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Khaine Beralt
Wolves Of Legend
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:06:00 - [31]
 

Edited by: Khaine Beralt on 08/07/2011 11:20:56
Edited by: Khaine Beralt on 08/07/2011 11:20:31

fake edit: didn't notice the "entire outfit" thing my bad

Atai Pekoe
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:07:00 - [32]
 

Originally by: cBOLTSON
You know what guys... I QUIT!


fixed for you.

Poetic Stanziel
Gallente
Macbeth Transport and Freight LLC
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:07:00 - [33]
 

Originally by: ChromeStriker
Edited by: ChromeStriker on 08/07/2011 10:53:43

First Very Happy

Edit:
ok.... ok kinda makes sense.... pricing still seems a bit high (lowest price items = 1plex)


He said 1 Plex for an entire outfit at the lowest tier ... if that holds, then that is completely in line with vanity items from other games.

As long as they have a pricing tier where individual items are on the order of $2-$5 per item, then that is acceptable to me.

I don't care about the higher tiers ... if people want to pay those prices, then more power to them and CCP.

Marsaac
Minmatar
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:08:00 - [34]
 

Maybe sheep are almost extinct so there is barely any wool, hence the price.

Mitchello
B O R G
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:09:00 - [35]
 

Edited by: Mitchello on 08/07/2011 11:20:46
Originally by: CCP Zinfandel
Hey guys,

Important note here. This is about learning. We need to learn about this stuff. We are just dipping our toes into the water here, seeing how this all works while being careful not to mess up the economy. So far, we've been successful at protecting the EVE economy. PLEX prices on the ISK market are currently unaffected.

We aren't making a lot of money but that's not the point.

Any questions?


Don't get me wrong, but I am really curious as to the reasoning of experimenting with the golden goose. I can understand change, and commercial necessities (which flat out don't exist, according to CCP's own finances). It just strikes me as an unwarranted risk to extend this strange doctrine of "X cannot be compelling unless enforced" to commercial model additions while in the mean time there is a truly frightening amount of work to be done in order to get even on the road towards making EVE a premium experience.

If you want to take this as a learning experience, do it for EVE, and not for other products. That EVE shares its resources, you know fine, there is sense in that. But to use it as a learning experiment ... I hope you understand how all too easily that can be seen (and felt) as taking it too far - regardless of factuality. It is after all the emotion that fuels the engine, and any application of consumerism to a service model is a mere demonstration of flawed definitions as buzzwords.

So, is experimenting really a priority over making money as you suggest? If so, that only has any merit whatsoever if you want to expand the road of microtransactions. In which case, I strongly suggest that CCP does not seek out the road of convenience items to extend definitions across desires.

On a second thought, in light of any company having limited resources (no matter how you grow, your market grows with you so growth of available resources is always relative and at best neutral) is it so hard to see that by pursuing this road in the current manner you are locking yourself down along that road in order to make the investment worthwhile. Regardless of it as an experience base for other products, regardless of EVE sharing its resources, you are creating internal debt. And just like other forms of debt, for example technical debt, the bill always has to be paid. And this kind of bill, you always have to pay more for than what you put in, that is the nature of a commercial experiment on a service model. But you know this, otherwise you would not have engaged in this. But is it so hard to see that at the end of the day (proverbially speaking) you will have to commit more resources in order to make the initial investment worth it - resources which will have to be allocated to this, and not other parts of EVE or even EVE as a whole.

Kheeria
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:13:00 - [36]
 

Originally by: Atai Pekoe
Edited by: Atai Pekoe on 08/07/2011 11:03:48
Originally by: Kheeria
Edited by: Kheeria on 08/07/2011 10:54:20
Originally by: Atai Pekoe
good thing you start to explain this to us. i like the concept and i think this could work. i really like the idea of having design studios in new eden and you can choose to wear a really expencive jacket from "Bugo Hoss Jita" or something. Or you just buy your ten Dollar Jeans from some crappy store and be happy withit cause it fits your style.

keep telling us more. i think we all have to handle this very carefully cause i dont think there is another MMO out there with this kind of item-price-strategy (proof me wrong?!?) ...it COULD become a great concept... like i said!


