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Keno Range
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:05:00 - [301]
 

Originally by: SilKKZ the3rd
Edited by: SilKKZ the3rd on 30/06/2011 16:54:13
I am starting to get really annoyed now to be honest. I am sick to death of hearing about how nex this nex that. TBH I couldnt care less about Nex.

I think the more important issues are

1.) CQ is absolute crap, I want to be able to revert to old system
2.) Bug issues being present for over 3 years
3.) Botting and RMT is way more an issue than a damn monecule no matter what it costs
4.) Supercapitals being win button, and way to many titans in the game
5.) Constant game inballance, and nerfs making it worse not better.
6.) Really bad QA
7.) Spending sub money on games we cannot even play unless we own a PS3 (wtf is that about)

I mean the list is endless to be frank. I been playing since 2004 and its been going rapidly downhill for over 2 years. Even if the Nex is all sorted out my subs are still going because this is all just a smoke screen to the bigger problems that await the game in the not to distant future.

Is there any point to a CSM, id prefer to be able to have a conversation with devs myself. How do I know my point is being made in the fashion I wish to make it when 3 of them are goons. Its all madness.


Very true.

TenTon Tommie
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:05:00 - [302]
 

Originally by: ed jeni

lets face it folks eve will stay as it is for the forseeable future.



For the most part, I think this fine. But introducing P2W features is unpalatable. $70 one-eyed Charlie's are very revealing on intent. I don't think anyone really cares about them, its the intent that people are ****ed about. Which is clear, regardless of what counter marketing BS come's out of the CSM "Summit".

This is self-evident in how extraordinarily difficult its been for CCP to say that they will not sell P2W features that are not made in game already. (Obviously there's the whole destruction of the industrial side of Eve, but that's no where in the realm of their conscious, otherwise they would made BPO's for vanity items with a degrading life cycle in order to keep plex sales higher).

So GL Chuck. But I expect nothing out of this but CCP positioning. Cheers.

TTT

AkJon Ferguson
JC Ferguson and Son Ltd
Ferguson Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:05:00 - [303]
 

If you let the other side set the agenda, you've already lost.

Almost nobody cares about NEX pricing. Almost nobody cares whether other racial CQ will be out in 3 months or 6 months or 9 months (or never.)

This CSM sucks. CCP is eating their lunch.

Carli Zandrya
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:06:00 - [304]
 

So many people have already left because of the sense of betrayal. Everything else is just fodder. They might apologize (don't hold your breath) and try to placate the masses, but I don't even think that's sufficient. Silence makes it worse.

When someone cheats on you that pretty much ends the relationship.
Especially when they are smug about it.

IT'S TOO LATE CCP. Good luck with your new player base.

Kira Summer
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:08:00 - [305]
 

Whitehound it seems enough players wanted information from their elected representatives about what concerned them not tweets that totally washed over it all.

With a great deal of cynicism and very little expectation I shall wait for this statement that will be made tomorrow night.

That statement sounded so much like political double talk I think I may be very disappointed but I shall certainly not be surprised at the outcome.

OHU812
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:10:00 - [306]
 

Edited by: OHU812 on 30/06/2011 17:28:25




Actually I think the answer has been given already. The mere fact the CCP&CSM has discussed EVERYTHING but the most important question a lot of us have been waiting for:

I think in the back of our minds who care about the future of EVE know already. Like me, just hope that CCP does an about-face and changes their mind.

I for one will not be in Jita protesting. I'll simply uninstall and take a break. I've not downloaded the client update and won't. I might reload if I ever see a patch that starts like ->:HEY CCP IS SORRY: Here is your station spinning option and we have no intentions of EVER implementing PTW items. <--Possible but the likelyhood of it is as likely as someone giving me 100 billion ISK.

The justification some make of EVE already having MT/PTW per/via plex is moot. A lot of us argued that introducing PLEXs was a bad idea, look where we are today. See the trend?

