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Annie Anomie
Shadows Of The Federation
Posted - 2011.06.26 22:45:00 - [811]
 

Better.

RougeOperator
Posted - 2011.06.26 22:46:00 - [812]
 

Originally by: Roosterton
This is finally good to hear. Anyone who's nitpicking on the "golden ammo" wording is now just clamoring for attention and unwilling to drop the "ccp sucks" bandwagon.



You miss the part about EVOLVING, or something.

Van Muchbetterer
Minmatar
EVE University
Posted - 2011.06.26 22:47:00 - [813]
 

Please let's not forget about the fact that while it offers alot for new palyers, incarna adds almost nothing to the older playerbase. I'm playing only for about 2-3 month, but this expansion does not give me anything new to do.

Ranita Drell
Intaki Liberation Front
Posted - 2011.06.26 22:47:00 - [814]
 

Edited by: Ranita Drell on 26/06/2011 23:24:02
The problem with MT should already be clear. The question of whether or not MTs will compromise the quality of EVE Online has already been answered.

CQ is being force-fed to players so we have a reason to buy vanity goods through NEX. CQ is more demanding and less functional than the hangar view that it replaces. The conclusion that I have a hard time escaping is that CCP is adopting the view that sacrificing the quality of the game is acceptable if it improves the odds that they'll sell greater quantities of virtual clothes and monocles.

If the door is left open for MT for convenience features or other things that offer an in-game advantage, or circumvention of the player-driven economy, then you can expect the design mentality in evidence with Incarna to be embraced in ways that will cause overall quality of the game to continue to decline, probably at a much-accelerated rate.

This is a strategy that ultimately turns the developers against any player that isn't happy to keep opening his wallet (above and beyond his subscription payment) for a better (or even status quo) gaming experience. Put a limit on ship fitting, then charge players to get it back. Hide other entities' faction standings to make faction grinding a more opaque process with fewer viable options available through the sandbox, then let people to pay CCP money to remove that inconvenience as well.

Existing failings, flaws and inconveniences in the game can also be shamelessly exploited: Pay aurum to make POS management less of a hassle. Pay aurum to buy an Advanced Informoph Psychology skill manual. Pay aurum for WTZ autopiloting.

Then you pay for access to better or easier access to ships, modules and ammo. If these options end up generating any kind of significant revenue for CCP, it's hard to believe that they wouldn't be having a significant impact on the events that are unfolding in the game and, that the competitive playing field will have been shifted and the player-driven economy will have been corrupted in ways that have significant consequences for most or all players.

There's no reason for players who love EVE for what it has traditionally been to accept any of this, unless CCP is in such dire financial straits that this is the only possible option that allows EVE to exist in any form, and thereby preserve any shred of the game's essence. And if this is the case, CCP shouldn't be shy about embracing what it needs to do, and should stop denying that there are plans to embrace MT and start working to bring the plans to fruition ... unless they're trying to trick us, trying to change EVE before our eyes without our noticing, trying to string us along, which frankly is the impression I'm getting (and is the impression conveyed in Fearless newsletter, Zulu's objections about "context" notwithstanding -- remember, Arnar, we don't trust you, and you're still being cagey). Either way it makes sense to simply quit now, and hope it sends a message and that CCP is in a position to act on that message.

Laendra
Universalis Imperium
Posted - 2011.06.26 22:53:00 - [815]
 

Why is a CSM visit required to understand that we don't ****ing want non-vanity RMT?

Teako
Posted - 2011.06.26 22:54:00 - [816]
 

Thanks for a whole bunch of nothing again P Zulu. Trying to play the waiting game again. You did ZERO in your blog. It was a pure spin of NOTHING. You couldnt even say SORRY for what P have done.

Mos7Wan7ed
Gallente
Dirt-Nap Ship Yards
Posted - 2011.06.26 22:54:00 - [817]
 

I expect the CSM to help get to the bottom it. Its time for CCP to bear it all to CSM and let the CSM decide of CCP has gone off the rails with MT or just needs to be tweaked.

