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Istyn
Tactical Knightmare
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:24:00 - [3631]
 

Originally by: Yvenn
Originally by: Amber Villaneous
Before my subs expire I'm going to liquidate all my assets and by PLEX, should be somewhere around 300 of them. Then I'm going to give them all to corpmates that I know will never buy a monocle.

How's your PLEX sink doing now ****tards.


Can we be corpmates ?




You possess eyewear so are at risk of being a monocle lover.

Skylar Gray
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:24:00 - [3632]
 

Originally by: Anoobis Aivoras
Originally by: ed jeni
Quote:


I pay to play Eve Online. I dont pay for Eve Online to support development of Generic Console FPS, or Generic Twilight Cash-in. I pay for Eve Online, to be a part of Eve Online, to play Eve Online and watch Eve Online grow. Perhaps CCP are confused? Since aquiring WW, it would seem that they have forgotten they are a development company, not a publisher. Perhaps seeing EA's crack vault made them envious? Maybe you have become/want to become a publisher like EA. One glaring issue there though, EA has swallowed so many developers, owns so many IPs that people mindlessly rebuy with a higher number each year, that they can literally print their own money, you CCP, can not. Never bite the hand that feeds you. See us here? All these people Angry/Sad/Happy/Indifferent? We are that hand, and rather foolishly you are trying to draw our left as well as our right to chew the fingers off of both. Management should ask, what will Dust be without Eve? What will make it unique, or worth buying (already lost half your market with the PS3 exclusive) over the next CoD brainwash? Nothing. We may be your "Golden Goose" as some careless employee put it, but this goose is already losing its feathers.

You dont really have many options here.
1 - Return to roots, make Eve great, focus.
2 - Continue as you are, risk it all.
3 - Seek outside investment, or a publisher for other projects.

The day that you as a company CCP, forget that you need us, more than we need you or Eve, is the day you no longer exist as one, and all your dreams of fancy new projects will vanish along with it. I know in the grand scheme of things, I am but a single customer, as are others who have stated their intention to unsub, or those who have done already, as and such at the end of the day I, and they, are little more than statistics to the suits that now seem to call the shots. One person though is all it takes to change the world. History is full of such individuals. I make no claim to be one of them, or capable of such action. However, in this age of the internet, the most powerful tool for communication thus far in human history, word of mouth can do more good, or more harm that at any other point in time, more than any advertising or publicity drive can accomplish.

Much larger companies than CCP have fallen for the mistake of viewing the customer as little more than a cash cow, you cant milk the cow if you arent providing the grass it needs, and I personally would hate to see CCP end this way. TL;DR - Ramble and +1 for sort your **** out CCP and fast.



^^^ this
+1

If you have a golden goose, nurture it,keep it happy and keep the eggs coming. Don't shoot it in the face and rip it's guts out to see how much gold there is inside.

Kassidie Larsen
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:24:00 - [3633]
 

Originally by: Crellion
Edited by: Crellion on 24/06/2011 13:13:14

PS I would pay you lazy asshats real life money to fix hybrids though. Try this if you want to suck us dry: offer to fix gameplay imbalances for aurum ...




Holy hell, so would I. :)

Kharontos
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:24:00 - [3634]
 

Originally by: Algathas

Are you moving beyond VANITY AUR items?




Tippia
Caldari
Sunshine and Lollipops
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:24:00 - [3635]
 

Parley, eh…? You know it's more of a guideline than a rule, right?

Anyway. People have already pointed this out, and my answer will drown in the flood, but since you have so kindly provided a soap box, I'll make use of it nevertheless.

Now, my full answer is… a bit long. It didn't quite fit into a single post, so I offer it to you on this page instead, and only provide the summary in this post.

Basically, it boils down to this:

Your three points are of some concern, but they are actually not particularly relevant. What is relevant is that you have been caught pursuing things that you promised us not to pursue, and you have further dented a relationship to your community that was already shaky from the last few weeks' worth of controversy: the developer licensing debacle, the IW Scorp debacle, the reneged promises about CQ and Incarna, the NeX store debacle, and all the standard mess that comes with a significant release of core content. However, the latter are just that: they're build-up. They're not the actual problem.

The actual problem is the lie.

