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Perexus Katanashine
Posted - 2011.08.03 17:25:00 - [1]
 

I've just upgraded to a raven from a drake to run level 4s. I swear it is so much slower it's ridiculous, I think I'm killing BS's very slightly faster, but the damage to smaller ships is just stupidly small. I've just taken 45 mins on a mission that would have taken me about 25 in my drake. What is going on? What am I doing wrong?

Jack Tronic
Posted - 2011.08.03 17:34:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Jack Tronic on 03/08/2011 17:35:23
Simple, bigger guns/missiles does not mean instawin. In this case, the explosion radius of larger missles (torps/cruises) is bigger than the signature radius of frigs. This causes a hilarious large damage reduciton. While heavy missiles have a much smaller explosion radius and so do more damage to frigs. There's other factors but the radius is a large one.

Akisa Damaar
Posted - 2011.08.03 17:36:00 - [3]
 

You just have found out how ***ing overpowered the Drake is.

Perexus Katanashine
Posted - 2011.08.03 17:42:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Jack Tronic
Edited by: Jack Tronic on 03/08/2011 17:35:23
Simple, bigger guns/missiles does not mean instawin. In this case, the explosion radius of larger missles (torps/cruises) is bigger than the signature radius of frigs. This causes a hilarious large damage reduciton. While heavy missiles have a much smaller explosion radius and so do more damage to frigs. There's other factors but the radius is a large one.


Thanks for the response. I understand how explosion radius and other factors of missiles work but everyone goes on about the raven being THE level 4 mission runner and they say it is faster than the drake. When many missions are a mix of cruisers - destroyers - frigates and battleships how do these people get around the fact that it takes longer to kill off the smaller ships??

Kraven Stark
Caldari
Atavism Industries
Posted - 2011.08.03 17:44:00 - [5]
 

I imagine you may be having the same issue that I am.

How much SP do you have and what level are your Cruise Missile Skills and Caldari BS skills?

Perexus Katanashine
Posted - 2011.08.03 17:48:00 - [6]
 

My SP is 1.7 mil
Cruise is at 3
Battleship is at 2

Kraven Stark
Caldari
Atavism Industries
Posted - 2011.08.03 17:51:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Perexus Katanashine
My SP is 1.7 mil
Cruise is at 3
Battleship is at 2


Oh holy hell. There's your problem.

At 5.5 mil SP on this character and I still wont take a Raven into a 4 over my Drake.

Does your Drake have any TII fittings on it?

Jack Tronic
Posted - 2011.08.03 17:51:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Akisa Damaar
You just have found out how ***ing overpowered the Drake is.


A myrmidon can out shield tank a drake, and do more dps. Yet nobody is complaining :P

Perexus Katanashine
Posted - 2011.08.03 17:59:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Kraven Stark
Originally by: Perexus Katanashine
My SP is 1.7 mil
Cruise is at 3
Battleship is at 2


Oh holy hell. There's your problem.

At 5.5 mil SP on this character and I still wont take a Raven into a 4 over my Drake.

Does your Drake have any TII fittings on it?


It has T2 BCS and some meta 4 stuff IIRC

It seems to be depending on the mission I've just done one with some BC's and BS's and its done it a lot faster. Just seems to be struggling with frigates and crusiers then :(. I would put a painter on in place of a hardener but I don't think I can chance it with my low SP tho.

Kraven Stark
Caldari
Atavism Industries
Posted - 2011.08.03 18:03:00 - [10]
 

Edited by: Kraven Stark on 03/08/2011 18:39:06
Originally by: Perexus Katanashine
Originally by: Kraven Stark
Originally by: Perexus Katanashine
My SP is 1.7 mil
Cruise is at 3
Battleship is at 2


Oh holy hell. There's your problem.

At 5.5 mil SP on this character and I still wont take a Raven into a 4 over my Drake.

Does your Drake have any TII fittings on it?


