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Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:08:00 - [2161]
 

Originally by: Captain Mung
Hahahahah I read that blog expecting maybe some kind of decent response, but instead I read: "We understand you don't like it, but **** you, deal with it". And for some odd reason the morons running the show think it's STILL a good idea to keep going down this road. Eve is really going down the ****ter.


Wait till you get to Hilmar's email.

Olivor
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:09:00 - [2162]
 

This was the absolute final straw after nearly four years, my other accounts desubbed and this account running on PLEX at which time it runs out I have absolutely no intention, at all, of renewing it.

This devblog is utterly insulting to any player. To miss the point so spectacularly, to offer no apologies for this god awful mess and make parallels between some graphics in a game and real life clothing is disgusting.

**** you, **** your product and **** your company.

CCP / EVE has been going in the wrong direction since ~18 months~ and has made no attempts to U-turn. I sincerely hope that EVE dies horribly, DUST is the mediocre FPS it is shaping up to be and WoD is a massive heap of ****e. I'm sure some of you are nice people and all... but i look forward to you all being unemployed.

Kavin Alavandar
Extropy Dianoetics
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:10:00 - [2163]
 

Edited by: Kavin Alavandar on 25/06/2011 07:13:50
Originally by: Olivor
This devblog is utterly insulting to any player. To miss the point so spectacularly, to offer no apologies for this god awful mess and make parallels between some graphics in a game and real life clothing is disgusting.
How are so many people missing the point of this analogy so completely?

Vikarion
Caldari
State Trade Consortium
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:10:00 - [2164]
 

Originally by: Olivor
This was the absolute final straw after nearly four years, my other accounts desubbed and this account running on PLEX at which time it runs out I have absolutely no intention, at all, of renewing it.

This devblog is utterly insulting to any player. To miss the point so spectacularly, to offer no apologies for this god awful mess and make parallels between some graphics in a game and real life clothing is disgusting.

**** you, **** your product and **** your company.

CCP / EVE has been going in the wrong direction since ~18 months~ and has made no attempts to U-turn. I sincerely hope that EVE dies horribly, DUST is the mediocre FPS it is shaping up to be and WoD is a massive heap of ****e. I'm sure some of you are nice people and all... but i look forward to you all being unemployed.


This. And fast.

Jules Asner
Van Diemen's Demise
Merciless.
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:13:00 - [2165]
 


Dalton Vanadis
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:14:00 - [2166]
 

At this point, I think my message will be lost in the 70+ pages of others. But I'll give it a go regardless.

CCP has been, easily, my favorite company on this planet. For the time I've played EVE they have always seemed up front and caring to customers, they always seemed to give a **** about the customer and by extension, this would bring them steady, good business.

I won't lie, a lot of things in the last few days have really irked me. Maybe not to the point of unsubbing, but damn close. All I can say is, this is the first time I've seen video game players RIOT. This is the first time I've seen thousands of players unite in under 24 hours to send a company messages of displeasure. I'm pretty sure CCP has gotten more forum responses in 24 hours than most US congressional representatives get in a month. I would think that this would prompt the company to listen.

See, if I don't think about Hilmar's email, or Zulu's rude, stuck-up, and arrogant as hell devblog, or the internal discussion on a topic I thought was closed, or even the absolute misunderstanding of the stated meaning of *micro,* I start to calm down and go to my normal state of, "perhaps they just screwed something up and it'll be fixed in a day or two."

But then I think about the absolute contempt of the player base in Hilmar's email, or the arrogance of Zulu's dev blog, or the money-sucking opinions of a propagandist internal newsletter (lets call a spade a spade here), or the complete disconnect with reality on the NeX. And really, the only shining beacon left to me is Pann's amazingly well-mannered olive branch (thank you!) and the amazing work that people like Soundwave have done (again, thank you! BFF made Soundwave my most favorite dev evah). It's hard to cling to those small gems when it seems like the higher ups are completely disconnected with reality.

Essentially, the players have given you an easy out, take it, all they want is information about a game that many pay for a YEAR in advance, that many have dedicated YEARS of their lives to. Manage expectations, be honest and forthcoming, you will solve a lot of this. Hopefully the player reaction shows you that doing this sooner rather than later is in your best interests.

