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Lyssa Ruiz
Hemastatic
Posted - 2011.07.10 03:30:00 - [421]
 

Any chance of bringing back purple hair? I like my new mohawk, but I would like it SO much more if it was purple.

Pax,
LR

Tam Althor
Posted - 2011.07.10 03:47:00 - [422]
 

Wow these people in Iceland still don't get it, not that you could expect any sound financial thoughts from that place. Was hoping to read this blog and see some sense to the prices, but all I see is CCP trying to milk the players even more. So after seeing what CCP did, I will continue to keep my accounts inactive. I may think about coming back to the game when the people who thought up these prices are fired or thrown into a volcano.

Reed Tiburon
Caldari
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
Posted - 2011.07.10 04:26:00 - [423]
 

Every time since Incarna's release that I've been tempted to resubscribe, CCP has released a devblog to explain why I should not. Thanks CCP.

Lemming Lass
Minmatar
Lemmings Online
Posted - 2011.07.10 05:26:00 - [424]
 

Originally by: Pure Tabasco
I'm starting to think that Incarna its going to be specially made for the Japanese.

1000$ Japanese pants, fully localization, prices for things only a japanese hardcore will buy... OH ****, this expansion its for JAPAN!


I am actually very totally cool with that, let the Japanese groove on all that stuff...as long as I don't HAVE to get out of my pod!

(Yes, I'm going to b*tch and moan about this until this account expires or CCP changes the "must enter CQ even to pick up ammo" requirement.)

Elayae
Gallente
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Posted - 2011.07.10 05:46:00 - [425]
 

Edited by: Elayae on 10/07/2011 05:48:35
The NEX store and it's pricing strategy seems ok except for the tier prices themselves. I understand that the prices were chosen in such a way that it would affect the EVE economy at a minimum, however in this state it will not participate in the economy much at all. As a role player I was happy to see the store for it would give more opportunities for role playing, but at this point I am trying to avoid it for it's a bit immersion breaking.

The NEX store and its contents is in conflict with the vision of EVE. The store does the opposite of what the vision tells us about being an immersive science fiction game. How do I explain new role players in EVE that a small monocle is worth as much as 3-4 orca ships? To make matters worse the station would be rife with criminals that club people down to take the monocle and fly off with a new freighter full of stuff. The fear of messing up the EVE economy with the NEX store is real, however if we divide all NEX prices by 10 it would still not affect the economy much, you have been too cautious with the pricing approach in my opinion.

Jasmina Dunier
Posted - 2011.07.10 05:50:00 - [426]
 

Well i'm starting to get used to this vanity stuff.
But would like something extra to complete this isk sink.
why not make these vanity items subject to wear and tear ?
After a few monthes your boots need a polish (? AUR)
Your skirt rips and you have to put on buttons on your shirt(? AUR)
Your new paint job gets scratched after a battle and needs toutch up (? AUR)
And why not buy direct attribute remap from NeX? EVE changes all the time and so do training requirements.
It's a ***** to wait a year to remap
Oh still against "pay to win".

Florestan Bronstein
24th Imperial Crusade
Posted - 2011.07.10 07:34:00 - [427]
 

Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 10/07/2011 08:04:44

disappointed by this devblog's lack of content

I was under the impression we would get a "Why we chose this pricing strategy" blog not a "This is our pricing strategy" one - if I want to see the prices I just have to look into the NeX.

What I can't see in the NeX is why CCP thinks these prices are justified and economically viable - where are the market research results which convince me that I am just an outlier and that CCP has not gone insane?

I don't really see how it would hurt CCP (or help their competition) if they would give us a short write-up about the expected sales and impact on the in-game economy for at least one high-price and one low-price scenario.

I would also have hoped for some discussion about the future role of discounts, special offerings, sale of whole clothing sets, ...

What is the lifecycle of a typical NeX item? does it just get introduced and then stay available at the same price forever? CCP has to introduce new content continually but will old content be retired? IRL it can be pretty hard to find a piece from last year's collection.
What are CCP's thoughts on competition from the secondary market? Do you expect people to keep old clothes (why?) or dump them on the market once they grow bored of them (and compete with your AUR offerings)?

How does CCP expect to generate a sense for fashion with customers? What will make me want to buy at least 2-3 different outfits per year for eternity? Will clothing collections be "themed"?

