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Coffe's Babe
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.14 00:03:00 - [1]
 

Edited by: Coffe''s Babe on 14/07/2011 00:03:52
So why do people active tank it? You are supposed to speed tank anyway, or am i wrong? And if I am right, wouldn't a bigger buffer be better to be able to dock/jump if you get caught in narrow places like gates/undock? Cuz i doubt anyone will catch and kill you in open space with a proper speed fit...

edit: also post fits if you got any goods ones. cheap/expensive, does not matter, I'm only curious.

Headerman
Minmatar
Quovis
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
Posted - 2011.07.14 00:21:00 - [2]
 

I don't fly a Tengu, but i would imagine people still active tank it cause a) they have the CPU and PG to do it, b) keeps the sig radius low, and c) needs less modules than a passive tank.

For PVP i think they nearly all are buffer fit and rely on logi to fix them up

Coffe's Babe
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.14 00:23:00 - [3]
 

I mean for PvP of course. And all the 100ab fits i saw had active tank. And IMO you can fit a decent 70-80k ehp passive one no probs, whereas with the active tank you rely on your faction or w/e large booster and the cap injector to be able to burn more damage than you take.

And as I said, in pvp the only times you will take damage with a 2km/sec tengu are kinda rare I would guess.

TheMahdi
Posted - 2011.07.14 02:19:00 - [4]
 

Headerman is correct on all 3 points, and to add to that it is used mainly for solo or small gang purposes with no logi.

Active tanking is better in small gang or solo situations where the DPS is manageable and your "Estimated Time to Live" (ETL) is longer with active tank than with buffer. The principle of buffer tanking became popular in peoples minds due to high DPS situations where it provided a longer ETL. It's the age old debate of mitigation versus HP really.

Here is El'Tar's ridiculously expensive fit: http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=11182863
And similar by Endless Subversion: http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=10662347

Here you can see it in action on Endless Subversion's video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVgxc0bw0PY

All 4 parts are in the description and you can see the awesome power of a Tengu duo with those fits.

P.S. You can make it perform almost as good with a MUCH cheaper fit if you have good fitting skills.

Headerman
Minmatar
Quovis
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
Posted - 2011.07.14 02:38:00 - [5]
 

<3 greek goodness

Aamrr
Posted - 2011.07.14 02:51:00 - [6]
 

There are cheaper variations, but this is where I'd start. Faction launchers do slightly more DPS and (more importantly) save powergrid.

With crystals and blue pill, this will tank 1086.2 EHP/s for as long as cap boosters hold out. Stable at 67%, so plenty of neut resistance.

It also travels 1700 m/s with a 158m signature radius. Alignment time is miserable, as standard for these configurations.

[Tengu, 100mnPimp]

Tengu Defensive - Amplification Node
Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Tengu Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix
Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay
Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst

Caldari Navy Heavy Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Caldari Navy Heavy Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Caldari Navy Heavy Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Caldari Navy Heavy Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Caldari Navy Heavy Missile Launcher, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile

Core X-Type 100MN Afterburner
Dark Blood Warp Disruptor
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier
Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 800
Gist X-Type Large Shield Booster
Caldari Navy Invulnerability Field

Damage Control II
Reactor Control Unit II
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System

Medium Ancillary Current Router II
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II

Coffe's Babe
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.14 03:14:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Aamrr
Faction launchers do slightly more DPS and (more importantly) save powergrid.



Faction launchers with faction ammo > tech 2 launchers with tech 2 ammo??

Is there no downside to favoring faction ones over tech 2? I'm talking only about launchers here.

Also how much REAL difference is it when using explosion velocity/radius rigs instead of rate of fire ones?

Aamrr
Posted - 2011.07.14 04:03:00 - [8]
 

Edited by: Aamrr on 14/07/2011 04:08:59
When I said that faction launchers did more DPS, I was speaking with respect to identical ammunition. As you might expect, T2 ammo will do more damage at the expense of signature radius (ouch) and explosion radius/velocity (double-ouch).

With faction ammo, this does 515 DPS. If you can squeeze them in, Scourge Fury will do 558. The only reasonable way of doing that I've found involves an officer reactor control unit, and a high-grade one at that.

I didn't think it was worth it, but it is certainly an option.

Edit: Keep in mind that faction launchers hold more missiles, so you'll be reloading less. They will also overheat longer -- a significant advantage on a T3 hull.

Alexandra Duckett
Posted - 2011.07.14 05:26:00 - [9]
 

Active tanks are better for the exact reason that you take low damage from speed/range tanking.

As a note on the fit linked above, it's better to use a pith x-type photon hardener or something, otherwise your fit has a pretty large EM hole, and also you should use a true sansha RCU and try to fit some T2 launchers (you won't be able to fit all T2, but you can do some).