Solomunio Kzenig
Amarr
Indicium Technologies
Hephaestus Forge Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.26 22:55:00 - [818]
 

Originally by: Narcissus Tombs
Edited by: Narcissus Tombs on 26/06/2011 19:22:01
Edited by: Narcissus Tombs on 26/06/2011 18:40:27
So far you're pulling it right out of the PR handbook.

I'll just leave this here Linkage

Edit: And this lovely link tallying 4482 unsubbed accounts so far.

What you seem to be missing, Zulu, is that even thought the future of MT is the biggest rage issue here, it's just a symptom of the dissatisfaction and dissapointmend we've felt with you, CCP as a whole, for a while now. I am not trying to attack anyone at CCP, just convey my dissatisfaction and sadness, and what my view of CCP has degraded to.

This is not speculation, but quite well known now, that you are using Eve as a cash cow and forced alpha test for your new projects, both of which are progressing at a rate beyond slow and sucking money and resources out of your flagship product.

What is worse, you simply don't care about the game anymore. Investors and aesthetics come before gameplay. This is something you've been saying internally, and now that it's out there you send PR meatshields to delay things until they cool down.
"If it looks good, it is good." Sound familiar? Because apparently it's said quite a bit around the CCP offices.

The fact is, you simply don't have a vision for Eve.

You have been flying by the seat of your pants for who knows how long, adding features on a whim and wasting colossal amounts of time and money on things players often don't want.

You are forcing unwanted content on us simply to gain free alpha testing for your next game.

You can't take negative criticism.

You ignore the playerbase that made you great.

You have a rockstar mentality that is completely unwarranted.

You are trying to push a niche game into the a mainstream market.

You lack professionalism.

You have no internal editing, or any that we can see, because of your childish dislike of negative criticism.

You release untested, half-baked expansions.

You ignore the mountains of information and suggestions and criticism your players give you to improve it.

You have ruined your image with new players. As seen here.

You push what you want, not what we want.

This is a service, if people dislike it, they'll stop paying for it.

You have been buying your own PR more than your players.

You have ignored the high-maintenance requirements for a game like Eve, instead adding more content itself in need of editing.

You set unrealistic goals, internally and externally, that you know you can't meet, but hype anyway.

You have yet to give a straight answer about non-vanity items. We don't want cute remarks or metaphors or comparisons or synecdoches, we want a YES OR NO ANSWER.

You assume stupidity on the part of your players, and it's just insulting. The average age of eve players is 29, if I recall correctly. Many are older, and none of them are going to fall for delay tactics and PR spin.

And most importantly, lost the love you once had for your universe.

Most of this post comes from a review by one of your own employees, linked here.



I love CCP and I love Eve, but now that you have other projects in the works, it seems like you have simply dropped the idea of improving Eve entirely, and for this reason, I have unsubbed, along with more than 4000 other accounts. I honestly hope you can set a worthwhile vision for Eve, and follow it, because without that, the game is going to start decaying. I am not being fanatical or defeatist, this is simply what is going to happen, and has happened to many other MMOs.

Best of Luck, and I hope Eve gets the attention and care it deserves.

Dan Estrellas Amigo
Posted - 2011.06.26 22:55:00 - [819]
 

Edited by: Dan Estrellas Amigo on 26/06/2011 23:02:26
Edited by: Dan Estrellas Amigo on 26/06/2011 23:01:30
Edited by: Dan Estrellas Amigo on 26/06/2011 23:01:12
Edited by: Dan Estrellas Amigo on 26/06/2011 22:59:34
For the moment I am happy with that dev blog release. Not content but quelled.

Like others I hold skepticism that the reference to "golden ammo" is a very literal reference and not a metaphor for P2W as a concept. But for now I can wait a few more days. Not many more, but a few more.

I'm bummed that in my home forum, so far FIVE people have joined Eve because of my encouragement and literally in that week this has come up. I would not enjoy having to turn around to those guys and tell them they've just signed up for a game with P2W on the way.

The truth is that P2W does damage a game. In terms of gameplay, P2W does damage a game. A debate around this point could be entered into but for now I'll state it as assumed and based on that, move to my next point:

CCP, you are going to have to make choices about the integrity of Eve's gameplay, and profit margins.

It's your business; you can do what you want. Players might be disappointed by things that happen to Eve but that is not a burden that you (CCP) owe us, only something for you to consider. It's your game, your product.