Did you fall and hurt your head? Paying $40-80 for a virtual item is insane.... What will you do if eve is shut down? Ask CCP to send you a real skirt or monocle? And CCP, pricing strategy is clearly not for you, lets say the monocle was $5 or $3, how many more would've bought it? I know I even might, but with prices like these I won't even enter the NeX again to even check your new items. Stupidity in 0's and 1's IMHO.



remember that you DONT NEED anything of it... its a way players "CAN" express themselves. You wont have any penaltys if you dont wear this stuff. personally i wont buy stuff from the mid or even higher segment... i cant cause im poor ^^ but i love the idea of the fashion aspect ^^

ps: sorry for my english, hope you can follow me nevertheless

You english ain't a problem, my reply would've been something of the lines of "Please speak english" if it was. I don't mind the NeX, let the gurls have something to play with, and as we been told the P2Win aspect won't happen I'm quite calm about it, but the prices are worse than here in Norway, and we're the most expensive country in the world. Sorry 2nd most expensive, Iceland just took over about 2 weeks ago.

Marlona Sky
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:13:00 - [37]
 

Originally by: Hilmar Veigar Pétursson
It's a complicated matter to define what is vanity and what is not vanity.


http://i763.photobucket.com/albums/xx271/dripbucketsnap/Aurumforhealthcopy.jpg

I guess my ship with full health does make me look better.

Morgan Polaris
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:13:00 - [38]
 

As long as you keep gameplay tightly under the subscription fee we agreed upon.

Still, this doesn't explain why you choose to call it microtransactions. Even a full PLEX is very much borderline, since a PLEX is not that cheap to bring into EVE (compared to even a monthly subscription fee).

Furb Killer
Gallente
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:14:00 - [39]
 

Edited by: Furb Killer on 08/07/2011 11:14:21
When CCP announced that this dev blog would come with information on pricing tiers I expected that CCP would use it to backpedal at olympic speeds and claim that all along the current stuff in the store was supposed to be the extremely high end stuff (which would be obvious BS, but we are talking about CCP). However kudos to CCP for not backpedaling and just sticking with your original idea.

Obviously those kudos are immediatly removed again, are you ****ing insane? So the current stuff is the mid range clothes? If the really special stuff was this price range I could possibly understand it, like the look-through top for female chars, or the pants that are on fire for male chars. But serious cloths that are as expensive as IRL are the mid-range stuff? You guys have any link left to reality?

And considering there apparently will also be an exceptional tier for the flaming pants, and the high tier is already 100 euro + for a shirt, you are deluded. It is called MICRO transactions.

Oblado
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:14:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: Marlona Sky
Originally by: Hilmar Veigar Pétursson
It's a complicated matter to define what is vanity and what is not vanity.


http://i763.photobucket.com/albums/xx271/dripbucketsnap/Aurumforhealthcopy.jpg

I guess my ship with full health does make me look better.


Haha, sad but funny

Mdih Lihu
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:14:00 - [41]
 

Edited by: Mdih Lihu on 08/07/2011 11:15:38
Originally by: CCP Zinfandel

We aren't making a lot of money but that's not the point.

Any questions?


If the point wasn't to make money you'd just be selling these things for ISK.

I don't really mind there being micro (I use that word loosely) transactions in the game for vanity items, I can choose to just not buy them if I don't see the value for money/isk/time.

I just hope it doesn't end up that there is some tiny selection of 'free' items and anything beyond that costs money. Also the whole, one pair of pants thing costing the equivalent or more than SPACESHIPS is extremely immersion breaking.

Shova Kais
Caldari
Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:18:00 - [42]
 

Originally by: CCP Zinfandel
I've got one pair of "cute high heels" coming in the next month.

The suits and tuxedos and such are being developed as part of our "corporate collection" which is months from now. We are in the "military collection" now. Also coming up is our "cyberpunk collection."

I've seen some amazing sketches from our fashion designer for the cyberpunk collection. I may have to create a female character one of these days.


Will there be faction specific military outfits for us FW types? Please say yes, please!

Morgan Polaris
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:18:00 - [43]
 

Originally by: Mdih Lihu
Edited by: Mdih Lihu on 08/07/2011 11:15:38
Originally by: CCP Zinfandel

We aren't making a lot of money but that's not the point.

Any questions?


If the point wasn't to make money you'd just be selling these things for ISK.

