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Gurgeh Morat
7th Interval
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:57:00 - [1531]

Edited by: Gurgeh Morat on 24/06/2011 23:59:57
Don't just unsub.

The Subscription metric has a lot of latency. Some of you have months or even up to a year of playtime - by then what will eve be?

to make any difference at all you have to hurt the metrics now.

There is one other metric they care about - server stats: logins.

Do not login to Eve & watch the server stats fall, that is the most immediate message you can send to the management. They don't listen to what you write on the forum, only what the graphs tell them.

If you object to non vanity MT - DO NOT LOGIN!

Edit: How do you do Big & Yellow?

Posted - 2011.06.24 23:57:00 - [1532]

For some reason this song comes to mind F**k you

Smoke Adian
League of Gentlemen
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:57:00 - [1533]

Edited by: Smoke Adian on 24/06/2011 23:58:30
Originally by: Kynder Furlow
"Will MT be limited only to vanity items?" .. was responded to with "Yes."

Done and dusted.. ?

Yes, they did promise that - you are correct. This whole s***storm is because the internal newsletter revealed that CCP is lying to us and is very actively considering rl money for everything from ammo to ships - something that a LEAD DESIGNER SUPPORTS.

So the issue is that they promised one thing publicly, but are secretly plotting behind everyone's back and now they are defending this soundwave idiot who is propagating this "money for in game advantage" mentality we were promised would never effect EVE.

I hate how CCPE people keep saying soundwave was just doing what he was asked. First of all why are they promoting someone whose business philosophy is at complete odds with Hilmar's and all prior public statements.

Secondly, why didn't soundwave have enough integrity to say "no thanks, we've specifically promised to NEVER GO DOWN THAT ROAD, so I'm not going write out that argument in an attempt to sway the employee base towards that direction".

The Tuskers
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:58:00 - [1534]

I cancelled my accounts a few hours before this blog was published. Having read it, I'm feeling all shiny and validated and stuff. Thanks!

Encina Technologies
Namtz' aar K'in
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:58:00 - [1535]

Originally by: Gurgeh Morat
Don't just unsub.

The Subscription metric has a lot of latency. Some of you have months or even up to a year of playtime - by then what will eve be?

to make any difference at all you have to hurt the metrics now.

There is one other metric they care about - server stats: logins.

Do not login to Eve & watch the server stats fall, that is the most immediate message you can send to the management. They don't listen to what you write on the forum, only what the graphs tell them.

If you object to non vanity MT - DO NOT LOGIN!

Erm, cancellation asks for a reason. Do you suppose the message you supply will only be sent to relevant places in 6 months when your account expires?

Excessum Industries
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:58:00 - [1536]

Originally by: agram tabris
first of all: has the CSM been able to check out this devblog before release? (and give you few hints how to respond?)

I understand many of the current CSM members have checked in with a "Yeah, we saw it, offered a ton of changes, the only thing they did was yank an even more inappropriate analogy." That is, btw, heavily paraphrased. Although... damn it makes you wander what could have been worse about that blog.

Originally by: agram tabris
i'm not sure how to address and answer all those questions - even if only 5% of all posts contains a question worth asking there is a ton of answers to be given. unfortunately it seems you (CCP) didn't do your homework; let me try a comparison: if you were deaf,blind on one eye and could only see about 60% on the other you could not miss those threadnaroks out there!!!!

this devblog gives nearly no new information, no answers, no apologize to at least calm down some overheated players/forum warriors. instead it gives us even more reason to be upset.
if you read it a bit more closely on the arguments/explanations there(if there are any at all) and notice the way it is written it's insulting, not to say disgusting. its a shame!!!

To be fair... CCP Manifest (IIRC?) spend hours in the multi-hundred page former thread, telling people he was reading carefully and compiling notes. Now... obviously those notes never made it to CCP Zulu. But somewhere in the CCP offices there should be a list of complaints the playerbase has with the current corp. vision. Or maybe it got chucked in the trash as not meeting with the corporate vision. It's highly possible CCP corporate thinks we're simply outliers who can safely be ignored, and therefore our subscription numbers are not worth addressing.

