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blankseplocked Protest Against the Protesters!!!
 
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El Muerte Vitae
Posted - 2011.06.25 10:58:00 - [31]
 

I actually agree with the OP...

I can see, and understand why some people are protesting or are angry/upset/raging about the changes but I really do think they have perhaps jumped too soon, we only have vanity items on this Nexus market at the moment, and as long as it stays that way, everything is fine

Katrina Cortez
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:05:00 - [32]
 

You are being naive...

xxxTRUSTxxx
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:10:00 - [33]
 

Originally by: Vim
Originally by: xxxTRUSTxxx
i laughed my ass off when ZULU compared RL items to pixels.

MESSAGE TO ZULU,, you're off your ****ing rocker,, lmfao

btw,, we lease the game and all it's items from ccp, so yea, if ZULU wants to compare RL items to ingame items,, show me where you can lease a pair of jeans for 1000 bucks.

i think it's pretty incredible how CCP staff are looking down on us (the customer)and thinking, idiots, they'll buy into any **** we drop on the table.





vanity items are infact made into Vanity by their high isk cost. We asked for Vanity. We got it.
We can also resell our 60$ monocle on the market to another player when we dont want it anymore, since plex<>isk<>aur might fluctate, the price you get back might be higher worth of isk, or lower. But it will still be worth 3.42plex when you resell, or possibly 3.3 so in essence a vanity item costs you .12plex =)

Wizarding ingame ships into existence with $ would be bad. Ill still not mind if they sell a luxuary gallente shuttle in the aur shop, the ingame advantage from having such an item is getting 8 free rounds of emp l delivered via 1400mm express :P
I would not mind if they introduced booster like items up to 10m sp or so for newbies to be able to feel they progress somewhere.

Had everyone been able to afford NeX items the plex demand would have spiked everyone wanting to try it, which would have resulted in alot of market speculants on plex to rise to profit madly from this patch. Which we don't want, and ccp don't want it.

It would be grand if they drafted a 'No, we will not sell machariels for aur, nor any other ship or module or implant or service. But we want to be able to give newbies something because they only stay 7 months'.
If they make a 'here we draw the line document' I'll be most happy.
If they give me my old hangarview back and option to go to quarters/station: Flaming rainbows of true love.

Peace. And reason.





vanity items are not vanity because of price, they are vanity because they do nothing but sit looking pretty.
vanity items,, in RL are vanity because others can see them and want them, this drives the prices for them, but, now here's the funny part, these vanity items in eve, which are causing so much trouble right now, can only be viewed by the individual who paid $60 or more for them,, lmfao

so right now,,, photoshop and some time = free vanity.

i care not for vanity ingame, i care that this MT's may lead to ships, modules, SP's, neural remaps, implants and so on being introduced because the fact about most gamers these days is they are lazy bastards who want it all handed to them on a gold plate.

i agree with some of what you say, but can't agree with MT's to allow others to get ahead with ingame abilities.

xxxTRUSTxxx
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:18:00 - [34]
 

Originally by: Tomasa de Torquemada
Ok lets get some perspective here... CCP Zulu post does make sense if you think about it.. you have free clothes for your character, in RL you have clothes that do not cost much, you can get a pair of trousers for say 20... but there are those that cost much much more, and are bought for VANITY reasons, this is what Zulu was getting at.

While there has been no specific update, they also have not said their previous comments about MT for game advantage no longer apply, I seriously do not see any MT for game advantage ever coming to EVE, simpley because it would damage CCP's rep, for all games, EVE, DUST and that vampire game..

I do understand people's reasons for protesting, but I also feel many are jumping the gun too soon, MT for Vanity items, I have no worries about


stop comparing RL to a ****ing game,, are you a ZULU alt ????

Demure Guise
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:21:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: Tomasa de Torquemada
These protesters are simply blind to the truth, and just irritate me no end, thinking that they know best!..

Knowing better than YOU is easy though. Vanity items for MT is nothing to give a **** about - If Apronstrings McNerdboy gets Mommy and Daddy to spring them a monocle no-one cares, well, other than the potential for podding them and general mockery.

