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blankseplocked New Player in Eve, Problems with making ISK - risk vs reward
 
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Postrem Inkunen
Posted - 2011.07.25 22:19:00 - [31]
 

As a fellow noob BC pilot, I agree with almost everything that has been mentioned here.

The difference for me, I think, was that I did not have any kind of "kick-start" infusion of ISK. I did it all on my own, and so I was not flying a BC until I could really afford it, and afford to buy a few replacements as well. Even then I was EXTREMELY cautious at first while doing L3's.

By the time I was comfortable flying my Drake I had done a ton of research, and trained up to a tech II tank setup.

Before I warped into any mission I had not done before, I researched them heavily on eve-survival so I knew what to expect. I knew what all the triggers were. I knew when to expect tacklers and scrams, and I took those out first. I used all the tricks like fighting aligned and bookmark hopping to safer ranges. I played it safe.

Basically, I just made absolutely sure I was prepared, because I did not want to lose my ship. And so far, I never have.

The point I want to make is that you shouldn't feel like BC is terribly far out of your reach, it isn't. A couple more weeks of training while you gain income from level 2s would probably be all you need. Like they always say, don't fly what you can't afford to replace. My personal rule of thumb is to have at least 2x the market value of your fitted ship in your wallet.

By 6 or 7 weeks even the hardest level 3s should be a cakewalk in a BC.

And that is the answer to your risk/reward problem. Properly trained and fitted, with requisite knowledge and experience, level 3s in a BC should present minimal risk because of the very remote likelihood that you will die. Sure it still takes a dozen or more missions to make the value of your ship, but if you never lose it, its a winning formula.

Good luck, fly safe.

J Kunjeh
Gallente
Posted - 2011.07.25 23:32:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: Postrem Inkunen

Before I warped into any mission I had not done before, I researched them heavily on eve-survival so I knew what to expect. I knew what all the triggers were. I knew when to expect tacklers and scrams, and I took those out first. I used all the tricks like fighting aligned and bookmark hopping to safer ranges. I played it safe.

Basically, I just made absolutely sure I was prepared, because I did not want to lose my ship. And so far, I never have.



Well now that doesn't sound like very much fun (for me anyway, I accept that others' boats are floated in a myriad of ways). You gotta lose at least ONE ship...it's exciting, frustrating, and adrenaline pumping all at once. I highly recommend getting yourself blown to smithereens this weekend!

Toshiro GreyHawk
Posted - 2011.07.26 00:01:00 - [33]
 

Edited by: Toshiro GreyHawk on 26/07/2011 00:19:42
In addition to training up your drone skills there are a few things you can do to enhance the effectiveness of your main battery.

1) Fit Tracking Computers This improves your turret tracking speed and range and can be fitted with scripts that will emphasize one over the other.

2) Fit Target Painters which increase the targets signature radius making it easier to hit for ANY ship engaging it.

3) Fit a Web - so that you can slow down the guy zipping around you that you are trying to kill.

4) Tactics - Kite the rats. Kiting the rats involves engaging them at range and using an After Burner to keep them at that range. What you do, is to approach the rats until you gain their agro (they start blinking at you) then turn away from them (not towards another group of rats) and kill the rats as they try to close. By shooting straight back over your stern you reduce the amount of tracking your guns need to do and increase the time it takes the rats to close on you. When they start trying to orbit you - it also makes their orbits more difficult as they have to keep up with you. If you are webbed - then you need to take into consideration the effect of using your AB's on your Capacitor. The AB's will make you go faster but will use up the amount of capacitor you have to tank your ship (for one thing).

5) Stay clear of the rat spawn points. The rats will typically spawn from certain areas of the mission. When you notice rats spawning in a certain area - stay away from it - so that they don't spawn right on top of you (that being within range of their webbers and scramblers).

6) Train Motion Prediction which improves your tracking speeds.

7) Consider fitting Missiles. If you're flying a Minmatar Ship - they often have fewer turret hard points than they do hi slots - with the rest available to missile launchers. Missiles always hit though they can benefit from things that reduce the speed of their targets so that they hit harder.

8) Train Target Navigation Prediction which will help your missiles be more effective against speedy targets.