In real-life the seasons provide a natural need to maintain ~4x as many sets of clothing as necessary in a fully air-conditioned space station Wink. How are you going to cope with this?

tl;dr Give us some insights into your actual strategy so we can make informed decisions, don't just tell us stuff we can already see by ourselves.
Give us some confidence that the NeX store rests on a solid business plan and is not just another management failure.

Vicious Cell
Amarr
Grim Determination
Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2011.07.10 08:01:00 - [428]
 

I like the female ninja outfit and the sexy secretarial skirts.

Good work CCP!

Matheus Esp
The Corporation of Noble Sentiments
Sleeper Social Club
Posted - 2011.07.10 09:03:00 - [429]
 

Totally, utterly, completely useless BS.

Instead of hiring fashion designers, how about hiring weapon designers? Or game designers that, instead of creating virtual dresses for your barbies, would have some actually interesting ideas for a game that focuses on fighting with spaceships...

I'm paying for EVE online, not the Sims online...

Kandreath
Posted - 2011.07.10 09:44:00 - [430]
 

Hey this sounds like communication! - Nicely done. Keep up the openness and hopefully you'll be rewarded by a more level headed community.

To be honest, I can't see me buying anything extra. My cash is just too tight to spend on virtual stuff. My monthly sub is about all I can justify. I'd be sorely tempted by ship skins but it would be a birthday present, and I'd never ever risk it in battle.

But good luck raising more cash. If it means more, better expansions, then that would be good.



Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Amarr
Posted - 2011.07.10 10:03:00 - [431]
 

As of July 18th my mains' PLEX will expire. I am still thinking about what will I do next, but so far I am testing LOTRO & feeling pretty discouraged about this whole Incarna - CQ - NEx issue. Incarna is turning to be void of content usable to the players who cared more of it -casuals who, like me, have got few time to play this game because we have a job (i.e., we got money but not time... perfect customers if you don't abuse us).

Yet CCP has managed to tell F*** YOU!! to all casual players who hoped for Incarna and prospects look very bleak. I wanted to achieve clothing to justify myself keep throwing time into this hobby. But now I must either rip open my CC (which I won't, as I've got better, REAL, hobbies to spend my money in) or just dismiss the Incarna stuff I want as in no way I am going to grind for months to get it.

And all we got is that CCP is "learning" what should be obvious to anyone who ever ran across a MT system. People rarely spend 70 $ in a bunch of pixels. And EVE players who got 1,3 billion in no way will waste it with "Space Barbies For Carebears".

So, here we are. Incarna is coming, hoorray. But it's not aimed for us casuals who hoped for it, rather aims at the wallet of player who don't give a rat's ass of it and mourn how resources are being used for this rather than their petty nullsec stuff.

And it's very, very discouraging. Why should I keep playing this game? Will you answer me, Fallout, Zinfandel, someone?

Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.07.10 10:06:00 - [432]
 

Edited by: Tippia on 10/07/2011 10:07:46
Originally by: Florestan Bronstein
I was under the impression we would get a "Why we chose this pricing strategy" blog not a "This is our pricing strategy" one - if I want to see the prices I just have to look into the NeX.
Pretty much. This dev blog doesn't do what it sets out to do.

The blog does not present a pricing strategy or explain CCP's approach to pricing; it just presents the prices of current and future items that this untold strategy and approach has generated. The blog kind of promised the process (which is actually interesting), but only presented the end results (which we can see in the store anyway).

There's still no word on why these prices and tiers were chosen. There is no word on what the goal is with the prices (or the NeX, for that matter). Why does the subscription-based EVE have more expensive MT than the MT-based games out there? The only thing we've gleamed is the comment on the first page that making money is not the point and that they don't want to upset the economy. That is the kind of information that is needed, and in absence, we can still only guess why things are the way they are.

Is it the case the the NeX is not an MT store in the sense everyone expects — thus explaining that the prices are not what everyone expects — but that its purpose is rather to slowly bleed the market of PLEX (which, agagin, explains the high prices)?

How much of the pricing is due to technical limitations? Did you want to make expensive items (in ISK terms) which, due to the unfinished state of the store meant that you had to set high AUR prices to get there?

You say you're only dipping your toes, but where is it supposed to lead? With a leisurely soak and scrubbing-off or with a Olympic swimming medal? What is it you're testing here, really? People's willingness to pay at all, or their willingness to pay these kinds of high prices, or their willingness to sacrifice game time for other services, or the market's response to a new kind of sink, or… what, exactly? Basically…
Quote:
Give us some insights into your actual strategy so we can make informed decisions, don't just tell us stuff we can already see by ourselves.
Give us some confidence that the NeX store rests on a solid business plan and is not just another management failure.
…this.