I don't really mind there being micro (I use that word loosely) transactions in the game for vanity items, I can choose to just not buy them if I don't see the value for money/isk/time.

I just hope it doesn't end up that there is some tiny selection of 'free' items and anything beyond that costs money. Also the whole, one pair of pants thing costing the equivalent or more than SPACESHIPS is extremely immersion breaking.


Try clone jumping while standing in your CQ. Immersion is not a priority here ;-)

Rawr Cristina
Caldari
Naqam
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:19:00 - [44]
 

A step forward, but I would still like to see some more reasonable price ranges. 300mil is by no means 'affordable' for bottom tier vanity items.

Black Dranzer
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:19:00 - [45]
 

Originally by: Mdih Lihu
Edited by: Mdih Lihu on 08/07/2011 11:15:38
Originally by: CCP Zinfandel

We aren't making a lot of money but that's not the point.

Any questions?


If the point wasn't to make money you'd just be selling these things for ISK.

Vitticeps
Gallente
The Royal Guard
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:21:00 - [46]
 

I would have to agree with most posts.

CCP have outpriced themselves concerning the market. Imagine... All those noobs who join on a daily basis, those who really wish to customise their character to it's fullest.
They go through the whole character creation, get fitted out etc and finally when in game they find that to get some decent looking clothing, they'd have to pay in excess of 300 million.

If the prices were dropped, especially for the lower tiered items, to say maybe a few thousand then you would have a massive influx of people willing to pay that isk just to fiddle and change their toon.
If they didn't like it, they would probably go buy another item. Constant revenue there.

I was extrememly excited by the news of Incarna. Alot of people have moaned and complained that it is taking away from the game. Now i feel quite disappointed that i'd have to spend £15 just so i could make my toon wear a skirt.
I'm all for supporting CCP in their endeavours, i wouldn't have such a time-consuming game or the friends i now have without them. But really, think about the customers, and what they are saying.

It'd be a benefit to yourselves with a drop in price to NeX store items.

Vitti. x

Atai Pekoe
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:22:00 - [47]
 

Question:

Is a pyramid based fashion structure planned?

Like a lot of items (lets say 50) in the low price segment, a little less (lets say 25) in the mid segment and a little less more (lets say... 5-10) in the high segment?

Bodrul
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:23:00 - [48]
 

Originally by: CCP Zinfandel
Hey guys,

Important note here. This is about learning. We need to learn about this stuff. We are just dipping our toes into the water here, seeing how this all works while being careful not to mess up the economy. So far, we've been successful at protecting the EVE economy. PLEX prices on the ISK market are currently unaffected.

We aren't making a lot of money but that's not the point.

Any questions?


this is a Joke right? the prices are still Jokes (wasn't it bad enough being ridiculed by almost all the eve players and Gaming websites)

didn't CCP learn from the Monocle? protect the economy as you want to say it but CCPs image
not doing so well

not that i care about doing dress up space barbie and Ken lol






Mr Trit
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:24:00 - [49]
 

Low range suit of clothes = 1 plex-2 plex ok (this is a complete suit, not just 1-2 pieces)

midrange suit = 2-3 plex

high end = make it worth the plex and it will be bought.

but DO NOT wait for me to buy it.

Katana Seiko
Gallente
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:24:00 - [50]
 

Originally by: CCP Zinfandel
Important note here. This is about learning. We need to learn about this stuff. We are just dipping our toes into the water here, seeing how this all works while being careful not to mess up the economy.


We have an important notice too. Why the heck did you put in a second currency? This is absolute boll****, and you know it. I bet that CCP Dr.EyjoG has told you about it, and he probably advised you not to do that.

Let me make it clear for you in terms that you understand: For example people don't like to buy a Freighter and a Janitor in a package if the Janitor costs them an additional 200 millions. It's the same with our ISK and AUR. If we transfer some ISK into AUR, we have 15%, maybe 20% overhead. Meaning a good portion that you just can't use. What good is a left over of 800 AUR if you can not use it for anything? It is worth about 100 million ISK, but you can not do sh*t with it because it's AUR and everything else in EVE just takes ISK.

So please. We had the same thing with blueprints before. They were brought from a far away place and resold for 10% to 100% profit. So if you want to **** off some players, keep AUR. If you want to make all players terribly happy and stop monitoring something you don't f**ing have to, remove the AUR from the system. And give back the ISK to those who made the mistake to enter into AUR.

