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blankseplocked CCP Employees are as frustrated as we are
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San Severina
Posted - 2011.06.26 00:20:00 - [61]

Edited by: San Severina on 26/06/2011 00:27:01
I think most of us understand that this is a management problem Hans.

I think it's systemic & can't be fixed Because Hilmar is a big stupid fat C%#t

The Unwanted.
Posted - 2011.06.26 00:22:00 - [62]

Originally by: ShadowLZ
No, no it shouldn't, Why in the **** are half of you people TRYING to destroy EVE? You're going to push them too far, investors will back out, EVE WILL DIE if you people don't stop being so damn blood thirsty.

I hate to be the one to tell you this, but PC Gamer have a corporation in EVE and have played this game for years.

You can't stop the signal. No one can.

And by the way, we are not trying to destroy EVE, CCP upper management have done it to themselves.

Katra Novac
Posted - 2011.06.26 00:24:00 - [63]

Sounds like they need the cash cow.

It does not bode well for Eve.

Deus Vex
Hole Spectors
Posted - 2011.06.26 00:32:00 - [64]

The testimony of ex-CCP employees is particularly interesting, as it paints a picture of an organisation run by “Super-Star Nerd Cow-Boys”, who have no idea how to run a company, and are intent on turning Eve into a cash-cow tech demo. It’s particularly disturbing because it indicates that the direction the company is taking is a result of deep-seeded delusions ingrained in its corporate-culture. At the centre of this is a complete disregard for the playerbase of Eve.

CCP should really come cap-in-hand, tearful with gratitude that they’ve been exposed early while they still have a chance to salvage the situation, and their livelihoods.

Posted - 2011.06.26 00:49:00 - [65]

Just Wow! I have been (co)assisting some large companies in changing strategies and long term directions. Normally, if it comes top down, it can take at least a year to get a company ship of this size turn its course for 10-20% degrees. It is hard to get the right people on the right seats, even if the management sees the need for it.

In this case it will be worse, as the somewhat autistic Icelandic 'old boys network' will not leave the bridge. They don't even realize they have a problem.
The CCP ship is heading for a cliff if you ask me. Especially since the always loyal internet customer base (the hardest crowd for doing damage control once u ***k them over) has hit the nail on its head and is unleashing hell on the internet and in game.

Myself, as a casual player, i have unsubscribed my 2 accounts just after the patch came out. Not because of the MT stuff, but i feel this expansion was made amateurish and proved
that this game is considered finished.
That all makes perfect sense now. Good luck all, its not gonna be pretty.

Sons Of 0din
Fatal Ascension
Posted - 2011.06.26 00:58:00 - [66]

"Fun game play is not a priority, promises made to investors and aesthetics are. ‘If it looks good then it is good’ is an often heard motto. CCP is committed to use technology in EVE as well as WoD and DUST, so certain features are made and used in EVE knowing they will not be fun, nor fit EVE and no one expects them to be appreciated by the playerbase. Alienating the playerbase of EVE further."

I copied that into the cancel subscription dialog, along with a note to forward it to as many managers as possible. Maybe that will help snap them out of their fantasy world.

They've got until August to change my mind.

Posted - 2011.06.26 01:02:00 - [67]

It's probably safe at the current rate to say that either Dust or WoD or both will no longer see the light of day.

Can't say I give a sh!t, seeing how the development of those two royally messed up every positive thing about EVE.

The lack of vision referred to is also no surprise, as EVE has stumbled all over the place with its various patches that have then been ignored. The Agile development process is also obviously too much for them too handle.

The one thing that is obvious from all the drama is that CCP needs new, foreign management. Hilmar is lost.

Klurigheten Haginen
Posted - 2011.06.26 01:06:00 - [68]

This thread (or rather the site it linked to) was the last straw for me. Cancelled and done. I have no interest funding the development of games I'll never play.

I've heard the argument that the success of their new games will benefit us directly, but I call BS on that given that the subscription fees from EVE obviously mostly goes to funding other games. There is no reason to trust that the future will change that. Once those games are released, not only will they have to split their attention over operating more games, but they will just find another set of new games to spend the money on.