You want to make more money CCP? May I suggest bringing back ghost training, just add a small fee for access to skill activation on ghost accounts then hike the sub fee for fully activated accounts.

The next move after the above, add content to the game without MT and make it possible for us to manufacture those items.

When was the last time you overhauled the mining process?
When was the last time you gave industry some loving? *Do appreciate the BPO/BPC change.*
When is the last time you've shined up the ships?

(All of which I'm sure have been mentioned.)

Want to rid people of their ISK? Give us access to TII BPOs through the market. Raise taxes for NPC corps again.

Hundreds if not thousands of ways to add to this game. Why choose one you knew would pit the community against one another and CCP? PR STUNT? Calvin Klein Affect?

as for the rest... I guess we'll see what kind of indirect answer you give us tomorrow. I hope I'm wrong but considering CCPs track record I don't expect anything more than smoke and mirrors again. I hope I'm pleasantly surprised, if not, I'll go back to playing a couple of games I've found in the last couple of weeks.

BTW, since CSM has seemed to forgotten the focus for whatever reason (jetlag, free beer, free food, free whatever.) I'm still waiting to hear about

1.) MT-PTW items in EVE? (Yes) (No)
2.) CCP going to give back our old station hangar with ship spinning? (Yes) (No)
3.) Will CCP re-direct some of their efforts/resources back to EVE in an effort to fix bugs, add content. IE: Essentially return the fire EVE once had? (Yes) (No)

Really the only things I care about. Apology would be nice but... I don't want to strain things anymore than what they are now.

Bubbles Udan
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:12:00 - [307]
 

Originally by: Gloria Stitz

Well said, we don't want explanations, we want stuff changed.


You mean you DON'T want anything changed. Currently there is no pay 2 win and people want it to stay that way :P

killmc
Gallente
Navajo commandos
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:12:00 - [308]
 

time go back to rioting i thank ccp/csm's

vasuul
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:14:00 - [309]
 

Originally by: Amar Azaph


1. Who owns these forums?
2. Do members of the EVE community post on there forums ?
3. Do members of the EVE community who have various issues with aspects of EVE game play/developments post their opinions on these forums ?
4. Do members of CCP read/monitor these forums?
5. Do members of CCP post comments on these forums ? in other words,do they interact with the members of the EVE community?
6. What value add does the CSM bring to the table in terms of making this process more effective and efficient?


1. CCP
2. yes including all the rage and anger posts I would have to say the forums get used
3. yes including the off the wall stuff
4. they should be
5. they were doing a **** poor job of it hence the rage
6. When you are being ignored cause you are angry its good to have an intermediary , face time is better than typing a forum post especially when no one is answering ,more can be done faster, in a face to face meeting especially when the **** hits the fan.
just my opinion

Riddick Liddell
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:14:00 - [310]
 

Why do I need a CSM?
My name is on the Credit card.
CSM Edwin says you bought a bull and that aint milk.

Jimmy Duce
Chaotic Tranquility
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:16:00 - [311]
 

You know, if you didn't understand how to answer the simple question you could have asked... I don't even have the energy to undock anymore, and I don't even have the energy to resub... Why are you being so difficult CCP...


Quote:

Are you moving beyond VANITY AUR items?






Greed, is so distructive...




This question is for Eve and Eve only, I don't care if I can buy gold ammo for DUST players, as long as that isn't implemented in Eve we are cool. Hell use your legal team to come up with the answer specifying that other games that influence Eve may have gold ammo but Eve itself never will.

Luckytania
Gallente
Bullets of Justice
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:19:00 - [312]
 

Originally by: killmc
time go back to rioting i thank ccp/csm's

Nah. Been there, done that. It achieved all that it could. (Which was not insignificant.)

If tomorrow's 'joint statement' is inadequate, then my play time will be limited to what's left on the accounts and my attitude towards the game will be:

"Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn."

