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Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.07.14 13:36:00 - [151]
 

Originally by: Sciencegeek deathdealer
There is no RP reason, CCP just want to make money.
By their own admission, it's not even that.
Most likely, they want to reduce financial liability (which, I suppose, could be seen as almost the same thing).

Portmanteau
Gallente
CTRL-Q
Posted - 2011.07.14 13:37:00 - [152]
 

All vanity items are made of spandex, srsly tho CCP ... answer the question pls

Drae Fokker
Caldari
Burst Of Aggresion
Posted - 2011.07.14 13:37:00 - [153]
 

Originally by: AnzacPaul
Edited by: AnzacPaul on 10/07/2011 04:44:37
This makes absoloutely no sense at all CCP. My implants are lost, my medical clone is lost, MY CORPSE IS IN SPACE, yet apparently your clothing and/or monacle are indestructible?

Could a dev just jump in here and sort this out nice and quick for me please?


If you're wondering how they eat and sleep, and other science facts....
LA LA LA
Just repeat to yourself it's JUST A GAME, you should really just relax.

Portmanteau
Gallente
CTRL-Q
Posted - 2011.07.14 13:44:00 - [154]
 

Edited by: Portmanteau on 14/07/2011 13:44:29
Originally by: Vice Admiral Spreadsheet

3. Cheap and destructible - no repeating sales. "Elite" forum alt saturation.


Of course more people willing or able to afford them and more often and more people having cause to repeat buy them ... no way there would be any repeating sales, makes perfect sense ugh

Soi Mala
Whacky Waving Inflatable Flailing Arm Tubemen
Posted - 2011.07.14 13:49:00 - [155]
 

Originally by: Sciencegeek deathdealer

There is no RP reason, CCP just want to make money.



Naran Eto
Posted - 2011.07.14 13:55:00 - [156]
 

Edited by: Naran Eto on 14/07/2011 13:56:06
Originally by: democrities
1 word: DOLEMITE.

"Dolemite! Its the shiney black metal that doesn't cop out when there's heat all about!"


It's actually called Dolomite and it's not a metal, it's a carbonate mineral composed of calcium magnesium carbonate CaMg(CO3)2, it's also formed of white, gray and pink, commonly curved (saddle shape) crystals and isn't black.

Dolemite is a 1975 blaxploitaion film starring Rudy Ray Moore.

Simetraz
Posted - 2011.07.14 13:59:00 - [157]
 

I could really care less about somebodies clothes or jewelry.

and I am sorry you feel threatened by a persons outfit, but might I suggest they aren't the problem.

You might want to seek the help of the mental health specialist.

Rolling EyesRolling EyesRolling Eyes

OMG get over this, next you will be complaining that a person shouldn't be allowed to wear certain colors before spring and others you can't wear till fall.
And if there outfit clashes it is a podable offense.

Look out all, the fashion police are on patrol and if they don't like what you are wearing they are going to pod you Rolling Eyes

Naran Eto
Posted - 2011.07.14 14:02:00 - [158]
 

Edited by: Naran Eto on 14/07/2011 14:02:38
Originally by: Raid'En

3) there is micro jump drive on the clothes, just before you die they jump to the cyno that the cloning facility have opened for them... ridiculous... wait not that much given others solutions...



Lol, i love it, imagine if there was a malfunction and while you were standing in the station bar chatting up some bird/bloke and the MWD accidentally triggered, how embarassing LOL.

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.07.14 14:02:00 - [159]
 

Originally by: Naran Eto
Originally by: democrities
1 word: DOLEMITE.

"Dolemite! Its the shiney black metal that doesn't cop out when there's heat all about!"


It's actually called Dolomite and it's not a metal, it's a carbonate mineral composed of calcium magnesium carbonate CaMg(CO3)2, it's also formed of white, gray and pink, commonly curved (saddle shape) crystals and isn't black.

Dolemite is a 1975 blaxploitaion film starring Rudy Ray Moore.
You need more Futurama in your life.

Naran Eto
Posted - 2011.07.14 14:08:00 - [160]
 

Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Naran Eto
Originally by: democrities
1 word: DOLEMITE.

"Dolemite! Its the shiney black metal that doesn't cop out when there's heat all about!"


It's actually called Dolomite and it's not a metal, it's a carbonate mineral composed of calcium magnesium carbonate CaMg(CO3)2, it's also formed of white, gray and pink, commonly curved (saddle shape) crystals and isn't black.