Originally by: agram tabris
this devblog screams: "we don't give a **** about you and your opinion!!!" and "if you can't afford it you're not rich enough!" i'm not sure what would be the best way to write an appropriate devblog/response, but you sir (ccp zulu) are definetely doing it wrong!!! even your comparisons with 1000$ desiger-brand jeans or golf players (leaked newsletter) show us that some of you ppl seem to need an extensive reality check!!

Alexis Sachs
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:58:00 - [1537]

Edited by: Alexis Sachs on 24/06/2011 23:58:46
Originally by: Katra Novac
Originally by: Bieber Fever
Clearly the best PR is to insult the customer and address no issues.

They know people have invested a lot of time in their characters and would be reluctant to leave.

Doubt you'll hear much until Monday now and by that time they'll be hoping that much of the anger has exhausted itself.

Items that give advantages are coming, why because they could easily have cleared up this mess if they wised to do so by answering that question and they've had plenty of time to do so.

Also the timing of this thread was deliberate so that you'll wear yourself out debating it in this thread so that by Monday hopefully you care less about it.

Items that give advantages generally sell better than just plain cosmetics ones, we call it greed they'll just say that's business.

Agreed, but my anger is not going to magically vanish over the weekend.

And you know what, as I said in the 200+ monster thread I kinda feel this is an all hands on deck situation. Screw your weekend plans CCP people - damage control mode is ON! This is not the time to hole up in your 1k jeans being elite and :awesome:

Tyr Vanagandr
PIE Inc.
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:58:00 - [1538]

Edited by: Tyr Vanagandr on 24/06/2011 23:59:06
Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.

Salus Novus
Test Friends Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.06.24 23:59:00 - [1539]

10 days left on my last active account, its been fun 0/.

Posted - 2011.06.24 23:59:00 - [1540]

Dear CCP,

In the two years I've been playing EVE I have become very fond of it. I think you guys have been doing a great job on a lot of things. Untill yesterday I thought I'd never stop playing EVE, however now I've decided to quit if and when the Aurum-thing gets out of hand.

Using real money in a game through plex is not something I like but I understand the black market has pushed you to it. However, Aurum has only one purpose: feed your wallet, so be carefull what you offer with it. (remaps, skillpoints, standing,... are definitely on my blacklist) I'd rather have you increase my subscription cost with 25% if you guys really need the money.

That's my opinion, but I'm am not the only one. I feel a large part of this community is begging you to listen and take their concerns seriously. This is the kind of thing that might crash an MMO of this size.

This dev blog does not answer our concerns. One question remains:
ARE YOU MOVING PAST VANITY ONLY ITEMS FOR MICROTRANSACTIONS, AND IN WHAT MANNER?I understand answering this question is not easy and might take some time,
but I believe it is in the game's interest to make your stand and make it clear to the community.

Sincerely, a concerned player.

ps: please forgive me any typo's

Levarr Burton
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:00:00 - [1541]

I normally love and appreciate your devblogs, even the technical ones that I don't understand. I love to read about changes happening in the game, and how and why those changes will be undertaken.

This devblog, however, is useless and insulting to your player base.

Much like many of the recent expansions, this devblog focuses entirely on "fluff," while ignoring the real, pertinent issues.

This devblog tells me that either your PR team is incredibly clueless, incompetent and illiterate; or you believe your customers are so pants-on-head that they can't tell their own anus from a hole in the ground.

It should be telling you something when the devblog, spawned by a 210-page (and counting) threadnought produces its own 40-page (and counting) threadnought within hours of being posted.

Let me tell you, CCP, what this devblog does:
-It denies the problems related to rolling out Incarna, including: a borked Mac patch (which was known about prior to release, yet was still pushed out to prime-time) which required the complete re-download of the client, and the nearly 5-hour extension on the planned downtime.
-It denies the, near universal, performance issues your users have experienced with Incarna, on all supported platforms.
-It implies that the disappointment with the prices in the NeX store are somehow the fault of players expecting prices in-line with other, existing MT stores, and not a failure of communication on your part.
-It implies (mistakenly) that (in CCP's understanding) the main source of frustration with the patch IS the high price of goods in the NeX store; rather than the poor performance and quality of the content provided.
-It implies that we as customers have no right to be concerned or upset when CCP says one thing to our face, and then actively discusses the exact opposite in its internal documents.

