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RutilusUnus
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:25:00 - [1]
 

My netbook that I've been playing eve on for a few months now does not have shader model 3.0 capability so I am looking at getting a new computer but am wanting to build it from scratch. I have no formal training in regards to building computers but I've taken apart a few laptops and desktops so I can recognize the parts well enough. This will be my first time putting a desktop together from scratch though.

What I need help from OOPE is guidance on what is and isn't important. I have around 1200$ to spend on a computer at the moment. I'm not looking to pimp out anything but I would like to be able to run EVE at around 30 fps at least when in space.

I pretty much need everything besides a mouse haha. I've been looking around at newegg and tigerdirect but I'm lost when it comes to processor speed, overclocking, etc.

At the very least, does anyone know of any good websites that have good information for building a desktop for a newbie? Very Happy

Blacksquirrel
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:22:00 - [2]
 

Edited by: Blacksquirrel on 25/06/2011 00:32:39
Edited by: Blacksquirrel on 25/06/2011 00:28:42
Core i5-i7 more cache the better.
4-6 gb of ddr3 higher the freq the better.
460 or above or amd 6850 or above.
depending on cost. Go 64gb SSD for OS, and 500bg + 7200rpm (or above) with 32-64mb cache for main storage.

monitors your choice...
sound depends on what you want.
Also buy a large case unless you want to cut out stuff to fit the VGA. And check for good cable management reviews. Example I have this case its not large btw http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119235&cm_re=scout_storm-_-11-119-235-_-Product

oh yeah mobo and PSU...
really just dont go micro for desktop, ASRock P67 EXTREME4 (B3) LGA 1155 Intel P67 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard
or
MSI Z68A-GD65 (B3) LGA 1155 Intel Z68 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard

PSU you just need 500 - 600w anything else is overkill. Also get MODULAR CABLING!!! YOU WILL THANK ME LATER!

It's also good to get cabling ties or wraps so everything isn't all over the place.


Also lol right on neweggs front page How to build a computer.
http://www.newegg.com/Store/Computer.aspx?name=Computer-Hardware


RutilusUnus
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:38:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: Blacksquirrel
Edited by: Blacksquirrel on 25/06/2011 00:32:39
Edited by: Blacksquirrel on 25/06/2011 00:28:42
Core i5-i7 more cache the better.
4-6 gb of ddr3 higher the freq the better.
460 or above or amd 6850 or above.
depending on cost. Go 64gb SSD for OS, and 500bg + 7200rpm (or above) with 32-64mb cache for main storage.

monitors your choice...
sound depends on what you want.
Also buy a large case unless you want to cut out stuff to fit the VGA. And check for good cable management reviews. Example I have this case its not large btw http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119235&cm_re=scout_storm-_-11-119-235-_-Product

oh yeah mobo and PSU...
really just dont go micro for desktop, ASRock P67 EXTREME4 (B3) LGA 1155 Intel P67 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard
or
MSI Z68A-GD65 (B3) LGA 1155 Intel Z68 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard

PSU you just need 500 - 600w anything else is overkill. Also get MODULAR CABLING!!! YOU WILL THANK ME LATER!

It's also good to get cabling ties or wraps so everything isn't all over the place.


Also lol right on neweggs front page How to build a computer.
http://www.newegg.com/Store/Computer.aspx?name=Computer-Hardware




God damnit lol...I must have missed that. Oh well Confused

Thanks for the info though. I just needed something to work off of really. I'll adjust it based on what I need. Core i7 might be overkill for me tbh.

Blacksquirrel
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:55:00 - [4]
 

Yeah thats why I didnt give specifics. People need a range to find out whats best for them.

The reason I said 15 to i7 is for longevity purposes. Just keeps you from having to upgrade a processor when ever you feel the need down the line. Important part of building actually is thinking about swapping parts down the line when you think you'll need to upgrade.

RutilusUnus
Posted - 2011.07.29 01:37:00 - [5]
 

So, I've been doing a lot of browsing, watching videos and etc. I've come up with a list of items to build the comp with. I know I don't have a few things (keyboard and GPU). I don't care too much about the keyboard but I've been keeping up with the forums and have noticed that some people have been having hardware meltdowns from heat. What has this been happening to mainly? The mobo and gpu?

Here is my list (tell me whether these items are good or bad)

Case: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=11-156-063&SortField=1&SummaryType=0&Pagesize=10&PurchaseMark=&SelectedRating=-1&VideoOnlyMark=False&VendorMark=&IsFeedbackTab=true&Keywords=%28keywords%29&Page=1#scrollFullInfo

Processor: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115072

Monitor: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824236051

Hard Drive: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136771

RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145345&cm_sp=Pers_ShellShockerBuyAlong-_-20-145-345_2_DM-_-13-128-488

PSU:http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371016

MOBO: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157229

PS. Please give me some advice on the graphics card. I'm still kinda lost on what I need.

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2011.07.29 02:31:00 - [6]
 

Edited by: Akita T on 29/07/2011 03:02:55

Originally by: RutilusUnus
I have around 1200$ to spend on a computer at the moment.[...]I'm not looking to pimp out anything but I would like to be able to run EVE at around 30 fps at least when in space.

You don't need 1200$ for that. 400$ will probably do just fine. In fact, maybe even less.
For 1200$ you can get something that runs EVE's CQ-incarna at max detail in fullHD at triple-digit FPS, and can run "EVE in space" on three fullHD monitors at max details inside a huge fleet fight at well over 60 FPS.