Dolemite is a 1975 blaxploitaion film starring Rudy Ray Moore.
You need more Futurama in your life.


Yeah i know about the Futurama Dolomite (note it's still spelled dolOmite in futurama), i was just being pedantic.

However, Proffessor Farnsworths use of the phrase "It's dolomite, baby!" is infact supposed to be a sneaky reference to the 1975 blaxpoitation film Dolemite.

I'm a geologist and a futurama fan, conflictions aplenty whenever they mention dolomite on the show lol.

Naran Eto
Posted - 2011.07.14 14:12:00 - [161]
 

Originally by: AnzacPaul
Edited by: AnzacPaul on 10/07/2011 01:53:56
Originally by: Selinate
Edited by: Selinate on 10/07/2011 01:47:21
Haven't the devs said multiple times before already that vanity items ARE destructible when in your cargo hold?

In addition to this, you are naked in your pod, its not like a monocle implant can't be explained as being just pulled out of your head before you decide to fly. No one is wearing clothes inside the pod, its just put back on your clone when you get out.

Therefore, I'm equally confused as to why people don't have the intelligence to piece this fairly simple puzzle together themselves...



EDIT: So when you leave jita, and your monocle is removed, how is it sent to your destination?


Well it's certainly not air mailed via hong kong post i know that! Ever tried to ahev something sent to you from hong Kong? Takes weeks! :p

Dethmourne Silvermane
Gallente
Origin.
Black Legion.
Posted - 2011.07.14 14:13:00 - [162]
 

Triforcing in epic troll thread.
  ▲
▲ ▲

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.07.14 14:24:00 - [163]
 

Originally by: Naran Eto
However, Proffessor Farnsworths use of the phrase "It's dolomite, baby!" is infact supposed to be a sneaky reference to the 1975 blaxpoitation film Dolemite.
As is the quote above.

Vice Admiral Spreadsheet
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.14 16:48:00 - [164]
 

Quote:
You're just assuming that pirate ships and officer mods can't be useless. It's actually very simple for them to be useless — why bring a Bhaalgorn to a POS bash, for instance? That extra expense is completely useless, and I've seen people do it anyway.

1. It wasn't entirely useless, now was it? If some enemy fleet came along your buddy's single Bhaalgorn would have had the might, honour and courage of 20 Rifters!
2. I assume that Bhaalgorn was in a blob. Blobs are safe, particularly POS bashing ones.

What I am looking for is something like a Wolf bristling with offlined, deadspace modules. Useless, killable and valuable.

Even your exceptional Bhaalgorn tale quivers in the face of thousands of capsuleers marching their monocles and shirts into the furnace of regret.

Quote:
because you assume in your examples that they are useful for the task at hand. It is more predictable than you claim. So the answer remains: officer mods and pirate ships come to mind, when they're not really needed for the task at hand.

The task at hand either being earning ISK (Faster with faction ships/officer mods, undoubtedly) or killing players (More likely with faction ships/officer mods).
With faction ships/officer mods certain tasks can be done faster, and uncertain tasks can be done with more certainty.
Quote:
…and yet the thread is full of examples of you doing [ad hominem]

This thread has countless examples of me insulting you AND providing evidence to support my case.
It seems you ignore the latter. What you should do is let my insults slide off of you! Don't let them get to you, I'm nasty to everybody Twisted Evil

Quote:
[low-price/destructible is most profitable]

Consider two broad player groups, carebears and PVPers with two subgroups of elite and peasants (Laughing). Consider three item types, monocles (elite tier), coats (Med tier) and shoes (peasant tier).

High-price/indestructible:
Carebears - Peasant carebears don't own monocles. Half the peasants own coats. Peasant carebears own shoes. Elite carebears own monocles. Elite carebears own coats. Elite carebears own pants.
PVP - Peasant PVPers don't own monocles. Half of the peasants own coats. Peasant PVPers own shoes. Elite PVPers own monocles. Elite PVPers own coats. Elite PVPers own shoes.