What this devblog has NOT done:
-Clarified, in the slightest, CCP's position on what the future of MT is going to be in EVE.
-Shown that CCP understands that it is the (justified, apparently) worry that MT will creep into aspects of EVE beyond vanity items which is causing the most anger and anxiety, not the high cost of the initial (lackluster) batch of items.
-Acknowledged that Incarna is not functioning particularly well on a large percentage of your customers hardware. Even though all these hardware issues were raised during testing.(let's face it, it looks like crap, 1/4 CQs, takes forever to load, and it runs extremely poorly even on high-end hardware - I like the turrets, though)
-Given insight into why such an unfinished feature such as CQ was allowed to go prime-time, rather than using the Incursion method of several smaller patches to introduce the new content AS IT IS READY.
-Acknowledged that the current Incarna UI is less functional than the previous in-station UI, or enlightened your user base as to what is being done to rectify that situation.
-Shown that you recognize why there is such an expectation gap between what we were promised ("sup customers, can't fix anything that's broken, because everyone is making Incarna AWESOME") and what we received (brown, muddy textures that crush high-end graphics cards, and clipping problems that other games resolved in 1998).
-Apologized for how poorly this situation has been handled up to this point.

There, I even made it all point-form like for you, CCP.

Sakura Zendragon
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:02:00 - [1542]

Edited by: Sakura Zendragon on 25/06/2011 00:03:16
(nevermind... please delete)

ilove fallout3
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:02:00 - [1543]

Edited by: ilove fallout3 on 25/06/2011 00:09:07
Dear CCP, i write this with concern and love for this game and i realize the words are harsh, but they do hold TRUTH.

CCP committed SUICIDE and they dont even know it.

I'm gonna start with the Noble exchange. NOBODY GIVES A ****!!! $70 for a monocle is ******ed but nobody cared that much about the prices because they were so outrageous that nobody bought it. It just showed how outright stupid you are when it came to this sort of thing, and im glad that newsletter got leaked. Now we know what you guys were planning on doing.

Off to CQ! OK, make the damn thing OPTIONAL! It slows my client down to 15 FPS and im running a high quality laptop with and NVIDIA card in it. So i said, "Oh look, you can turn it off!" So i did, and i got the big **** YOU door. That was nice, not only did u make something that was functionally useless and messed up our FPS, you also decided that if a person wanted to play without lag that they could screw themselves for all you cared.

That newsletter was not a series of opinions, and you know it. You said in the Newsletter that: "The question of virtual good sales is not 'to do, or not to do?' Rather, it's 'how do we do this?' " Now im no english major, but that is NOT an opinion by any means. That was a clear and defined statement, and an absolutely foolish statement at that.

I used to brag about EVE, how great it was, how it was DIFFERENT than any other game i played, no MT in the game i loved, and that's why i LOVED it. I wore an EVE-online shirt to school some days and i would get approached by random people that asked about the game, and i told them what the game was and i encouraged them to play it. Well, not anymore. I hope that you show up to Comic-Con so i can give u a piece of my mind personally, and i want a high level staff member there too.

Trust takes years to build and seconds to destroy. And what u did to us CCP is called LYING. And you only do this so that u can work on your ******ED other projects that will somehow, you hope, make u money.

And worst of all, money wont make you happy, and your not going to have money when we rage-quit because the game that we love has been destroyed by greedy people.

I dont think you get it, YOU WORK FOR US, we are your financial backers, and if we were the stockholders in your company, we'd fire any of you that were on this little MT boat.

So, what can you do CCP? You can start by ELIMINATING the Noble Exchange and all of that MT bull****. Gone, forever, never to return. I want, no, i DEMAND a written agreement from all of the people who work on EVE to NEVER have MT enter this game. Not any way, not any form. And for CQ, give me the option to disembark from my ship. Make the content of CQ so good that i want to leave my ship. Because right now, it sucks and all it does is cause my client to lag.

Start focusing on Internet Spaceships, what made this game great. The past 3 expansions have done nothing but cosmetic fixes that have done 0 to why we play this game. I want more PVP focused releases that helps to drive this game and the economy.

Nobody is going to play a game that they feel does not interest them, no matter how good it looks.

Yes it's a business, but its OUR business, and the sooner you wake up to smell the torches burning in your yard, the better.

With hope and concern,

Delphina Amaranthus
Cypher Industries.
Fade 2 Black
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:02:00 - [1544]

CCP Zulu...

