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Fennore
Posted - 2011.07.19 17:12:00 - [181]
 

bump for a blue bar

Kumq uat
Posted - 2011.07.19 17:33:00 - [182]
 

You people realize that perhaps the reason no dev has posted yet is because if they do they will have to bar its use. I would say they are turning a blind eye. Either that or they are asking Uncle Hilmar if they can has ponies.

MeBiatch
Posted - 2011.07.19 18:11:00 - [183]
 

Edited by: MeBiatch on 19/07/2011 18:17:21
imo the reason why ccp has kept "schtum" so far is that there are likely legal issues that have to be worked out before they can respond...

CCP would be crazy not to want to add this feature they just have to figure out how to do it without getting sued...

As it stands EVE is a game you pay to play... which means anything that is included as a feature of the game CCP makes money off of it...

Lets say they allow a certain music video to be played... i would argue that CCP owes royalties to the music industry because they are using copy righted material to make money...
A solution for this could be ingame advertising in the TV to offset the payments...

Moreover there could be some sort of ARUM monthly payment to pay for TV channels that then pay the royalties...

I think we have opened a real big bag of worms with this one... and even as cool as i think it is... it might take a while for CCP to consult thier contract lawers to see if this is a viable feature or not...

Hopefully they make a deal with youtube and let google handle the charges Cool

Dr DustRemover
Posted - 2011.07.19 19:10:00 - [184]
 

Originally by: MeBiatch
Edited by: MeBiatch on 19/07/2011 18:17:21
As it stands EVE is a game you pay to play... which means anything that is included as a feature of the game CCP makes money off of it...


This would only apply if CCP was providing YOU with content you didn't own. This hack allows players to directly watch materials on their on computer.

In essence, the CQ TV hack just allows the EvE client to function as a media player no different than iTunes.

MeBiatch
Posted - 2011.07.19 19:17:00 - [185]
 

Originally by: Dr DustRemover
Originally by: MeBiatch
Edited by: MeBiatch on 19/07/2011 18:17:21
As it stands EVE is a game you pay to play... which means anything that is included as a feature of the game CCP makes money off of it...


This would only apply if CCP was providing YOU with content you didn't own. This hack allows players to directly watch materials on their on computer.

In essence, the CQ TV hack just allows the EvE client to function as a media player no different than iTunes.



1. there is no way to prove that they material being put ON CQ TV is legally purchased by said person... I know i have lots of music and videos i DL via Bittorrent that i never payed for..

2. you dont have to pay to use Itune or Windows media player...
but you do have to pay to use EVE... hence making money off of it as a feature...

as i said before this not black and white... its a shade a gray that lawers just love to nit pic over...

So'rren
Posted - 2011.07.19 19:20:00 - [186]
 

Originally by: MeBiatch
Originally by: Dr DustRemover
Originally by: MeBiatch
Edited by: MeBiatch on 19/07/2011 18:17:21
As it stands EVE is a game you pay to play... which means anything that is included as a feature of the game CCP makes money off of it...


This would only apply if CCP was providing YOU with content you didn't own. This hack allows players to directly watch materials on their on computer.

In essence, the CQ TV hack just allows the EvE client to function as a media player no different than iTunes.



1. there is no way to prove that they material being put ON CQ TV is legally purchased by said person... I know i have lots of music and videos i DL via Bittorrent that i never payed for..

2. you dont have to pay to use Itune or Windows media player...
but you do have to pay to use EVE... hence making money off of it as a feature...

as i said before this not black and white... its a shade a gray that lawers just love to nit pic over...


1. None of their business.
2. Because 1 is none of their business, they're not liable for #2.

Not-Apsalar
Posted - 2011.07.19 19:29:00 - [187]
 

Edited by: Not-Apsalar on 19/07/2011 19:30:57
Originally by: MeBiatch
Originally by: Dr DustRemover
Originally by: MeBiatch
Edited by: MeBiatch on 19/07/2011 18:17:21
As it stands EVE is a game you pay to play... which means anything that is included as a feature of the game CCP makes money off of it...


