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Posted - 2011.06.24 21:25:00 - [511]

I've played other mmo's in the past that have have vanity items and ive never bought a thing, and it never affected the game because of that decision, ive played EVE since beta pretty much and this is the first thing CCP have ever done that has ever made me question playing, if CCP turn around and say "vanity items only will be sold" thats not a big issue, anything more and forget it.

You talk about making more money by selling items that can give an ingame advantage over a person who cant afford those items is ridiculous.

Make more money? do this and you will lose a huge amount of the player base.

RU Sirius
Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:25:00 - [512]

You know what this reminds me of? Mubarak's speeches on Egyptian state TV where he completely missed the point and was behind the curve of the events taking place in the streets outside.

Steve Ransom
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:25:00 - [513]

Now IF and this is a big stupid if, They allow Jovian Ships including Battleships and the rest on there. I will be all over that lolRazz

Velani Askiras
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:26:00 - [514]

Originally by: Amber Villaneous
CCP you have lost your collective ****ing mind.

I'm out, -4 subs, bubye.

same here...

-4 subs (doing it right now)

This is very sad, very very sad...

Manos Heimenbarger
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:26:00 - [515]

Originally by: Captain Vayl
You didn't address ANYTHING!!!

What the hell did you do with all the notes and quotes CCPFallout and Manifest have been gathering these last two days?! You disregarded anything that these poor bastards have had to sift through!!

Oh my god THIS!

Kat's Discount Weapon Emporium
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:26:00 - [516]

I'm sorry CCP, you've lost what little respect i had left for you.
All i heard while reading that blog was "Don't whine at us, we're not in the wrong: shut up and give us money for pointless items that are extortionately priced and completely break the immersion of the setting we have built up over half a decade!"

RMT is bad, yes we know that. PLEX was a way to try and combat that, but adding in Aurum and micro-transactions doesn't work if you still have a subscription and at launch you have barely a handful of purchase micro-transaction items at prices that beggar belief. Oh and don't get me started on the Quafe shirts that us Fan Fest goers got - they are low-quality and the fact they are only usable in the character editor if you have them in your hangar at that station is... stupid at best.

Come on, either admit you want a crap-tonne of money from us and don't care about your rich and immersive game any more, or back-pedal and withdraw this rubbish you call an expansion. Give us a serious dev blog or don't bother. You got backed into a corner and know your laundry has been aired in public and it is dirrrrteeee!

Posted - 2011.06.24 21:26:00 - [517]

...that is the single worst devblog and/or apology I have ever read. You managed to pack in an impressive amount of arrogance and ignorance into a neat little package.

I'd been fairly neutral on this debate so far. Wasn't thrilled about Incarna but was looking forward to the winter expansion and didn't mind $70 monocles. But after reading that my opinion of your management team has really tanked. Please spend some more time reading the forum feedback and come back with a better response. It would be sad to see Eve sunk after all this history it has built up.

Scott Ryder
Ministry of War
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:26:00 - [518]


You have to do better then that, try adressing the issue

Dragon's Legion of New Eden
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:26:00 - [519]

As someone who has been accused of being a CCP alt several times so far for supporting CCP... I'm disappointed.

The expectation that $50 for a monocle is okay, is bad. A price reduction would in fact benefit them by increasing sales to an item that doesn't cost them anything to "manufacture".

And for the love of all that is good... higher price points?

thoth rothschild
Method of Destruction
Snatch Victory
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:26:00 - [520]

Dear CCP,

this is an open letter.

I as customer do feel misunderstood and not treated like a a loved paying subscriber to your service. I asked for a feedback on some issues which i feel are quite disturbing.

I care for this game, really. This _was_ the only option i had in the spaceship nichee of the mmo world.
I love this idea but i feel as if only my cash matters and spaceships are getting less and less important.

I do not want walking or avatars. there are so many games featuring avatars and wgo shooting.

Why do i feel completly ignored ?
Why do i feel as if none of our concerns was actually read ?
Why do i feel as if i do not matter.