And money talks very loudly; can't be denied, so it really does come down to this: If P2W is demonstrably going to create more profits than the way things are now, is there even a decision here?

  • Is this a question of: "How fair to the game would such a change be?"

  • Or is it truly business: "Would P2W MT improve profits?"



If it's the latter then like I said, it's your business and your call. It doesn't matter what anyone does; the statistics and economists will be the deciders.

I am writing this to throw out there the notion that it might be the former. I am wondering if CCP really might be willing to consider the value of their game, as a game. As a piece of fun. And perhaps give that enough significance and value to decide that maybe no, damaging the gameplay for a better profit isn't a great choice, isn't something to be proud of; there has to be a better way.

Because with Eve, CCP has a lot to be really proud of from a gamer's perspective.

What other game has aged so well to still look impressive and occasionally beautiful 8 years on?
What other game has such an incredible market?
What other game has such a mature moral code as to allow such serious metagaming to occur?
What other game has so much complexity in its offering of internet spaceships and toys for internet spaceships? Entire websites and communities exist out there that focus solely on fitting your internet spaceship.


EVE is like a behemoth that stands above in the gaming industry, for reasons based on gameplay. It's the big daddy of a lot of things, based on gameplay.

Implementing P2W will significantly damage that. So I hope it really might be the former of those two possibilities I mentioned above. That the value of Eve as a game really does hold some weight against the value of Eve as a product. I know money speaks louder than anything, but sometimes, some developers out there really are genuinely impressive and loved by their games' fans.




PS. I hope you also discuss the optional CQ issue. We sorely miss an alternative to CQ that is visually appealing but not GPU-intense. Ie, ship hangar with 'Leave Pod' option.

PPS. Bring back the real Aura.

Galenea Moreau
Galactic Operations
Posted - 2011.06.26 22:59:00 - [820]
 

So I basically just typed up a 4000 character rant about betrayal of player trust but I can't post it. As much as I want to I love the game too much and after 6 years I still do.

I have one request . Listen to the players, for gods sake listen to them and fix it, but don't wait too long.


Talsha Talamar
Amarr
Nebula Rasa Holdings
Nebula Rasa
Posted - 2011.06.26 22:59:00 - [821]
 

Edited by: Talsha Talamar on 26/06/2011 23:01:24

I appreciate this blog.
Calling in the CSM is an appropriate response to this crisis.
If the resulting negotiations, are open, transparent and meaningfull,
then they will be a first step in regaining our trust.

Points that I personally see as central:

CPP should commit to
  • keep the sandbox free of pay2win contaminations.

  • open up the Incarna Content to all your subscribers.
    Our money financed its development.
    We have a right to this content.
    Hell we want to enjoy this content.

  • the fact that eve is a game about spaceships.
    That content needs to be developed along Incarna, not after it.


Personally I find RMT disgusting.
Nevertheless I can respect that strategic decision,
if you make the aforementioned commitments.

Keep the Macro-Transcactions for the financially insane and
give the rest of us financially responsible micro-transactions.

If the last days have shown anything then it is this:

We love EVE.

But they have also show how quickly
love can turn into hate
if spoiled.

This is your chance to do it right CCP.
Please do not fail us,
this time or ever after.

Lira Reib
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:00:00 - [822]
 

Edited by: Lira Reib on 26/06/2011 23:24:03
I can tell you that this is one of the moments where we look at what CCP does and less of what they say.

Quote:
mutual trust and respect


We don't have that. You broke it by lying and now we can't trust anything you say.

Ooh, you're going to talk to the CSM? Like you did when they warned you about the ****storm that was coming? Good job. It makes me feel a lot better that my elected representatives will get to be ignored to their faces.


Trust is something you build, and over the last 18 months you have exhausted what you had. I used to like CCP, but now I am actively hostile toward them. My suspicion is almost zero that you will either listen to the CSM or stop ****ing us over, but I'll tell you what: If something positive actually happens, I'll consider leaving one or two of my accounts active. Trust and respect probably aren't in the cards; they aren't easy to rebuild once you've ****ed them away.