I couldn't believe how poorly done Planetary Interaction was when it came out, and I just took another look at it a few days ago. I guess it makes sense now that they only wanted it as a tie-in for DUST. If PI was a game on its own, it wouldn't even be considered good enough for an iPhone game. There's so much potential there, as with so many other gameplay elements, but if they're just spending their time and money on new shiny projects that have nothing to do with EVE we will never see that potential realized.

I'm sure I'll be back if they get their act together in the future, but all this left too bad of a taste in my mouth to stay right now.

Boaz Hedion Merkava
Posted - 2011.06.26 01:20:00 - [69]

Edited by: Boaz Hedion Merkava on 26/06/2011 18:25:02
It was quite the shocker when I read this page, too. Yes, indeed, like someone said earlier, a lot of people rather want the game to go up into flames than it be destroyed by evil management decisions.

Posted - 2011.06.26 02:10:00 - [70]

CCP bit off more than they can chew. EVE development has been one mess after another, Incarna was the last drop.

After reading the employees testimonials about the company you understand why the thing is going downhill.

Zeta Zhul
Preemptive Paranoia
Posted - 2011.06.26 02:10:00 - [71]

Originally by: Machete Visor
consider the dates on the posts before you guys swallow internet BS

seem slightly suspicious?

Why? CCP has been advertising for game programmers for a long time now. It is pretty obvious that they have significant turnover. It is extremely obvious that they have very lax coding standards. Frankly every thing I've read in these reviews so far makes perfect sense with respect to problems and issues I've experienced with Eve and my personal past experience with similar situations as a professional software developer.

Zeta Zhul
Preemptive Paranoia
Posted - 2011.06.26 02:13:00 - [72]

Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Originally by: Solus Starcunning
Originally by: Aiwha
Sounds like a bunch of good buddies who are trying to run a game. As nice as that sounds, you can't run a business like that. It just doesn't work...

But that's how CCP started up, you fool. CCP ran nice and steady for years with a relatively small, close-knit, like minded team of people who were in it not just for money but to make a quality product.

What is it with these people going 'yeah well businesses have to make money somehow'. We know companies have to make money to survive but a balance between money, quality control and consumer loyalty has to be struck. CCP is now monstroussly inbalanced.

I have worked for some of such kind of companies.

They start and grow VERY well but one day they wake up as proper mid-sized corporations, with all the big challenges and professionalism required to keep them going.

Suddenly the close knit group of friends (now top managers) becomes a liability: they still think they are in the "all friends" phase, while the company outgrows their capability to manage it.

The result is a giant with fragile feet, ready to collapse at the first non trivial issue.

CCP is this.

Precisely. This is the difference between entrepreneurs and corporate managers. Entrepreneurs must have a hands-on approach where everything goes through them and their vision is the only one that matters. But when a company has outgrown the entrepreneur and that person(s) cannot make the shift into mid-size company mode then a collapse is a distinct possibility.

Lao Mah
Posted - 2011.06.26 04:17:00 - [73]

Shocking. But it explains a lot.

Narcissus Tombs
Posted - 2011.06.26 04:52:00 - [74]

Bumping for truth. This is just amazing.

I've more and more seen CCP as unprofessional, but to hear it from their own employees?
My view of CCP in the last few months (and mostly the last two days) has gone from Positive, to mildly displeased, to very dissapointed.

They've lost my respect and my trust, as well as my business.
I don't mean to insult anyone at CCP, but they just seem... incompetent...

Everything they've done recently has reminded me of those adages your mother tells you for years. Specifically, when you don't listen.

"Trust and respect take years to earn and moments to lose, and longer to get back"
"Hard work and direction equal success"
"You get out what you put in"
"Always listen to others"

I remember me mum telling me this when I was 5, and I can only feel embarrassed when I feel CCP needs to hear them.