9) Be aware of the nature of the weapons you are using against the rats. Projectiles, Charges and Crystals all come in long and short range versions. The longer the range the less the power. Carry some of both. Load each into your weapons, right click on the weapon, do a show info and note the Optimal and Fall Off. Add those two numbers together and you've got the effective range of your weapon with that thing loaded. Missiles have a range based on velocity and flight time. These are modified by your skills in Missile Bombardment and Missile Projection. Know the effective ranges of all your weapons with that loads you are going to use before going into combat. Also - take note of any vulnerabilities your rats have to specific types of damage. The Missions Guide is a good place to look.

10) When something is jamming you or webbing you - there will be a little counter that starts scrolling down in the middle of your screen and a symbol by the rat. Mouse over it.


The above are not mutually exclusive but then you don't need to do all of them either. They're just options to consider.

Another factor here though is that flying Minmatar ships is more skill intensive than others. They can use Drones, Missiles and Projectiles as well as being Armor or Shield Tankers. This makes them more flexible but is also going to make them less amenable to a 3 week old player than other factions ships.

.

Postrem Inkunen
Posted - 2011.07.26 00:25:00 - [34]
 

Edited by: Postrem Inkunen on 26/07/2011 00:28:46
Originally by: J Kunjeh
Originally by: Postrem Inkunen

Before I warped into any mission I had not done before, I researched them heavily on eve-survival so I knew what to expect. I knew what all the triggers were. I knew when to expect tacklers and scrams, and I took those out first. I used all the tricks like fighting aligned and bookmark hopping to safer ranges. I played it safe.

Basically, I just made absolutely sure I was prepared, because I did not want to lose my ship. And so far, I never have.



Well now that doesn't sound like very much fun (for me anyway, I accept that others' boats are floated in a myriad of ways). You gotta lose at least ONE ship...it's exciting, frustrating, and adrenaline pumping all at once. I highly recommend getting yourself blown to smithereens this weekend!


Oh, don't worry. I have lost a few frigates and 1 (one) cruiser. That was plenty enough for me. After that I decided that I would take whatever steps I needed to not lose a BC. At least not to an NPC rat.

I will have ample opportunity to get blown up in PvP. I am planning on it.

Jill Veli
Posted - 2011.07.26 09:09:00 - [35]
 

Everything that has been said here is brilliant. Allow me to add one little piece. L1's are kind of fun. They are not profitable, but what is more fun then flying a "coup" around a L1. I feel like the sluggish speed of each class compared to the last is very deliberate. Learn to enjoy the speed. Learn to use the speed. You will learn how to not lose the muscle you will have in later life. I still fit up a merlin and run L1's because I like the speed.

Eve is not really about the missions. It is not about the isk even. Eve is about the experience. If losing big ships is no fun then stop doing it. If you want to use big ships then get to a .5 and rat belts. Scare the miners.

My early days were spent in L4's pretending to be useful. I was not. I lost many ships but I learned about transversal very fast. My "big brother" in eve did not just give me isk. He made me pretend to earn it. Risk my assets in the process. Find someone to fly with. It can be a vet or a noob. They will teach you everything one step at a time. This game is about relationships.

Crimson Cloverrr
Posted - 2011.07.26 17:01:00 - [36]
 

Originally by: Jill Veli
My early days were spent in L4's pretending to be useful. I was not. I lost many ships but I learned about transversal very fast. My "big brother" in eve did not just give me isk. He made me pretend to earn it. Risk my assets in the process. Find someone to fly with. It can be a vet or a noob. They will teach you everything one step at a time. This game is about relationships.


This. There is a lot of good advice in this thread but this one is right up there with the links to Eve Survival. I regularly run missions with members of my corp, going out of my way to invite the members who are lacking in skills and resources. During the mission I will watch what they do and give them hints and tips while they are flying in relative safety next to my really very over tanked and too low dps BS. (Those are intentional as I use it partly for a learning tool. While I do not usually take 100% of the aggro I do make sure I have enough to make it manageable.)

There is a role for everyone. My BS doesn't like frigates. All you can fly is a destroyer? Great! Kill some frigates. No outgoing DPS is bad dps. By the end of the night hopefully everyone has learned a little something, there might be a few story line missions to be done to raise corp standings, almost everyone involved has made more isk than they otherwise would have, and those of us who make less isk doing this have the enjoyment of helping out with something bigger than ourselves. Now if I know one of the people I have ben flying with like this has their own standings to do level 3 misisons and I have seen them in action a bit THEN I often will buy them a BC hull and expect them to fit it themselves, but even then I am willing to give advice.

TL;DR Flying with a good corp/group of friends is one of the most useful things you can do for yourself.


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