, can we nerf jam drones!? They are uber op. Also reduce jams period to ten seconds, this way you can still be jammed but with a 20 second cycle timer then you have 10 seconds to lock and defend yourself before you are jammed again, or a g ood jammer will cycle jam, but this way some skill is involved.

There are many other fixes to this, but these are what come to mind right now.

Wild


Dear nubs, please learn to probe, us wormholers are doing just fine. "Unprobeable ships" no longer exist, it's just REALLY hard to the point you need characters specficially invested into scanning with Virtues and lvl 5 skills to lock down.

Also nerfing probe time would make wormhole space safer which is a big no-no.

MirrorGod
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
Posted - 2011.08.16 21:52:00 - [67]
 

http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1566488

I'm hoping that my proposed fix to the way PVE is done in 0.0 sov space might help.

Nezumiiro Noneko
Posted - 2011.08.16 23:37:00 - [68]
 

Originally by: Newt Rondanse
Otherwise you don't even get the chance to meet people you don't already know. Maybe you consider it an acceptable tradeoff, but it is the one change I can see them making to the game that would make me seriously reconsider whether they deserved my money.



ummm....not sure how your 0.0 crew works, but yeah...havig friendly chats with neuts and hostiles usually has leadership at some level going...is this guy a tard, a spy or a spy who is a tard. 0.0 lcoal is not a social club. Only people you need to talk to...are blue to you and in the corp/alliance/intel channels + voice comms. Talking to non-blues all buddy buddy generally raises security concerns. See your boy from way back on the other side (ie. not blue) private chat it bro. this a good tip if you have ambitioon to outdo the heist of like 600+ billion from that NC corp. Trash talk in local, if your thing, would still be there. It be the wh local. Those who speak, show up in local. Those who don't...are ghosts in the machine.



The no local change being pushed is for 0.0. It be an extra line of code right below the wh code. Some pseudo code:

if player in wh
then clean local
if player in 0.0
then clean local

Low sec...I'd like to see it added as well. Or do you chat with pirates as well?

Empire...if you want open local to be social, can leave it as is.

Woulvesbaine
Posted - 2011.08.17 00:13:00 - [69]
 

Edited by: Woulvesbaine on 17/08/2011 00:14:00
Remove local.

Removing local will accomplish several of CCP's stated goals. It will create more roles for new players (means more subs for you guys). It will reward intelligence and communication over numbers. It will create more pvp.

More roles: Scouts and escorts will be needed for mining, ratting gangs and transport.

More people will play together: To rat in safety, people may want to bring a buddy or two. Same goes for mining.

More pvp: People will either be great at scouting or will stumble onto gangs in pipe. I am guessing both will happen.

Reward thought, not density: So what will this mean? Intelligence, and planning, and knowledge will be rewarded; not mere numbers.

If you want, keep local in Jita or the rest of empire. But if you want to make 0.0 more interesting, visceral, and challenging, remove local.

Nezumiiro Noneko
Posted - 2011.08.17 01:52:00 - [70]
 

Originally by: Woulvesbaine
Edited by: Woulvesbaine on 17/08/2011 00:14:00
Remove local.

Removing local will accomplish several of CCP's stated goals. It will create more roles for new players (means more subs for you guys). It will reward intelligence and communication over numbers. It will create more pvp.

More roles: Scouts and escorts will be needed for mining, ratting gangs and transport.

More people will play together: To rat in safety, people may want to bring a buddy or two. Same goes for mining.

More pvp: People will either be great at scouting or will stumble onto gangs in pipe. I am guessing both will happen.

Reward thought, not density: So what will this mean? Intelligence, and planning, and knowledge will be rewarded; not mere numbers.

If you want, keep local in Jita or the rest of empire. But if you want to make 0.0 more interesting, visceral, and challenging, remove local.


could be something to revive AF's even. Bit tankier, bit shootier than inty's. Don't know whats out there (for real now if it happens), might need some deeps yet be agile/fast enough to tackle...might jsut give af's a role. Something else needed in the small pvp landscape. As is now its inty or pirate ships for vanilla combat, sb's for special ops.

Sorry can't help eaf...recon it to do the same role better, or run the t1's to die jsut milliseconds faster...but cheaper lol.