That problem is compounded by the very casual and uncaring manner in which concerns have been met with since the patch release.

It is further compounded by your apparent inability to identify this very obvious key issue.

Yes, the NeX store prices are barmy, and you need to address this, and make your strategy for vanity items clear to assuage the worries that you don't really know what you're doing and that you're not wasting time and effort on things no-one will ever use. Yes, the CQ lacks the required options to make it a satisfactory addition for all players, and you need to address this too — preferably by providing those options, but at least by communicating what led up to them not being included (this time, or ever). Yes, there are technical issues with the patch, but those will presumably be dealt with in due time as they always are.

But again, the key issue here is that your voice no longer have any value.

You no longer have the confidence of the community. You have managed to contradict and suppress yourself into a position of zero trustworthiness. This is not something you can “PR” yourselves out of — it requires a drastic change in organisational culture (good luck), a drastic change in communications strategy (good luck), and, yes, quite possibly killing some of your darlings (tough luck).

Caldari Citizen20110707
The Official Hyperdallas Fanclub
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:25:00 - [3636]
 

Things u miss in your observation:

-spaceships in this spaceship game are still broken
-entire races are disbalanced/broken
-entire weapons systems are broken
-some content is not pratical, pos rules corp members vs wormhole introduction
-2 yrs ago i saw presentation about how ccp's plans were to populate 0.0 again; but make it more risky / anom nerf + agent buff = more people 0.0?


Concubinia Scarlett
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:25:00 - [3637]
 

Originally by: Halcyon Ingenium
Seriously CCP, did you hire Matt Ward as a content adviser?


That made me lol Very HappyVery Happy

Headerman
Minmatar
Quovis
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:25:00 - [3638]
 

Originally by: Raivi
Originally by: Dierdra Vaal
Edited by: Dierdra Vaal on 24/06/2011 12:22:35
I feel sad that this has happened - and sad that I need to write this post (not just because it'll probably get buried under 9000 other posts). However, I hope this will be read because I am trying to make a reasonable argument here - not a raging flame post.

As a recurring member of the CSM, whose duty it is to represent the players (something I took very seriously), I went to CCP to discuss the issue of microtransactions. In fact, this topic was discussed several times on CSM summits (both in October and in December). We were assured that microtransactions would be vanity items only.

I was told, to my face, that CCP would not sell anything in their virtual goods store that would not be a vanity item (vanity items being useless fluff, not giving any benefits). Now I read in your newsletter that one of your main game designers is openly argueing to break this promise. I take that as a personal insult and a clear sign of disrespect towards the Eve community as a whole. Shame on you for even considering to break your word!

I'm still subscribed, the but moment CCP will offer anything other than vanity items for PLEX/AURUM/etc is the moment I will cancel my accounts. In going for the 'hobbyist gamer' (casual gamers, even though eve isn't that casual gamer friendly), you seem to have forgotten a large part of your player base. The part that has shaped Eve over the years: the hardcore gamers. We don't come here as a hobby to experience an ultimate sci-fi simulator. We pay a subscription for an all-access pass to this crazy dystopian universe, where what you do, what you become and what you achieve comes down only to your skills, dedication and your effort. And because of that, our actions are meaningful.

By extending the virtual goods sales beyond vanity items you directly attack one of the things that seperates Eve from all the other MMOs out there: that actions are meaningful. If I can just buy faction standing, what meaning is there in doing missions for faction standings? What meaning is there in finally achieving 6.0 standing (for POSs) or 9.0 standing (for COSMOS missions)? And from what I read, that's not even the end of it!

Some people might enjoy spending more money 'on their hobby' like it was golf (an analogy that is inherently flawed, which I'll explain below), but due to the dystopian, merciless nature of Eve you've bred a community that exists for a large part out of hardcore players. People who see Eve as a serious business proving ground - not as a lighthearted diversion. These are the people who have allowed you to get to where you are today. These are the people who stuck by you over the past 8 years - even if they do call themselves "bittervets". To turn your back on those people is at best poor form, and at worst commercial suicide. Because Star Wars Galaxies has shown you can't just trade in one group of customers for another.