For EVE right now, the video card is almost always the big bottleneck, while the processor is of a very distant secondary importance (and per-core speed matters more than number of cores anyway).
DO NOT overclock your processor for EVE. It is bordering on the useless. The weakest i5 should be able to handle it all just fine without any overclocking whatsoever with cycles to spare and at least 2 of 4 cores barely used at all. I would even recommend to stay away from intel altogether FOR NOW and get a much cheaper AMD processor/motherboard combo.
As for video card, even the puniest of all 5xxx series Radeons should be able to offer you what you asked for (the under-40$ Radeon HD 5450), but the best price/performance ratios right now are the video cards around Radeon HD 5770 or 6770, or maybe a NVIDIA GTX 460 (the 1GB version).


Just for reference's sake, take a look at this thread : "Budget PC". In it you will find a build that costs around 284 GBP (236 GBP + 20% VAT).
That should mean it would cost around 385 USD from newegg (or thereabouts) and it will run "EVE in space" flawlessly - far better than what you say you need.


"Future-proofing" is pretty much pointless, because if you take a reference machine you can buy today, in 3 years (give or take a few months), if you exclude the case+PSU (and any fancy cooling system you might want) from your calculations, you can buy a new computer that's 4 times cheaper and has roughly the same performance, or a machine at the same price but 4 times faster and with 4 times larger RAM/HDD.

It's much, MUCH better to get a mid-range (or even slightly below mid-range) machine and keep getting new ones every 2 years or so.
You'll end up spending less money overall AND have accumulated a pile of hardware with at least one (maybe even two) halfway decent fallback machine (or, alternatively, you could even sell them and recover some cash) AND you won't be too far behind whatever the gaming industry is pushing out at the moment, always able to get a pretty decent experience in just about any game out there.


TL;DR - unless you want "a pimp machine", never set your budget much above 600$, preferably just 400$ or so.
And for god's sake, UPGRADE OFTEN (and cheaply).


___

P.S. 250GB HDD is laughable. My OS-and-apps-only partition (my documents and all installed games are somewhere else) has almost 40GB used. Add a few games, a few movies, some music, and BAM, you're out of HDD space. Besides, why get a 250GB HDD for almost 40$ when you can get almost the same type but in 1TB size with double the cache for just 20$ extra ? Linkage ?

And you know what ? Get this Radeon HD 6790 for just 140$ : Linkage.

Nimrod Nemesis
Amarr
Royal Amarr Institute
Posted - 2011.07.29 03:01:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Akita T
"Future-proofing" is pretty much pointless, because if you take a reference machine you can buy today, in 3 years (give or take a few months), if you exclude the case+PSU from your calculations, you can buy a new computer that's 4 times cheaper and has roughly the same performance, or a machine at the same price but 4 times faster and with 4 times larger RAM/HDD.



If there is anything i've learned in my lifetime of dealing with computers it's this. There's seriously no reason to go the extra mile in order to get another year of performance out of a pc for a couple hundred premium. I've long since scrapped the "uber machine," race and settled on building a new rig every couple of years with bargin parts and i'm quite happy. Less wasted money, less guinea-pig testing of brand-new technology, and more chances to get the rush of "it's ALIVE!"

Lithalnas
Amarr
Privateers
Privateer Alliance
Posted - 2011.07.29 03:03:00 - [8]
 

Quote:
At the very least, does anyone know of any good websites that have good information for building a desktop for a newbie?


I have several
The Tech Report system builders guide I dont agree with all the choices and the format is a little crude but i can dig it.
PC Perspective hardware leaderboard one of the more strait forward pages there is to be found.
NewEgg Youtube: How to build a PC Part 1 A good real world grounding in building a PC. How to choose parts and put things together.

I can give more advice once we get a shopping list proposed.

Super Whopper
I can Has Cheeseburger
Posted - 2011.07.29 10:24:00 - [9]
 

Akita's recommendations are excellent for mid level gaming system and more than excellent for EVE. That system will last for years, if you play no other games than EVE of course as CCP don't upgrade the engine too often and even SM3 is very old.

RutilusUnus
Posted - 2011.07.29 15:49:00 - [10]
 

Future proofing was somewhat what I was trying to accomplish with my build, but Akita T's example does make sense. And I had heard that the biggest bottleneck has been the graphics card and not the processor. I have no plans on overclocking my CPU either, partially because I have no earthly idea on how I would do that.

I looked at that "Budget PC" thread and was just flat out shocked that a good pc could be built so cheaply. And I went with the 250gb because I really didn't know HDD's were so damn cheap.

I used some of the same parts from the Budget PC thread but changed a few of them

HDD
GPU
Case
PSU
MoBo
CPU
RAM
Monitor
Optical Drive

Total price: $624

I may be able to find an old monitor and keyboard and use them which would make the price around $540.

PS. Thanks for all the help so far. I really appreciate it.

Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2011.07.29 17:44:00 - [11]
 

Originally by: RutilusUnus
I looked at that "Budget PC" thread and was just flat out shocked that a good pc could be built so cheaply.

That was me, roughly 5 years ago, after my previously-purchased "muscle machine" of almost 10 years ago actually broke down (I think it was the motherboard capacitors) and I was looking for a replacement machine (I didn't actually need a stronger machine, just one that worked - and got one that was much better from all viewpoints for a tiny fraction of the cost of the old one).

RutilusUnus
Posted - 2011.07.29 18:40:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: RutilusUnus
I looked at that "Budget PC" thread and was just flat out shocked that a good pc could be built so cheaply.

That was me, roughly 5 years ago, after my previously-purchased "muscle machine" of almost 10 years ago actually broke down (I think it was the motherboard capacitors) and I was looking for a replacement machine (I didn't actually need a stronger machine, just one that worked - and got one that was much better from all viewpoints for a tiny fraction of the cost of the old one).


And the machine that I build will hopefully last a few years. And upgrading every few years makes more sense, because your gear stays more current and it's cheaper pretty much. 540 is really good for a brand new system.


 

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