SATAN
BURN EDEN
Northern Coalition.
Posted - 2011.08.17 03:39:00 - [71]
 

Originally by: Woulvesbaine
Edited by: Woulvesbaine on 17/08/2011 00:14:00
Remove local.

Removing local will accomplish several of CCP's stated goals. It will create more roles for new players (means more subs for you guys). It will reward intelligence and communication over numbers. It will create more pvp.

More roles: Scouts and escorts will be needed for mining, ratting gangs and transport.

More people will play together: To rat in safety, people may want to bring a buddy or two. Same goes for mining.

More pvp: People will either be great at scouting or will stumble onto gangs in pipe. I am guessing both will happen.

Reward thought, not density: So what will this mean? Intelligence, and planning, and knowledge will be rewarded; not mere numbers.

If you want, keep local in Jita or the rest of empire. But if you want to make 0.0 more interesting, visceral, and challenging, remove local.


And yes this...

SIGNED REMOVE LOCAL

Newt Rondanse
Posted - 2011.08.17 04:44:00 - [72]
 

Edited by: Newt Rondanse on 17/08/2011 04:49:25
Originally by: Nezumiiro Noneko
Originally by: Newt Rondanse
Otherwise you don't even get the chance to meet people you don't already know. Maybe you consider it an acceptable tradeoff, but it is the one change I can see them making to the game that would make me seriously reconsider whether they deserved my money.



ummm....not sure how your 0.0 crew works, but yeah...havig friendly chats with neuts and hostiles usually has leadership at some level going...is this guy a tard, a spy or a spy who is a tard. 0.0 lcoal is not a social club. Only people you need to talk to...are blue to you and in the corp/alliance/intel channels + voice comms. Talking to non-blues all buddy buddy generally raises security concerns. See your boy from way back on the other side (ie. not blue) private chat it bro. this a good tip if you have ambitioon to outdo the heist of like 600+ billion from that NC corp. Trash talk in local, if your thing, would still be there. It be the wh local. Those who speak, show up in local. Those who don't...are ghosts in the machine.



The no local change being pushed is for 0.0. It be an extra line of code right below the wh code. Some pseudo code:

if player in wh
then clean local
if player in 0.0
then clean local

Low sec...I'd like to see it added as well. Or do you chat with pirates as well?

Empire...if you want open local to be social, can leave it as is.


So, an indy pilot wanting to find a place in nullspace has to go through communication channels other than the game?

He can't just pick up, haul out, and find a friendly corp because he might be a spy?

This is exactly why I don't live in nullsec anymore. I have to be paranoid for a living, I can't take it in my games.

After reading a couple more responses, I get a picture of nullsec in a couple of years with 3 empires mostly populated by bitter, old players wondering why nobody wants to come out and PvP with them, and static borders because they each have an "arrangement" with the other two empires.

Booooring. If all I wanted to do was collect digital shinies I can use Blender, too.

Messoroz
AQUILA INC
Posted - 2011.08.17 05:18:00 - [73]
 

Edited by: Messoroz on 17/08/2011 05:18:11
Alright, I am going to a put a ridiculously awesome twist on this.

I am part of a wormhole corp that null PVPs ALOT using wormholes as the magic key to everywhere
Here's one week for kills for an example http://kb.aquilaeve.com/?a=home&w=32&y=2011 as a kind of proof of how bloody effective it is.

I am going to throw in some interesting points directed at

Quote:

Easy to rebase
Groups running regular small fleets should find it pretty straightforward to move their base of operations. This allows them to "go where the action is", and allows any given part of the cluster to get a much more regular rotation of "local gangs", which in turn should lead to more combat variety for the average player on both sides of the fence (ie roaming groups and defense gangs).


-The most common wormholes in wspace are nullsecs, they spawn everywhere as incoming and outgoing to/fro wspace.
-Wormholes mean you can connect all over eve without traveling thousands of jumps and disappear where you want
-You essentially have a mobile base of operations, a ship inside a ship of sorts.
-It is an form of small combat PVP + mobile base of operations that works RIDICULOUSLY well.