Posted - 2011.06.26 05:05:00 - [75]

OMG, is this were they got the inspiration for The Disgruntled Employee mission? Like a cry for help, or even a threat at their CEO? And look what happens, CCP sends every n00b and his mum after the poor employee [..."In effect, he's fair game. Please warp over to the location on the bookmark I'm about to give you and squash this little pest. I doubt he will survive long, as some of our customers are heavily armed. So hurry up and take him out if you want your reward."] ... Imagine what they'd do to these people if CCP would find out their identities... <shudder>

the united
Posted - 2011.06.26 06:03:00 - [76]

Reading this, it explains quite a lot.

I'm seeing a trend with the employees' gripes: lack of communication, no documentation, iron curtain between the senior management and everyone else, etc. To me, that explains things like the great forum ****-up, and things like the quite predictable "patch day is here, set a LONG skill." The above-average occurances of "we've fixed this, but broke that. Oops." Seriously, documentation is voluntary??? Have any of the policy makers ever worked at a real company before?

How do you expect anything even remotely technical (like, oh... a computer program) to work well if it's managed this way?

I love EVE... I always laugh at the "EVE IS DYING" posts, I shrugged off the T20 scandal for the most part, but ****... things are looking a little bleak to me here. The whole micro-transactions thing has me seriously questioning the future here, and mostly for the simple fact that no one from CCP has come out and said "No, no, no... it's going to be vanity only! Don't worry, we'll never offer things that affect gameplay!" Not that I'd have much faith in that proclomation, since not too long ago they were saying "No, no, no, we'll NEVER go the microtranaction route!"

I'd be really saddened to see Eve go the way of the dodo, but it'd be extra sad to see it go down because of misguided greed. (i.e. charging $80 for a monocle... really? Offer it for $2 and watch the dough roll in. Those 52 you've sold for the incredible price point? Imagine how many you'd sell if you made it more available to the greater playerbase.) I won't buy any of that crap regardless, but there are tons of people who will.

I guess my whole point is that I've got near zero faith in the management's ability to make good business decisions, at this point. And that can't fare well for EVE. You seriously look inept! And you are doing nothing to prove otherwise. Is this just some incredibly well-done propoganda by the "bittervets" which have me feeling this way? Perhaps, but CCP is failing so far at swinging people like me, (the silent majority who never frequent the forums, but rather just enjoy the game,) the other way.

Game-altering microtransactions (i.e. pay-to-win) WILL see an end to my three accounts, but I'm still holding out until that point. The complete failure of CCP to re-assure me is not helping. I'm not sure HOW they could reassure me, either, which is even more disconcerting.

U sad? I sad.

edith prickley
Posted - 2011.06.26 11:10:00 - [77]


Celluloid Gurus
Posted - 2011.06.26 11:21:00 - [78]

Originally by: Mehina22
CCP bit off more than they can chew. EVE development has been one mess after another, Incarna was the last drop.

After reading the employees testimonials about the company you understand why the thing is going downhill.

What i read was just typical for such anonymous statements from disgruntled employees, not everyone is a high payed senior game producer. And like any of these statements have anything to do with Incarna or content in particular. Rolling Eyes

CCP is just a big company now, with all the typical issues that go with it.

Deus Vex
Hole Spectors
Posted - 2011.06.26 14:58:00 - [79]

Originally by: clixor
What i read was just typical for such anonymous statements from disgruntled employees, not everyone is a high payed senior game producer. And like any of these statements have anything to do with Incarna or content in particular. Rolling Eyes

CCP is just a big company now, with all the typical issues that go with it.

Read it through, take your time, consider the issues of contention we're having and compare it with the points made by ex-employees. "All companies have disgruntled workers" is irrelevant. Here the devil is in the details about what's happening to our game.

Cedar Locus
Posted - 2011.06.26 15:44:00 - [80]

its a trap!

all this explains perfectly why this bug ridden game gives me frustration.

River Ace
Posted - 2011.06.26 17:11:00 - [81]

Hi Machete Visor,

If you get a chance would you log into game and read a mail I've sent you.

Many Thanks

River Very Happy

Posted - 2011.06.26 17:14:00 - [82]

Here's a quote from one of the disgruntled ex employees that I think sums it up rather nicely.