Please, please, I love the potential WiS offers, you enchanted me at fanfest, you've shown you are committed to player requests, please don't let something as ******edly stupid as definitively answering one question derail you as a company. As Pann said, you have long since passed the expiration date on our patience, the farther you go away from it, the more it's going to sour. I don't know what you've got roiling internally right now, but you best get it sorted.

So to end: I like EVE, ima little ****ed, I have good memories new and old, most devs I like (there are a few that I may not have glowing opinions of, but I'll keep that opinion to myself and my corpmates), It's hard not to get ****ed at the material out there now, I'm still excited for the future of EVE, but you really do need to hop on the full-disclosure bandwagon (or at least some variant that you were on earlier), and I really hope this turns out for the better and that we can all go back to happiness, puppies, and rainbows.

But seriously, you guys suck at PR lately, you've been doing way more damage control than is normal, you should be structured so damage control never need occur because you are that in tune with your customers, the products they buy and want (actually say they want, this is NOT a no means yes situation).

Just my long ass two cents, hopefully you'll take a little time and notice it.

Spyra Gryra
Cruoris Seraphim
Exalted.
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:15:00 - [2167]
 

I'm not upset, I'm disappointed.

PsyBlade
Caldari
Havoc Violence and Chaos
Merciless.
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:15:00 - [2168]
 

not sure if it has been posted yet here, but read this

Quote:
— Email Starts—-

Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 18:16:54 -0400
To: riverini@gmail.com
Subject: ccp ceo global msg sent today
From: evewatch@hush.com
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=”UTF-8″
Message-Id: <20110623221654.CF1E76F438@smtp.hushmail.com>

sent by hilmar to ccp global list-

(strt)

We live in interesting times; in fact CCP is the kind of company that if things get repetitive we instinctively crank it up a notch. That, we certainly have done this week. First of we have Incarna, an amazing technological and artistic achievement. A vision from years ago realized to a point that no one could have imaged but a few months ago. It rolls out without a hitch, is in some cases faster than what we had before, this is the pinnacle of professional achievement. For all the noise in the channel we should all stand proud, years from now this is what people will remember.

But we have done more, not only have we redefined the production quality one can apply to virtual worlds with the beautiful Incarna but we have also defined what it really means to make virtual reality more meaningful than real life when it comes to launching our new virtual goods currency, Aurum.

Naturally, we have caught the attention of the world. Only a few weeks ago we revealed more information about DUST 514 and now we have done it again by committing to our core purpose as a company by redefining assumptions. After 40 hours we have already sold 52 monocles, generating more revenue than any of the other items in the store.

This we have done after months of research by a group of highly competent professionals, soliciting input and perspective from thought leaders and experts in and around our industry. We have communicated our intention here internally in very wide circles through the Virtual Economy Summit presentation at the GSM, our Fearless newsletter, sprint reviews, email lists and multiple other channels. This should not come as a surprise to anyone.

Currently we are seeing _very predictable feedback_ on what we are doing. Having the perspective of having done this for a decade, I can tell you that this is one of the moments where we look at what our players do and less of what they say. Innovation takes time to set in and the predictable reaction is always to resist change.

We went out with a decisive strategy on pricing and we will stay the course and not flip flop around or knee jerk react to the predictable. That is not saying nothing will change, on the contrary, in fact we know that success in this space is through learning and adapting to _what is actually happening_ and new knowledge gained in addition to what we knew before and expected.

All that said, I couldn’t be prouder of what we have accomplished as a company, changing the world is hard and we are doing it as so many times before! Stay the course, we have done this many times before.

(end)


how ****ing far from reality are you that you cannot and are going to refuse to listen to your customer base saying this is the moment to be proud?

this is in fact CCP has just shot themselves through the head and are now on IC to try and remain alive.

Carmoisine Bavaire
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:15:00 - [2169]
 

Originally by: Olivor
This was the absolute final straw after nearly four years, my other accounts desubbed and this account running on PLEX at which time it runs out I have absolutely no intention, at all, of renewing it.