What I do want to see is perhaps make some of the "objectives" desired to be added to also apply well to corps like mine, who have no interest in sov, but just want fights. From our perspective, the first point is also silly
Quote:
Objectives and incentives
Smaller fleets moving through enemy space should always have something to do, and doing that something should make them feel like they've achieved something worthwhile even if they didn't get any actual fights. This means having things to do that are both satisfying and deliver some kind of long-term value (ideally things with tangible ISK-relative value as well as intangible strategic value) to offset the opportunity cost of a roam. We want people out PvPing, and if they're thinking "I wish I'd stayed at home and run missions" then something is wrong.
Interfere with larger ops


We literaly have all the isk in the world like many other wormhole corps, we PVP because PVE is literally the most boring thing next to pos spinning. We pick fights because we want to shoot at people and make THEM lose isk, not us, also the tears. If we die, we lose some of the isk we werent going to use for anything else anyway.

Here's an example of what makes us PVP summed up in an image:
http://tinyurl.com/3jh2flg

Nezumiiro Noneko
Posted - 2011.08.17 06:32:00 - [74]
 

Edited by: Nezumiiro Noneko on 17/08/2011 08:28:39
Originally by: Newt Rondanse
So, an indy pilot wanting to find a place in nullspace has to go through communication channels other than the game?

He can't just pick up, haul out, and find a friendly corp because he might be a spy?

This is exactly why I don't live in nullsec anymore. I have to be paranoid for a living, I can't take it in my games.



not sure if serious......So you jsut up and take a hauler to 0.0 blob space..or the NPC space buried in it all neut and un blue to anyone? If thats the case...this works out for you. No one on gates....in like a ninjya out like ninjya. Only seen on station JF...even better. By the time they realize its not a corpie or alliance cyno, your jf is cyno'd in and well into warping off.

Looking for blueing to enter a goon station...c'mon man...you say you know how 0.0 works. talk to a diplo before you fly. No point jumping to goon space...then asking let me dock. fastest way to not want your rhea any more I know of lol.


And they aren't finding a corp not because a spy...but because they want combat pilots. most 0.0 types who hate ratting...learned to run indy alts many moons ago. Anything short of super caps...any corp I called home I could find it. last home...even had a super cap hookup in last alliance (no money or desire or skills to fly...but damn fine price to amke me wish I had the money jsut to flip it...brosef discount with a 3rd party fee would have been sweet all the same) Nice sidelines that keep you out the belts as much, 2 man alt corp did this for my combat char tbh. That indy wants some 0.0 corp love...better fly a few of them combat ships they make lol. Walking up and saying I can make you rapiers cheap...will get a so what, I got 20 members with alts that can do that. they can also fly recons, fleet bs, and a few have carriers. What ya got...? If really nice, jsut a fleet bc and inty could open s door lol.

Furb Killer
Gallente
Posted - 2011.08.17 08:05:00 - [75]
 

Edited by: Furb Killer on 17/08/2011 08:34:12
Originally by: Woulvesbaine
Edited by: Woulvesbaine on 17/08/2011 00:14:00
Remove local.

Removing local will accomplish several of CCP's stated goals. It will create more roles for new players (means more subs for you guys). It will reward intelligence and communication over numbers. It will create more pvp.

More roles: Scouts and escorts will be needed for mining, ratting gangs and transport.

More people will play together: To rat in safety, people may want to bring a buddy or two. Same goes for mining.

More pvp: People will either be great at scouting or will stumble onto gangs in pipe. I am guessing both will happen.

Reward thought, not density: So what will this mean? Intelligence, and planning, and knowledge will be rewarded; not mere numbers.

If you want, keep local in Jita or the rest of empire. But if you want to make 0.0 more interesting, visceral, and challenging, remove local.

Or more realistic results: People do their pve in high sec where they are completely save and earn way more (really if you going to need people hanging on gates to check if anything is coming through, which is btw ridiculously boring and no one in their right mind should ever think that is a game mechanic we want, there is just no point in doing it in 0.0), and it promotes hugely outnumbering your opponent and completely one sided ganks, not actual combat.


