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Mendolus
Aurelius Federation
Posted - 2011.07.21 16:23:00 - [31]
 

Originally by: Sader Rykane
I'm quite surprised this post made it to page 2 without any major flames.

Either half the people who threatened to cancel actually did.... or they've resigned to their fate.




This.

Roc Wieler
Masuat'aa Matari
Ushra'Khan
Posted - 2011.07.21 16:39:00 - [32]
 

Yeah, so without demonstrating that I've never actually interacted with a RL female before by saying crude things at you ...

I recently wrote a post about this. Not in regards to females, but in regards to the homogenous nature of the Noble Exchange between races, civilians vs military personnel, and just the sheer lack of variety.

If you're interested in reading, it's over at my blog, www.rocwieler.com

And for the "men" that have nothing better to do than post derogatory comments on a game forum at these lovely ladies, hope that's working out for you. Rolling Eyes

J Kunjeh
Gallente
Posted - 2011.07.21 17:11:00 - [33]
 

Edited by: J Kunjeh on 21/07/2011 17:11:05
Originally by: Roc Wieler

I recently wrote a post about this. Not in regards to females, but in regards to the homogenous nature of the Noble Exchange between races, civilians vs military personnel, and just the sheer lack of variety.

If you're interested in reading, it's over at my blog, www.rocwieler.com



I read your blog regularly and I rather liked the sentiment behind that post. CCP needs to bring back more distinct difference between the races whether it be clothing, tats, physical features, whatever.

Renosha Argaron
Caldari
IronPig
Sev3rance
Posted - 2011.07.21 17:15:00 - [34]
 

Edited by: Renosha Argaron on 21/07/2011 17:15:30
Originally by: J Kunjeh
Edited by: J Kunjeh on 21/07/2011 17:11:05
Originally by: Roc Wieler

I recently wrote a post about this. Not in regards to females, but in regards to the homogenous nature of the Noble Exchange between races, civilians vs military personnel, and just the sheer lack of variety.

If you're interested in reading, it's over at my blog, www.rocwieler.com



I read your blog regularly and I rather liked the sentiment behind that post. CCP needs to bring back more distinct difference between the races whether it be clothing, tats, physical features, whatever.


Agreed, defo need to bring back the different race aspect of eve, what CCP have given us so far is frankly very disapointing and STILL over priced!YARRRR!!


Emperor Cheney
Celebrity Sex Tape
Posted - 2011.07.21 18:21:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: Cyzin Jita
Looking good isn't free. Enjoy your peasant wardrobe.


Yeah, pay the big bucks and you can look like a secretary, or even, if you pay enough, like someone with an anus in their eye.

Worth it!

Price McChecker
Posted - 2011.07.21 18:24:00 - [36]
 

Tbh, I think they should allow the men to wear dresses if they want... at least the Gallente ones should.

Ildus Hekx
Minmatar
Republic Military School
Posted - 2011.07.21 18:28:00 - [37]
 

Originally by: Price McChecker
Tbh, I think they should allow the men to wear dresses if they want... at least the Gallente ones should.


Those Amarr "men"... They already have dresses to wear, dude.

Rashmika Sky
Amarr
R. Sky Escorts
Posted - 2011.07.21 20:28:00 - [38]
 

All the Dude ever wanted was his veil back... it really tied the toon together...

I've been arguing this myself; the prices are insane for the clothing and it's going to seriously stunt the adoption of Incarna by the playerbase, male and female alike. The people that would have used Incarna won't because, let's face it, what's the point when it'll be filled with a bunch of ugly clones (and I'm not referring to the fact that we clone ourselves, I mean we'll all look the same due to no customization options).

I'm sure there will be more variety in the future; I know it takes time to create content. My issue is that it won't matter what's available if the prices stay as they are, clothes just won't be worth buying unless you want to show off how rich you are - and who exactly will you show them off to, given the only people using Incarna will be rich people, people with no financial sense, or people that don't care about looks and therefore have no actual reason to use Incarna in the first place?

