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Super Whopper
I can Has Cheeseburger
Posted - 2011.07.29 10:28:00 - [31]
 

Originally by: Mar Lee
Speaking as someone who has studied post-colonial Africa: you're full of ****. Pre-colonial Africa had a wide variety of governments, from acephalous tribes to feudal kingdoms, which were no better or worse than governments in Europe or Asia. When Europeans came in and took over, though, they imposed colonial governments that were externally, rather than internally, focused; that is to say, the purpose of the colonial government in Kenya, or Nigeria, or the Congo, was to take wealth and resources away from the people and give it to those in control of the government.

Make sense so far? Good. Because this is how post-colonial governments in Africa, by and large, still work. In the United States, if somebody used his government position to make everyone in his family very wealthy and ensure that his home town had the best roads and hospitals and so forth, and if that person also made sure that towns that didn't vote for him didn't get their roads and sewers and so forth repaired, that person would not be in office long. Almost everyone in the United States shares a common vision of government as something (theoretically) fair and just and even-handed and representing all the people.

That vision doesn't exist in most places in Africa. Instead, it is understood, on a very fundamental level, that the purpose of government is to take resources from some people to make other people rich. Almost everyone who takes power enriches his own family and home town and tribe at the expense of everyone else. Their political opponents may make noises about fairness and equality, but, by and large, if they come to power they'll do exactly the same thing. The job of the African politician is, essentially, to eat: to loot and plunder and grow fat off other people's wealth, and never, ever, give up power if he can avoid it, because he knows that his enemies will impoverish his family and tribe and home town, in the same way that he has done to them. And anyone who genuinely believes in modern Western ideals, who limits his use of government power and surrenders office voluntarily when his term ends? Well, he's a fool, because his successor is going to stomp him flat anyway.

This is not a problem with 'government'. This is a problem with African cultures, which - because of colonialism, because they use the loot-and-plunder colonial government as the model for what government should be - does not operate on the same foundational principles that the Western world relies on to keep government in bounds and civil society civil.

tl;dr? Yes, African government is broken. But it's broken because of European influence. African countries did not revert to their prior systems of government. They kept the colonial system, and that is exactly the problem.

(I know this is probably way too long a response to a driveby racist troll. But whatever.)


Excellent post and the best in this racist, propaganda driven thread of fools.

Most of you poasting your so called opinions here got your idea's from the mass media, you know nothing about what you're talking about and are spouting the same lies you've been fed through FAUX, CNN, BBC, etc.

The moment you leave the comfort of your miserable country behind (yes, your country is a miserable excuse for a country) you realise the world is a big place and you aren't superior.

Super Whopper
I can Has Cheeseburger
Posted - 2011.07.29 10:34:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: Jada Maroo
Europe or Asia can do something if they want, but the United States should do nothing in Africa. If wars or famine force migrant hordes to pour out of Africa, they rarely end up in America. It's not our problem.

We have much bigger problems closer to home. Mexico's in a state of all-out war with the drug cartels, the government is totally corrupt and dysfunctional and we have third world masses flooding into our country trying to flee the chaos.

We're 14 trillion in debt and have over 100 trillion in obligations. The limit of our generousity has been reached. We can't afford to be world police anymore (thankfully!).


Generosity? You call one and a half million dead in Irak and Afghanistan generous? You need to be invaded, bombed to smitherines and covered in depleted uranium before you have a clue what you're talking about.

The US are fomenting civil war in Libya under the auspices of 'humanitarian intervention'. The North Atlantic Terror Organisation has killed more people in Libya and Tripoli than Gaddafi ever could. And let the Europeans take over? They are desperately trying to, while drowning in the patheticness of their own debt.

As someone who has been to many of the countries listed in this thread I can say the sooner NATO dies the better and those psychopathic Europeans can join NATO. After all the civil war in the Balkans didn't start until NATO decided to have a proxy war with Russia.

I am glad to be out of Europe, I can see with a clear vision how barbaric, brutal and evil European governments are.

Jada Maroo
Posted - 2011.07.29 11:19:00 - [33]
 

Edited by: Jada Maroo on 29/07/2011 11:30:32
Originally by: Super Whopper

Generosity? You call one and a half million dead in Irak and Afghanistan generous? You need to be invaded, bombed to smitherines and covered in depleted uranium before you have a clue what you're talking about.



Yes, generosity. You have any idea how much those things cost? And we just let Iraq and Afghanistan have them for free.

Originally by: Super Whopper

The moment you leave the comfort of your miserable country behind (yes, your country is a miserable excuse for a country) you realise the world is a big place and you aren't superior.


Why would we want to leave a comfortable country for some bombed out ****hole? Laughing

Where are you living now, out of curiosity?

Estephania
Independent Political Analysts
Posted - 2011.07.29 14:19:00 - [34]
 

Originally by: Super Whopper

Generosity? You call one and a half million dead in Irak and Afghanistan generous? You need to be invaded, bombed to smitherines and covered in depleted uranium before you have a clue what you're talking about.

The US are fomenting civil war in Libya under the auspices of 'humanitarian intervention'. The North Atlantic Terror Organisation has killed more people in Libya and Tripoli than Gaddafi ever could. And let the Europeans take over? They are desperately trying to, while drowning in the patheticness of their own debt.

As someone who has been to many of the countries listed in this thread I can say the sooner NATO dies the better and those psychopathic Europeans can join NATO. After all the civil war in the Balkans didn't start until NATO decided to have a proxy war with Russia.

I am glad to be out of Europe, I can see with a clear vision how barbaric, brutal and evil European governments are.


Are you mad? Because you seem mad. Did some American bombed you house in Falluja? You question West generosity? The useless UN operates on the US and Western money. Tbh, the West should stop financing that useless terrible organization and settle all disputes based on the decisions of real world powers - leading NATO states, Japan and China. What's the point in giving an equal vote to corrupt, bankrupt countries who oppress and steal from their own citizens. They should learn how to rule themselves before they can give any advice on international matters. NATO killed more than Caddafi, because NATO had batter weapons and thank god for this, because the world would be a real bloodbath if ppl like Caddafi and Ahmadinejad had weapons equal to those of NATO.

Alex Sinai
Mining And Probing Specialists
Posted - 2011.07.29 19:02:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: Estephania
The useless UN operates on the US and Western money. Tbh, the West should stop financing that useless terrible organization and settle all disputes based on the decisions of real world powers - leading NATO states, Japan and China. What's the point in giving an equal vote to corrupt, bankrupt countries who oppress and steal from their own citizens. They should learn how to rule themselves before they can give any advice on international matters.



Agree with you 100%.
And lots of these money given by normal countries to UN gets stolen or wasted on idiotic projects that help nobody but contractors and where hammer cost 1000$ understanding reasons why. Not to speak how much UN discredited itself in many ways and countries by its own actions.
The purpose of that organization long gone and it just adds to spending without real help to anyone. And don't mention UN relief programs. Teach them to fish instead of giving them fish. UN spend tens of years in some countries but situations not improve there. UN military "guarding" conflict sides borders. They just sitting there angering both sides and ensure conflicts cook slowly without extinguishing it. If they do who would need them and how would they make money off civilians on sites or off countries on big scene. And for all these UN "peacekeepers" worth if one of sides seriously prepares for war these troops removed instantly.
That organisation already on its descend spiral but will take another decade for it to dismantle itself due to enormous uselessness and waste of money.


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