Serious maybe first consider something important in a game: is it fun? Yes I am sure some think one-sided ganks are the end game, and dont want anything resembling a good fight. However look a bit further than that, forcing players to sit idle on gates for hours just to 'scout' is not a good game mechanic. Forcing people to hit a scan button every 5 seconds is not a good game mechanic.
Related, also with current mechanics forcing people to 'protect' a mining fleet against possible enemies that probably arent even near, but you can never know, is not a good game mechanic, it is just sitting idle near a belt, this is supposed to be a game.

Lunce
Caldari
Posted - 2011.08.17 09:42:00 - [76]
 

Edited by: Lunce on 17/08/2011 09:46:13

I never fail to be amazed at the feedback that the EVE community delivers. There's a lot of useless junk, granted, but at the same time there is also a lot of great 'gems in the rough'.

There are, however, many challenges for the devs in trying to utilize the experience, insight, talent, and ideas of the community.

May I suggest a method that CCP devs could use to minimize these challenges while maximizing the benefits of the valuable resource that is the EVE community?

The idea is simple. Once the devs have a game mechanic or concept that they think has promise, and is ready to be put to 'destruction testing', rather than use a forum system such as this one, they instead use a blind forum system.

In other words, the devs post a devblog detailing a mechanic/concept and ask for specific types of feedback. Feedback such as: ways to improve the proposal and (perhaps more importantly) feedback on it's possible weaknesses (i.e.: ways it could be abused or worked around to destroy it's purpose.)

The community could post it's feedback, but ONLY the devs would be able to read the posts. All that the community would see is the devblog and perhaps the number of submitted posts.

I am sure this would be a very valuable tool in the dev's toolbox for creating improvements to the game, and could possibly even speed things up.

Again, there are a lot of amazingly talented people in EVE. They want to contribute and make a difference. They are a resource that is worth tapping into.

This may be a viable way to make this possible.

Lunce
Caldari
Posted - 2011.08.17 09:54:00 - [77]
 

Edited by: Lunce on 17/08/2011 09:56:34

By the way, this process could be repeated for each mechanic/concept until the devs were happy with the final product.

Note: in order to make this system work properly, there would have to be some form of thank you given out. It's amazing how hard people will work for nothing other than an occasional heartfelt 'thank you.'

OMGWTFResearch
Posted - 2011.08.17 11:14:00 - [78]
 

Originally by: Hansipoo
So how about AFK cloaking? Is small gang "disruption" actually going to be active? Or are big alliances still going to have an afk cloaker in every system?


We have proposed an idea to remove the incentive to walk away from your computer cloaked in a system for long periods of time while protecting those who are actively in the client using the cloak.

My part of the proposal would be a very high cost, very high skill module or probe launcher that only fits on a destroyer hull. A person using this module would "scan" a random point in space generated every time a cloak is activated (And goes away when it shuts down obviously) This would be FAR FAR FAR slower than scanning for ships and would only have the effect at the end of a decloak. This will mean it cant be used to camp areas to keep any cloaker out.

To add extra balance and to prevent any major disruption to the intended active uses. A warning would come up once the scan process has started with a final warning soon before the decloak actually happens. (perhaps 15-30 seconds after point is found) An active cloaker would simply warp away. Recloak and the process starts again.

You can see how this protects active cloakers while removing the incentive to go AFK. This would fix the issue and help improve the system and the game itself.

Jack Tronic
Posted - 2011.08.17 12:35:00 - [79]
 

Originally by: OMGWTFResearch
Originally by: Hansipoo
So how about AFK cloaking? Is small gang "disruption" actually going to be active? Or are big alliances still going to have an afk cloaker in every system?


We have proposed an idea to remove the incentive to walk away from your computer cloaked in a system for long periods of time while protecting those who are actively in the client using the cloak.

My part of the proposal would be a very high cost, very high skill module or probe launcher that only fits on a destroyer hull. A person using this module would "scan" a random point in space generated every time a cloak is activated (And goes away when it shuts down obviously) This would be FAR FAR FAR slower than scanning for ships and would only have the effect at the end of a decloak. This will mean it cant be used to camp areas to keep any cloaker out.