4 years and you havent found a Corp yet ?
Man, I hope you found out how to load skills...Rolling Eyes

Hockston Axe
Amarr
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:17:00 - [2170]
 

Since I’m not the type (read: not a fool) to buy MT stuff in the first place, my only concern with it is that it of course is always just for vanity items. My concern over your pricing strategy is that it’s making CCP and Eve look bad to the larger gaming community. Using your analogy of designer clothes the simple truth of the matter is that the quality of what is currently being offered is like selling Walmart quality for a designer price and that’s always going to lead to ridicule.

My main concern over Incarna and I hope you plan to change it at some point is how we are foisted to always use the CQ. It’s understandable that you’d want to start off a new player in CQ when they first log on, and that you want to test your hardware by having as many people using it as possible at first. However once that’s done it should be obvious that it hampers the smooth flow of gameplay more than it helps it to go through all that rigmarole just to do the quick simple things that so often happen while docked. It should also hopefully be obvious that you wouldn’t want to be paying for all the hardware usage on your end of all the people who are in CQ but not actually using it for any gameplay purpose that requires it. Also once there is something to do in Incarna people won’t want your servers wasting resources on people that are just avatar spinning while they’re trying to do actual Incarna things. The obvious and easy solution is Dock->Hangar->Incarna->Hangar/or straight Undock. Sometimes you’ll want to get out of your ship and play around with your avatar, and other times you just want to do some quick nothing. Having to achieve that via a graphics menu option with it always on/off isn’t a good way to go about it.

My other concern about Incarna is that I really hope you aren’t planning on doing any big marketing push until Incarna is ready for mass consumption. If you do a push now you will get a lot of new trials, and an awful lot of people that don’t sub up due to the ‘what’s the point’ nature of just having a CQ. Quite a few of those people won’t ever come back for a second look, and you’ve just lost out on a lot of potential customers.

All the nerdrage aside your customers are generally very loyal and want Eve to be the biggest and best-est game there is and they fear for the future (with cause imo.)

Kavin Alavandar
Extropy Dianoetics
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:17:00 - [2171]
 

Edited by: Kavin Alavandar on 25/06/2011 07:18:46
Originally by: PsyBlade
how ****ing far from reality are you that you cannot and are going to refuse to listen to your customer base saying this is the moment to be proud?
It's referencing you, basically.

Desigre
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:18:00 - [2172]
 

Just read that hilmar email leaked, thats it for me.

After my accounts run out of time, im not renewing them.

Shame to loose access to this unique game, but if current direction continues, its not unique too long.

After 2.5 years of playing best game in the world, it has come down to this. Walk with your wallet, becouse game company dosent listen to voice of reason, but are in love with theyr own grand vision...

And for bean counters, thats 4 accounts payed by cash. Have a good luck, your going to need it just to survive.

TripodAl
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:21:00 - [2173]
 

"If I wanted to pay money for each of my internet bullets I might as well buy real bullets and put them in real people."

Sylthi
Minmatar
Coreward Pan-Galactic
Holy Empire of The Unshaven
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:21:00 - [2174]
 

FOR ALL THOSE STILL WONDERING HOW FAR MT WILL GO:

For all of you who keep asking the question: Are non-vanity items in CCP's plans to come to Eve MT? The reason that they are NOT answering you directly is that they HAVE already answered all of us directly in the confirmed authentic leaked Newsletter. We just weren't supposed to SEE it.

The author is speaking directly about Eve, and I quote DIRECTLY from page 9:

"Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization: some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright."

If you don't believe me, go read it for yourself.

They are NOT talking hypothetically. They are NOT discussing different options that might come to Eve. Do NOT believe all the Dev lies saying that they are.

They are talking about FACT in the Newsletter. They are talking about what is COMING to Eve VERY SOON (without the TM).

And, when we all complained about it, we were told by the Senior Producer and the CEO themselves to: STFU and GTFO. Oh, and I forgot we got a healthy dose of "How DARE you ungrateful scum question us your Lords and Masters?!?!?"