I think you've been buying too many pairs of $1000 jeans.

I agree with the link posted on the first page of responses...the response by Citrute.

Posted - 2011.06.25 00:02:00 - [1545]


So you give us a useless expansion, introduce microtransactions that everyone knows will expand into non-vanity things like skill points, and you honestly expect the players to like it? Just how far from reality are you?

Posted - 2011.06.25 00:02:00 - [1546]

We will gradually introduce items at other price points, definitely lower and probably higher than whatĎs in the store today. We hope you enjoy them and are as passionate about them as you are of the current items that are for sale.

ARE YOU ****ING NUTSExclamation


Diablo Ex
The Devil's Reject's
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:02:00 - [1547]

Clearly the Butterfly has left the Sandbox.

Unfortunately, I'm at this point paid ahead for the next 3 months. If I unsub at this point I would be burning almost $45.00 in unused Plex, which has been already put towards my subscription. I seriously doubt that any unused portion will be paid back. Forget getting another red cent out of me though. When the time runs out I'm not going to renew, period!!!

The only thing of any real value in this game is Time Spent training skills. If you can't recognize that then go ahead and buy your BLING Things. Unfortunately, CCP Zulu spoke VOLUMES in what he so shoddily avoided, and that's Pay2Win Game Breaking MT's. You know it's coming, and I know it's coming, so I'm gone.

CCP YOU HAVE 3 MONTHS TO PROVE ME WRONG, But I think the FAILSCADE has already began, You don't have 3 months.

Xarolith Speedstrike
Angels Templar
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:02:00 - [1548]

So this is the answer that we get? No really, is this the official stance from CCP? Because if it is then this is not only reflecting poorly on the company, but now the door is open to kick things up a notch as it were.

First off, letís start with pricing even though that THIS IS NOT THE MAIN ISSUE AT STAKE. We as the player base should, if we choose to do so go into the NeX and be able to pick things out that define us better without breaking our wallets. If I was to give a fair price for the monocle I would say $7.50 (RL Dollars) should be its price. Why $7.50? Let us use your logic of people wanting to pay more to look nice as an example. So we know that in time we can spend 350 million - 400 million isk in getting a plex, in the real world that would be enough for 10 generations to live very comfortably, but in real life translates into $14.95 a plex. Lets use 400 million for our example.

Now in this example letís say you as CCP develop a vanity item that gives our avatar an Iphone, and letís say it is modeled after the World's most expensive Iphone which currently stands at 8 million dollars in Real Life Cash. Well if we want to look as nice in game as we do out of game, I might as well get my hands on this Iphone right? So how much should it cost to get the equivalent of 8 million dollars in real life? so 1 Plex = 3500 Aur which in turn means that 1 Aur = $114285.71 isk And to get a real life equivalent would then be 80 AUR to by myself this Vanity Item, not 12000 AUR to by a Virtual Object. And the cost of 80 AUR is... equivalent to $.19 -.25 dollars (233.33 AUR per dollar Ratio). And that is what I would say should be the rate at which they charge for NeX Items, but since that is unrealistic how about low end items at $.25 and high end cost $2.00 an item.

If you were to use those prices and those numbers, not only would this fix a problem, but chances are this would bring in more revenue then charging $60.00 for buying glasses that is missing the other half.

HOWEVER! The NeX Prices are not the problem here, the main problem is the fact that in the "Fearless" Brochure you were bringing up non-vanity items. While I do agree that in some regard it is a good idea to discuss controversial topics, but DONT DO IT BEHIND CLOSED DOORS, PERIOD! By doing what you did not only have you ostracized the players, you have also unequivocally thrown the CSM under the bus. And on top of that if I recall correctly the player base did vote on the NeX in the CSM portion of the forums and everything that I saw was NO, and yet you still continued to talk about this behind closed doors continued to implement it even when we the players voted NO on the subject. And one last thing for this part here, a person's opinion affects their judgment and character and the things that a person can and will do in real life, so even though it can be that someoneís opinion that X Y and Z are bad, they will always take action that will reflect their opinion that X Y and Z are bad.

