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Millstone Industries
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:27:00 - [1591]

This is the future of this game:

"However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE
needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further
revenue – revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you."

And this is what you mean to CCP.

Hulkageddon Orphanage
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:27:00 - [1592]

If CCP now this quickly change the PLEX AURUM exchange rate or change the NEX prices, those that bought into this MicroTransaction on Day 0, GET A BIG HARD KICK IN THE TEETH.

Now, would they buy more if that happens? I would think / hope they would think twice about it.

Ranka Mei
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:27:00 - [1593]

Originally by: Cpt Wrongway
After thinking about it for a long while I've decided that maybe it's best for this to happen. Think of it a couple of ways; CCP is a growing company and they're doing all this to make profit, that's all corporations exist for. Now how do you make more proft and gain new customers when the old guard players have such a heads up on PvP and dominate the SP difference. You keep the core game but offer the weaker willed or more impatient new players the ability to have more of an edge in the existing world. Of course there have to be limits, maybe if you pay for boosts it's only good upto a certain level of SP and or only works on NPCs if we're talking about fancy ammo or something, and the NeX isn't a market killer, people will still buy your PLEXs and there will still be demand for more and CCP will still make proft.

You poor deluded man! You think this is good for the noobs? Perhaps this is a good time to quote Malcanis' Law:

Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of "new players", that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players.

Brutor Tribe
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:28:00 - [1594]

Originally by: Jehvan Sunburnadire
Originally by: Othran
Originally by: Jehvan Sunburnadire

No. Plex are best thought of as equivalent to promisorry notes or bearer-bonds. They are a loan to CCP in return for something that entitles the bearer to 30 days of game time. As has already been stated in this thread, it would be interesting to see a test case regarding the 'limited liabilities' that companies like to put in their EULAs though.

I'm afraid you are seriously out of date. While PLEX started with the status you seem to think it still has, CCP changed it to a full in-game item last summer. As an in-game item CCP own it, not you.

Thanks for the info, I stand corrected! Smile

You perhaps missed the edit :

Edit - if you have it reverse redeemed then that might be a legal argument that would work, but PLEX is nailed down, CCP just want to get rid of the stockpile.

Planetary Genocide
White Sail Anarchists
Yarr Collective
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:28:00 - [1595]

I'm logged in but autopiloting at the moment. I might even turn to afk mining, and anyone who has ever brought up the subject of mining in front of me knows that I ****ing hate it.

As much as I'd like to think that this will never happen, I am preparing a plan to carry out if (when) it does... I think I'll follow the example of people like Paul Clavet and trade all my assets in for PLEX to donate to a plex for good drive.

Also, this kinda reminds me of the backstory where all the empires recognize that Sansha's a threat and they kinda get together and **** them up... if anything can bring all the nullsec alliances together, it's saving the game that we used to love.

Amy Darkfire
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:28:00 - [1596]

Edited by: Amy Darkfire on 23/06/2011 17:28:40
CCP is pulling a John Smedley..
this is their version of a "New Game Experience".

ah well The Old Republic is due later in the year :D


Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:28:00 - [1597]

Edited by: Jade Constantine on 23/06/2011 17:28:44

Originally by: Abelard Nightbringer

Quoting Jade Constantine's best post ever...

this is his best? Ill reword it for him

Please don't play silly games with reinterpreting the very simple argument I am making.

1. Im too stupid to have cargo open when i dock, or double click the ship to open cargo from ships window. oh, and right clicking - activate ship is too hard on my brain

The argument is that this expansion has in effect taken away functionality that we've played with for years now. Needing to run multiple clients with CQ turned off means we get a dead wallpaper that cannot be interracted with and does not show the ship we are piloting. It is not a complicated argument.

2. Speculation of Doom, wow, the world is ending, just not right now, maybe later

I am making reference to what purports to be a CCP newsletter that has not yet been disavowed by CCP. In that newsletter a lead producer of the game is speaking about introducing micropayments for gameplay boosts and advantages and strongly advocating FTP (free to play) style micropay conventions into a (pay to play) PTP subscription based game and that means he is looking for a way to charge us TWICE for content we have already paid for. You can mischaracterize my comments as doom-mongering by all means but do not claim I am not referencing a document in the public domain that has not yet been disavowed by CCP.


3. Speculation of Doom, 6+ months from now, based on actions that have not happened yet. I am too stupid to comprehend how to use isk to buy things from the noble store even if they existed (WHICH THEY DONT YET), like in the LP store that for some reason i cant complain about right now. I am just too hard headed to understand that new things in the noble store are just as attainable to anyone else thru isk, therefore i think i am being held back.

I own a Titan in this game. I am not short of isk. But I do not like the way the Noble store messes with the sandbox in denying the player base of eve the chance to manufacture the things that will be for sale in the market. I think this is short-circuiting the industrial side of Eve even as "vanity items" but does represent a terrible slide into greedy money-grubbing microsanctioning that has no place whatsoever in a pay to play game.

If ccp want more money they should just put the subscription up and stop messing with the essential balance of the sandbox that keeps this game healthy and viable.

Io Koval
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:28:00 - [1598]

Edited by: Io Koval on 23/06/2011 17:28:55
whoops. Ignore.

Adunh Slavy
Ammatar Trade Syndicate
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:29:00 - [1599]

Originally by: Miilla

I always loved NOT voting Steve Balmer

blue badge ftw

Financial Removal
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:30:00 - [1600]

CCP just became the biggest griefer in EVE.