So yeah, CCP has VERY much answered the question about how far MT is going. Just read a little for yourself, you'll see.

Kavin Alavandar
Extropy Dianoetics
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:22:00 - [2175]
 

Edited by: Kavin Alavandar on 25/06/2011 07:30:45
Originally by: Desigre
Walk with your wallet, becouse game company dosent listen to voice of reason, but are in love with theyr own grand vision...
That's what game design is. Design what you want and hope it works. That's the passion. It's not for you. It's for the game.

Designing something not because you believe in it, but because some backseat designers think they know better (while accusing you of being arrogant and out of touch!) is quite a bizarre thing to expect.

‘Voice of reason’ indeed. Have read this thread? Good grief. Telling CCP what you like and don't (and why), and indeed, walking with your wallet, is one thing, but the bulk of the feedback is just asinine, selfish, ignorant, obtuse tantrums; not to mention judgments and forecasts made of a business of which one knows nothing.

Coronolus
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:23:00 - [2176]
 

Hm, any chance we could finally get a response to "Will you include non-vanity items for MT?".

I don't mind ship skins or fluffy clothes, but I would hate to see "golden ammo", "improved Raven Mk II" or (worse!!!) additional ship fitting slots for real money.

Sylthi
Minmatar
Coreward Pan-Galactic
Holy Empire of The Unshaven
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:27:00 - [2177]
 

Originally by: Coronolus
Hm, any chance we could finally get a response to "Will you include non-vanity items for MT?".

I don't mind ship skins or fluffy clothes, but I would hate to see "golden ammo", "improved Raven Mk II" or (worse!!!) additional ship fitting slots for real money.


As stated in my post a couple up from yours, this already HAS been answered. Do the research for yourself if you don't believe me.

Cheers mate.


Kronossan
Bellum Esca
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:27:00 - [2178]
 

This almost made my cry before I went to bed last night. The Hilmar internal mail I just read really did make me cry :/

PsyBlade
Caldari
Havoc Violence and Chaos
Merciless.
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:29:00 - [2179]
 

Originally by: Kronossan
This almost made my cry before I went to bed last night. The Hilmar internal mail I just read really did make me cry :/


can you point to us where the bad man has touched you?

mercury glitter
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:30:00 - [2180]
 

Japanese jeans?????? Are u serious??????? I cant beleive I pay this ****sticks wage.

Florestan Bronstein
24th Imperial Crusade
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:30:00 - [2181]
 

Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 25/06/2011 07:31:43
Originally by: Coronolus
"golden ammo", "improved Raven Mk II"

that's still a long time down the line

If I were CCP my first unique ship BPC sold in the NeX would be the Tornado, possibly even in limited quantity.

That's much less controversial than a direct upgrade to an existing ship and they know that some of their customers have been waiting for that ship a long time now.

Troy LS
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:30:00 - [2182]
 

boycott sony till they drop Dust?

Cyaxares II
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:33:00 - [2183]
 

Originally by: Troy LS
boycott sony till they drop Dust?

I think you should totally boycott the local catering service CCP uses until it stops supplying CCP.


Hoya en Marland
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:34:00 - [2184]
 

Edited by: Hoya en Marland on 25/06/2011 07:35:28

This blog would be funny if it weren't sad. Well, at least it's all clear now and we know where this game is heading. They made a decision so I made one too.

R.I.P. EVE

Khandara Seraphim
Amarr
StarHunt
Fallout Project
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:37:00 - [2185]
 

We went from the most amazing, unique experience in the history of gaming to a laggy, glitchy, bug-ridden mess... and now they're planning to give a leg up to whoever pays them the most.

How did we get here? How?

I dreamed a dream that was Eve. And now that dream is dead.

Ciar Meara
Amarr
Virtus Vindice
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:38:00 - [2186]
 

This devblog is pointless and as predicted held all the elements of a "**** you and calm the **** down" You'd been better off saying nothing.

Discussion? Really, why does it go into detailed explanations how to implement in systems in Dust and WoD and Eve after the discussion?