Psychlo
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:21:00 - [313]
 

So a whole day of meeting. . .and absolutley nothing of substance reported. . . .

EXCELLENT!

Bubbles Udan
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:23:00 - [314]
 

Originally by: Luckytania
Originally by: killmc
time go back to rioting i thank ccp/csm's

Nah. Been there, done that. It achieved all that it could. (Which was not insignificant.)

If tomorrow's 'joint statement' is inadequate, then my play time will be limited to what's left on the accounts and my attitude towards the game will be:

"Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn."


What would be adequate for you? Nothing I assume.

Based off the vibe from the tweets so far, there is indication that nothing game changing will be able to be purchased for cash. Even if that is the statement, there will still be doubters and butthurt.

The reasonable thing for the players to do is put a plug in it and just enjoy the game until such a time that game breaking items are actually introduced.

Sellendis
Caldari
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:23:00 - [315]
 

As usual, they said nothing on questions we asked.
NON-vanity stuff, hangar view. They just got a lesson in eve economy from people that dont know **** about it.

Pure Tabasco
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:26:00 - [316]
 

Originally by: OHU812
Edited by: OHU812 on 30/06/2011 17:17:22
I for one still waiting to hear about

1.) MT-PTW items in EVE ever? Yes No
2.) CCP going to give back our old station hangar with ship spinning? Yes No
3.) Will CCP re-direct some of their efforts/resources back to EVE in an effort to fix bugs, add content. IE: Essentially return the fire of enthusiasm EVE once had. Yes No

Really the only things I care about. Apology would be nice but don't want to push too much.


The 1M$ questions. If they are not responded soon then....
I will follow this pic: Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.

Elaine Eza
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:29:00 - [317]
 

Svennig
EVE_Svennig Svennig
@
@Trebor_CSM Just out of interest - will there be just the statement, or will there be full minutes of these meetings?

Robert Woodhead
@Trebor_CSM Robert Woodhead
@EVE_Svennig Unclear if formal minutes needed. Joint statement + clarifications in forums may be enough #tweetfleet #csm6

Shocked

Luckytania
Gallente
Bullets of Justice
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:29:00 - [318]
 

Originally by: Bubbles Udan
Originally by: Luckytania
Originally by: killmc
time go back to rioting i thank ccp/csm's

Nah. Been there, done that. It achieved all that it could. (Which was not insignificant.)

If tomorrow's 'joint statement' is inadequate, then my play time will be limited to what's left on the accounts and my attitude towards the game will be:

"Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn."


What would be adequate for you? Nothing I assume.

Based off the vibe from the tweets so far, there is indication that nothing game changing will be able to be purchased for cash. Even if that is the statement, there will still be doubters and butthurt.

The reasonable thing for the players to do is put a plug in it and just enjoy the game until such a time that game breaking items are actually introduced.


You are free, of course, to assume, anything you like.

Your last sentence is "reasonable" for people who play a day to day, near FPS like, style of Eve. I make plans which take months to reach fruition. Without some confidence of the future, it is not "reasonable" to strive to achieve goals more substantial than "what can I shoot today".

I can hope that the tweet I quoted was merely poorly phrased. We'll see in a day or so.

Whitehound
The Whitehound Corporation
Frontline Assembly Point
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:30:00 - [319]
 

Edited by: Whitehound on 30/06/2011 17:31:45
Originally by: Kira Summer
Whitehound it seems enough players wanted information from their elected representatives about what concerned them not tweets that totally washed over it all.

And it is wrong. It is "High-Noon in Iceland" and not election time. The CSMs need to stop responding to individual players and players need to stop begging them for answers. The CSMs are our heros. If it was not for them then who would be talking to CCP for us? Let the CSMs do their jobs. We judge them by their success at the end of it, not by the scraps of answers we manage to claw out of them.

BtodaC
24th Imperial Crusade
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:30:00 - [320]
 

Originally by: Psychlo
So a whole day of meeting. . .and absolutley nothing of substance reported. . . .