So part two is that you have betrayed the player's trust by pulling this stunt. But it doesnít stop there with the mere suggestion of non-vanity items being tossed around you as a company have scared/ ****ed/ [Insert Negative Emotion here] for a huge part of the player base who understand this game completely and realize the implication of tossing this language around behind closed doors. And trust me it scares me a lot as a veteran of this game. If CCP were to implement Non-Vanity items it would break what makes EvE special, which is a player run world with little to no interference from the Developers and by implementing non-vanity items it would take the sandbox that you have given us away from the players.

However, in the end all I can do is hang on for as long as possible and hope that non-vanity items never appear in the game. And if they do, is the day I will leave EvE for the last time.

Katra Novac
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:03:00 - [1549]

Originally by: Smagd
Originally by: Gurgeh Morat
Don't just unsub.

The Subscription metric has a lot of latency. Some of you have months or even up to a year of playtime - by then what will eve be?

to make any difference at all you have to hurt the metrics now.

There is one other metric they care about - server stats: logins.

Do not login to Eve & watch the server stats fall, that is the most immediate message you can send to the management. They don't listen to what you write on the forum, only what the graphs tell them.

If you object to non vanity MT - DO NOT LOGIN!

Erm, cancellation asks for a reason. Do you suppose the message you supply will only be sent to relevant places in 6 months when your account expires?

No because your account is cancelled at the time you cancel, but existing time left on the account is still honuored. It probably just sticks the reason on some daily report somewhere.

Thayne en Welle
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:03:00 - [1550]

The biggest uprising in EVE history, forums filled with rage, mass the response?

Could have saved time and simply said "No, you are all wrong. We know what you want better than you do"

So glad I canceled.

Posted - 2011.06.25 00:03:00 - [1551]

Edited by: TZeer on 25/06/2011 00:03:31
We hope you enjoy them and are as passionate about them as you are of the current items that are for sale.

When did a 200 page rage-thread, about concerns regarding non-vanity items with actual game changing abilities, turn into people being passionate about their clothing???

Seriously CCP? Are you so stuck up and out of touch with the community that you are unable to read what is put in front of you?

Crack is bad for you mmmmkay.

Hieronymus Alexandre
Fashionable Enterprises
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:03:00 - [1552]

Posting just to do my part to keep these complaints from being dismissed as a "vocal minority." I've been around long enough to see many vocal minorities and none of them came close to this.

As far as the pricing issue is concerned, Zulu's argument is ridiculous. In the EVE world, capsuleers are gods among men who think nothing of tossing around money in amounts that would shame a planetary government. Even the poorest newbie could afford to strut around in a solid gold tuxedo.

Gurgeh Morat
7th Interval
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:04:00 - [1553]

Originally by: Smagd

Erm, cancellation asks for a reason. Do you suppose the message you supply will only be sent to relevant places in 6 months when your account expires?

Not at all, but do you think the CFO or upper management read those? Also as I said before, they are expecting some unsubs, but undoubtedly are relying on the heady, addictive properties of Eve that was to ensure you keep playing and eventually accept their BS

If you can show them that you can break the addiction and they see the server utilisation dropping like a stone they will take notice.

You do realise under utilisation of their hardware affects their bottom line right?

Stormseige Adraelia
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:04:00 - [1554]

Edited by: Stormseige Adraelia on 25/06/2011 00:06:39
Originally by: Reid Lutman
To those having hardware problems:
People complaining of broken hardware need to contact their hardware supplier or upgrade. No hardware pushed to it's limit should break. You have to expect that over time hardware requirements are going to increase and so will the burden on your hardware.

Out of all the screaming this caught my eye the most. If your hardware has failed it had nothing to do with the incarna release I build machines and I understand a little factor called hardware tolerances. The gear you put in your machine:

1. Must be compatible with every other piece in the machine
2. have all the appropiate updated drivers (this is never the case with straight out of package software for the hardware)
3. must be properly seated in the machine and the machine should be cleaned regularly a.k.a. blow the dust bunnies out.

A less known fact is heat destroys components over time this is where you go "How long have I had this video card in my machine?". I recently replaced my video cards before incarna because they died on me have not had a major issue with incarna itself yes some minor **** like being stuck in station without functions after a clone jump "relog" or the ever present this CQ was not designed for that station failed interfacing "relog".

If you just bought the item and put it in your machine and it fails scream at the manufacturer not CCP.