Shintai
Gallente
Arx Io Orbital Factories
Arx Io
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:01:00 - [823]
 

Originally by: Solomunio Kzenig
Originally by: Narcissus Tombs
Edited by: Narcissus Tombs on 26/06/2011 19:22:01
Edited by: Narcissus Tombs on 26/06/2011 18:40:27
So far you're pulling it right out of the PR handbook.

I'll just leave this here Linkage

Edit: And this lovely link tallying 4482 unsubbed accounts so far.

What you seem to be missing, Zulu, is that even thought the future of MT is the biggest rage issue here, it's just a symptom of the dissatisfaction and dissapointmend we've felt with you, CCP as a whole, for a while now. I am not trying to attack anyone at CCP, just convey my dissatisfaction and sadness, and what my view of CCP has degraded to.

This is not speculation, but quite well known now, that you are using Eve as a cash cow and forced alpha test for your new projects, both of which are progressing at a rate beyond slow and sucking money and resources out of your flagship product.

What is worse, you simply don't care about the game anymore. Investors and aesthetics come before gameplay. This is something you've been saying internally, and now that it's out there you send PR meatshields to delay things until they cool down.
"If it looks good, it is good." Sound familiar? Because apparently it's said quite a bit around the CCP offices.

The fact is, you simply don't have a vision for Eve.

You have been flying by the seat of your pants for who knows how long, adding features on a whim and wasting colossal amounts of time and money on things players often don't want.

You are forcing unwanted content on us simply to gain free alpha testing for your next game.

You can't take negative criticism.

You ignore the playerbase that made you great.

You have a rockstar mentality that is completely unwarranted.

You are trying to push a niche game into the a mainstream market.

You lack professionalism.

You have no internal editing, or any that we can see, because of your childish dislike of negative criticism.

You release untested, half-baked expansions.

You ignore the mountains of information and suggestions and criticism your players give you to improve it.

You have ruined your image with new players. As seen here.

You push what you want, not what we want.

This is a service, if people dislike it, they'll stop paying for it.

You have been buying your own PR more than your players.

You have ignored the high-maintenance requirements for a game like Eve, instead adding more content itself in need of editing.

You set unrealistic goals, internally and externally, that you know you can't meet, but hype anyway.

You have yet to give a straight answer about non-vanity items. We don't want cute remarks or metaphors or comparisons or synecdoches, we want a YES OR NO ANSWER.

You assume stupidity on the part of your players, and it's just insulting. The average age of eve players is 29, if I recall correctly. Many are older, and none of them are going to fall for delay tactics and PR spin.

And most importantly, lost the love you once had for your universe.

Most of this post comes from a review by one of your own employees, linked here.



I love CCP and I love Eve, but now that you have other projects in the works, it seems like you have simply dropped the idea of improving Eve entirely, and for this reason, I have unsubbed, along with more than 4000 other accounts. I honestly hope you can set a worthwhile vision for Eve, and follow it, because without that, the game is going to start decaying. I am not being fanatical or defeatist, this is simply what is going to happen, and has happened to many other MMOs.

Best of Luck, and I hope Eve gets the attention and care it deserves.


Kaos Supreme
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:02:00 - [824]
 

"Therefore we have asked the CSM to join us in Iceland for an extraordinary meeting June 30th and July 1st to discuss the events of past week, to help us define and address the real underlying concerns, and to assist us in defining and iterating on our virtual goods strategy....."


Concerns?! How's this for starters >

NO MICRO-TRANSACTIONS FOR NON VANITY ITEMS!

FIX THE ****IN LAG SO THAT MAJOR ALLIANCES CAN COMPETE FOR CONTROL OF REGIONS AND THE RESOURCES WITHIN(As advertised) SO THAT STRATEGY & TEAMWORK DETERMINES THE OUTCOME NOT LAG!

NULL SEC AND MOON RESOURCES NEEDS A MAJOR OVERHAUL!

DESTROY ONCE AND FOR ALL THE ABILITY TO RUN BOTS / MACROS!

Algathas
Minmatar
The Revenge of Auntie Freeze
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:03:00 - [825]
 

Originally by: Flesh Slurper
Very disappointing. So we already pay you a fee per month for this game and its features, and now you want us to pay you again on top of that.