EXCELLENT!


CCP and the CSM have stated that the announcement will come after the two days of meetings, not during.
Calm down and get some patience, maybe you will be able to buy some in the NEX store soon!!! Laughing

Alejan Gerakh
Minmatar
Clan Hyena
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:32:00 - [321]
 

Originally by: Bubbles Udan
What would be adequate for you? Nothing I assume.

Based off the vibe from the tweets so far, there is indication that nothing game changing will be able to be purchased for cash. Even if that is the statement, there will still be doubters and butthurt.

The reasonable thing for the players to do is put a plug in it and just enjoy the game until such a time that game breaking items are actually introduced.

This is what I figure, too. People who are raging probably won't be placated, even if they do hear what they want to hear- and this may, in fact, have been something CCP was afraid of to warrant bringing in the CSM. Explain situations more effectively than in devBlogs or forum posts, hash things out more organically face-to-face. Because, in all likelihood, this is just as much about trying to explain the Fearless newsletter and the Hilmar email in relation to everything as it is deciding or telling the players that they aren't going to offer non-vanity items. Because, let's face it, there WILL be doubt even if they say it, in a number of corners of the game community, and they probably want to qualify that answer as thoroughly as possible so the CSM knows they are sincere about the stance, and, in turn, the CSM can relay that sincerity to us.

Either that or they are bull$#!tting and stalling. But that's hopefully to be revealed tomorrow.

Renan Ruivo
Hipernova
Vera Cruz Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:35:00 - [322]
 

Originally by: Whitehound
Edited by: Whitehound on 30/06/2011 17:31:45
Originally by: Kira Summer
Whitehound it seems enough players wanted information from their elected representatives about what concerned them not tweets that totally washed over it all.

And it is wrong. It is "High-Noon in Iceland" and not election time. The CSMs need to stop responding to individual players and players need to stop begging them for answers. The CSMs are our heros. If it was not for them then who would be talking to CCP for us? Let the CSMs do their jobs. We judge them by their success at the end of it, not by the scraps of answers we manage to claw out of them.

Luckytania
Gallente
Bullets of Justice
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:35:00 - [323]
 

Originally by: Alejan Gerakh
... People who are raging ...


If you scan my posts I think you'll see I can't be placed in the same category as Milla. :)

Amar Azaph
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:36:00 - [324]
 

Originally by: vasuul
Originally by: Amar Azaph


1. Who owns these forums?
2. Do members of the EVE community post on there forums ?
3. Do members of the EVE community who have various issues with aspects of EVE game play/developments post their opinions on these forums ?
4. Do members of CCP read/monitor these forums?
5. Do members of CCP post comments on these forums ? in other words,do they interact with the members of the EVE community?
6. What value add does the CSM bring to the table in terms of making this process more effective and efficient?


1. CCP
2. yes including all the rage and anger posts I would have to say the forums get used
3. yes including the off the wall stuff
4. they should be
5. they were doing a **** poor job of it hence the rage
6. When you are being ignored cause you are angry its good to have an intermediary , face time is better than typing a forum post especially when no one is answering ,more can be done faster, in a face to face meeting especially when the **** hits the fan.
just my opinion


Quick question, Given that some/most of the meeting is covered by a near worthless NDA, then how is bringing 4/5 people who play EVE to Iceland helping the community if they can't discuss any of it public ? In other words, why discuss sensitive issues when they can't become public knowledge to the broader community ? All this will do is generate more vague/generic comments leading to greater level of player frustration surely?
Why not have a webcast or podcast ? discuss players concerns in full and in public with no need for any release of sensitive information ?

Mater Dolorosa
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:37:00 - [325]
 

I am relieved ! NEX pricing and Amarr/Caldari CQ were the main issues...

Thank you dear CSM members, glad you saved my player's life...