CCP shouldn't be thinking about $1000 jeans; they should be thinking "$60 monocle == price of a new game that doesn't shaft its playerbase".
On that note, I'll point out that Champions Online tried the subscription + microtransactions idea, and look how *they've* done.

Oh, and don't even think of making Eve free to play with microtransactions; it's the one mmo that can't do that, because it'll end up with 4000 player fleets of free accounts controlled by one player.

Sieges
Posted - 2011.07.21 21:04:00 - [39]
 

I want some rose colored glasses so I can start seeing only the good things in EVE again.

Liva Daril
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.21 21:07:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: Sader Rykane
I'm quite surprised this post made it to page 2 without any major flames.

Either half the people who threatened to cancel actually did.... or they've resigned to their fate.
Actually just resigned to watching the account timer tick off and post here for the last couple of weeks.

Thanks for your concern.

Water MEI
Posted - 2011.07.21 22:38:00 - [41]
 

I bet some man designed all those cloth in NeX purely based on what he read from the race descriptions. All of them look very plain and office lady-like, lack any sci-fi spirit or exotic-ness
I wouldn't get them even if they are free.

XIRUSPHERE
Gallente
Deadly Intent.
Posted - 2011.07.21 23:09:00 - [42]
 

'scuse me miss, are you a size 14?

Rashmika Sky
Amarr
R. Sky Escorts
Posted - 2011.07.21 23:29:00 - [43]
 

Originally by: Sieges
I want some rose colored glasses so I can start seeing only the good things in EVE again.

They can be yours for the low low price of just $60! ;)

Water MEI
Posted - 2011.07.22 00:38:00 - [44]
 

Originally by: XIRUSPHERE
'scuse me miss, are you a size 14?

2 :)

XIRUSPHERE
Gallente
Deadly Intent.
Posted - 2011.07.22 00:39:00 - [45]
 

Originally by: Water MEI
Originally by: XIRUSPHERE
'scuse me miss, are you a size 14?

2 :)


The hell am I supposed to do with the lotion and hose now ugh

FutureTroll5000
Posted - 2011.07.22 00:40:00 - [46]
 

came thinking this thread was going to compare the average cost of a date with a woman and chances of getting laid vs. the cost of a monacle.

and just left.

Water MEI
Posted - 2011.07.22 00:46:00 - [47]
 

Originally by: XIRUSPHERE
Originally by: Water MEI
Originally by: XIRUSPHERE
'scuse me miss, are you a size 14?

2 :)


The hell am I supposed to do with the lotion and hose now ugh


I bet my alliance mate would be more than happy to accommodate you :D

Mors Sanctitatis
Posted - 2011.07.22 01:27:00 - [48]
 

Originally by: Azahni Vah'nos
Edited by: Azahni Vah''nos on 21/07/2011 05:24:34
It seems that the designer for the early EvE Incarna/WiS clothing was moved to WoD and has been working on that for the last few years.

Harpa Einarsdottir gallery

And this Gallante Jin'Mei

The current range of clothing doesn't look like Harpa Einarsdottir designs, so my guess is someone with little ability to make futuristic looking and elegant clothing took over.

I quite like Harpa's style and it's a shame we didn't see her original designs in game.

Also sadly now anything even remotely decent in looks will have a ludicrous AUR price tag attached to it.


That's all WoD crap. Not Eve stuff.

Andr Katelo
Caldari
Dromedaworks inc
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.07.22 02:31:00 - [49]
 

I am a girl too!

Guy In Real Life

CCP Apollo

Posted - 2011.07.22 05:37:00 - [50]
 

Hi Rhasphody,

I am the producer responsible for the Virtual Goods business at CCP. Obviously we are very rough around the edges on multiple fronts with our offerings in the NeX. So I very much agree with your comments.

