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Orkasm
The Remnant Legion.
The Remnant Legion
Posted - 2011.06.26 08:59:00 - [9931]
 

2 Days since the last CCP Reply, Keep this going Hilmar just wants it to blow over, dont let it!

Talamicus
Posted - 2011.06.26 08:59:00 - [9932]
 

Originally by: Adunh Slavy
A Parting word before sleep, with no particular point, sure to be lost in the ever growing thread; lethargic if nothing else.

We're all aware that CCP so far refuses to answer The Big Yellow Question, and we've our fears about that. It seems as though CCP wants to make this all about the prices in the store, as if that is our concern. If we look at most of the gaming press at that time, it was to laugh at CCP's silly prices. CCP is not answering us, they are answering the press.

But the press is slowly pulling the story to the 'pay to win' issues despite CCP's best efforts to the contrary. Other MMO communities are starting to talk about what we the Eve community are doing and why as well.

We are CCP's past revenue stream. It seems as though CCP feels they can ride it out, make up new subs with 'good press' of 'awesome' and some cheap tacky space pants. That is, or was until now, their new revenue.

We have taken it beyond CCP's calculations. CCP used to always be proud that the community grew Eve to be greater than the sum of its parts. I think CCP is beginning to learn that the community does not belong to them, it belongs to us, it always has. Most of the time we're blowing each other up so we didn't recognize it quite so tangibly. That veil has fallen.

CCP can not ignore the gaming press, they depend on it. They must have it, they can not launch their new products or attract new loyal customers to a company with bad press. So far they have completely screwed them selves.



Well said

Mycheala Zanjoahir
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:00:00 - [9933]
 

Originally by: Talamicus
Originally by: Adunh Slavy
A Parting word before sleep, with no particular point, sure to be lost in the ever growing thread; lethargic if nothing else.

We're all aware that CCP so far refuses to answer The Big Yellow Question, and we've our fears about that. It seems as though CCP wants to make this all about the prices in the store, as if that is our concern. If we look at most of the gaming press at that time, it was to laugh at CCP's silly prices. CCP is not answering us, they are answering the press.

But the press is slowly pulling the story to the 'pay to win' issues despite CCP's best efforts to the contrary. Other MMO communities are starting to talk about what we the Eve community are doing and why as well.

We are CCP's past revenue stream. It seems as though CCP feels they can ride it out, make up new subs with 'good press' of 'awesome' and some cheap tacky space pants. That is, or was until now, their new revenue.

We have taken it beyond CCP's calculations. CCP used to always be proud that the community grew Eve to be greater than the sum of its parts. I think CCP is beginning to learn that the community does not belong to them, it belongs to us, it always has. Most of the time we're blowing each other up so we didn't recognize it quite so tangibly. That veil has fallen.

CCP can not ignore the gaming press, they depend on it. They must have it, they can not launch their new products or attract new loyal customers to a company with bad press. So far they have completely screwed them selves.



Well said


+1

Sol Kal'orr
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:01:00 - [9934]
 

Originally by: Juwi Kotch
Edited by: Juwi Kotch on 26/06/2011 08:57:32
Originally by: Pandadora
Originally by: Juwi Kotch
Churn is a well known and analysed figure in subscription based businesses


While true, i what SoE calculated with SWG. Sometimes the 'experts' are just plain wrong.


That's why it's so well known. Churn can be dangerous, and sometimes a product does not survive to be shoot in the own knee.

Actually Island has a reputation with overdoing things commercially, as you can see at their banking industry in the past years.


Where is this 'Actaully Island' of which you speak? Is it near 'Pen Island'?

Ibraim Cordes
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:01:00 - [9935]
 

It's obvious that CCP gives a F * * * about their actual playerbase.

They are fishing for a bored WoW kiddies who LOVE to give money for what ever **** Blizzard offers them so they can show off.
Unfortunalty those kiddies don't want to wait a year before they can fly a carrier, they want it now!

The consequence is, you have to offer skill point for money in the furure.

There is NO OTHER WAY please understand that!