Why golf is not the same as eve
Specifically, buying golfclubs isn't the same as buying items in Eve. The equivalent would be if you could pay $100 to get one swing/strike/whatever it's called removed from your record. Instead of making a hole in 5, you could pay $400 and get it listed as a hole in one! Suddenly, your golf stats won't depend on how good you are, but simply on how much money you're willing to spend. Try to suggest that to golfers and see how they like it.

In Eve, just flying a spaceship isn't all there is to the gameplay. The effort to GET that spaceship is part of the game. The fact that it isn't easy to obtain certain things, achieve certain things or do certain things is exactly what makes these things meaningful. Meaningful to me AND to others, who can see what I have achieved. And now some game designer would like to take that away? Bad move CCP.


Need to make sure this doesn't get buried in the tsunami of posts.

Jereth Ravyn
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:25:00 - [3639]
 

Originally by: Zey Nadar
Edited by: Zey Nadar on 24/06/2011 13:00:22
Originally by: Lars Zundi

EVERY SINGLE OPINION IN THIS THREAD FROM EVERY SINGLE PLAYER WHO HAS POSTED IS EXPRESSLY AGAINST IN-GAME ADVANTAGES FOR £££



Posting to confirm this.

Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.


This clearly defines the short-sighted, blind and unimaginative rage that I fear will obscure the more constructive posts that CCP should look at. By all means, express your opinion, but don't be so arrogant to think that everyone is agreeing with you.

This debacle is somewhat disheartening, because obviously CCP can't please everyone. If any CCP'ers manage to read my post after wading through all the garbage, please know that I still have faith in CCP. The release of The NeX was probably premature, and the prices put in the context of the leaked newsletter confuse and anger a lot of people. Maybe I'm too optimistic, but I think there's a bigger picture here that won't be fully realized until DUST hits. Keep your heads up and stay true to the vision.

Sol Kal'orr
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:25:00 - [3640]
 

Originally by: Graic Valente
Originally by: Zey Nadar
Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Awesome!

Don't let CCP turn this into a features/prices debate. Keep them honest on there activities and future intent.


Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
And posted in the king of threadnoughts. Cool

Jaroslav Unwanted
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:25:00 - [3641]
 

Originally by: Kamikaze Jihawty

"I don't like to threaten Pete"..... Quoted from helicity himself. I suspect this is part of a threat, partially because I see the word threaten there. Yet Helicity is innocent, and only a victim to CCP. Yes everyone know's I'm an idiot, but I am smarter than you. :)


"Ok, so i dont want to threaten you but i am going to your house and burn your family your dog and then slowly and painfully kill you."

Thats about fine with you ? Well you must be quite a character i give you that.

leth ghost
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:25:00 - [3642]
 

found this a fun read
Linkage

Amber Villaneous
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:25:00 - [3643]
 

Originally by: Yvenn
Originally by: Amber Villaneous
Before my subs expire I'm going to liquidate all my assets and by PLEX, should be somewhere around 300 of them. Then I'm going to give them all to corpmates that I know will never buy a monocle.

How's your PLEX sink doing now ****tards.


Can we be corpmates ?




That made me LOL. You're in my address book, you get one when the time comes.

Yvenn
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:25:00 - [3644]
 

Originally by: Istyn
Originally by: Yvenn
Originally by: Amber Villaneous
Before my subs expire I'm going to liquidate all my assets and by PLEX, should be somewhere around 300 of them. Then I'm going to give them all to corpmates that I know will never buy a monocle.

How's your PLEX sink doing now ****tards.


Can we be corpmates ?




You possess eyewear so are at risk of being a monocle lover.


Crying or Very sad

The Post Man
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:25:00 - [3645]
 

I'd just like to take this opportunity to remind CCP that with Star Wars: The Old Republic just around the corner, you should be doing absolutely everything in your power to convince your loyal customers to remain your loyal customers, rather than taking them for granted and coming up with new ways to exploit and/or alienate them.

Quite frankly even if TOR turns out to be a massive pile **** that makes STO look like a masterpiece, it still has the Star Wars name, and that alone should have you very concerned.

In short, now is not a time for grabbing all the money you can, now is a time for scrambling to keep what you already have and looking to build on your (until recently) strong position.