Low-price/destructible:
Carebears - Half of the peasant carebears own monocles. Peasant carebears own coats. Peasant carebears own shoes. Elite carebears own monocles. Elite carebears own coats. Elite carebears own shoes. No repeating sales, as carebears aren't podded.
PVPers - Peasant PVPers don't own monocles. Peasant PVPers don't own coats. Half of the peasant PVPers own shoes. Half of elite PVPers own a monocle. All elite PVPers own coats. All elite PVPers own shoes. I'll assume the best case scenario, where there are repeat sales for all of the PVPers. Just for you. Razz

So, what have we got? Well, for low-price/destructible it'd be difficult to decide who's elite, unless dying is a good thing, making an elite carebear impossible. However, this is besides the primary point.

In regards to revenue, high-price/indestructible is better. Why? Because CCP worked it out Laughing.
In case you're wondering, let's assume there are 10 PVPers and 10 carebears. Per group, 8 are peasants, and 2 elite. For expensive/indestructible a monocle is worth 100, a coat is worth 50 and shoes are worth 25. For cheap/destroyable a monocle is worth 10, a coat is worth 5 and shoes are worth 2.5.

Total for expensive/indestructible: 1500
Total for cheap/indestructible, while repeating all PVP sales 10 times: 485

Here's a spreadsheet: https://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/pub?hl=en_US&hl=en_US&key=0AjuXYcdPnABFdHUxd1RSOEdoWDJ5OFdQMno4U3FzbXc&output=html

Conclusion: Made up numbers are best numbers.

Part 2, coming.

Vice Admiral Spreadsheet
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.14 16:50:00 - [165]
 

Quote:
Quote:
2. Putting on and taking off clothing items would be a pain.
Taking precautions is often a pain, but people do it anyway if there's some advantage to it (which there often is).

Precisely. And since there is no advantage to wearing monocles, players would leave them off most of the time, thus there would be no purpose of buying one. Unless, of course, that player is elite and wants to die to prove how awesome they are.

Quote:
Quote:
4. The cheap/destroyable implementation you're describing suffers from flaws
The only real flaw of the ones you list would be the rage from early adopters

Overall reduced revenue - see my spreadsheet
Loss of elite - yes, unless CCP add a monocle death counter, and the higher it goes the more awesome you are Rolling Eyes
Highsec saturation, with nullsec scarcity. Vanity items should be a fun, exciting and safe option for everybody.

Quote:
Yes, but through the poor choice of combining expensive/indestructible, that maximum prices is very low compared to the NeX price. More than that though, with the current implementation, the price cannot go up — it can only go down. There's almost zero flexibility. Make it destructible and the value can go up, all of a sudden.

The wording. It burns.
Under the current system, the price cannot drop forever. There is a minimum price which sellers won't go beyond, because it simply won't be profitable. Selling a 1.1b coat for 500m is not a good idea.
And no, there is flexibility with current pricing. Goggles cost about 1000 AUR. A PLEX is converted to 3500 AUR. If you want goggles and goggles only, you'd look towards the market.
Effectively, assuming PLEX price is 400mil, the absolute price range is between approximately 115mil and 399.9 mil.

Quote:

Quote:

Read Trebor Daehdoow 2nd, 3rd and 4th posts
…which doesn't contradict them having used tea leaves to pick the strategy. That's just a list of assumptions — they certainly haven't tested it, because that's what they're doing now.

Read it again! "They do this because if worn clothing was destructible, nobody would ever undock wearing any NEX-store goods."
Sounds pretty certain to me.
Read the entire recent CSM minutes? I have. There are more than a couple of instances where "vanity items will be destructible" has been strikethroughed (It's a word if I say it is), with an editor's note beside it explaining that the decision was changed.
I'm seriously not kidding - CCP don't pull all-encompassing, important EVE additions like the NeX store and its current state out of a hat Shocked

Quote:
Quote:
Don't relate insta-warp undock BMs to monocles.
Why not? It protects your stuff, much like leaving expensive things behind would. It's not about what it protects — it's about effort → safety.

What if you automatically insta-warped off whenever you undock into danger? That would be excellent. Any victim would want that! There's a NeX equivalent to that. Never wearing your vanity items. Vanity items only affect in-station. You lose nothing but time and enjoyment by recustomising each and every time you undock. Undocking with a destructible monocle has no purpose.
What does the attacker gain by killing a monocleer? Nothing.
What does a monocleer gain from wearing his monocle in space? Nothing. Not even self-satisfaction at fashion. Spaceships can't wear monocles.