Have fun Mr. Petrusson, with your new shiny universe.

Hope you sleep well when thinking about that you could finally get rid of those bastards who made you what you are today and finally can make real money milking 12 year olds.

Mission accomplished!


And just because Mr Petursson wants to see actions and not just words : 2 subscribtions canceled here.

Jint Hikaru
OffWorld Exploration Inc
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:02:00 - [9936]
 

How has this been allowed to go on for so long without a response from CCP. This is such a bad way to run a company. Its the players who make a game like Eve become what it is.

The longer you leave it, the harder it's going to be to rebuild your reputation.

However I don't think CCP is EVER going to get back their old reputation as an innovative and trend bucking MMO producer. (which is sad)


Talamicus
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:03:00 - [9937]
 

Originally by: Talamicus
Originally by: Talamicus
I know it has been said before but make sure you DO NOT let this calm down, trust me i bet they are just sitting there chillin waiting for the gale force winds to reduced to a mild western breezer and then hit out with some corporate sh*t

Remember Hilmar said they are not going to knee jerk to the predictable (which is our reaction probably)

STAY THE COURSE HILMAR, Even if there is an massive iceberg in your way!!

Hope you drown in the process Twisted Evil



I could feel the storm calming so thought i would quote myself Twisted EvilTwisted EvilTwisted Evil



Dont let the storm blow over! Twisted EvilTwisted Evil

Torquil Noble
Caldari
Eternal Profiteers
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:03:00 - [9938]
 

New Poll:

which will be first -- 10,000 posts or 1,000,000 views?


TN

Gnulpie
Minmatar
Miner Tech
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:03:00 - [9939]
 

The upper management doesn't care about EVE.


It is obvious now.

Agrikaan
Amarr
Defensores Fidei
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:04:00 - [9940]
 

Originally by: Ra Vhim
Originally by: Azanee Yarabokin

Oh, and why does the lighting in Captain's Hostel make my toon look like a crack***** who took a bad beating from her pimp?

...

What the hell is up with this tiny hostel room, anyway? I'm the immortal captain of a starship and my station quarters are smaller and uglier than any motel room. Why can't I stay in my freaking pod? I'm sure it's at least cleaner than this dump.



Thank you, I really needed to LOL. Great posting, I feel much better now :)


Yes, and while I'm trapped in this stinking room... Hmm, no toilet... Humm humm hummm *heads back into the pod*

CCFAIL
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:04:00 - [9941]
 

CCP probably watched to much of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wS5xOZ7Rq8

Hormus
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:04:00 - [9942]
 

Imagine a few thousand angry experienced players transfering to an unsuspecting MMORPG. I pity it...

Oscar Goldreich
Center for Advanced Studies
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:05:00 - [9943]
 

Let's keep this going, do not put down your pitch forks, cancel your subs it the only way they will understand.

Raster Fain
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:06:00 - [9944]
 

Edited by: Raster Fain on 26/06/2011 09:08:12
Originally by: Londo Cebb
Originally by: Adunh Slavy
A Parting word before sleep, with no particular point, sure to be lost in the ever growing thread; lethargic if nothing else.

We're all aware that CCP so far refuses to answer The Big Yellow Question, and we've our fears about that. It seems as though CCP wants to make this all about the prices in the store, as if that is our concern. If we look at most of the gaming press at that time, it was to laugh at CCP's silly prices. CCP is not answering us, they are answering the press.

But the press is slowly pulling the story to the 'pay to win' issues despite CCP's best efforts to the contrary. Other MMO communities are starting to talk about what we the Eve community are doing and why as well.

We are CCP's past revenue stream. It seems as though CCP feels they can ride it out, make up new subs with 'good press' of 'awesome' and some cheap tacky space pants. That is, or was until now, their new revenue.

We have taken it beyond CCP's calculations. CCP used to always be proud that the community grew Eve to be greater than the sum of its parts. I think CCP is beginning to learn that the community does not belong to them, it belongs to us, it always has. Most of the time we're blowing each other up so we didn't recognize it quite so tangibly. That veil has fallen.