Also, flying these with a loki and tengu gang booster is more or less mandatory, lol

Aamrr
Posted - 2011.07.14 06:28:00 - [10]
 

If you try to plug the EM hole exclusively, you end up with an explosive hole. At least this acts uniformly, and you do at least retain some EM resistance if your hardener gets neuted off.

I'll take a [61.9 89.1 83.6 72.7] profile over [66.5 82.5 73.8 71.6] any day. (The latter is a Pith A-type photon + T2 Anti-Explosive Screen)

Muad 'dib
Caldari
The Imperial Fedaykin
Posted - 2011.07.14 09:45:00 - [11]
 

i laugh my ass off when i see another newb who went straight for the pimped 'look at me, im unstoppable' setup and dies in a fire with no kill in it (or any other tengu!!)

tengus work asolutly fine with mwd, but for the love of god newbs fly moar oversized AB plz, i like a shiney loot payout as much as the next guy.

...and for the record fitting 5 launchers and oversized AB is a squeeze on the grid and is mostly the reason why active tanks are more popular with that config.

Lady Spank
Amarr
In Praise Of Shadows
Posted - 2011.07.14 11:57:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Muad 'dib
i laugh my ass off when i see another newb who went straight for the pimped 'look at me, im unstoppable' setup and dies in a fire with no kill in it (or any other tengu!!)

tengus work asolutly fine with mwd, but for the love of god newbs fly moar oversized AB plz, i like a shiney loot payout as much as the next guy.

...and for the record fitting 5 launchers and oversized AB is a squeeze on the grid and is mostly the reason why active tanks are more popular with that config.



I agree it's funny but it's not usually the newbs that do it, it's people encountering tactics like this used against them who then try to imitate, but get it horribly wrong.

If you are smacking the OP for this you should realise he admits he has no idea how this works and is simply curious. At no point did they suggest they were about to go jump into a 2b isk ship Rolling Eyes

Muad 'dib
Caldari
The Imperial Fedaykin
Posted - 2011.07.14 12:04:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Lady Spank

If you are smacking the OP for this you should realise he admits he has no idea how this works and is simply curious.


not at all, more of a wake up call to the tengu pilots out there who hear nothing of the mwd tengus due to the lack of any hype coverage.

A mwd buffer tengu is not easily alpha-ed, cheap and suitably more effective than a drake for the isk.

I fly both a lot and i like both a lot Cool

Alexandra Duckett
Posted - 2011.07.14 16:56:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Aamrr
If you try to plug the EM hole exclusively, you end up with an explosive hole. At least this acts uniformly, and you do at least retain some EM resistance if your hardener gets neuted off.

I'll take a [61.9 89.1 83.6 72.7] profile over [66.5 82.5 73.8 71.6] any day. (The latter is a Pith A-type photon + T2 Anti-Explosive Screen)


Except that people are going to be shooting primarily EM damage at you, and you can overload the photon hardener. Despite the fact that I fit my tengus with photon hardeners over invuls, i still load em ammo vs tengus simply because evreybody else fits invuls.

The only time the invul will be better is if you're fighting a blaster ship or some moron shooting scourge fury missiles becuase he gets a damage bonus to them.

In both cases however, most of the damage will be mitigated from your speed/sig (for the missiles), and the range you are from the blaster ships/their tracking. I mean, you are a 100mn AB tengu, just kite them, no problem.

A large portion of the damage you will take will be from lasers and projectiles, and obviously lasers are em damage only, and I guarruntee you that at least 80% of the projectile ships you meet will load and shoot em, and the rest will either shoot whatever they had previously loaded, or exp damage (in which case the photon vs invul fit doesn't really matter since the resists are roughly the same).

BuckStrider
Nano-Tech Experiments
Posted - 2011.07.14 17:36:00 - [15]
 

Hey look...Goes over 1450m/s w/ sig radius of only 264m, Does a touch over 500dps(out to 110+km), has 98k EHP and cap stable at 36%.

And not one shiney mod was needed...Who knew! Rolling Eyes

[Tengu, On the Cheap]
Ballistic Control System II
Power Diagnostic System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Power Diagnostic System II

100MN Afterburner II
Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Photon Scattering Field II
Warp Disruptor II

Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile

Medium Ancillary Current Router II
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I

Tengu Defensive - Supplemental Screening
Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay
Tengu Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix
Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst


ThrashPower
Gallente
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2011.07.14 17:46:00 - [16]
 

Originally by: BuckStrider
Hey look...Goes over 1450m/s w/ sig radius of only 264m, Does a touch over 500dps(out to 110+km), has 98k EHP and cap stable at 36%.

And not one shiney mod was needed...Who knew! Rolling Eyes

[Tengu, On the Cheap]
Ballistic Control System II
Power Diagnostic System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Power Diagnostic System II

100MN Afterburner II
Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Photon Scattering Field II
Warp Disruptor II

Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile

Medium Ancillary Current Router II
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I

Tengu Defensive - Supplemental Screening
Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay
Tengu Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix
Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst



LOL

U 96
Posted - 2011.07.14 17:56:00 - [17]
 

I am posting for no reasons other then i love BLING BLING!!!.