I would also like an answer about the non-vanity item sales because if eve turns into a pay to win game I will go the **** back to wizards 101. I don't play eve to "pay to win" I play eve to enjoy an very rich dynamic environment in which there seem to be endless posibilities instead of "plug in cartridge play levels 1-50 unplug cartridge find a new damn game".

Posted - 2011.06.25 00:04:00 - [1555]

I want a refund on my account. I bought a year ahead. Id rather have that money back now honestly.

I will not be buying dust. I will not support a CCP product going forward ever with real money after this response.

I will be giving my stuff to my corp mates, so dont ask its already spoken for.

I wish i could vent how i really feel but getting banned isnt worth it.

Midnight Elites
Echelon Rising
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:05:00 - [1556]

Originally by: Maisonian
Originally by: Tamahra
Originally by: Maisonian
Originally by: Grimpak
players: CCP can you please answer our questions.
CCP: well yes, Incarna is awesome and it was deployed relatively smoothly!
players: eh?
CCP: also, the NeX prices reflect elite status!
players: wait what the **** are you ta-
players: dude wha-*banhammer*

this is how it feels, really.

You sir, have +1 internets for redecorating my monitor with tea.

because you laughed so hard or you cried so hard? Because if you read it thorougly, it pretty much resembles whats really going on right now

Laughing at the sheer brilliance with which this has been summarised. And then crying.

that is pretty much how I felt when I pressed "post reply" and saw it posted.

success because I manage to portrait the issue how it seems like, and then I felt somewhat depressed because it really is how it seems like.

pete's sake, in almost 8 years of gaming this is pretty much the biggest can of huge freakin' mutated blood-sucking flesh-eating worms CCP has ever opened.

T20 incident? pebbles on the side of the road
boot.ini? a pothole the size of your index finger and as deep as the nail of your thumb.
the "new forum"? a mild rash.
Incarna? a nuke, a meteor falling, volcanos exploding and 2012 falling on your head.

at the same time.

Nulli Secunda
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:05:00 - [1557]

Originally by: zulupark
successful expansion

You know what, I'm gonna call shenanigans on this one. Not only is it too early to tell for sure, it's a really shaky statement to make.

The deployment itself took only half again as long as initially announced. This is nitpicking of course.

Incarna as a GUI is quite poor. It actually removed functionality compared to the previous expansion, it is more resource hungry and nothing in it can really said to be achieved quicker than using the existing 2d interface layered on top of Incarna.

Incarna as a gameplay feature is sparse, and that's speaking kindly.

Incarna as a means to attract new players to Eve leaves a lot to be desired. Considering that whatever you are trying to attract them AWAY from most likely already has more substantial gameplay than what Incarna currently represents all you can offer is better visuals. While The Captain Quarter isn't ugly, what it displays is hardly competitive compared to what's on the market right now. So that leaves the OTHER 99.9% of Eve gameplay to keep this potential new player entertained, and if they weren't attracted by that to begin with... Well you see were this is going.

Now you may insist that Incarna is a necessary first stepping stone towards something that potential customers will be attracted to. You may argue that Incarna is an expansion for the fledgling pilots out there and nothing for the veterans to freak out over. While I think it's a fair point I'm gonna preempt that by asking a simple question.

If it's not a feature for experienced players, why oh why are you making it mandatory for us?

Regarding the Noble store all you have to do is release some sales figures to set the record straight. If the Eve community really wanted this then you should have had a busy couple of days counting aurum, right?

Mintala Arana
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:05:00 - [1558]

So. I've read the blog post.

First, I agree that the vilification of CCP Soundwave is uncalled for, over the top, excessive, etc. Smile I understood what that issue of "Fearless" was from the start. It was obvious that he'd had been asked to, or had volunteered to, play "Devil's Advocate". (I do that quite a lot, because I've learned that if I think I understand all sides of an argument, there's a good chance I'm wrong.)

Now, my concern: "Pay to win". I don't care about micro-transactions, or macro-transactions, for vanity items, except that I want some to be affordable and appealing to me personally, and nothing in the Noble Market is either. I understand the points that CCP Zulu makes with regard to pricing, though I don't agree with him; something that costs $70+ isn't a micro-transaction any more, it's 4-5 months(!) of game time equivalent.