Bubbles Udan
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:40:00 - [326]
 

Originally by: Luckytania

Your last sentence is "reasonable" for people who play a day to day, near FPS like, style of Eve. I make plans which take months to reach fruition. Without some confidence of the future, it is not "reasonable" to strive to achieve goals more substantial than "what can I shoot today".



I have plans too and I really don't care what CCP or anyone says right now. If the game is fun I will play and if it is not fun I will not play. At the end of the day CCP can swear up and down they won't implement p2w, then turn around do it anyway. It won't be any skin off my back because there are plenty of other games out there to play :P Furthermore the game engine I have spent the last few years working on could be retooled for an eve like game, though the code is ps3 only :(

I guess it all boils down to different philosophies of play. I say enjoy the game while it lasts, one way or another it will not last forever. I don't see why people are so invested emotionally into something they have no control over at the end of the day :P Even if CCP does everything right in EVE they may still crumble financially because of WoD.

Lord of cocksuckers
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:40:00 - [327]
 

Originally by: Keno Range
Originally by: SilKKZ the3rd
Edited by: SilKKZ the3rd on 30/06/2011 16:54:13
I am starting to get really annoyed now to be honest. I am sick to death of hearing about how nex this nex that. TBH I couldnt care less about Nex.

I think the more important issues are

1.) CQ is absolute crap, I want to be able to revert to old system
2.) Bug issues being present for over 3 years
3.) Botting and RMT is way more an issue than a damn monecule no matter what it costs
4.) Supercapitals being win button, and way to many titans in the game
5.) Constant game inballance, and nerfs making it worse not better.
6.) Really bad QA
7.) Spending sub money on games we cannot even play unless we own a PS3 (wtf is that about)

I mean the list is endless to be frank. I been playing since 2004 and its been going rapidly downhill for over 2 years. Even if the Nex is all sorted out my subs are still going because this is all just a smoke screen to the bigger problems that await the game in the not to distant future.

Is there any point to a CSM, id prefer to be able to have a conversation with devs myself. How do I know my point is being made in the fashion I wish to make it when 3 of them are goons. Its all madness.


Very true.


id go along with this.

i couldnt give 2 fu cks what the price of **** in that store cost. ITS NOT IMPORTANT.

CQ should be optional. dock to old view, hit button LEAVE SHIP, enter CQ
No MT for none vanity items

how hard is that ffs

Alejan Gerakh
Minmatar
Clan Hyena
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:41:00 - [328]
 

Originally by: Amar Azaph
Quick question, Given that some/most of the meeting is covered by a near worthless NDA, then how is bringing 4/5 people who play EVE to Iceland helping the community if they can't discuss any of it public ? In other words, why discuss sensitive issues when they can't become public knowledge to the broader community ? All this will do is generate more vague/generic comments leading to greater level of player frustration surely?
Why not have a webcast or podcast ? discuss players concerns in full and in public with no need for any release of sensitive information ?

It's actually 9 people, isn't it? Or did half of them not go?

raker
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:43:00 - [329]
 

Edited by: raker on 30/06/2011 17:46:46
Originally by: Bomberlocks


This is the lipstick on a pig moment


LMFAO Laughing

You might be nearer to the the truth than you think with that comment

Enuen Ravenseye
Malevolence.
Posted - 2011.06.30 17:45:00 - [330]
 

Originally by: Whitehound
The CSMs are our heros.


Wrong - they had the opportunity to become heroes, and blew it.

The price of items in the NeX was a major concern for some people (not me) and the brunt of jokes across the gaming media outlets. It was something the CSM should have fought for ... you know, like a hero would fight. Instead we get a tweet saying that the CSM is "less butthurt" about the pricing structure because CCP "explained" the situation to them. In other words, CCP said, "We're keeping the prices as they stand now, or you won't get any more freebies" and the CSM, between sips of kool-aid, said, "Yes, sir!"

If that's your idea of a hero, then you have some seriously ****ing low expectations.


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