Not to mention that clothes will cost more than a whole ship. If an article of clothing costs more isk than even an executioner it will be laughable at best.

And for those who think that it will give more $ to develop the things in eve we have been wanting think again. The $ will only fund devs to make more of this utter crap instead of fixing / adding core features to the game. Why should they update and add things for "free" when they can **** you for more cash by making clothes with their time. This is already evident with the last updates. Nerf this, screw that, bunch of updates with little thought or effort put into them, while their devs are spending time proudly making clothes to sell.

If they really wanted to make clothes a great system, they would make a way to manufacture them with patterns, PI textiles, dyes, etc. The same with painting your ship - paints could be manufactured, industrialists could paint ships, etc. Instead were left with disappointment.

Alexis Sachs
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:05:00 - [826]
 

Ok, talking to the CSM is a good idea. I also appreciate the fact you choose your words a bit more carefully. Good to know you figured out we were unhappy folks - and that when folks are unhappy, words matter.

I'm still not sure where you all stand on non-vanity. It appears that maybe your gold ammo comment is meant to mean non-vanity. That wasn't a particularly clear sentence. We are all hoping that you in fact mean: that you will not sell pay to win items items that change what EVE is.

If people want to waste cash on monocles that offer nothing but pixels on their avatar - fine. More power to them and I can't say I particularly care. But if you ever do sell items that offer a tangible, real advantage in terms of game play - the spaceships in space part of EVE - then I and many of us are DONE. See, you, at the end of the day, need to be that clear. This is the answer we want to know, finally, unambiguously. If the answer is "no, we will not" then I'll stick around. If it is "actually, yeah, we do want to sell you gold ammo" then fine. It's your company, you make the game, but I'll not be playing it.

I guess what I'm saying is that while you all think EVE in time will become more than spaceships in space, please don't forget about the spaceships in space part. Vanity avatars may become serious business for the people that like that. But to some of us, it's the spaceships in space part that is serious business.

Overall, I'm not sure you did much with this blog. I will say I'm stunned, STUNNED, that it came out today and not tomorrow. You do get my credit for doing this on a weekend as this situation is in fact important enough to not wait until Monday. I can also understand that you don't want to comment further until after the emergency CSM meeting. It's not that far off. But you all at CCP can not take 5 days (or some other lengthy period) AFTER it finishes to get information out to us. If the meeting is on the 30th of June and the 1st of July - we're gonna need and want you to have a statement out regarding this meeting on July 2.

And frankly, that shouldn't be too difficult. If folks like Fallout, Manifest, and Pann (using her as example of community liaison, we know of her situation and many of us offer our hopes for her daughter) are doing their jobs of passing along our thoughts as expressed here and elsewhere (we know someone is paying attention) then when you talk to the CSM their input shouldn't be shocking to hear. Can you all really claim to NOT know what has us riled up? I didn't think so.

Lastly - while I think the CSM has a handle on the other concerns besides pay to win gold ammo (as ANYONE would if simply paying marginal attention to this whole situation) please do not fail to simply answer other questions. At the end of the day, I may not like your answers, but not being told anything can be worse at times. I just want to know, from you, CCP, if I should keep playing. Your answers will tell me that. If I don't like what I hear, fair play, I can move on. And I think I got to rambling here at the end, I'm tired from all this.

Ispai Ponue
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:09:00 - [827]
 

Apologies are no good to us. Still, thanks for admitting it.

OK, that just makes the whole thing sound like a bunch of twunts testiculating. If apologies are no good to "us" then why even bother trying to appease "us"? Now, "**** you guys," seems like a measured and reasonable response.


Once again,
Please repeat after me: "There will never be non-vanity MT's in Eve Online".


The problem with them saying something like that is two fold:

1. How can anyone say "never", especially a business that has to follow where the market leads? The best honest answer anyone can give to something like that is that they have no plans to ever do such a thing, and that's what we've been given. If that's not enough for you then what you're really asking is to be lied to.

2. They already do sell items for real $$ that amount to game enhancing items that can only be had this way. If you buy an EvE Online box you get this plugin that lasts for 30 days and gives you +3 to all your attributes. It cannot be transferred to any other character but the first new character you create on the account the box is used to register.