However, nothing has yet addressed the "pay to win" concern that the leaked issue of "Fearless" creates. The reason that this leaked issue of "Fearless" creates such concern is the timing. Either someone seriously wants to torpedo EVE Online, or someone truly believes that CCP Soundwave was echoing the "party line" inside CCP. "Pay to win" (anything that circumvents in-place game mechanics for someone willing to haul out a credit card) will, if implemented, be the death of EVE, and (I believe) very quickly.

I've already adopted a "wait and see" attitude, but the first hint of anything that conveys even the slightest in game advantage will, as far as I'm concerned, be the end of EVE Online as a game I want to play. I will give away my stuff (no, you can't "haz" it, it'll go to in-game friends), sell my toons (someone might as well enjoy them), give away that stuff, and cancel my accounts.

Demon Azrakel
Narwhals Ate My Duck
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:05:00 - [1559]

I may be wrong, but I think I just read CCP Zulu telling the playerbase to go **** itself...

Consortium Agent
Posted - 2011.06.25 00:06:00 - [1560]

First of all, the very fact that your newsletter was leaked to the public by one of your own (who should be promoted, by the way) would tend to indicate to many of us that they, too, found the message it contained to be opposite of the core values CCP built Eve around - destroying the very sandbox that Eve is by attempting to replicate what every other MMO on the planet is doing.

Has CCP stopped to remember that they're not the typical MMO? Have you guys even played any of the other MMOs that are out there? You do realize that CCP attracts a very distinct crowd because it is one large sandbox where players, ultimately dictate the direction of their own game play in any of many complex directions. You lose more people to complexity than you do to your half-baked ideas. So, given that you have and attract a very different crowd of people than any other MMO on the planet, and CCP used to brag about that, why would you even attempt to replicate what other MMOs are doing? Do you honestly think barbie clothes are going to attract the kinds of players other MMOs do?

As for the newsletter content... Creating such dissent inside your own organization is progressive and helpful? Pitting extreme views one against the other muddles down in the end to... what, exactly? The half-assed smooth delivery of lack lustre patches is what. And if you consider everything you broke with Incarna, being more than the last 2 major patches combined, as being 'the smoothest' then you, my friend, need to cut back on the booze some. Sobriety will shed light on your confused little mind.

I do not buy $1000 jeans. I don't know anybody in the game that buys $1000 jeans... and I've met lots of people since 2004. I don't even know people in real life, in the middle of a global recession soon to turn global depression, that would even consider buying $1000 jeans - and I ain't no broke ass b!tch either and neither are the people I know. How aburd can you be to even compare a handful of pixels to that of a designer jean anyway? A designer jean is a tangible asset. I can wash it, wear it, cut it up into little $100 strips if I so choose, sell it, trade it, get mugged for it, or get it caught in the wheelwell of a semi truck rolling by and be dragged down the hill in it. What can I do with my virtual pixels? Nothing. It's not a tangible asset. I can look at it (ooo pretty) and I can trade hard earned real money for it. What do I get? Prestige? Dear God man... prestige isn't gotten in this game by wearing silk panties - prestige is gotten in this game by shoving two fists up each others asses and ripping out the intestines of your foe. You made Eve that way, and now you want to turn it into rainbow bright and call it prestige? Again, a little less booze mate... a little less booze.

I want WIS, don't get me wrong, I've wanted it since you teased us with it in 2008. But I didn't want nor expect the Noble Exchange or a handful or ugly items being sold for *more than real clothes* under the guise of 'they're designer. The exude prestige'. And we all know where this leads - the MT will envelope and eventually dumb down Eve so that the average WoW player can pay to win. The sandbox will be broken, the shoving two hard-earned and well fought fists part will be gone, and all that will remain is your precious rainbow bright barbieville and a handful of WoW-types jacking each other off for Aurium.

I also didn't expect my video card would overheat. I didn't expect turrets to not show up, brackets to be wrong, corp window to get totally nerfed, black screens, inability to run multiple clients, loss of ship spinning in favor of some dumb rusty door we can't even get through to begin with in CQ, the outright lies and deceit of your company and this GD lipstick you keep rubbing all over this pig. It ain't getting any prettier.

I do hope CCP figures out they're headed the wrong way before it's too late to save the core principles of Eve. But I bet you'll be abandonware instead

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