CCP can not ignore the gaming press, they depend on it. They must have it, they can not launch their new products or attract new loyal customers to a company with bad press. So far they have completely screwed them selves.


Your post was not lost on me.

Thank you for summing up what I have been thinking.


This so needs a +1 and more. /me puts in the buy orders for more Pitchforks and Torches!!!

**Edit for annoyance of wrong quoting lol*

Morgan Polaris
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:06:00 - [9945]
 

Posted on Massively.

Quote:
Protests are a wonderful thing. In the context of MMOs, protests are a great way to let developers know how unhappy you are with the current state of the game. Unfortunately, there's only really one way to make such a protest effectively: cancelling your subscription and encouraging others to do the same. A mass gathering of players shouting in protest on the servers is mostly sending the message that when the company screws up, players will be right there to continue paying a subscription fee in order to complain.


http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/06/25/wrup-in-praise-of-protests-edition/

Sanied
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:07:00 - [9946]
 

How did that "greed is good" thing work out for Gordon Gecko?

Manos Heimenbarger
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:07:00 - [9947]
 

Originally by: Morgan Polaris
Posted on Massively.

Quote:
Protests are a wonderful thing. In the context of MMOs, protests are a great way to let developers know how unhappy you are with the current state of the game. Unfortunately, there's only really one way to make such a protest effectively: cancelling your subscription and encouraging others to do the same. A mass gathering of players shouting in protest on the servers is mostly sending the message that when the company screws up, players will be right there to continue paying a subscription fee in order to complain.


http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/06/25/wrup-in-praise-of-protests-edition/


Unsub, then go protest. Best of both worlds.

Londo Cebb
Official Market Discussions Troll
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:07:00 - [9948]
 

Originally by: Torquil Noble
New Poll:

which will be first -- 10,000 posts or 1,000,000 views?


TN


10,000 posts - easy Monocle

DarkTemplarCrimsonWolf
Amarr
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:08:00 - [9949]
 

New list of demands:
-No non-vanity items in-game, ever;
-No more lying from the devs, signed legal document stipulating sever consequences should lying happen;
-No more Hilmar, he wants to be cool? let him be cool running a Walmart, he seems to have the right skills for it.

diaufop
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:08:00 - [9950]
 

Originally by: Hormus
Imagine a few thousand angry experienced players transfering to an unsuspecting MMORPG. I pity it...


Sufficient EVE players joined up with Perpetuum yesterday that we crashed their log-in server. The Devs in that game seemed very pleased to have us (and our money, naturally).

Calvin Pax
Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers
The 0rphanage
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:09:00 - [9951]
 

PLEASE CCP READ AGAIN AND UNDERSTAND THIS !!!

Originally by: Dierdra Vaal
Edited by: Dierdra Vaal on 24/06/2011 12:22:35
I feel sad that this has happened - and sad that I need to write this post (not just because it'll probably get buried under 9000 other posts). However, I hope this will be read because I am trying to make a reasonable argument here - not a raging flame post.

As a recurring member of the CSM, whose duty it is to represent the players (something I took very seriously), I went to CCP to discuss the issue of microtransactions. In fact, this topic was discussed several times on CSM summits (both in October and in December). We were assured that microtransactions would be vanity items only.

I was told, to my face, that CCP would not sell anything in their virtual goods store that would not be a vanity item (vanity items being useless fluff, not giving any benefits). Now I read in your newsletter that one of your main game designers is openly argueing to break this promise. I take that as a personal insult and a clear sign of disrespect towards the Eve community as a whole. Shame on you for even considering to break your word!

I'm still subscribed, the but moment CCP will offer anything other than vanity items for PLEX/AURUM/etc is the moment I will cancel my accounts. In going for the 'hobbyist gamer' (casual gamers, even though eve isn't that casual gamer friendly), you seem to have forgotten a large part of your player base. The part that has shaped Eve over the years: the hardcore gamers. We don't come here as a hobby to experience an ultimate sci-fi simulator. We pay a subscription for an all-access pass to this crazy dystopian universe, where what you do, what you become and what you achieve comes down only to your skills, dedication and your effort. And because of that, our actions are meaningful.