One of the cornerstones of this game is the much-vaunted Player-Driven Economy. P are bouncing ideas around that would destroy this cornerstone. Do you want to see day when ships and ammo magically appear out of thin air, without the need for raw materials and thus no need for the services of Mining and Industrial players? If yes, do the game a favour and leave now, and in the meantime let the dedicated players force P into an answer.

At least buying Plex, converting it to ISK and buying ships, or whatever, still requires people to gather the raw materials and then build your product, and in turn get ISK off you. Ships and ammo from the MT store aren't going to do this.

To virtually silence the forums overnight, all P had to do in that pitifully inadequate blog as say "No, we will never sell non-vanity items via MT." Dissension would drop down to a background murmur mainly comprising the few people who don't want Incarna and/or people who have quad core PCs with heat-fried dual SLI graphics cards if they enter a small room, even though their rig can otherwise play Crysis II on max settings.

Vice Admiral Spreadsheet
Caldari
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:24:00 - [36]
 

So one major issue is AUR for outright ships?
Ain't going to happen.
1. CCP's leaked newsletter was created prior to the AUR for skinned Scorpion. CCP eventually ditched the idea because of player feedback. In fact, AUR for a Scorpion would only last 2-3 months while the store was being coded to support a "Scorp + AUR = skinned Scorp" trade-in.
2. AUR for an outright ship was one person's opinion. A person who was told to imagine a completely MT EVE. In the newsletter there's a "No for MT" and "Yes for MT" section. Both were extremes.

AUR for SP? Never said.
Free to play EVE? Won't work when one person can run a mission with 10 Dominix alts simultaneously.
AUR for standings? Once again, just one person's devil's advocate opinion.

AUR for Super ships? Never said. It barely matters, either.
Assume Drake + AUR = Super Drake. If CCP will make anything, it'll be like this. Anyone can get a super Drakes. ISK -> PLEX -> AUR. No ships appear out of thin air. When reprocessed, you get a Drake's minerals.
AUR = Super Drake. Pretty bad. Anyone can get it, but reprocessing the Drake will add materials to the economy. And ships can appear out of thin air.
Cold, hard cash = Super Drake. Very bad. Very, very bad. Won't happen. Laughing

Demure Guise
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:30:00 - [37]
 

Originally by: El Muerte Vitae
I actually agree with the OP...

I can see, and understand why some people are protesting or are angry/upset/raging about the changes but I really do think they have perhaps jumped too soon, we only have vanity items on this Nexus market at the moment, and as long as it stays that way, everything is fine

I've highlighted two significant parts of your post. Yes, you're right. We KNOW that already. What we want is a simple yes or no answer to the very easy to comprehend question "Will P EVER sell non-vanity items via MT?" With this question featuring very heavily in the Parlay Post they created (probably asked hundreds of times) there is no way on God's Earth that they couldn't notice it.

Yet in the derisory blog they chose to insult our intelligence with, they all but danced a minuet around this core question, thinking they had cunningly evaded it. Fail. A simple "no" would have stopped almost all the forum rage, all the unwarranted personal insults to P spokesmen/women and stopped all the blockades of Jita and Amarr.

Now why wouldn't they just say "no" to that question, eh? I think because they didn't dare to.

Demure Guise
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:33:00 - [38]
 

Originally by: Vice Admiral Spreadsheet
AUR = Super Drake. Pretty bad. Anyone can get it, but reprocessing the Drake will add materials to the economy. And ships can appear out of thin air.

Tough **** on the Miners then? Tough **** on the people who centre their game around building ships in the first place, eh?

mrmooo
Caldari
Pentag Blade
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:34:00 - [39]
 

Originally by: Vice Admiral Spreadsheet
So one major issue is AUR for outright ships?
Ain't going to happen.
1. CCP's leaked newsletter was created prior to the AUR for skinned Scorpion. CCP eventually ditched the idea because of player feedback. In fact, AUR for a Scorpion would only last 2-3 months while the store was being coded to support a "Scorp + AUR = skinned Scorp" trade-in.
2. AUR for an outright ship was one person's opinion. A person who was told to imagine a completely MT EVE. In the newsletter there's a "No for MT" and "Yes for MT" section. Both were extremes.