Brands? Really, well have fun with you 1000 dollar jeans, perhaps paris hilton might by a few. (maybe you think you are edgy and daring launching stuff like that but, sadly, you are mistaken)

****storm? No kidding, I am done here.

Ciar Meara
Amarr
Virtus Vindice
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:41:00 - [2187]
 

Originally by: PsyBlade

Quote:
— Email Starts—-

Date: Thu, 23 Jun 2011 18:16:54 -0400
To: riverini@gmail.com
Subject: ccp ceo global msg sent today
From: evewatch@hush.com
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=”UTF-8″
Message-Id: <20110623221654.CF1E76F438@smtp.hushmail.com>

sent by hilmar to ccp global list-

(strt)

We live in interesting times; in fact CCP is the kind of company that if things get repetitive we instinctively crank it up a notch. That, we certainly have done this week. First of we have Incarna, an amazing technological and artistic achievement. A vision from years ago realized to a point that no one could have imaged but a few months ago. It rolls out without a hitch, is in some cases faster than what we had before, this is the pinnacle of professional achievement. For all the noise in the channel we should all stand proud, years from now this is what people will remember.

But we have done more, not only have we redefined the production quality one can apply to virtual worlds with the beautiful Incarna but we have also defined what it really means to make virtual reality more meaningful than real life when it comes to launching our new virtual goods currency, Aurum.

Naturally, we have caught the attention of the world. Only a few weeks ago we revealed more information about DUST 514 and now we have done it again by committing to our core purpose as a company by redefining assumptions. After 40 hours we have already sold 52 monocles, generating more revenue than any of the other items in the store.

This we have done after months of research by a group of highly competent professionals, soliciting input and perspective from thought leaders and experts in and around our industry. We have communicated our intention here internally in very wide circles through the Virtual Economy Summit presentation at the GSM, our Fearless newsletter, sprint reviews, email lists and multiple other channels. This should not come as a surprise to anyone.

Currently we are seeing _very predictable feedback_ on what we are doing. Having the perspective of having done this for a decade, I can tell you that this is one of the moments where we look at what our players do and less of what they say. Innovation takes time to set in and the predictable reaction is always to resist change.

We went out with a decisive strategy on pricing and we will stay the course and not flip flop around or knee jerk react to the predictable. That is not saying nothing will change, on the contrary, in fact we know that success in this space is through learning and adapting to _what is actually happening_ and new knowledge gained in addition to what we knew before and expected.

All that said, I couldn’t be prouder of what we have accomplished as a company, changing the world is hard and we are doing it as so many times before! Stay the course, we have done this many times before.

(end)


how ****ing far from reality are you that you cannot and are going to refuse to listen to your customer base saying this is the moment to be proud?

this is in fact CCP has just shot themselves through the head and are now on IC to try and remain alive.


If this is true they have gone crazy. I'll be "doing" not saying from now on.

Van Flegg
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:42:00 - [2188]
 

Unsubbed. It's clear by that e-mail certain bigwigs in CCP aren't even bothering to listen to us. The only thing Hilmar is intrested in is increase/decrease in revenue. Money is the only voice he hears in terms of wether something is a success or failure in Eve. Player out-cry doesn't matter - after all, we always protest change, right?

So there it is, 1 more unsub. I just became a miniscule negative stat in CCP's future financial report. That's the most attention I'm ever going to recieve by CCP if I want to get my point across. How ****ing pathetic is that?

What really annoys me is it's obvious not everyone in CCP is on the same wave length. There are still some (maybe even most) employees who likely do care about what we think. These employees need to start making their voices heard. Leaking these documents to the public isn't enough when the public's reaction obviously means nothing to your bosses.

Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:43:00 - [2189]
 

Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 25/06/2011 07:46:32

Originally by: Ciar Meara


--snip Hilmars email--

If this is true they have gone crazy. I'll be "doing" not saying from now on.


Confirmed by CCP Navigator. Internal CCP communication thread lock.

edit: bah too long

TripodAl
Against ALL Authorities
Posted - 2011.06.25 07:43:00 - [2190]
 

NO worries as soon as CCP ****s eve players for ever dollar, and in process turns the game to ****. You can be sure the DUST and WOD will fail without the eve teet to feed on.


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