The Offerer
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.07.10 10:24:00 - [433]
 

Originally by: Matheus Esp
Totally, utterly, completely useless BS.

Instead of hiring fashion designers, how about hiring weapon designers? Or game designers that, instead of creating virtual dresses for your barbies, would have some actually interesting ideas for a game that focuses on fighting with spaceships...

I'm paying for EVE online, not the Sims online...


You mean like redesigning turrets?

Gypsy RoseLee
Posted - 2011.07.10 11:51:00 - [434]
 

Thank you for making it very clear you do not want me to resubscribe any of my 3 accounts.

This just proves without a doubt that the developers and lead management of CCP suffer from extreme Dunning-Kruger Effect. The fact that they can't wrap their heads around why there is such a massive rejection of the Nex store can only be explained by the Dunning-Kruger Effect. That or they are the most evil greedy mother fathers I have ever run into in any of the 20+ MMO's I've been a part of.

So which is it CCP Zinfandel, blinding stupidity or ravenous greed?

Xanos Blackpaw
Amarr
Inadeptus Mechanicus
Posted - 2011.07.10 13:50:00 - [435]
 

News at 11, CCP still have no idea what MT mean...

Shaana Mistique
Posted - 2011.07.10 15:13:00 - [436]
 

paying for stuff in a game i have to pay for to play. right..Rolling Eyes I AM still flying spaceships rite ? Maybe you could add some clothes for my ships aswell?? fluffy ships ftw.

Talsha Talamar
Amarr
Nebula Rasa Holdings
Nebula Rasa
Posted - 2011.07.10 16:02:00 - [437]
 

Lets put CCPs pricing in

real money

terms:

~15 Euro - Affordable Tier
>45 Euro - Mid-Tier
>225 Euro - Delux Tier (5 slot a (15 Euro x 3)

>>>225 Euro - Exceptional Tier




Insane.
Ethically wrong and disgusting.





Originally by: ccp

An affordable tier outfit... one PLEX ...
Mid-tier outfits ... 3-4 PLEX ...
Deluxe tier outfits ... two or three times the price of an affordable outfit on a single piece
An exceptional tier ... rare investment for the wealthiest ...



Originally by: CCP

...slots: Footwear, Bottoms, Tops, Outer, and Eyewear...



Originally by: CCP

flamboyantly rich capsuleers ... currencies from Earth.


Spugg Galdon
Posted - 2011.07.10 16:12:00 - [438]
 

/facepalm

Hakaru Ishiwara
Minmatar
Republic Military School
Posted - 2011.07.10 16:21:00 - [439]
 

Originally by: CCP Zinfandel
I've got one pair of "cute high heels" coming in the next month.

The suits and tuxedos and such are being developed as part of our "corporate collection" which is months from now. We are in the "military collection" now. Also coming up is our "cyberpunk collection."

I've seen some amazing sketches from our fashion designer for the cyberpunk collection. I may have to create a female character one of these days.
And this is CCP's vision of a Sci-Fi simulation? Clothing for our physical bodies?

I can't even begin to imagine the amazing things that could have been if CCP had invested their financial and intellectual capital in creative science fiction related aspects of the game.

What. The. ****.

Tarinara
Posted - 2011.07.10 16:58:00 - [440]
 

Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
And it's very, very discouraging. Why should I keep playing this game? Will you answer me, Fallout, Zinfandel, someone?

^^^ This!! How about an answer to this question CCP! What is our motivation to pay you ( yes ... some of us casual care bear, ex nerfed lvl4 mission runner scum pay CCP to play this game... ) to play Sparkle Space Dress-up Barbie?

Mashie Saldana
Minmatar
Veto Corp
Posted - 2011.07.10 17:39:00 - [441]
 

Awesome CCP, Im glad that this pricing structure will save me from ever spending any money on the NeX store. I just spent £90 in World of Tanks, I guess the value for money was a lot better there.

Heavenly Blues
Posted - 2011.07.10 17:53:00 - [442]
 

Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
And it's very, very discouraging. Why should I keep playing this game? Will you answer me, Fallout, Zinfandel, someone?



QFT

Don't hold your breath, they are too busy cooking up **** sandwiches for us to eat.

Personally I won't be playing this game until they remove Mega-Transactions and fix the years old backlog of broken / incomplete features. So I seriously doubt I will ever log in again.