Color, styles and themes, types of items, bundling capability, getting our pricing spectrum established, Male vs Female appeal, how we describe the goods/items, character creator, how we communicate with the player base, ease of use, fulfilling fantasy, UI / Shopping experience, payment options, satisfying the FiS crowd, growing Incarna adoption, technical limitations with the game engine, even our analytics capability needs a lot of work.

Its going to take some time, we are watching and listening, and I would like to think we will get really good at this one day.

It is our intent to offer things on the cheaper side as well other price ranges. First batches of items did not hit a wide spectrum, nor did it offer enough variation in look or color. The current items are all part of a military theme, color variation on this these will start to show up after the summer but we also have other themes in various phases of development and want to get them out as quickly as we can.

I would love to see examples of what you would like to see, I can take them to our fashion artists and creative directors, push some buttons. I also want to set up voting and an idea funnel for players. Hear other perspectives based and consider the results as part of our decision making process.

Question for you and other players, we see a lot of popularity with the skirt and the knee-high boots. Why do you think this is? What do you feel about showing more skin with our clothing offerings?

When you think about lower price points, what price ranges would work better for you? Consider a few points though... clothing is not destructible, players usually focus their game play on a primary character, volume wise we have a modest player base (we don't have 10's of Millions of players) and only a % of people that will buy. Beyond how you look, do you also value originality, rarity, design, lore, how something would sound and animate in how you view price?

FiS players, don't worry we are think about you too. Just need more time. Very Happy

Thanks

CCP Apollo

Kyoko Sakoda
Caldari
Veto.
Veto Corp
Posted - 2011.07.22 05:57:00 - [51]
 

Edited by: Kyoko Sakoda on 22/07/2011 05:56:58
Originally by: CCP Apollo
Stuff


You guys need to work on the UI design for NeX pretty badly. It needs reorganization like the FiS market had not too far back. Navigation needs to flow like a tree, instead of a flat list. Make categories for male/female/unisex, collection type, and color.

Also, I know this is only indirectly related but please fix the "torpedo boobs" avatars that have been showing up due to a slider glitch in the character creator. It looks really stupid. I thought this wasn't WoW-in-space. Neutral

Cyra Mangeiri
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.07.22 06:36:00 - [52]
 

On the topic of colors, Apollo, would it be feasible to allow us to decide on the colors of our clothes ourselves? At the moment there are simply roughly three or four different cloths with different colors and graphics making up for the variety (limited as it is), if we could (re-)dye the clothes ourselves, those variations could focus on texture to make them more different.

BLACK-STAR
Posted - 2011.07.22 06:39:00 - [53]
 

Apollo, deleted my post... I lol'd

srry bro was being honest.. here:
Quote:
excuses

no feelings hurt.

CCP Apollo

Posted - 2011.07.22 06:52:00 - [54]
 

not I, nor did I ask for it to be deleted. I can handle the honest too.

Azahni Vah'nos
Amarr
Posted - 2011.07.22 07:30:00 - [55]
 

Originally by: CCP Apollo
Hi Rhasphody,

I am the producer responsible for the Virtual Goods business at CCP. Obviously we are very rough around the edges on multiple fronts with our offerings in the NeX. So I very much agree with your comments.

Color, styles and themes, types of items, bundling capability, getting our pricing spectrum established, Male vs Female appeal, how we describe the goods/items, character creator, how we communicate with the player base, ease of use, fulfilling fantasy, UI / Shopping experience, payment options, satisfying the FiS crowd, growing Incarna adoption, technical limitations with the game engine, even our analytics capability needs a lot of work.

Its going to take some time, we are watching and listening, and I would like to think we will get really good at this one day.

It is our intent to offer things on the cheaper side as well other price ranges. First batches of items did not hit a wide spectrum, nor did it offer enough variation in look or color. The current items are all part of a military theme, color variation on this these will start to show up after the summer but we also have other themes in various phases of development and want to get them out as quickly as we can.