So there it is. They've done it in at least some degree. A friend of mine I just got into EvE a little while ago bought like 3 of these things. It's not much of an enhancement, and it is far from permanent, but it is an item in the game that you can't buy with ISK, only with real money. Unlike the shuttle that came in the previous one, this item actually has consequences and works as a "convenience" item.

I personally am not at all bothered by this thing but it does mean that if they where to tell me that they'll never sell P2W or conveniences in-game for real $$ I'd have to conclude that they're liars because they already have.

Cadela Fria
Amarr
x13
Raiden.
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:09:00 - [828]
 

Edited by: Cadela Fria on 26/06/2011 23:12:36
Edited by: Cadela Fria on 26/06/2011 23:11:46

Originally by: Kah Niel

i call damage control x2 lol, ohh no things are going wrong! lets call csm to iceland itl buy us a few days! when they get here we can then try to convince them they should speak our case and try to get people to spend tons of money on aurum!
i meen ccp... u seen the logs from jita rens and everywere els, i do belive alot of people have been spaming something close to "NO MT IN EVE" is it realy that hard to missunderstand?



I call conspiracy theory nut on you. Really? Where do you get your information from? You don't know what will be said and neither do I. Remember the CSM are our representatives, and if you think they're so fickle and easy to brainwash, then why aren't you running for CSM if you're so much better instead of this armchair cleverness.
Its so easy to whine, but until you stand behind your words and do something about it, its just whining.


EDIT: You *WANT* there to be a conspiracy, you're not content to get an answer that dismissed this conspiracy. No matter what they're saying and doing its all just a cover for what they're "REALLY" planning to do.

secondproto
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:11:00 - [829]
 

I can actually, for one, understand Zulu's participation in an emotional outburst.
The thing is, EVE is not only a baby to its subscriber base, but also to its developers.

This week's events have stirred up a hornets' nest and there is no denying that it did unrepairable damage to CCP and EVE Online's subscriber base.
Yet, many of these issues, that apparently made quite a few accounts quit, are quite hypocritic at best.

One example is the, alleged, plan to extend the service of the NeX store to non-vanity items, if anything, I can't see why so many people complain about this, aren't EVE's most powerful alliances fueled by RMT or automated scripts?
This makes EVE a very volatile place for new people, as EVE is the only place where there is such a huge, huge gap between players and their veterancy status.

And now, CCP, either fictionally or non-fictionally introduced the idea of adding non-vanity items to the fray, and all the ego-tripping, e-peen intolerant alliance executors see this as a breach in their monopoly status in EVE, simply because this will introduce a way to actually attain more SP than EVE's most loyal and earliest subscriber.

derivativo
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:11:00 - [830]
 

Originally by: Narcissus Tombs
Edited by: Narcissus Tombs on 26/06/2011 19:22:01
Edited by: Narcissus Tombs on 26/06/2011 18:40:27
So far you're pulling it right out of the PR handbook.

I'll just leave this here Linkage

Edit: And this lovely link tallying 4482 unsubbed accounts so far.

What you seem to be missing, Zulu, is that even thought the future of MT is the biggest rage issue here, it's just a symptom of the dissatisfaction and dissapointmend we've felt with you, CCP as a whole, for a while now. I am not trying to attack anyone at CCP, just convey my dissatisfaction and sadness, and what my view of CCP has degraded to.

This is not speculation, but quite well known now, that you are using Eve as a cash cow and forced alpha test for your new projects, both of which are progressing at a rate beyond slow and sucking money and resources out of your flagship product.

What is worse, you simply don't care about the game anymore. Investors and aesthetics come before gameplay. This is something you've been saying internally, and now that it's out there you send PR meatshields to delay things until they cool down.
"If it looks good, it is good." Sound familiar? Because apparently it's said quite a bit around the CCP offices.

The fact is, you simply don't have a vision for Eve.

You have been flying by the seat of your pants for who knows how long, adding features on a whim and wasting colossal amounts of time and money on things players often don't want.

You are forcing unwanted content on us simply to gain free alpha testing for your next game.

You can't take negative criticism.

You ignore the playerbase that made you great.