Perpetuum Online is still freakin awesome. A small indie game with developers that haven't had their minds polluted with delusions of corporate imperialism. Funny that a small studio with minimal income can iterate on core gameplay more effectively than a powerhouse with three-hundred thousand subscribers. I guess that is what happens if you develop your flagship product instead of spending the bulk of your resources on marketing and other developmental projects.

CCP: All bark, no bite. I for one think that this is a time where we should watch what they do, rather than what they say.

Ranka Mei
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.10 17:59:00 - [443]
 

I'd pay for Tier 1 clothes. :) The expensive ones, to be precise. I didn't spend 3 attempts at the character creator to make my characters beautiful (ahem), only to deface myself with a plucked-out eye-patch people call 'monocle.' But a fancy outfit, THAT I'd buy!

Kudos for CCP!

P.S. Yay for BiS! (Barbie In Space)

Ranka Mei
Caldari
Posted - 2011.07.10 18:42:00 - [444]
 

Originally by: Ranka Mei
I'd pay for Tier 1 clothes. :) The expensive ones, to be precise. I didn't spend 3 attempts at the character creator to make my characters beautiful (ahem), only to deface myself with a plucked-out eye-patch people call 'monocle.' But a fancy outfit, THAT I'd buy!

Kudos for CCP!

P.S. Yay for BiS! (Barbie In Space)


ADDENDUM: CCP, please make it so that NeX clothes can be previewed thru the regular character customization 'mirror' thingy. Prior to buying them, that is! (Just gray out the 'next' button or something when you're still wearing unpaid for NeX clothes).

Vin Hellsing
Posted - 2011.07.10 21:58:00 - [445]
 

Edited by: Vin Hellsing on 10/07/2011 22:11:24
Originally by: CCP Zinfandel
Any questions?


I think you guys are going to create a disenfranchised element in EVE that will be very upset with you, with this pricing strategy, Zinfandel.

You're telling us that a single item of clothing that looks fantastic and is highly attractive as a piece of clothing, will be effectively $80.

We have roleplayers, good sir, and you are going to be ****ing them off in due time. They are not all rich, either ingame or out. Can you imagine sitting in EVE, playing, and walking around in establishments, as a roleplayer, and you realize that you are basically looking like every other Caldari Deteis, and you want to spice up your character a bit...

...only to find that the average piece of clothing is worth twenty American dollars?

Here's another dynamic you should have accounted for when involving real currency: The average gamer will not place greater precedence on digital currencies, but on real tangible currencies. The result is that ISK holds no real value, because the dominant currency is the American Dollar. Which means if you were to price a single military flannel shirt for the AUR equivalent of one PLEX, you are effectively charging that person $20.

This is the dynamic CCP needs to account for, which they apparently have not. The overall atmosphere and approach I have seen thus far tells me that CCP treats their MMO more as a platform for "hobbyists" that shell out lots of money for things that support their hobby.

The reality is that most hobbyists prefer to have a tangible object in their hands for the $100+ they spend on each purchase. I am a model railroad hobbyist (HO-scale), and I can tell you that it is FAR more gratifying to be paying $450 for a steam locomotive that is a precise replica of a real locomotive - one that you can hold in your hands, run on a train layout, and admire on your fireplace mantletop.

It's not so gratifying when I shell out the equivalent of $20 USD for a pair of affordable-tier 3D-modelled boots, of which I do not actually claim any ownership for because the EULA of EVE expressly states that my account is owned by CCP, not me. Actually, I just feel ripped off.

The reality about your NeX pricing structure, CCP, is that it is hugely flawed in terms of business model. You want to make it all look reasonable, and to me, who survives on barely $800 a month (and has to scrap together money to pay for a 3-month subscription), these prices are an insult.

You are effectively creating a market system that panders to the haves, but does not pander to the have-nots.

Most companies that do DLC and microtransactions know how to price their goods properly so that both the haves and have-nots can participate in the market on equal footing. Sure, the haves will have more stuff, but that's beside the point. The point is giving the have-nots the option to choose what they want to have without starving them to death.

With that said, CCP should have done a study of the real-money income levels of EVE Online's players, and aimed for the greatest common denominator. This isn't rocket science, CCP - if you wanted to "learn", you could have done so without creating a societal divide in EVE Online that pits the haves against the have-nots.