I would love to see examples of what you would like to see, I can take them to our fashion artists and creative directors, push some buttons. I also want to set up voting and an idea funnel for players. Hear other perspectives based and consider the results as part of our decision making process.

Question for you and other players, we see a lot of popularity with the skirt and the knee-high boots. Why do you think this is? What do you feel about showing more skin with our clothing offerings?

When you think about lower price points, what price ranges would work better for you? Consider a few points though... clothing is not destructible, players usually focus their game play on a primary character, volume wise we have a modest player base (we don't have 10's of Millions of players) and only a % of people that will buy. Beyond how you look, do you also value originality, rarity, design, lore, how something would sound and animate in how you view price?

FiS players, don't worry we are think about you too. Just need more time. Very Happy

Thanks

CCP Apollo




This is my take on how clothing should have been released and what I would have liked to have seen:
1) A 'casual' line of clothing that covers all races in game without restrictions.
2) A military line for each race and also restricted to those races to give them a unique appearance.
3) A return of the very unique and more opulant racial clothing similar to what was seen in the previous character creator. Also race restricted.

But I guess at the end of the day this wont happen because then CCP wouldn't maximize the microtranaction sales of each item if they were race specific.

Regarding the skirt/long boots question, it's not that hard to work out ... it's the only skirt available and looks best with the long boots.Cool

Unfortunately the whole way the clothing, etc has been implemented with the NEX store and the pricing has just completely turned me off it. CCP should thank that external marketing company for their advice regarding microtransactions because they clearly don't have a clue what I as a customer wants and CCP has completely lost me as a customer as far as the NEX store goes.

Incarna/WiS could have been a highly immersive expansion, but the day CCP decided to attach microtransactions to it was the day it was kneecapped.

Jowen Datloran
Caldari
Science and Trade Institute
Posted - 2011.07.22 08:25:00 - [56]
 

Edited by: Jowen Datloran on 22/07/2011 08:38:52
I will try to give some serious feedback instead of all the pointless complaining.

I think, the skirt is popular simply because it look like something you (or your girlfriend/wife) could actually wear in the real world without looking odd or be sending an undesired signal with your clothing. The boots simply follow because they match the best.

True, some go specifically for the items that make their character look like a freak, but I believe it is a minority. It is going to be interesting to see how well the Odin eye implant will sell as that really turns your avatar into a something inhuman.

Further, the current clothing options are of little interest if you do not want to signal 'military' with your avatar. I wonder what people prefer; more 'current day' looking clothing or more futuristic?

I am personally very fond of the blue female dress currently available on Singularity as well as the matching shoes.

Baneken
Gallente
The New Knighthood
Apocalypse Now.
Posted - 2011.07.22 09:04:00 - [57]
 

I for one would like to have back those translucent helmets and visors that gallente used to have.
Also a black on black is such a cliché these days in scifi, especially in the 2000's, on seventies and 60's it used to be white so how about adding some more colors aside from white/dark/black on military clothings.

And while were at it deteis would like to have back their "wife-beater-camo" shirts. Razz

RShade
Posted - 2011.07.22 09:13:00 - [58]
 

For one thing.. has anyone @ CCP ever heard or seen the game Sims3?.. Not even taking the game play into account, but just the character creation in that game when it comes to type and various styles of clothes, the ability to custom color -anything- in the game with a color swatch, plus builtin and community supplied textures/stencils. I know iv seen comments in other threads about even possibly evolving the nex offerings to include things from the community (as long as they go thru some approval process). As for visual styling.. look at some space based anime's like Cowboy Beebop and Outlaw Star.. they had both what we would consider "modern day" clothes, plus very unique and intuitive futuristic styling. I know my suggestions are not the best out there, but its definitely a start. Just having the content creators look at some of those examples, for not only nex UI ideas, but style examples, would help in allowing the player base to really make their individual character unique looking and avoid this "Hey those are my clothes" issue we have now. Heck.. look at even some of the civilian clothes in startrek/stargate/starwars. Would just have to worry about not making the looks too similar to avoid coming off like copy-cat work.