I'm a sad one now. I wanted to see a pasionate dev talking to me.

All i see at ccp is no more passion it is just give me your

that is not the eve i loved. it is going a way i can not follow.

from a sad player
cya in another world.

Garreth Vlox
Obsidian Inc.
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:26:00 - [521]

we think its not cool how individuals that work here have been called out and dragged through the mud due to something they wrote in the internal company newsletter. Seriously, these people were doing their jobs and do not deserve the hate and ****storm being pointed at them.

really? i kinda think you earned it, reading that internal post kinda reminded me of the enron scandal. if you say something stupid on the internet expect it to bite you sooner or later, if you say something ina super secret corporate GREED thread you should expect it to drop a **** storm on your ass when it gets leaked end of story, you said things you didnt want ppl to see and some saw them and realized what a bunch of underhanded ****s you were for saying it and decided that we the player base (you know the people who pay your salary?) deserved to know that guy i wont **** talk, i hope the rest of you die in a fire.

on a public interest note to the players out there join the ingame channel MASS-PROTEST and kick CCP in the **** with the rest of us jita is almost usable again amarr... well not so much YARRRR!!

[21:20:03] xxxxxxx xxxxxxx > get more to amarr friends alts, mother fathers.. that weird kid next store.. bring rage..

^^ x's are incase some dev decides to perma ban some more people for expressing their displeasure at his corporations greed and ineptitude

Pan Caldarian Ventures
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:26:00 - [522]

Ive heard of people committing suicide on the internet but I have never witnessed one. Shocked

Posted - 2011.06.24 21:26:00 - [523]

I hope Ive addressed your concerns and cleared up a lot of the issues youre having. Well continue monitoring the forums and other communications channels and pick up and reply if there are concerns not covered by this blog.

you did not and by the look of things you will never do

keep the protes alive, don't back down

Sciencegeek deathdealer
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:26:00 - [524]

**** you to.

I will be canceling all three of my accounts, and recommending my friends to do the same. I trusted you, I supported you, hell I fought for you for three years, and this is how you treat me? I'm sorry, I'm not going to pay YOU money to **** me up the ass.


Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [525]

CCP is failing hard at Damage Control, maybe you guys need a officer DCU.

Is CCP going to sell in-game items that will be used in combat, if the answer is yes then please let me know as my subs are coming up for renewal.

RC Denton
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [526]

Edited by: RC Denton on 24/06/2011 21:56:14
Edited by: RC Denton on 24/06/2011 21:52:17
Epic failure of a response. Pan had three issues that really had very little to do with the rage. You only sort of address two of them.

  • Epic failure sir in addressing whether or not the NEX store will be used to sell game impacting items. Instead you write up a straw man argument and knock it down. And explaining it away with "well it's just clothes" shows (I assume willful since there's 170+ pages of discussion on the real reaons) a complete failure to understand what the problem as perceived by your customer base is and sidesteps the entire main issue

  • The tone of this blog, like many of zulu's previous attempts to communicate with the community, shows a certain amount of contempt for the customer base. "It's just clothes" is so disengenous as to almost be a middle finger to folks that have been very articulate about what the problems actually are from the customer perspective

  • Words have meaning. It matters not where they were said. Context is important. What you seem to misunderstand (again on purpose it looks like) is that the majority of the rage is centered around two things A) The fact that the words that were written fairly drips with contempt for your customers and B) The deal breaking changes that you guys seem to want to bring to the game come hell or highwater. Simply dismissing that as "You're overreacting, it's just an internal communication where actors are playing their parts" falls very flat.

  • Trying to justify the absurdly high prices for vanity items is insulting both your intelligence and ours. I could be wrong, but I'd bet big that in a few months data will show that these items brought in very little revenue for the company . The market will be the final say in that though

  • Failure to address performance issues and the fact that the CQ is forced

  • Patting yourself on the back for a "successful" release when you've got multiple rage based threadnaughts about the "features" in that release. Successful from who's perspective? If this is success I'd hate to see failure.

Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [527]

Originally by: CCP Zulu
Incarna - which by the way is one of our more smooth and successful expansions, not to mention absolutely gorgeous


I pity you.

Originally by: CCP Zulu
The opinions and views expressed in Fearless are just that; opinions and views. They are not CCP policy nor are they a reliable source of CCP views as a company.


We will gradually introduce items at other price points, definitely lower and probably higher than whats in the store today.

So those views weren't CCP policy, yet you're telling us you're going to introduce items that are priced even higher?

I pity you.

Originally by: CCP Zulu
I hope Ive addressed your concerns and cleared up a lot of the issues youre having.

So the paying customer is the one having issues?

I pity you.

Nal Shaishi
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [528]

I had 6 accounts... as soon as the current game time expires within a month I'll be down to one... if that

X-Factor Industries
Synthetic Existence
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [529]

TLDR summary of the devblog:


Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [530]

Originally by: CCP Zulu
Seriously, these people were doing their jobs and do not deserve the hate and ****storm being pointed at them.

Hmmmm, how about the people who PAY you, do they deserve the mockery you treat them with ?

CAT Corp
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [531]

This was probably the most pointless CCP response yet including some rather ill places sarcastic one-liners.

This doesn't answer anything at all.

What are your intentions with MT in EVE? How far will you go? I hate that it exists at all but since at this time there are no serious competitors to EVE I can live with vanity items. If you ever where to introduce a game play affecting item in the NeX store I would however leave instantly. It would be good to know if you intend that now already so I can just go out and shoot away my ISK right now instead.

How overextended is CCP Games with WoD and Dust? It seemed you have reached way to far and now you have to trash EVE to make your liquidity...

Maybe that economist you have employed can tell you this too. There is a finite limit to how much profit you can divert from a product.

You see the more money you take in profit or re-invest in other products the easier it gets for someone else to make a better version of that product. Since they don't actually have to be more innovative then you to be better, all they need to do is not divert there earnings to other projects but re-invest a few percent more in the project and they will have a better product then you.

That EVE doesn't have direct competition now does not mean it will always be like that. Also if you expand MT you yourself have changed to put it in direct competition with MMOs that have alot more resources then EVE, you do not want to compete with those.

If there actually is a problem with the base line of the EVE product let us know and raise subscription cost, but if you just overinvested our money into other projects that whent over budget then **** you!

Stay in the ALL-INCLUSIVE subscription sandbox category for the future of EVE.

Ronaldo Carrare
RR Financial Services
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [532]

Hey CCP I like how you only talked about monocles and Helicity being mean to your dude but completely ignored the 300pages of mad posts about the other issues.

DIAF ccp

Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [533]

so in conclusion - i am a bad person for disagreeing with the nex pricing, and being upset about ccp going back on promises with P2W. Thanks devblog for showing me the error of my ways!


Transporter Slave
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [534]



Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [535]

This dev blog answers NOTHING. Its nothing but a pathetic attempt to brush your players under the carpet.

Arya Greywolf
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [536]

"This week has seen quite a controversy unfold. In almost the same instant as we deployed Incarna - which by the way is one of our more smooth and successful expansions, not to mention absolutely gorgeous - an internal newsletter with rather controversial topics addressed leaked out. To further compound the confusion there was a clear and rather large gap in virtual goods pricing expectation and reality with a large segment of the community. Im going to address both these issues right here."

- CCP Zulu

Aren't you missing something? Like THE OVERWHELMING DESIRE FOR US PLAYERS TO HAVE THE OLD HANGER VIEW BACK AND HAVE THE CQ AS A "DISEMBARK" BUTTON! Seriously, did you guys even read ANY threads?

Now, regarding the internal document:

"The opinions and views expressed in Fearless are just that; opinions and views. They are not CCP policy nor are they a reliable source of CCP views as a company. The employees who submitted articles to that newsletter did exactly what they were asked to do, write about theories and opinions from an exaggerated stand."