To add extra balance and to prevent any major disruption to the intended active uses. A warning would come up once the scan process has started with a final warning soon before the decloak actually happens. (perhaps 15-30 seconds after point is found) An active cloaker would simply warp away. Recloak and the process starts again.

You can see how this protects active cloakers while removing the incentive to go AFK. This would fix the issue and help improve the system and the game itself.


wspace will be made almost completely safe and turned into high sec, cloakies need to actively sit watching sites, wormholes or other poses without leaving visual, forcing them to warp off is the most ridicilous part of your idea because theres no intel to gain anywhere else often times.

Laechyd Eldgorn
Caldari
draketrain
Posted - 2011.08.17 12:55:00 - [80]
 

one thing which is annoying is stupid game mechanics which allow your target whatever escape or deny your loot i.e.:

- logoffski capitals/freighters/sometimes other bigger ships, logoffski freighters have become kind of standard wtf. Nerf escaping at the gates via logoffski.
- self destructing big ships
- sieging pos's is somewhat useless, even if you have luck and find ******edly set up pos first so you can actually attack it. people can warp out their stuff and self destruct rest in case you take down guns and put up large bubbles (which is impossible in low sec).

i really do not find it amusing that after you've tackled a fat target which probably already made mistake getting caught just self destruct errything or just escape via logoff timer.

Takashi Halamoto
Mercurialis Inc.
RAZOR Alliance
Posted - 2011.08.17 13:10:00 - [81]
 

to help on the self destructing big ships (which does frustrate small gangs, i was in a hac gang we caught a carrier he SelfD'd at around 25% armour and we all got upset being denied)

when a ship self destructs the mechanic for self D should be the ship deals its total hp in damage with no resists to itself, it generates a loss mail to the owner and a kill mail to a player in the same system who has done the most damage to it on the current battle log as it were, so bob undocks i hit him for 1 shield hp, he self destructs, i get a km because i hit him between him undocking and exploding,

now you cant just deny the pleasure of the kill when you get caught,

there really need to be some raidable targets for small gangs to nuisance the enemy with that are easy to hit so you cant just blob the small gang you need to engage them on a similar level,


and to the person who thinks null is three big static empires ROFLMAO, go find the animated gif of sov changes up till the fall of IT (if it hasnt been updated to include the collapse of the North) null has been changing around its very much dynamic,

Newt Rondanse
Posted - 2011.08.17 13:38:00 - [82]
 

OK, fine, you don't like AFK cloaking, I have a fix for it.

A real fix.

After a half hour of inactivity your client is disconnected from the server.

There. Now nobody can fly into a system, cloak up, and go on a date while keeping people paranoid.

None of this stupid making it harder for people to talk to each other. For goodness sake, smacktalk is important!

CCP Greyscale

Posted - 2011.08.17 13:38:00 - [83]
 

Originally by: Kaar
Huuuuuuuuuuuuuge list of interesting things to discuss about 0.0 mechanics and combat...but not a single word on local chat?

Really??
ugh


Local isn't a nullsec problem, it's an EVE problem. This blog is mostly about things specific to nullsec.

OMGWTFResearch
Posted - 2011.08.17 13:58:00 - [84]
 

Originally by: Jack Tronic
Originally by: OMGWTFResearch
Originally by: Hansipoo
So how about AFK cloaking? Is small gang "disruption" actually going to be active? Or are big alliances still going to have an afk cloaker in every system?


We have proposed an idea to remove the incentive to walk away from your computer cloaked in a system for long periods of time while protecting those who are actively in the client using the cloak.

My part of the proposal would be a very high cost, very high skill module or probe launcher that only fits on a destroyer hull. A person using this module would "scan" a random point in space generated every time a cloak is activated (And goes away when it shuts down obviously) This would be FAR FAR FAR slower than scanning for ships and would only have the effect at the end of a decloak. This will mean it cant be used to camp areas to keep any cloaker out.

To add extra balance and to prevent any major disruption to the intended active uses. A warning would come up once the scan process has started with a final warning soon before the decloak actually happens. (perhaps 15-30 seconds after point is found) An active cloaker would simply warp away. Recloak and the process starts again.