This would only apply if CCP was providing YOU with content you didn't own. This hack allows players to directly watch materials on their on computer.

In essence, the CQ TV hack just allows the EvE client to function as a media player no different than iTunes.



1. there is no way to prove that they material being put ON CQ TV is legally purchased by said person... I know i have lots of music and videos i DL via Bittorrent that i never payed for..

2. you dont have to pay to use Itune or Windows media player...
but you do have to pay to use EVE... hence making money off of it as a feature...

as i said before this not black and white... its a shade a gray that lawers just love to nit pic over...


There are media players and media playing devices that you do pay for. The device manufacturers and player developers are not responsible for the content the user places on it. Rare exceptions have been made if there was an expectation that the media would be in violation of copyright, but there is no such expectation here.

The only issue they may run into is licensing of the media codecs and if their license agreements allow this type of use. Of course, this is a good reason why it's nice to encourage developers to use open formats like Vorbis and Theora.

MeBiatch
Posted - 2011.07.19 19:47:00 - [188]
 

Originally by: Not-Apsalar

There are media players and media playing devices that you do pay for. The device manufacturers and player developers are not responsible for the content the user places on it. Rare exceptions have been made if there was an expectation that the media would be in violation of copyright, but there is no such expectation here.

The only issue they may run into is licensing of the media codecs and if their license agreements allow this type of use. Of course, this is a good reason why it's nice to encourage developers to use open formats like Vorbis and Theora.


So you are saying that aslong as the media is player owned there is Zero copy right infrigment? kick ass if true... Though i wonder because of the MMO thing (file sharing) there could be Gray zones... Is there a president of having an MMO community like eve with a shareable TV...

Though i would love there to be netflix put on my CQTV so i can invite peeps over to watch virtual TV Cool

I am sure there is a whole bunch of legall mumbo jumbo that needs to worked out before CCP lets us do this without breaking EULA...

Not-Apsalar
Posted - 2011.07.19 20:07:00 - [189]
 

Originally by: MeBiatch
Originally by: Not-Apsalar

There are media players and media playing devices that you do pay for. The device manufacturers and player developers are not responsible for the content the user places on it. Rare exceptions have been made if there was an expectation that the media would be in violation of copyright, but there is no such expectation here.

The only issue they may run into is licensing of the media codecs and if their license agreements allow this type of use. Of course, this is a good reason why it's nice to encourage developers to use open formats like Vorbis and Theora.


So you are saying that aslong as the media is player owned there is Zero copy right infrigment? kick ass if true... Though i wonder because of the MMO thing (file sharing) there could be Gray zones... Is there a president of having an MMO community like eve with a shareable TV...

Though i would love there to be netflix put on my CQTV so i can invite peeps over to watch virtual TV Cool

I am sure there is a whole bunch of legall mumbo jumbo that needs to worked out before CCP lets us do this without breaking EULA...



Speaking from a US perspective, yes, and maybe that's the rub. Rules might not be the same in Bulgaria.

quigibow
Posted - 2011.07.19 20:16:00 - [190]
 

Originally by: Dr DustRemover
Originally by: MeBiatch
Edited by: MeBiatch on 19/07/2011 18:17:21
As it stands EVE is a game you pay to play... which means anything that is included as a feature of the game CCP makes money off of it...


This would only apply if CCP was providing YOU with content you didn't own. This hack allows players to directly watch materials on their on computer.

In essence, the CQ TV hack just allows the EvE client to function as a media player no different than iTunes.



Eventually we are going to be able to invite people over to our CQ right? i could see an interpretation that since CCP is providing a medium for ptp file transfer that could be an issue...
Example:
person A buys a movie and invites person B over to thier CQ...
Since eve allows person B to watch content they dont own, is this not a copy right violation?

Meryl SinGarda
Caldari
Belligerent Underpayed Tactical Team
Posted - 2011.07.19 20:24:00 - [191]
 

Originally by: MeBiatch


1. there is no way to prove that they material being put ON CQ TV is legally purchased by said person... I know i have lots of music and videos i DL via Bittorrent that i never payed for..