What the hell does this even mean? Did you not see the millionth post asking for confirmation that WE DO NOT WANT REAL MONEY TRANSFER FOR IN-GAME PROGRESSION/ADVANTAGE!? How the HELL is that not answered?

As far as I'm concerned you totally BLEW over the TWO MAIN issues we wanted to have dealt with.

1) An answer to "Are you EVER going to use aurum for an in game advantage/progression" (via internal document)?

2) We want our OLD hanger view back!

After reading the response, I'm extremely upset. No one even cared that much about the damn monocle prices! Did you read the posts? We were mocking the idea of EVEN buying it in the FIRST place!

This is fail. 3 accounts still unsubbed. Sadface.

Alexis Sachs
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [537]

Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Summary:- We are being sooo unfair with poor lil' CCP employees after learning they were asked to discuss how to spoil the game

But conversely, it's totally ok for them to come back at us with nastiness. So, don't be mean to CCP! Only they can be mean!

Did someone actually ok this crap? You all are insane CCP.

Ryunosuke Kusanagi
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:27:00 - [538]

okay, let me take a crack at it

Zulu: Your blog, while appreciated, was kinda murky in some of the topics addressed, like what is currently planned as Aurum items and not.

Fallout: I appreciate your patience with the EVE community and not killing anyone in game or at CCP headquarters :)

To CCP in general: I believe that the prices are, while representitive of RL items, the inherent problem is that these are NOT RL items, so alot of people feel that these are a bit overpriced. And has been stated earlier, as long as these are restricted to vanity items, (Ishukone skinned Scorpion, clothing, etc.) then that is fine, but if you intend to sell inherently stronger ships, (capitals, Super Caps, T2 ships, faction ships) for Aurum, then that is bad for the games economy I believe. Also, regarding Aurum for Faction standings, While good for the wallet, again addresses the balancing issue, if everyone can access lvl 4 missions off the bat, then what good are lvl 1-3 agents? You have to do this carefully, while remaining balance, and the current in game economy, I know that you know this, but sometimes, you need us to tell you.

Again, I think you need to address what is currently on the table regarding Aurum items, the balancing issues and in game economy, And what your plans for DUST are for regarding such.

/Thread TL:DR

Posted - 2011.06.24 21:28:00 - [539]


Was this seriously the offical response from CCP top devs ?

PDF is out internal news letter where we ut stuff and discusss - we knew that allready.

Clothing can be expensive, but we will put some cheap stuff inside as well.

Hope it helps and best of luck ...

Ummm ... could we get someone that can actually read to browse the forums and then use REALLY small words while explaining to like of Zulu, Hilmar and the like WHY we are all upset ?

Clearly the higher you climb corp ladder the stoppider you get.

Interstellar Waste Management Committee
Posted - 2011.06.24 21:28:00 - [540]

After reading the blog, it has FAILED to address any of the issues we, the EVE players, are concerned about.

Many of us DO NOT want microtransactions to become part of the game. The dev blog failed to address OUT MAJOR CONCERNS. While the blog did say that the newsletter does not express the official views of the company, it does not answer anything.

The opinions and views expressed in Fearless are just that; opinions and views. They are not CCP policy nor are they a reliable source of CCP views as a company.

If Fearless is not a reliable source of CCP views about the direction it is heading, then WHAT ARE CCP'S VIEW ABOUT IT? You have access to the players voices as seen through various protests happening on the servers right now, the various threads and posts against it, and the many number of players who have voiced their choice to unsubscribe from the game. You know our concerns and are willing to take drastic measure to express them to you and get your attention.

We as players, DEMAND ANSWERS!!! We as players, who want to believe that CCP is still the great company that provided us a great game, is still a great company to support and believe in. This blog has not provided us with ANY ANSWERS nor has it resolved anything.

You've heard everything the players have to say, CCP. So far you've only left us with DISAPPOINTMENT and EMPTY PROMISES. However, you still have a chance to rectify this issue. You can still fix this issue by being completely HONEST with your players.

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