AUR for SP? Never said.
Free to play EVE? Won't work when one person can run a mission with 10 Dominix alts simultaneously.
AUR for standings? Once again, just one person's devil's advocate opinion.

AUR for Super ships? Never said. It barely matters, either.
Assume Drake + AUR = Super Drake. If CCP will make anything, it'll be like this. Anyone can get a super Drakes. ISK -> PLEX -> AUR. No ships appear out of thin air. When reprocessed, you get a Drake's minerals.
AUR = Super Drake. Pretty bad. Anyone can get it, but reprocessing the Drake will add materials to the economy. And ships can appear out of thin air.
Cold, hard cash = Super Drake. Very bad. Very, very bad. Won't happen. Laughing


lets hope --i remain subscribed for the time being--but why after the leaked newsletter email etc cannot CCP give us this assurance ??

Milkmy Sausage
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:37:00 - [40]
 

Originally by: Tomasa de Torquemada
These protesters are simply blind to the truth, and just irritate me no end, thinking that they know best!..

RMT in the sense you talk about already exists. People can buy Game time, trade for plex and put it on market, get isk, and then use that isk to give them an advantage in game.

This Aurum rubbish is just essentially the same deal, plex > Aurum instead of isk....

Stop the pathetic rage, block all that do this stupid pathetic local channel spam, infact petition them for creating lag..

This stupid protest must be stopped, and needs to stop now, because it is not doing eve any good nor giving the outside world a good view of eve, this will kill eve, not the new so-called RMT stuff.

so STFU, HTFU, and just play the ****ing game instead of whining like little babies, No? then quit because eve has no place for babies like you


You don;t understand the current or future mechanics of the proposals. Yes PLEX exists and can be sold for ISK, bu at the end of the day whatever you pruchase form that ISK has been built by players, materials mined by miners etc, the money is recycked through the players. AUR items are created out of thin air. no benefit to the player base whatsoever. COme back when you know what you're talking about and you understand how it will impact on the game.

Swynet
State War Academy
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:38:00 - [41]
 

Originally by: Tomasa de Torquemada
These protesters are simply blind to the truth, and just irritate me no end, thinking that they know best!..

RMT in the sense you talk about already exists. People can buy Game time, trade for plex and put it on market, get isk, and then use that isk to give them an advantage in game.

This Aurum rubbish is just essentially the same deal, plex > Aurum instead of isk....

Stop the pathetic rage, block all that do this stupid pathetic local channel spam, infact petition them for creating lag..

This stupid protest must be stopped, and needs to stop now, because it is not doing eve any good nor giving the outside world a good view of eve, this will kill eve, not the new so-called RMT stuff.

so STFU, HTFU, and just play the ****ing game instead of whining like little babies, No? then quit because eve has no place for babies like you


They are getting mad because all the plex changed directly in Aurum is one less plex in the market.

1 less plex in the market will create higher sell prices

Higher sell prices will make rmt's and in game jerks work a lot more to have free subscriptions and play the game for free while you pay

This rage is nothing but kid's and winners stuff, let them wine.

And if tomorrow you can buy a super tempest with aurum you can't have it with the normal process of players interactions is pretty simple: unsub


Milkmy Sausage
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:39:00 - [42]
 

Originally by: El Muerte Vitae
I actually agree with the OP...

I can see, and understand why some people are protesting or are angry/upset/raging about the changes but I really do think they have perhaps jumped too soon, we only have vanity items on this Nexus market at the moment, and as long as it stays that way, everything is fine


I highlighted the important bit.... Do you really thing that if we don;t make ourselves heard that it will stay this way? No. Someone somewhere will say 'hey we're making profit off this... let's put ships, ammo, standings, sec status and SP on there too.'

Either way I'd rather revolt and put a marker in the sand than have the alternative sneak out of the woodwork in a years time.

Callduron
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:44:00 - [43]
 

Originally by: Tomasa de Torquemada
FIrst

Jove Ships for Aurum coming in Incarna 1.2??!