D Liver
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:26:00 - [3646]
 

Originally by: Dierdra Vaal
I feel sad that this has happened - and sad that I need to write this post (not just because it'll probably get buried under 9000 other posts). However, I hope this will be read because I am trying to make a reasonable argument here - not a raging flame post.

As a recurring member of the CSM, whose duty it is to represent the players (something I took very seriously), I went to CCP to discuss the issue of microtransactions. In fact, this topic was discussed several times on CSM summits (both in October and in December). We were assured that microtransactions would be vanity items only.

I was told, to my face, that CCP would not sell anything in their virtual goods store that would not be a vanity item (vanity items being useless fluff, not giving any benefits). Now I read in your newsletter that one of your main game designers is openly argueing to break this promise. I take that as a personal insult and a clear sign of disrespect towards the Eve community as a whole. Shame on you for even considering to break your word!

I'm still subscribed, the but moment CCP will offer anything other than vanity items for PLEX/AURUM/etc is the moment I will cancel my accounts. In going for the 'hobbyist gamer' (casual gamers, even though eve isn't that casual gamer friendly), you seem to have forgotten a large part of your player base. The part that has shaped Eve over the years: the hardcore gamers. We don't come here as a hobby to experience an ultimate sci-fi simulator. We pay a subscription for an all-access pass to this crazy dystopian universe, where what you do, what you become and what you achieve comes down only to your skills, dedication and your effort. And because of that, our actions are meaningful.

By extending the virtual goods sales beyond vanity items you directly attack one of the things that seperates Eve from all the other MMOs out there: that actions are meaningful. If I can just buy faction standing, what meaning is there in doing missions for faction standings? What meaning is there in finally achieving 6.0 standing (for POSs) or 9.0 standing (for COSMOS missions)? And from what I read, that's not even the end of it!

Some people might enjoy spending more money 'on their hobby' like it was golf (an analogy that is inherently flawed, which I'll explain below), but due to the dystopian, merciless nature of Eve you've bred a community that exists for a large part out of hardcore players. People who see Eve as a serious business proving ground - not as a lighthearted diversion. These are the people who have allowed you to get to where you are today. These are the people who stuck by you over the past 8 years - even if they do call themselves "bittervets". To turn your back on those people is at best poor form, and at worst commercial suicide. Because Star Wars Galaxies has shown you can't just trade in one group of customers for another.

Why golf is not the same as eve
Specifically, buying golfclubs isn't the same as buying items in Eve. The equivalent would be if you could pay $100 to get one swing/strike/whatever it's called removed from your record. Instead of making a hole in 5, you could pay $400 and get it listed as a hole in one! Suddenly, your golf stats won't depend on how good you are, but simply on how much money you're willing to spend. Try to suggest that to golfers and see how they like it.

In Eve, just flying a spaceship isn't all there is to the gameplay. The effort to GET that spaceship is part of the game. The fact that it isn't easy to obtain certain things, achieve certain things or do certain things is exactly what makes these things meaningful. Meaningful to me AND to others, who can see what I have achieved. And now some game designer would like to take that away? Bad move CCP.


agreed

Stone Cold'Killer
VELD5PARTA
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:26:00 - [3647]
 

With this much "noise", something is seriously wrong.....just sayin.

Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:26:00 - [3648]
 

Originally by: Cherry Bones
Originally by: Des Aray
Jesus christ some people just take this game WAY too seriously. Go outside and breath some fresh air, play with your kids ... do something.


Hey CCP_Pann, nice try.


Reading these forums while doing laundry and dishes ftw. Razz

Technovar
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:26:00 - [3649]
 

Originally by: Nicho Void
I'd be interested to know how many of you raging are currently doing so from in-game.

Until you decide to make a REAL stand and stop logging in, this type of thing is going to continue to happen. They've lauded the CSM as a way to enact change when in fact it's simply a distraction from the truth: you hold the power. They want a "parley" for a day? Fine, no one log in. Issues still not addressed to your liking? Unsubscribe. Don't pay with money? Stop buying PLEX. Stop logging in.

Having only 5k online pilots would certainly send a message.




Haven't been on since a few hours before canceling yesterday, other than to validate one character on a corp forum to talk about this there.

Ancyker
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:27:00 - [3650]
 

Hacked into CCP Soundwaves account, look what I found:

Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.