Quote:
Quote:
One major aim of the NeX store is to sell vanity goods, which ties in with the secondary function which is to act as a PLEX sink.
Wrong way around…

Whichever way you or I think it is, one cannot function without the other. If an implementation doesn't work, the NeX store fails.

Part 3, coming right up.

Vice Admiral Spreadsheet
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.14 16:52:00 - [166]
 

T-T-T-TRIPLE POST

Quote:
Quote:
This particular quote-chain goes back to an expensive/destroyable approach, in case you're wondering.
I know — that's why it's not relevant.

The expensive/destroyable topic may not be relevant anymore, but the success of the NeX store certainly is!
"If the NeX store doesn't sell items, it's a failure. This is for all scenarios, and thus is relevant."
Your opinion regarding the importance of the NeX store is worthless, because CCP clearly see value on it.

Quote:
Quote:
Hold it! Under this implementation, every carebear will be elite
No, because they will have no death record.

Assuming a special monocle death record is created...
Assuming being killed is a good thing...
Assuming being killed with a monocle is a good thing...
Assuming CCP are going to make a vanity death record...
Assuming someone will be hailed as elite if their podded 100 times and each time lose wooly sock...

Quote:

Quote:
I don't see a monocle death record.
Because there's no need for it at the moment. Make them destructible, and there will be…

Where will this monocle death counter be? Character sheet? On the killboards? On the forums?
Why should CCP do more :work: to chase after the flaws of a new system, when there are more important things to do? Especially when the current system is fine.
If the only correct way to implement an unnecessary feature is to spend time developing more unnecessary features, why bother?

Why do you even when destructible vanity items?
Tears? Oh please. That's just a meme.
Roleplay consistencies? Nanobots and Jovians. Alternatively, imagine each time you undock your clothes are stripped (Which they are, anyway), and all monocles are not owned, but indefinitely rented.
Risk vs reward? Destructible vanity items have all risk and no reward.

AnzacPaul
Perkone
Posted - 2011.07.15 04:21:00 - [167]
 

^^ 3 posts of tl;dr


Bumping for a Dev answer!! Its almost insulting to not get a response really when Dev's have been seen in other threads a'plenty.

Khira Kitamatsu
Posted - 2011.07.15 05:02:00 - [168]
 

This whole topic is dumb. Vanity items do not effect game-play whatsoever, at all, zero, zilch, nada...none...period. So why does it matter to you if someone has a monocle or not and whether you can destroy it.

It seems to me that the only reason people are whining that these vanity items cannot be destroyed is because you like so many others are "grief gamers" and this has nothing to do with any other reason other than you like to grief in games. Period - end of story.

Khira Kitamatsu
Posted - 2011.07.15 05:04:00 - [169]
 

Originally by: AnzacPaul
^^ 3 posts of tl;dr


Bumping for a Dev answer!! Its almost insulting to not get a response really when Dev's have been seen in other threads a'plenty.


They haven't responded because you are an idiot for complaining about something so stupid.

AnzacPaul
Perkone
Posted - 2011.07.15 08:05:00 - [170]
 




Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu
Originally by: AnzacPaul
^^ 3 posts of tl;dr


Bumping for a Dev answer!! Its almost insulting to not get a response really when Dev's have been seen in other threads a'plenty.


They haven't responded because you are an idiot for complaining about something so stupid.




Your tears are delcious bear.

Now gtfo if you've nothing productive to say, i'm entitled to my game as much as you are.

Important Person
Posted - 2011.07.15 08:12:00 - [171]
 

Originally by: AnzacPaul

i'm entitled to my game as much as you are.

Not your game bro.

Soi Mala
Whacky Waving Inflatable Flailing Arm Tubemen
Posted - 2011.07.15 12:33:00 - [172]
 

In a game where everything has always had a reason, or a chronicle, or some kind of explanation for the past 8 years, introducing magic clothes seems to illustrate perfectly the direction the game is taking.

* Remove freeform contracts
* Introduce superbright red/green texts for buy/sell
* SPELL OUT isk values in contracts (this one particularly gets me. Seriously, if you can't count the number of zero's you don't deserve to have them. It's like 6-10 digits, count them on your fingers if you must.)
* Remove functionality from the dock screen
* Introduce sparkly new clothes/accessories

Seriously, what happened to the cold, harsh world of eve that would beat you up, steal your money then **** on you? It has been dumbed down to a fluffy tellytubby land where you play dressup with magic clothes.