The result is that the company is suffering because we cannot sustain the development of EVE, DUST and WOD. EVE is not creating enough revenue which means that solutions are sought, solutions that CCP was vehemently against a few years ago.

Laruen Pleides
Posted - 2011.06.26 17:38:00 - [83]

Edited by: Laruen Pleides on 26/06/2011 17:38:18
The key word found in one of the reviews spells it all out quite clearly "investors".

Investors only care about one thing: their money.

They want a return on the money they give to a company. And they want it regardless of what happens to the company.

Also, does anyone here honestly believe that the top management at CCP isn't already set for life when it comes to cash? Even if they got "fired" they'd get a severance package that is probably triple what most of us make in a year. They have no "skin in the game". They have no reason to care at all about Eve, and they will simply do whatever the investors want.
In the long run that is the saddest thing of it all. If CCP really does "crash and burn", the only people who will be hurt for it are the underpaid employees that most of us probably would have no argument with if we knew their opinions.
The folks who deserve most to be on the street, will be living on lobster and filet mignon for the rest of their lives.

*edit for spelling*

Posted - 2011.06.26 17:41:00 - [84]

thats pretty damning

ccp need to wake up

Imperial Academy
Posted - 2011.06.26 17:45:00 - [85]

Edited by: 4RR0W on 26/06/2011 17:52:17
Edited by: 4RR0W on 26/06/2011 17:51:07
Edited by: 4RR0W on 26/06/2011 17:47:34
To compare:

-Huge disconnect between customer service and development in CA. The higher ups are always stunned to hear how angry or disgruntled the CS department employees are. This is due to the fact that CS management does not honestly tell them how bad things are, they hide it and you suffer for it.
-No chance for growth unless you started when the Austin branch opened. It's very buddy buddy so you will see certain individuals gain promotion after promotion while you sit there stagnant even after doing everyhting asked of you and more.
-The pay is still a joke after several company wide raises. Similair jobs in Austin pay almost twice the amount. The company things simply by working for Blizzard you will want to stay because they make good games.
-Constant delays on promotions due to inept planning. You will be strung along for months hoping to get a promotion you deserved a year ago.
-No feasable way to move to the development side of the company unless you get experience in another company.
-90% of the managers are inept. They may have been great Game Masters but they are terrible leaders and are only out for themselves. No accountability at all for management. They will still be there till the end of time because once you get that management job, the only way to lose that position is through another promotion." ugh

Blizzard sux even more appearently.

Seul Manus
Posted - 2011.06.26 18:19:00 - [86]

Edited by: Seul Manus on 26/06/2011 19:03:34
Edited by: Seul Manus on 26/06/2011 18:24:55
Bloody hell. Shocked

This bit "CCP does not take criticism well" probably refers to us lot. ugh

If CCP management doesn't alter course and how change how CCP is run, it could be in serious trouble within the near future.

Look out to bridge, iceberg dead ahead, suggest you change course asap.

I'm no company expert having never worked in an office environoment, but as I see it if a company has a high turn over in stafff, then there is something bad in the company to cause so many people to leave, and new comers to become disillusioned, hence the high turn over and continued advertisements for staff.

Florestan Bronstein
24th Imperial Crusade
Posted - 2011.06.26 18:24:00 - [87]

Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 26/06/2011 18:25:44

Has nobody looked at the employee survey results in the leaked Fearless?

(that being said I wouldn't concentrate too much on the latest reviews and rather put emphasis on the first few - they tell pretty much the same message but the likelihood that they were forged is much lower)

Posted - 2011.06.26 18:29:00 - [88]

lets just hope these brave lot along with the rest of the EVE community can make the top brass stop making stupid decision that they think will net them more cash, and concentrate on keeping EVE the great game it was before all this kicked off.

To those devs who are opposed to non vanity and game breaking items, keep fighting, you have a few thousand people backing you up

Adrian Schultze
Veto Corp
Posted - 2011.06.26 18:38:00 - [89]

Oh well....looks like CCP is acting like SOE...

Symbiosis International
Moose Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.26 18:42:00 - [90]

It's a shame that all those people who were saying 'EVE IS DYING' for years turned out to be actually right.

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