You have a rockstar mentality that is completely unwarranted.

You are trying to push a niche game into the a mainstream market.

You lack professionalism.

You have no internal editing, or any that we can see, because of your childish dislike of negative criticism.

You release untested, half-baked expansions.

You ignore the mountains of information and suggestions and criticism your players give you to improve it.

You have ruined your image with new players. As seen here.

You push what you want, not what we want.

This is a service, if people dislike it, they'll stop paying for it.

You have been buying your own PR more than your players.

You have ignored the high-maintenance requirements for a game like Eve, instead adding more content itself in need of editing.

You set unrealistic goals, internally and externally, that you know you can't meet, but hype anyway.

You have yet to give a straight answer about non-vanity items. We don't want cute remarks or metaphors or comparisons or synecdoches, we want a YES OR NO ANSWER.

You assume stupidity on the part of your players, and it's just insulting. The average age of eve players is 29, if I recall correctly. Many are older, and none of them are going to fall for delay tactics and PR spin.

And most importantly, lost the love you once had for your universe.

Most of this post comes from a review by one of your own employees, linked here.



I love CCP and I love Eve, but now that you have other projects in the works, it seems like you have simply dropped the idea of improving Eve entirely, and for this reason, I have unsubbed, along with more than 4000 other accounts. I honestly hope you can set a worthwhile vision for Eve, and follow it, because without that, the game is going to start decaying. I am not being fanatical or defeatist, this is simply what is going to happen, and has happened to many other MMOs.

Best of Luck, and I hope Eve gets the attention and care it deserves.

Abaidaa
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:12:00 - [831]
 

Originally by: Angeliq

Originally by: Julian Kirov

Here's a presentation from the creators of BF:Heroes that explains why Hilmar gives no fcks about the forums.

http://www.slideshare.net/bcousins/paying-to-win




This is a very interesting presentation. Everyone should... MUST watch it!

This presentation will tell you why EVE Online WILL have a Cash Shop WITH GAME CHANGING ITEMS beyond vanity ones!! It shows that the business model works and why it will work in EVE too.




Indeed a very interesting presentation. The differences between BFH and EVE have been mentioned, and may be very obvious. I think though CCP knows very well, that there are just a very few peacocks around in New Eden, who like to look special. But these peacocks are generaly older and have proper jobs and with it higher income than the common BFH player. This might explain the high prices in the nex. So they go the way of high prices (for the few) rather than making lower (attractive) prices for the masses. The profit may be similar.

I'm sure CCP knows this presnetation or a least its content, because the golf comparison appers in there and the leacked fearless blue sky thinking.

I also want to add this thought, as I don't want to be part of the silent majority, which never posts/cares (this is my 2nd post ever after almost 3 years as paying subscriber!).

And most important: Don't go beyond vanity items! You find billions of reasons for avoiding that around here these days. I'd rather pay more for my subscrition, if you really need the cash.

Graava
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:12:00 - [832]
 

Edited by: Graava on 26/06/2011 23:44:09
Edited by: Graava on 26/06/2011 23:13:30
First off let me say this is a welcome but tardy first step.

However as to this seciotn of your blog...

Quote:
The tone and demeanor of my blog on Friday did not correctly portray my emotions towards the community and player base at large. I love and respect EVE and its community on a level that's hard to really do justice in words. However I let my frustration take charge of me, fueled by emotions that had built up due to a breach of trust we at CCP have been experiencing over the past few days. I know that sounds ironic considering those are the exact same feelings you have been having towards CCP.


Allow my cycnical nature to call bullshyte on this paragraph. The previous blog was the result of a whole day of meetings, and personal emotions would NOT have been allowed through the PR propaganda machine. The original post still stands as is, totally insulting to the intelligence of the Eve community.

Originally by: Darik Jita
Quote:
what you do, not what you say


This is now the only 'trust' we have for CCP, words are meaningless!

Two accounts of four already run out and they will not be renewed until we see something substantive!

Yet another Eve player who is trying Perpetuum!

Grit Diaspora
Gallente
Titan Inc.
Bloodbound.
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:12:00 - [833]
 

Originally by: Kaos Supreme
"Therefore we have asked the CSM to join us in Iceland for an extraordinary meeting June 30th and July 1st to discuss the events of past week, to help us define and address the real underlying concerns, and to assist us in defining and iterating on our virtual goods strategy....."