GunJob
Lonetrek Salvage and Scrap
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:27:00 - [3651]
 


Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:27:00 - [3652]
 

Originally by: Anakin Pubcrawler
Unsubbed accounts. No other game to play but I don't care - I will play WoW on my sons account before I pay a single penny in MT in a game where you can pay for an advantage.


If you're looking for a "complex" game give Dwarf Fortress a shot.

Get ready to lose at least a week of your life.

Istyn
Tactical Knightmare
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:27:00 - [3653]
 

Originally by: Amber Villaneous
Originally by: Yvenn
Originally by: Amber Villaneous
Before my subs expire I'm going to liquidate all my assets and by PLEX, should be somewhere around 300 of them. Then I'm going to give them all to corpmates that I know will never buy a monocle.

How's your PLEX sink doing now ****tards.


Can we be corpmates ?




That made me LOL. You're in my address book, you get one when the time comes.


He has eyewear already, you can't trust him!

I'thari
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:28:00 - [3654]
 

Originally by: Grey Stormshadow
To be honest most valid posts were made before 500 post mark. Now we are just demonstrating and keeping the lynch mob active untill CCP finally desides to come up with some billiant newsletter.

The content will most likely be something close to
Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
...but hey - I didn't wait for anything less, anything more.

Yeah, we deffinitely need more supercraps. Smile

Maisonian
Amarr
The Green Machine
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:28:00 - [3655]
 

Lets not forget one of CCPs most recent trailers: "The Butterfly Effect"

With its resounding ending message that all actions have concequence.

If you decide to run with in game benefits for RL cash, there will be NO concequence for people's actions. Only a divide between those willing to chuck good money at a problem and those that aren't blind enough to do so. I personally am not angry at the company's decision to incorporate microtransations into the game, the introduction of Incarna or the lack of actual content for the last few patches.

Im angry because CCP has stopped caring about its playerbase.

Yvenn
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:28:00 - [3656]
 

Originally by: Amber Villaneous
Originally by: Yvenn
Originally by: Amber Villaneous
Before my subs expire I'm going to liquidate all my assets and by PLEX, should be somewhere around 300 of them. Then I'm going to give them all to corpmates that I know will never buy a monocle.

How's your PLEX sink doing now ****tards.


Can we be corpmates ?




That made me LOL. You're in my address book, you get one when the time comes.


<3 Very Happy

Nishachara
True Enlightenment
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:28:00 - [3657]
 

Btw...
This just occured to me.
Do you people remember how ccp devs were stating for some time now that they want to tie up incarna with combat booster trading and black market..etc...

What if they really mean to sell boosters for aurum? Shocked

LifeLines
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:28:00 - [3658]
 

Originally by: Amber Villaneous
Before my subs expire I'm going to liquidate all my assets and by PLEX, should be somewhere around 300 of them. Then I'm going to give them all to corpmates that I know will never buy a monocle.

How's your PLEX sink doing now ****tards.


no man. just buy them and destroy them. inflate the prices as much as you can. i know i will be doing this, if a few more richies join we could sustain 5-600m+ for a while, enough to **** off many players.

oh theres a catch... CCP is 99% interfering in the PLEX market. buying/selling(and thus making the prices go down/up) as they see fit.

I knew I should just quit this game after T20 did what he did. Even back then I had a feeling that CCP is corrupt to the core. greed is good, yes, I dont mind being ripped off by game developers that actually DELIVER on their promises.

6 accounts canceled, so long o7

Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:28:00 - [3659]
 

Originally by: Alexingeras
Originally by: Maisonian
EVE IS DYING!


And CCP is digging it's grave in CQ.


Grave Quarters AMIRITE?

It's basicly like a crypt, where we can rot away watching TV being alone.. like, in our moms basement, being fat and pale and nerdy and goonswarmy. Now it all makes sense that Soundwave likes this concept!

Marcus Vorenius
Caldari
Task Force 42
Posted - 2011.06.24 13:28:00 - [3660]
 

Unsubscribing is obviously not working since we haven't had a serious response from CCP C-Level yet. Since it's too easy to re-subscribe and we have too much time invested it's time to start biomassing en masse.

From Biomass or Chicken Quit thread
Originally by: Hanz Naari
Delete characters, end of story. no drama


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