By extending the virtual goods sales beyond vanity items you directly attack one of the things that seperates Eve from all the other MMOs out there: that actions are meaningful. If I can just buy faction standing, what meaning is there in doing missions for faction standings? What meaning is there in finally achieving 6.0 standing (for POSs) or 9.0 standing (for COSMOS missions)? And from what I read, that's not even the end of it!

Some people might enjoy spending more money 'on their hobby' like it was golf (an analogy that is inherently flawed, which I'll explain below), but due to the dystopian, merciless nature of Eve you've bred a community that exists for a large part out of hardcore players. People who see Eve as a serious business proving ground - not as a lighthearted diversion. These are the people who have allowed you to get to where you are today. These are the people who stuck by you over the past 8 years - even if they do call themselves "bittervets". To turn your back on those people is at best poor form, and at worst commercial suicide. Because Star Wars Galaxies has shown you can't just trade in one group of customers for another.

Why golf is not the same as eve
Specifically, buying golfclubs isn't the same as buying items in Eve. The equivalent would be if you could pay $100 to get one swing/strike/whatever it's called removed from your record. Instead of making a hole in 5, you could pay $400 and get it listed as a hole in one! Suddenly, your golf stats won't depend on how good you are, but simply on how much money you're willing to spend. Try to suggest that to golfers and see how they like it.

In Eve, just flying a spaceship isn't all there is to the gameplay. The effort to GET that spaceship is part of the game. The fact that it isn't easy to obtain certain things, achieve certain things or do certain things is exactly what makes these things meaningful. Meaningful to me AND to others, who can see what I have achieved. And now some game designer would like to take that away? Bad move CCP.


Sellendis
Caldari
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:09:00 - [9952]
 

Edited by: Sellendis on 26/06/2011 09:10:36
Originally by: MotherMoon
Originally by: Dr4FT
**** you CCP Pann.


hey her daughter is in the hospital, lay off Ahole


Well, thats how they got their kid in the first place.

But yea, lets keep it cool, their families have nothing to do with this. And i am pretty sure CCP Panns child didn't implement MT and AUR.
Edit - going into shock from CCPs behavior and ignorance is a possibility.

Torquil Noble
Caldari
Eternal Profiteers
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:09:00 - [9953]
 

Originally by: diaufop
Originally by: Hormus
Imagine a few thousand angry experienced players transfering to an unsuspecting MMORPG. I pity it...


Sufficient EVE players joined up with Perpetuum yesterday that we crashed their log-in server. The Devs in that game seemed very pleased to have us (and our money, naturally).



this is breaking news...

TN

Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:09:00 - [9954]
 

Originally by: CCFAIL
CCP probably watched to much of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wS5xOZ7Rq8


LOL!

Londo Cebb
Official Market Discussions Troll
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:09:00 - [9955]
 

Originally by: DarkTemplarCrimsonWolf
New list of demands:
-No non-vanity items in-game, ever;
-No more lying from the devs, signed legal document stipulating sever consequences should lying happen;
-No more Hilmar, he wants to be cool? let him be cool running a Walmart, he seems to have the right skills for it.


New list of demands:
-None. I quit.

silver20
Caldari
WEPRA CORP
White Noise.
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:10:00 - [9956]
 

CCP Hilmar said:
I can tell you that this is one of the moments where we look at what our players do and less of what they say.

Well if u rly whana know what we do now it's easy to find out....just check how many people unsub in last few days!!!

Marc Goth
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:10:00 - [9957]
 


Glasgow Dunlop
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:10:00 - [9958]
 

quick question to all, has there ever been a 10k thread?

Also there either working on an epic blog, or sipping some meduim-priced sparkling cava.

i predict the latter.Rolling Eyes

Gulliver Rex
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:11:00 - [9959]
 


MrSteack
Caldari
Unchained Potential
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.06.26 09:11:00 - [9960]
 

Originally by: Marc Goth
that's for yer fun...

Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.


+1 internets for you


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