You can see how this protects active cloakers while removing the incentive to go AFK. This would fix the issue and help improve the system and the game itself.


wspace will be made almost completely safe and turned into high sec, cloakies need to actively sit watching sites, wormholes or other poses without leaving visual, forcing them to warp off is the most ridicilous part of your idea because theres no intel to gain anywhere else often times.


Off grid bookmark. Quick warp back within moments. A smart cloaker will not be affected considering the time it would take to find this spot. This will only add risk to the AFK part.

OMGWTFResearch
Posted - 2011.08.17 14:00:00 - [85]
 

Originally by: Newt Rondanse
OK, fine, you don't like AFK cloaking, I have a fix for it.

A real fix.

After a half hour of inactivity your client is disconnected from the server.

There. Now nobody can fly into a system, cloak up, and go on a date while keeping people paranoid.

None of this stupid making it harder for people to talk to each other. For goodness sake, smacktalk is important!


That would fix the issue but could also affect other activities. Also a bot could easily beat that. The Destroyer module idea would add in a new layer of gameplay. While fixing the issue.

Newt Rondanse
Posted - 2011.08.17 14:20:00 - [86]
 

Edited by: Newt Rondanse on 17/08/2011 14:23:07
Originally by: OMGWTFResearch
Originally by: Newt Rondanse
OK, fine, you don't like AFK cloaking, I have a fix for it.

A real fix.

After a half hour of inactivity your client is disconnected from the server.

There. Now nobody can fly into a system, cloak up, and go on a date while keeping people paranoid.

None of this stupid making it harder for people to talk to each other. For goodness sake, smacktalk is important!


That would fix the issue but could also affect other activities. Also a bot could easily beat that. The Destroyer module idea would add in a new layer of gameplay. While fixing the issue.

What other things?

If you are AFK then you aren't playing the game (by definition). Therefore you have no reason to be connected to the server. Oh, and botting is against the TOS, bannable even.

OMGWTFResearch
Posted - 2011.08.17 14:27:00 - [87]
 

As I said before things such as fleet bonuses. You want to target things where AFK is an advantage not harm other activities.

Like I said before it IS a solution but I think a module for the destroyer is a far better one.

Newt Rondanse
Posted - 2011.08.17 14:34:00 - [88]
 

Originally by: OMGWTFResearch
As I said before things such as fleet bonuses. You want to target things where AFK is an advantage not harm other activities.

Like I said before it IS a solution but I think a module for the destroyer is a far better one.

It seems to me that fleet boosting with an AFK character is the null-case 'bot' since once you close the window or walk away it isn't a person playing the game anymore.

OMGWTFResearch
Posted - 2011.08.17 15:26:00 - [89]
 

Edited by: OMGWTFResearch on 17/08/2011 15:27:24
Ok let me ask directly. Are you for or against this?

Originally by: OMGWTFResearch
Originally by: Hansipoo
So how about AFK cloaking? Is small gang "disruption" actually going to be active? Or are big alliances still going to have an afk cloaker in every system?


We have proposed an idea to remove the incentive to walk away from your computer cloaked in a system for long periods of time while protecting those who are actively in the client using the cloak.

My part of the proposal would be a very high cost, very high skill module or probe launcher that only fits on a destroyer hull. A person using this module would "scan" a random point in space generated every time a cloak is activated (And goes away when it shuts down obviously) This would be FAR FAR FAR slower than scanning for ships and would only have the effect at the end of a decloak. This will mean it cant be used to camp areas to keep any cloaker out.

To add extra balance and to prevent any major disruption to the intended active uses. A warning would come up once the scan process has started with a final warning soon before the decloak actually happens. (perhaps 15-30 seconds after point is found) An active cloaker would simply warp away. Recloak and the process starts again.

You can see how this protects active cloakers while removing the incentive to go AFK. This would fix the issue and help improve the system and the game itself.

fukier
Handsome Millionaire Playboys
Flatline.
Posted - 2011.08.17 15:30:00 - [90]
 

PLEASE OH PLEASE IF YOU WANT TO MAKE MORE SMALL COMBAT MAKE ALL 0.0 STATIONS KICK OUT STATIONS...

THIS WILL FIX DOCKING GAMES AND MAKE LOGISTICS MORE DANGEROUS/FUN!!!!


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