Hello, I'm with the FBI. We'll be tracing your I.P. and knocking down your door in a few moments.

dfred
Posted - 2011.07.19 20:30:00 - [192]
 

Edited by: dfred on 19/07/2011 20:32:33
Originally by: quigibow
Originally by: Dr DustRemover
Originally by: MeBiatch
Edited by: MeBiatch on 19/07/2011 18:17:21
As it stands EVE is a game you pay to play... which means anything that is included as a feature of the game CCP makes money off of it...


This would only apply if CCP was providing YOU with content you didn't own. This hack allows players to directly watch materials on their on computer.

In essence, the CQ TV hack just allows the EvE client to function as a media player no different than iTunes.



Eventually we are going to be able to invite people over to our CQ right? i could see an interpretation that since CCP is providing a medium for ptp file transfer that could be an issue...
Example:
person A buys a movie and invites person B over to thier CQ...
Since eve allows person B to watch content they dont own, is this not a copy right violation?


Unless the video file is being streamed from Person A to Person B, I doubt Person B will see what Person A sees. It's more than likely that Person B's Client will load up their local video file instead. Basically this only affects the client in which the change is made.

MeBiatch
Posted - 2011.07.19 20:35:00 - [193]
 

Originally by: Meryl SinGarda
Originally by: MeBiatch


1. there is no way to prove that they material being put ON CQ TV is legally purchased by said person... I know i have lots of music and videos i DL via Bittorrent that i never payed for..




Hello, I'm with the FBI. We'll be tracing your I.P. and knocking down your door in a few moments.


bring it on mr FBI you have to deal with the MOUNTIES if you want to get to me...Smile

dfred
Posted - 2011.07.19 20:40:00 - [194]
 

Originally by: MeBiatch
Originally by: Meryl SinGarda
Originally by: MeBiatch


1. there is no way to prove that they material being put ON CQ TV is legally purchased by said person... I know i have lots of music and videos i DL via Bittorrent that i never payed for..




Hello, I'm with the FBI. We'll be tracing your I.P. and knocking down your door in a few moments.


bring it on mr FBI you have to deal with the MOUNTIES if you want to get to me...Smile



What one of the Mounties may look like.

quigibow
Posted - 2011.07.19 20:45:00 - [195]
 

Originally by: dfred
Edited by: dfred on 19/07/2011 20:32:33
Originally by: quigibow
Originally by: Dr DustRemover
Originally by: MeBiatch
Edited by: MeBiatch on 19/07/2011 18:17:21
As it stands EVE is a game you pay to play... which means anything that is included as a feature of the game CCP makes money off of it...


This would only apply if CCP was providing YOU with content you didn't own. This hack allows players to directly watch materials on their on computer.

In essence, the CQ TV hack just allows the EvE client to function as a media player no different than iTunes.



Eventually we are going to be able to invite people over to our CQ right? i could see an interpretation that since CCP is providing a medium for ptp file transfer that could be an issue...
Example:
person A buys a movie and invites person B over to thier CQ...
Since eve allows person B to watch content they dont own, is this not a copy right violation?


Unless the video file is being streamed from Person A to Person B, I doubt Person B will see what Person A sees. It's more than likely that Person B's Client will load up their local video file instead. Basically this only affects the client in which the change is made.


interesting... but if they did make it a feature... which is what i think we all want... there would have to be a way for uploading the video data and then stream it to person B computer... otherwise it would just be lame...

so if its just me watching the video its legal but if there was a data stream linking the TV to the other persons display then we are in hot water? hmmm...

Dr DustRemover
Posted - 2011.07.20 14:20:00 - [196]
 

Originally by: quigibow
interesting... but if they did make it a feature... which is what i think we all want... there would have to be a way for uploading the video data and then stream it to person B computer... otherwise it would just be lame...

so if its just me watching the video its legal but if there was a data stream linking the TV to the other persons display then we are in hot water? hmmm...


I think we would like to "share" videos with others in CQ, but beyond just the previously mentioned legal issue I'm sure that the sheer network bandwidth and infrastructure would be an issue.

I mean, do we REALLY want space lag to get worse just so someone could share ponies with 8 other people in CQ?