Thank you.

CCP Zinfandel

Posted - 2011.07.08 11:26:00 - [51]
 

We don't yet have targets for how many pieces are designed for which tier. Some of that is purely artistic freedom for the artists who design the pieces. Also, this is because we can't currently create new items as quickly as we'd like.

We are using a combination of in-house designers, outside art production, and in house art direction to make these pieces. And yes, we are hoping they can eventually pay for themselves and contribute to the EVE development budget.

But initially this is just about learning. And you'll see us doing things with prices to try to learn more.

Arklan1
Dunedain Rangers
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:27:00 - [52]
 

lowest teir outfit for the price of ...three or four t1 battleships. i'm sorry, but that's just plain stupid. just because bill gates HAS billions of dollars doesn't mean he spends millions on shirts and pants.

now, the optional nature of this whole NeX thing obviously makes it a bit less of a concern, but the prices are still stupid high. i happen to like some of the clothing i've seen in there, but i won't be buying it if the LOW END is the price of a plex. not ever. i balk at the prices of +5 implants, and your talking about that much ...for pants.

M Blanc
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:27:00 - [53]
 

Well, I guess we now have a new unit for quantifying collective insanity: the CCP.

Gratz!

Lina Miaoke
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:27:00 - [54]
 

I assume the basic free clothing line will see more addition eventurally? The selection is pretty damn limited as is right now.

I'm 100% positive I'll bump into many characters thats wearing exactly same clothing I am... Gonna feel awkward for those who doesn't want to spend their hard earned ISK/Cash on virtual clothing.

AnzacPaul
Perkone
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:28:00 - [55]
 

Originally by: CCP Zinfandel
We don't yet have targets for how many pieces are designed for which tier. Some of that is purely artistic freedom for the artists who design the pieces. Also, this is because we can't currently create new items as quickly as we'd like.

We are using a combination of in-house designers, outside art production, and in house art direction to make these pieces. And yes, we are hoping they can eventually pay for themselves and contribute to the EVE development budget.

But initially this is just about learning. And you'll see us doing things with prices to try to learn more.


its funny how sometimes you can say so much, and yet really say nothing at all....... Crying or Very sad

Siigari Kitawa
Gallente
Perditus Peregrinus
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:29:00 - [56]
 

I would like to run a tailor shop. It has been my dream that once Incarna launched, I could have people stop by my shop and I would be able to sell them fine outfits and threads. However, those prices are exquisitely painful. Even I don't know if I can swallow a few billion ISK for an outfit or two.

Ctair
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:31:00 - [57]
 

I've never once felt the need to got on the forums in the time I have played but this time I will. We pay to play pewpew in spaceships not barbie. This six months of waiting for an update and its to line your pockets with money. Greed is goning to be your downfall.

Mitchello
B O R G
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:33:00 - [58]
 

Originally by: CCP Zinfandel


But initially this is just about learning. And you'll see us doing things with prices to try to learn more.


I understand you ignored my previous question, so let's try a more safe one this time.

Was this devblog ran by the CSM?


Vitticeps
Gallente
The Royal Guard
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:33:00 - [59]
 

I noticed that CCP Zinfandel has a NeX Monacle,
Did you pay the 3-4 PLEX's for that item? Or was it an optional extra for staff?

Vitti. x

Vuk Lau
4S Corporation
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2011.07.08 11:33:00 - [60]
 

Originally by: CCP Zinfandel
Hey guys,

Important note here. This is about learning. We need to learn about this stuff. We are just dipping our toes into the water here, seeing how this all works while being careful not to mess up the economy. So far, we've been successful at protecting the EVE economy. PLEX prices on the ISK market are currently unaffected.

We aren't making a lot of money but that's not the point.

Any questions?


Thanx for coming out to the players, but I am positive that we are all sharing the same concern the clothes are overpriced. I mean paying 45-60$ for piece of midtier virtual cloth is kinda...insulting. I could ALMOST swallow that price for some VIP ultra exclusive piece of thongs made of titanium, but not for midtier Tshirt. Please reconsider your price politics or we will stay naked (or maybe thats the REAL intention of CCP marketing dept - naked pilots everywhere)


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