In the unlikely event of this coming to pass you will be able to use isk to buy plex to buy aurum to buy Jove ships.

SHIPS FOR ISK! THE SKY IS FALLING!

Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:46:00 - [44]
 

Originally by: xxxTRUSTxxx
...i care not for vanity ingame, i care that this MT's may lead to ships, modules, SP's..

That is the exact reason why protesters should be protested, the uproar is over a hypothetical scenario that has never been outside of the internal debate forums (in this case a newsletter).

A creaky floorboard can scare even me but I do not automatically assume that it is incontrovertible proof of a Zombie Armageddon or a Martian/Communist Invasion which is what this whole thing amounts to .. rampant phobias and collective delusions.

Being worried is one thing but this has been blown so far out of proportions that any semblance to intelligence has been eradicated .. fear is part of being human but it is the ability to reason that defines us and it allows us to face the fear.

Uriel Laskaris
Minmatar
The Littlest Hobos
En Garde
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:47:00 - [45]
 

FREE OUR BANNED COMRADES! FREE MONOCLE! FREE ROSA PARKS!

Milkmy Sausage
Posted - 2011.06.25 11:49:00 - [46]
 

Originally by: Hirana Yoshida
Originally by: xxxTRUSTxxx
...i care not for vanity ingame, i care that this MT's may lead to ships, modules, SP's..

That is the exact reason why protesters should be protested, the uproar is over a hypothetical scenario that has never been outside of the internal debate forums (in this case a newsletter).

A creaky floorboard can scare even me but I do not automatically assume that it is incontrovertible proof of a Zombie Armageddon or a Martian/Communist Invasion which is what this whole thing amounts to .. rampant phobias and collective delusions.

Being worried is one thing but this has been blown so far out of proportions that any semblance to intelligence has been eradicated .. fear is part of being human but it is the ability to reason that defines us and it allows us to face the fear.


right so when a country talks about going to war you sit back and say... 'well they're only talking about it'. You're post is ridiculous, if you leave it until it's been introduced it's too late. People are angry becuase they've had the wool pulled over their eyes before and this time they're not going to let it get that far.

Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
Posted - 2011.06.25 12:06:00 - [47]
 

Originally by: Milkmy Sausage
right so when a country talks about going to war you sit back and say... 'well they're only talking about it'. You're post is ridiculous, if you leave it until it's been introduced it's too late. People are angry becuase they've had the wool pulled over their eyes before and this time they're not going to let it get that far.

That is just it: They HAVE NOT talked about it.

What they have done is run an internal debate by use of a scenario .. much like a country makes scenarios to wage war for each and every speck of land in the world.

WHEN they actually say that they are cooking up a P2W scheme then it is a different matter, I was among the spearhead to prevent the heinous AF-AB buff, openly opposed the carrier revamp and helped temper the projectile buff (still became OP, but what the sheep wanted was insane!).

Related Fun:
Did you know that in case of a nuclear exchange in the waning years of the cold war, Scandinavia would likely be glassed over by its NATO allies and not the Soviets because it was reasoned that hamstringing the Soviet Baltic and North Sea Fleets was of more value than a few million allies?
Should I run around like a headless chicken protesting everything NATO/Western because of such a contingency having been discussed?

Ashlyn Shi'jun
Posted - 2011.06.25 12:30:00 - [48]
 

I agree with the op and can understand why ccp zulu likes to compare rl and eve market. The dynamics are similar and you can make predictions in eve more easily then on the rl market because its a smaller closed environment.

Raging against this or calling it stupid makes no sense to me, please give us sound counterargument that are objectiv and logical.

All i got so far from the protesters is rude behaviour, mindless repitition of other peoples words and stark paranoia.

Kirika Misono
The Eiken Club
Posted - 2011.06.25 15:16:00 - [49]
 

+1 to op

Originally by: Uriel Laskaris
FREE OUR BANNED COMRADES!


-1 to this ****.

Have you read the **** your 'banned comrades' were spewing? Telling the GM to die screaming in a fire because they did not immediately give you what you want? If ANYONE in this game said that to a GM, we'd be banned. I say, let the law apply to all, regardless of what in-game terrorists want.


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