It has T2 BCS and some meta 4 stuff IIRC

It seems to be depending on the mission I've just done one with some BC's and BS's and its done it a lot faster. Just seems to be struggling with frigates and crusiers then :(. I would put a painter on in place of a hardener but I don't think I can chance it with my low SP tho.


Are you using TII Drones?

If not, that should be a priority. Also, I know there are some cheapo builds for a Raven, but a lot of what I have been hearing is that unless you are in a full TII equipped Raven, you are going to have a hard time competing with a TII equipped Drake.

I looked into the times for this on EvE Mon and the time it would take to get comfortably into a Raven is more than it would take to get into a Tengu which is apparently a great mission ship.

Kalrissia
Temporal Incursion
Posted - 2011.08.03 18:34:00 - [11]
 

Firstly m'dear, you have jumped straight into a Raven with lower skills than you had as a Drake.
Personally I use Cruise missiles... with ammo suited for the mission type. Alongside a faction shield repper and two shield boost amps I can set the repper running indefinately.
Then, for the smaller ships use drones. The Raven really works well with these little fella's zipping about. Word of warning though, any prober / ninja salvagers can use drone sigs to probe out mission runners and salvage your loot if you are into that type of thing.
Yes, the Raven outclasses most mission ships in it's entirety but like every ship, it needs skilling up.
Where do you run your missions? I don't mind helping out and hell, I dont need the isk. Only a bit of fun and an excuse to help out.

MN Norse
Posted - 2011.08.03 19:32:00 - [12]
 

Edited by: MN Norse on 03/08/2011 19:33:28
So there are a couple of things going on here...

The drake is very forgiving for low SP pilots.
Cruise missiles without the proper support skills do very little damage to the elite frigs seen in lvl 4s.
T2 drones can really help with the smaller ships.

With only 1.7m SP it is unlikely that you have the needed (support) skills needed to fly a raven well.

My advice would be to stick it out in your drake while you build up your (support) skills some more.

Tau Cabalander
Posted - 2011.08.03 19:38:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 03/08/2011 19:47:46

Link to Raven fitting and tactics that I use (post #8).

The larger the ship, the more important drone skills are.

With minimal skill you can one-volley destroyers, and two-volley battlecruisers. Learn to identify what they look like, and watch how much damage your first volley did.

While frigates are MWD to you, and before they settle into orbit around you, they are easier to hit with cruise missiles. Even when they are in orbit, you should be able to help your drones, and even elite frigs shouldn't last very long.


Generals4
Caldari
Posted - 2011.08.03 21:01:00 - [14]
 

Well i think it might be due to higher drake related skills.
But also, do you have decent drone skills? the bigger your ship the more you rely on them to kill smaller targets.
And do you also use a target painter? very useful for the cruisers and down.
On top of that the support skills increasing explosion velocity and reducing sig radius from missiles become more important the bigger the missiles are.

Leetha Layne
Posted - 2011.08.04 02:48:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Perexus Katanashine
Originally by: Jack Tronic
Edited by: Jack Tronic on 03/08/2011 17:35:23
Simple, bigger guns/missiles does not mean instawin. In this case, the explosion radius of larger missles (torps/cruises) is bigger than the signature radius of frigs. This causes a hilarious large damage reduciton. While heavy missiles have a much smaller explosion radius and so do more damage to frigs. There's other factors but the radius is a large one.


Thanks for the response. I understand how explosion radius and other factors of missiles work but everyone goes on about the raven being THE level 4 mission runner and they say it is faster than the drake. When many missions are a mix of cruisers - destroyers - frigates and battleships how do these people get around the fact that it takes longer to kill off the smaller ships??


When you get your skills up, the Raven WILL be a lot faster. But you will take hours to do a large Level 4 with low SP. Its not much fun. Also, T2 drones are really a requirement I think.

Dave Auscent
Posted - 2011.08.04 15:36:00 - [16]
 

Come back to your Raven once you have T2 Mids and Lows, as well as Cruise Missiles (and Missile support skills) at 4+; you will see a MAJOR difference.


 

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