Concerns?! How's this for starters >

NO MICRO-TRANSACTIONS FOR NON VANITY ITEMS!

FIX THE ****IN LAG SO THAT MAJOR ALLIANCES CAN COMPETE FOR CONTROL OF REGIONS AND THE RESOURCES WITHIN(As advertised) SO THAT STRATEGY & TEAMWORK DETERMINES THE OUTCOME NOT LAG!

NULL SEC AND MOON RESOURCES NEEDS A MAJOR OVERHAUL!

DESTROY ONCE AND FOR ALL THE ABILITY TO RUN BOTS / MACROS!



This ^

Solomunio Kzenig
Amarr
Indicium Technologies
Hephaestus Forge Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:16:00 - [834]
 

I am only a little heartened by Zulu's blog, still a little vague and slippery for me. Plus they did not need to fly the CSM out to Iceland, get them on SKYPE ASAP and have a few conference calls to sort things out NOW! not in a weeks time.

I really need to know only one thing, are there plans for Game effecting MT goods/services in EVE Yes/No. If Yes I'm gone (accounts are allready un-subbed and ticking down) if its a definite No, I'll re-sub.

Karri Wilts
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:17:00 - [835]
 

What can the CSM say in Iceland they haven't already said on the forums, over skype, on blogs, etc etc? It's very simple - no MTs for anything non-vanity. The community is furious because you (yes you, CCP Zulu, personally) promised us that less than 12 months ago and now we've found you have been debating exactly how far you can go in breaking your word.

No gold ammo, no ships-for-aurum, no standings resets, nothing that impacts the game, ever. Paint jobs and monocles we can live with. That's the line.

Of course, that's assuming you can ever regain our trust. As Hilmar said about us - we'll be watching what you do, not what you say. Till then, Perpetuum's pretty cool. Their devs are happy to say no when asked about non-vanity MTs.

Zey Nadar
Gallente
Unknown Soldiers
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:20:00 - [836]
 

Originally by: CCP Fallout
Read Zulu's newest dev blog here

DE
RU


It is good that you took this seriously and not lightly (as the first blogs and posts made look like).

I am waiting what comes out of this. There are aspects of incarna I like, lets stay on that road.

Lynx Amurie
Caldari
CRUX CORPORATE ARMADA
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:24:00 - [837]
 

Originally by: Vhelia
Originally by: Darik Jita
what you do, not what you say


Dr Lebroi
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:29:00 - [838]
 

Please, please do the right thing and not the wrong thing and by that I mean, sit by a river or walk up a mountain, be at peace with yourself and your thoughts and then ask the important questions and listen to the answers you get. There is still time.

Luke S
Zeta Corp.
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:30:00 - [839]
 

Originally by: Tsu Hak
Edited by: Tsu Hak on 26/06/2011 19:01:43
TOO LATE CCP AND NOT ENOUGH


CCP Zulu already murdered 2 of my accounts by the crap he posts

RIP both


Annie *28.3.2007 to June 2011

and

Ivy *26.12.2009 to June 2011





That's your own damn fault Tas hak. Dont blame CCP for your actions.

When I saw people say/do what you did, I was shocked you would make such of a harsh decision based on rumors and speculations.

Now go back to WoW and QQ like they do.

Dennie Fleetfoot
Posted - 2011.06.26 23:31:00 - [840]
 

This a small sign of contrition from Zulu but my alt sub remains cancelled till a solid, clear and resounding no to ALL game changing items EVER being put on the store.

I don't care if some idiot spends a billion isk on a virtual eye furniture. I DO care if some rich idiot spends a couple of hundred real world quid (which a sane person wouldn't do, they'll need it to buy a new graphic's card to replace the one that Incarna melted) getting a unique ship which is better than anything available in the game normally. It ruins the whole concept of the player driven sandbox.

I'll wait to see what the CSM meeting brings up. I hope we get the name of the idiot/idiots who thought of this idea. I bet it wasn't one of the dev's. It'll be a suit. And I've yet to meet a suit who I didn't trust.


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