It's called "studying what the other companies do". Learn by example, apply by example. What you're doing right now, CCP, is like throwing crap at the wall to see what sticks - what you don't realize is that the wall itself is the very representation of EVE - a mural if you will - and you're wrecking that mural, making it difficult for certain elements of the playerbase to enjoy the game.

Think on it!

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Amarr
Posted - 2011.07.10 22:07:00 - [446]
 

Originally by: Tarinara
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
And it's very, very discouraging. Why should I keep playing this game? Will you answer me, Fallout, Zinfandel, someone?

^^^ This!! How about an answer to this question CCP! What is our motivation to pay you ( yes ... some of us casual care bear, ex nerfed lvl4 mission runner scum pay CCP to play this game... ) to play Sparkle Space Dress-up Barbie?


Certainly not that they've aimed at our gameplay rather than our credit card... I want to play for those items, not pay for them, as a mean to justify my gameplay.

Vin Hellsing
Posted - 2011.07.10 22:14:00 - [447]
 

Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Originally by: Tarinara
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
And it's very, very discouraging. Why should I keep playing this game? Will you answer me, Fallout, Zinfandel, someone?

^^^ This!! How about an answer to this question CCP! What is our motivation to pay you ( yes ... some of us casual care bear, ex nerfed lvl4 mission runner scum pay CCP to play this game... ) to play Sparkle Space Dress-up Barbie?


Certainly not that they've aimed at our gameplay rather than our credit card... I want to play for those items, not pay for them, as a mean to justify my gameplay.


QFT. CCP should have just thrown out the NeX market and went with player-craftable clothing. That would have gone over a LOT better than this ****storm.

Vin Hellsing
Posted - 2011.07.10 22:25:00 - [448]
 

Edited by: Vin Hellsing on 10/07/2011 22:26:21
P.S. - I thought you Icelanders had more business sense than this. Didn't you have some megabanks managed by some of the most intelligent financial managers in the world? Oh wait, nevermind.

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Amarr
Posted - 2011.07.10 22:31:00 - [449]
 

Originally by: Vin Hellsing
(stuff)


Well, it's hard to judge. The "hobby" approach is what they used at the infamous Fearless pdf, but, who knows what are they thinking? We are left to wonder why would a company undertake such an effort and then spoil it by not attending to their customers. Have you been asked about what would you think it would be the "right" price for NEx? Has the CSM? Has anyone? I guess the answer is "No".

And now they spoiled my hopes for this game. I've been running missions for two years and since I got a marauder -a money-printer in terms of mission running- it's becoming increasingly hard to figure why should I keep grinding to pay for grinding to pay for grinding. I was hopeful that incarna would bring some aditional gameplay for me, but turns it won't (Buying boosters? Bleah. Chasing bootleggers aka PvP in hisec? I fart in your general direction!). Then the NEx entered scanner and was a funny thought. "Why not Space Barbies?", I said myself, and was hopeful about it. But the prices mean I can't play to get them. And they're already getting 30 € each month from me, one way or another.

Mission running no longer cuts it. This main's PLEX expires July 18th. And I no longer find a reason to keep playing this game I like, which means I shall not keep paying for it.

It's very discouraging (well, already said that).

Vin Hellsing
Posted - 2011.07.10 22:53:00 - [450]
 

Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Originally by: Vin Hellsing
(stuff)


Well, it's hard to judge. The "hobby" approach is what they used at the infamous Fearless pdf, but, who knows what are they thinking? We are left to wonder why would a company undertake such an effort and then spoil it by not attending to their customers. Have you been asked about what would you think it would be the "right" price for NEx? Has the CSM? Has anyone? I guess the answer is "No".

And now they spoiled my hopes for this game. I've been running missions for two years and since I got a marauder -a money-printer in terms of mission running- it's becoming increasingly hard to figure why should I keep grinding to pay for grinding to pay for grinding. I was hopeful that incarna would bring some aditional gameplay for me, but turns it won't (Buying boosters? Bleah. Chasing bootleggers aka PvP in hisec? I fart in your general direction!). Then the NEx entered scanner and was a funny thought. "Why not Space Barbies?", I said myself, and was hopeful about it. But the prices mean I can't play to get them. And they're already getting 30 € each month from me, one way or another.

Mission running no longer cuts it. This main's PLEX expires July 18th. And I no longer find a reason to keep playing this game I like, which means I shall not keep paying for it.

It's very discouraging (well, already said that).


I plan on renewing my subscription for one more three-month period. If CCP does not get their act together by the end of that period, I'm finished with EVE.

And I was starting to get into it, too...


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