AnzacPaul
Perkone
Posted - 2011.07.16 03:38:00 - [173]
 

Bumping for a Dev answer, especially after the May Minutes that show CCP originally planned to have them destructible.

Bei XiaoJie
Posted - 2011.07.16 05:08:00 - [174]
 

You do not actually own them.

When you buy it, you only get the right to "rent" the item for photo opportunities (toon piccy). When you arrive at a new station, these rights are passed along to the local NEX store which quickly places a copy of said item into your foot locker for use whilst at the station. The items are then returned on undock.

None of these items are actually with yo in the pod.

AnzacPaul
Perkone
Posted - 2011.07.16 05:26:00 - [175]
 

Originally by: Bei XiaoJie
You do not actually own them.

When you buy it, you only get the right to "rent" the item for photo opportunities (toon piccy). When you arrive at a new station, these rights are passed along to the local NEX store which quickly places a copy of said item into your foot locker for use whilst at the station. The items are then returned on undock.

None of these items are actually with yo in the pod.




You can still transport items in cargo bays if you are not wearing them. So how can the items be in the cargo if they are only available in station?

In other words, stop making stuff up.

Bei XiaoJie
Posted - 2011.07.16 08:50:00 - [176]
 

LOL... Its a game of pixelated spaceships .. everything is made up.

Ok .. hmm .... maybe you can buy them and if you so desire, put them in your cargo and risk dropping them ... but, Nex will store them for you, at no extra charge, and let you use stored copies at other stations (its all part of the service, now you know why the prices are high!).

If you want to transport them in cargo .. its up to you, nut Nex would not recommend it.

(Nex stuff on kill mails is bad for their image)

Gurgeh Murat
Minmatar
Blue Republic
Posted - 2011.07.16 10:47:00 - [177]
 

Edited by: Gurgeh Murat on 16/07/2011 10:51:39
Magic Space pixies materialize around your clone when your about to get popped and whisk the vanities to your next clones destination?

Oh wait, this thread was about asking CCP for a simple explanation as to the lore rationale and/or strategy behind introducing eves first player tradeable/transportable item which cannot be destroyed (if worn).

Not for wild conjecture on the part of random players. An informed response from CCP is what OP (and myself) are after.

If you dont care, if it doesent bother you, if your immersion and sense of sandbox remains uncompromised, feel free to demonstrate this by not posting. I demonstrate how little I care about Xenuria by not posting in or even reading her threads. Feel free to apply the same rationale. If you post here to say you dont care, its not a big thing etc guess what...... Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.

AnzacPaul
Perkone
Posted - 2011.07.16 23:14:00 - [178]
 

Originally by: Gurgeh Murat
Edited by: Gurgeh Murat on 16/07/2011 10:51:39
Magic Space pixies materialize around your clone when your about to get popped and whisk the vanities to your next clones destination?

Oh wait, this thread was about asking CCP for a simple explanation as to the lore rationale and/or strategy behind introducing eves first player tradeable/transportable item which cannot be destroyed (if worn).

Not for wild conjecture on the part of random players. An informed response from CCP is what OP (and myself) are after.

If you dont care, if it doesent bother you, if your immersion and sense of sandbox remains uncompromised, feel free to demonstrate this by not posting. I demonstrate how little I care about Xenuria by not posting in or even reading her threads. Feel free to apply the same rationale. If you post here to say you dont care, its not a big thing etc guess what...... Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.


Bumping for a Dev answer!!

Sharon Anne
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.16 23:25:00 - [179]
 

Originally by: Barkaial Starfinder
When you buy a NeX item, you are actually signing a contract which includes the replacement at the cloning facilities around our stars.
It is stored in a compartment of your POD while you are in the goo.

Seriously, is this what worries you in EVE?


This, it is part of the price of the clone ... hmmm maybe CPP should charge extra for NeX items like the next level of clone to cover NeX items?

AnzacPaul
Perkone
Posted - 2011.07.17 01:36:00 - [180]
 

Originally by: Sharon Anne
Originally by: Barkaial Starfinder
When you buy a NeX item, you are actually signing a contract which includes the replacement at the cloning facilities around our stars.
It is stored in a compartment of your POD while you are in the goo.

Seriously, is this what worries you in EVE?


This, it is part of the price of the clone ..


Link to devpost plz


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