Xearal
Minmatar
SOL Industries
Black Thorne Alliance
Posted - 2011.07.20 14:59:00 - [197]
 

Originally by: Dr DustRemover
Originally by: quigibow
interesting... but if they did make it a feature... which is what i think we all want... there would have to be a way for uploading the video data and then stream it to person B computer... otherwise it would just be lame...

so if its just me watching the video its legal but if there was a data stream linking the TV to the other persons display then we are in hot water? hmmm...


I think we would like to "share" videos with others in CQ, but beyond just the previously mentioned legal issue I'm sure that the sheer network bandwidth and infrastructure would be an issue.

I mean, do we REALLY want space lag to get worse just so someone could share ponies with 8 other people in CQ?


YES! MOAR PONIES!
( sorry, couldn't resist.. )

Anyway.. the reason that they probably didn't advertise this or put in a full feature like a video jukebox, is exactly the transfer of the videos.
You can play your own music in Eve, but you can't let others hear it.
Playing a videofeed from your own HD on the EveTV is exactly the same, so no legal problems.

HOWEVER, as soon as a 2nd person would be able to walk into that room, and watch what you are watching, aka they get a stream from your machine to theirs with the video material( or music, if we'd have a stereo in the CQ ), then legality becomes an issue. They make money off Eve, so they'd have to pay for royalties for the streaming in some countries/situations.
Argueably, one could say that the CQ is your'home' so you'd not be sharing it on the interwebs, but showing a video you own to friends/family in a closed enviroment. However, since the CQ is a virtual enviroment, this could be very tricky.

Ein Spiegel
Minmatar
Fly-by-Night Industries LLC PTY LTD
Posted - 2011.07.20 17:48:00 - [198]
 

The only streaming video I'd want on the big screen is Eve-related... Slap some Eve-TV on there, the Alliance Tournament coverage, video devblogs, and possibly live news footage or live exteriors of Jita / Rens / Amarr / Dodixie.

But really, give us a damn remote. You can't tell me that in the distant future, where we're flying ships from inside a pod WITH OUR MIND, that I can't change the channel on my Pleasure Hub Motel 6 TV screen. This could be a way to get video jukebox functionality in an immersive way.

With moar ponies. Always moar ponies.
(Just think, in the time of Eve, ponies are "classical" literature.)

Cpt Greagor
Caldari
Liquid Relief
Posted - 2011.07.20 17:55:00 - [199]
 

Edited by: Cpt Greagor on 20/07/2011 17:57:59
Originally by: CCP Konflikt
Cerberus shoots fast,
Missiles everywhere,
Target drops loot can.


So the devs have time to write haiku's (taken from another thread) but won't even take 30 seconds to say they don't want to say anything about this in here?

Edit - Made this post usefull.

Fennore
Posted - 2011.07.20 19:03:00 - [200]
 

Any good conversion software out there?Question

Ataxio
Posted - 2011.07.20 19:39:00 - [201]
 

Started a thread on this in the Features & Ideas section. This ones much more popular however.

Our CQ TV needs far more options and player control. Even if we could just splash the ingame browser onto it... It's a start.

MeBiatch
Posted - 2011.07.20 22:13:00 - [202]
 

Edited by: MeBiatch on 20/07/2011 22:15:37
imo the answer to ptp file tsf taking up too much bandwidth could be solved via cloud computing...

this could also help CCP with legal issues and content control...

Basically we all get a set 1 gb cloud drive (that is linked up to our API) that the videos are uploaded from...

you have a converter(remote control) on the CQ couch that lets you choose what you want to watch...

this would allow CCP to VET all info loaded and make sure there arnt any copyright violations...
Though i still think youtube integration with adds would be a better way to go about legal issues...

Dr DustRemover
Posted - 2011.07.21 01:36:00 - [203]
 

Originally by: MeBiatch
Edited by: MeBiatch on 20/07/2011 22:15:37
imo the answer to ptp file tsf taking up too much bandwidth could be solved via cloud computing...

this could also help CCP with legal issues and content control...