Vain Eldritch
Caldari
State War Academy
Posted - 2011.07.22 10:16:00 - [59]
 

Originally by: CCP Apollo
Question for you and other players, we see a lot of popularity with the skirt and the knee-high boots. Why do you think this is? What do you feel about showing more skin with our clothing offerings?

CCP Apollo



Apollo, nice of you to ask. Showing skin is fun as long as we can choose not to as well.

On styles, I'd love to see more edgy tight tops, a laced bodice and some thumper boots would be great!

:)

Foraminifera
Posted - 2011.07.22 10:38:00 - [60]
 

Edited by: Foraminifera on 22/07/2011 10:50:33
Edited by: Foraminifera on 22/07/2011 10:47:24
Comparing your offering in clothes to e.g. that other space game based on a rather popular space franchise, who I believe have a similarly large subscription base then eve, the NEX store seems quite expensive.
E.g: Buy a set of clothes in said competing store will cost you around 3 euro ( usually less ) , you usually get matching pants, shirt and boots. And then you are not restricted to 1 color, you can change the color on any item of clothing.

Right now the lineup of clothing is quite strange, Nothing seems to fit together it seems. belly-top military shirt with a weird plastic ring that seems to hover on the sides, I guess a skirt would work with it, there’s no pants that fit with it, at least nothing is there with a militaristic look.

You are competing against cheaper, more customizable, and way better organized pixel boutiques. And also against in game items I can buy for isk.

So what would you have to do to sell me stuff?
  1. Have some really awesome pieces of clothing, I wont blow money on something that is pretty much useless for me, unless it look so cool and/or sexy that I must have it. You are competing against a machariel with a faction fit, which is cool and sexy.
    If you cant convince me on the cool and/or sexy, make it so cheap that a "I guess its okay" rating of an item is enough of a threshold for me to buy it. Which is what works well in said other space game.


  2. Organize your store. I’m not interested in men's clothing, filtering would be great. Maybe make a men and women fashion category, and in those categorize them with the fashion Labels you already created. Right now it looks like a random heap of stuff, I dont buy 1000$ Jeans from a rummage table


  3. Give me a changing cubicle, I don't buy clothes that I didn't try on. The clothes on a mannequin only decide between "no" and "maybe" . Right now the testserver is my changing cubicle, but I believe implementing something in the actual game where you could try out the clothing would also help sell more stuff. If you let me try them out you just pushed me a bit closer to the "I blow money" threshold. ( I guess in the char creator alone would be a start, but actually having a room where you could walk around in would be better)

  4. Actually, extend the NEX store to be real stores on the station, Build some mannequins that show off your newest fashion. Wake the hunter-gatherer in me. I wanna see what you sell, and be inspired on how I could combine the various items. A store that sells 1000$ Jeans ( well actually it was a jacket ) does everything to present their items in the correct way.
    Also a hairdresser, interior architect for my quarters, a customization hangar to give your ships a hello kitty paint-job....

  5. Don't swamp the game with ads or whatever for the stuff. In a store where you can buy 1000$ Jeans the staff treats you well, give you hints on what else would work really well with that, but at the same time don’t make you feel that they are forcing you to buy stuff. No-one screams "buy buy buy!!!!!" like the usual TV ad does
    They too are in the business of complete vanity items, everything is geared towards presenting them, their company and their product in a way that makes me feel important, and not just like yet another sucker that will leave their money there.



tl;dr.
In conclusion, In light of cheaper, more compelling competition, if you want to sell stuff that is basically useless, you should make sure to present it in a way that it does not appear completely useless.

( 6. at least appear to be listening to your customers, an "I read through this crap you all posted and I think it sucks [because <insert relatively plausible argument>]" beats saying nothing at all)


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