Have i lost idiotic tengu's before, yes, will i lose more, probably, i do not care they are fun to fly.

Here is my newest.

[Tengu, Ham 5 launchers large]
Damage Control II
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System

Corelum C-Type 10MN MicroWarpdrive
True Sansha Warp Scrambler
Gist X-Type Large Shield Booster
True Sansha Medium Capacitor Booster, Navy Cap Booster 800
Dread Guristas Invulnerability Field
Pith B-Type Photon Scattering Field

Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile

Medium Anti-Explosive Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Core Defence Operational Solidifier II

Tengu Defensive - Amplification Node
Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Tengu Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix
Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay
Tengu Propulsion - Intercalated Nanofibers

FTP says.
1539 defense with my crystal set.
EM: 80.9 The:89.1 Kin:83.6 Exp:81
Stable with 800 boosters.
DPS: 737

You can fit tengu's in so many ways, spending relatively small amount of ISK or go the idiotic way. WMD / AFT.... Whatever, They are cool.

Aamrr
Posted - 2011.07.14 19:09:00 - [18]
 

Originally by: BuckStrider
Hey look...Goes over 1450m/s w/ sig radius of only 264m, Does a touch over 500dps(out to 110+km), has 98k EHP and cap stable at 36%.

And not one shiney mod was needed...Who knew! Rolling Eyes



I...um...I think you're neglecting the 1000 DPS tank. And rigor catalyst. And stasis web. And damage control.

Alexandra Duckett
Posted - 2011.07.14 20:58:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: BuckStrider
Hey look...Goes over 1450m/s w/ sig radius of only 264m, Does a touch over 500dps(out to 110+km), has 98k EHP and cap stable at 36%.

And not one shiney mod was needed...Who knew! Rolling Eyes

[Tengu, On the Cheap]
Ballistic Control System II
Power Diagnostic System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Power Diagnostic System II

100MN Afterburner II
Large Shield Extender II
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Photon Scattering Field II
Warp Disruptor II

Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile

Medium Ancillary Current Router II
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Medium Core Defence Field Extender I

Tengu Defensive - Supplemental Screening
Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay
Tengu Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix
Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst




Have fun trying to kill the dramiel flying around you and webbing you :P.

Have fun pointing to 24km and getting tackled/neuted constantly at that range

Have fun not having any staying power because you're buffered and can't just go out of dps range and boost your shield back up.

Alexandra Duckett
Posted - 2011.07.14 21:08:00 - [20]
 

Originally by: U 96
I am posting for no reasons other then i love BLING BLING!!!.

Have i lost idiotic tengu's before, yes, will i lose more, probably, i do not care they are fun to fly.

Here is my newest.

[Tengu, Ham 5 launchers large]
Damage Control II
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System

Corelum C-Type 10MN MicroWarpdrive
True Sansha Warp Scrambler
Gist X-Type Large Shield Booster
True Sansha Medium Capacitor Booster, Navy Cap Booster 800
Dread Guristas Invulnerability Field
Pith B-Type Photon Scattering Field

Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile
Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Terror Rage Assault Missile

Medium Anti-Explosive Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer II
Medium Core Defence Operational Solidifier II

Tengu Defensive - Amplification Node
Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Tengu Engineering - Capacitor Regeneration Matrix
Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay
Tengu Propulsion - Intercalated Nanofibers

FTP says.
1539 defense with my crystal set.
EM: 80.9 The:89.1 Kin:83.6 Exp:81
Stable with 800 boosters.
DPS: 737

You can fit tengu's in so many ways, spending relatively small amount of ISK or go the idiotic way. WMD / AFT.... Whatever, They are cool.


Have fun trying to deal damage with HAM Rage missiles without a web.

Have fun dying to neuts because you're just barely cap stable with the booster and fight within scram range.

Have fun being basically outclassed by a sleipnir that costs far less than your faction pinata. Oh look: http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/5305/sleipnirbetterthantengu.jpg

Whoops, looks like that sliepnir has better tank, better dps (and dps that will be all applied), and costs way less.

Kamunix
Posted - 2011.07.15 00:02:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: Alexandra Duckett
Originally by: U 96


You can fit tengu's in so many ways, spending relatively small amount of ISK or go the idiotic way. WMD / AFT.... Whatever, They are cool.


Have fun being basically outclassed by a sleipnir that costs far less than your faction pinata. Oh look: http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/5305/sleipnirbetterthantengu.jpg

Whoops, looks like that sliepnir has better tank, better dps (and dps that will be all applied), and costs way less.


But, it's not a Tengu. Very Happy

Coffe's Babe
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.15 01:01:00 - [22]
 

I feel like killing myself. It's gonna take ages to get warfare link specialyst V or whatever the skill for command ships is. Plus another 17 days for matar cruiser 4-5 QQ


 

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