Basically we all get a set 1 gb cloud drive (that is linked up to our API) that the videos are uploaded from...

you have a converter(remote control) on the CQ couch that lets you choose what you want to watch...

this would allow CCP to VET all info loaded and make sure there arnt any copyright violations...
Though i still think youtube integration with adds would be a better way to go about legal issues...


If you think CCP should host the "cloud" space and monitor the content then no. CCP has already used all of it's resources creating Space Barbies and paying lip service to FiS. They have none left over for anykind of monitoring of anything at all.

BUT if they could integrate it with youtube or something, then that'd be OK I guess. I'm not interested in YouTube though.

Cyzin Jita
Posted - 2011.07.21 01:46:00 - [204]
 

This pony garbage is a hard sell. Why didn't he use a different video, like highlights of the Bears winning the Super Bowl.

Kirkland Langue
Posted - 2011.07.21 01:52:00 - [205]
 

I do have to say that if you could:
A) Invite other Players over
B) All watch the same streaming video, selected by the player who's CQ it was
C) expand the monitor to cover all/most of the screen

That would actually make CQ a feature worth having. It probably isn't even that difficult to implement either - seems similar to using an IGB that pointed to a youtube video - only this would trigger anyone's client who stepped into the room to access the same video.

As for the obvious issues related to **** - even that isn't impossible to work around. Since the CQ is owned by a single Pilot, and since the Pilot is attached to a single account - EVE would effectively have the "ages" of every pilot in game. Just have a line in the TOS that says that if you are under 21 you can NOT play **** on the video, and that if any visitors are under 21, you have to turn the **** off even if the CQ is owned by a 21 year old... then CCP could have an indicator on the screen that shows if there is someone in the room that is under 21.

Rumplefink
Posted - 2011.07.21 06:00:00 - [206]
 

One of the voices in the original My Little Pony series is:

Bart Simpson!

Err umm, I mean the ugly chick in the Twilight Zone...

Yeah thats it!

/vault of senseless knowledge

Fennore
Posted - 2011.07.21 17:27:00 - [207]
 

I don't care if I'm the only one to see the video. Having it available wile i trade would be awesome. Also would be nice not to have to alt/tab constantly to interact with eve GUI.

Dr DustRemover
Posted - 2011.07.21 23:05:00 - [208]
 

Originally by: Kirkland Langue
As for the obvious issues related to **** - even that isn't impossible to work around. Since the CQ is owned by a single Pilot, and since the Pilot is attached to a single account - EVE would effectively have the "ages" of every pilot in game. Just have a line in the TOS that says that if you are under 21 you can NOT play **** on the video, and that if any visitors are under 21, you have to turn the **** off even if the CQ is owned by a 21 year old... then CCP could have an indicator on the screen that shows if there is someone in the room that is under 21.


Because no one has ever lied about their age on the internet? Why do we want to spend even a single minute of CCP's time to do any kind of monitoring or enforcement of CQ TV? Just watch your own stuff and be happy with it.

Plus, pron has copyright issues too.

MeBiatch
Posted - 2011.07.21 23:24:00 - [209]
 

Edited by: MeBiatch on 21/07/2011 23:24:36
Originally by: Fennore
I don't care if I'm the only one to see the video. Having it available wile i trade would be awesome. Also would be nice not to have to alt/tab constantly to interact with eve GUI.


moreover do they not have the internet in the 28 000th century?
just a TV...

Personally the TV should be your monitor for the ingame browser... well when in station it should be...

if they made the IGB full flash then you could watch youtube and nexflix or ****o all you want and there would be Zero copy right infringement because those companies already bought the rights to show the content (or in youtubes case remove any infringements) let 3rd parties deal with all the legall mumbo jumbo and get me my youtube... hell even apple TV would work...

boseo
Gallente
Azure Horizon
Posted - 2011.07.21 23:44:00 - [210]
 

Edited by: boseo on 21/07/2011 23:45:23
Originally by: Dr DustRemover

Plus, pron has copyright issues too.


yes and someone will probably make some home made stuff Shocked which for me is a vote against that... things that have been seen can not be unseen!


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