Forget about Orphanage, or any other silly pirates etc.

This amount tears produced in such a short timespan must be somewhat of a record.

But truth to be told, these tears might be too salty and too numerous. For even CCP.

Posted - 2011.06.23 17:30:00 - [1601]

Originally by: Marielle Ley
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and “get” what makes Eve great – and that’s the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not “get eve” does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base.

Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game:

1. The Captains Quarters – it’s not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible – if you have a bad graphic card it’s a jerk fest – if you have a decent graphics card it’s heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQ’s turned on – I can run it smoothly – but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQ’s on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay.

CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a “disembark ship” option to the UI but “oh no” to do that would have meant we weren’t being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if we’re to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store.

2. If you read the newsletter you’ll see reference to saved fitting slots – and I don’t know about you Verone but in JF we’ve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the “biz-devs” talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such “minor upgrades.”?

3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldn’t you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about.

Here’s the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didn’t want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come.

I don’t want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really don’t have much of a clue in business.

Not something I'm going to make a habit as far as agreeing with Jade Constantine goes, but signed.

I feel dirty for agreeing with Jade, but for once, it was quite well written too. +1

Cyber Duck
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:30:00 - [1602]

Edited by: Cyber Duck on 23/06/2011 17:33:51
Originally by: Cyber Duck
CCP 1st Post Number guess = 1549 :p

Well... I lost this bet...

Edit: That post was all the way back in the mid 500's.

Hulkageddon Orphanage
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:31:00 - [1603]

Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 17:32:02
Originally by: Adunh Slavy
Originally by: Miilla

I always loved NOT voting Steve Balmer

blue badge ftw

A lower numbered blue to be exact :P which is before the CSP bull****. :)

Basgerin Pirate
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:33:00 - [1604]

So...ya... good going ccp way to **** up EvE

also the door is very nice, thank you.Rolling Eyes

Adunh Slavy
Ammatar Trade Syndicate
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:33:00 - [1605]

Originally by: Miilla

A lower numbered blue to be exact :P which is before the CSP bull****. :)

Turned mine in years ago, not had a real job since Smile

leth ghost
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:35:00 - [1606]

this thread may get too 100,000 views in 24 hours

Judicator Saturnius
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:36:00 - [1607]

I think the appropriate question now is:

How long will they keep asking for a sub fee when they have so many far-reaching MT schemes in place? The games they seem to want to emulate are in large part F2P with an emphasis on MT. Had they stated EVE would be F2P before this storm they might have won over at least a few players who are ok with being second-class so long as the game is free. In this model, paying once just to have the luxury of logging in and twice to stay competitive, you really have nobody that's happy. Subscriber/anti-mt players are unhappy about the gameplay MT advantages, the F2P/pro-mt potential-players are not going to sign on for something that isn't F2P.

They literally took the worst of both worlds and combined the two.

Sakura Zendragon
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:37:00 - [1608]

CCP & CCP Soundwave:

I fart in your general direction!

Good day, sirs.

Vasiliy Jopodirkin
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:37:00 - [1609]

His name was John Turbefield!

Cyber Duck
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:38:00 - [1610]

So... it's just turned 5:30pm in iceland, end of their working day, the day after their internal newsletter was leaked... and still no word... guess we'll be here another 24 hours ugh

Terianna Eri
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:38:00 - [1611]

Edited by: Terianna Eri on 23/06/2011 19:09:28
Oh, and:

Image changed to link. Navigator

p.s. u mad?
-Teri <3

Hulkageddon Orphanage
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:39:00 - [1612]

Originally by: leth ghost
this thread may get too 100,000 views in 24 hours

We even beat this thread :)

Open Designs
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:41:00 - [1613]

fifty four page threadnought and not a single blue bar?

I can't believe that even CCP couldn't figure out how absolutely ****ing ****ed the entire EVE community would be over this...

Hulkageddon Orphanage
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:42:00 - [1614]

The people who bought monacles are crying they dont want the price to be LOWERED lol


Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:42:00 - [1615]

That "Your characters will be stored safely" is bull****.

They have no policy on it apart from saying they may one day delete them.

Audelyn Xiao
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:43:00 - [1616]

Originally by: Digital Messiah
This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No amount of creeping it in has worked either.

While it will have an effect on the supplier side of the market--depending on what CCP sells--six months ago I could spend my local currency and buy both an Thanatos and a pilot to sit in it, if I had so chosen. Clearly, money for non-vanity items has not killed every game that has ever tried it: this one.

Sakura Zendragon
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:43:00 - [1617]

Originally by: Cyber Duck
So... it's just turned 5:30pm in iceland, end of their working day, the day after their internal newsletter was leaked... and still no word... guess we'll be here another 24 hours ugh

If this is as big of a cluster**** as it seems to be, I wouldn't be surprised they're still in the same all day long emergency-all-hands-on-deck management meeting trying to find a way to spin, mitigate, damage control, sweep under the rug, backpedal, fix or somehow get a grip...

Tea Ester Elliot
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:43:00 - [1618]

Originally by: Constantinus Maximus
That "Your characters will be stored safely" is bull****.

They have no policy on it apart from saying they may one day delete them.

More likely to hold them for future sale. I wonder how much ARUM cash they'll get for my 9 characters, most of which are in excess of 90m sp.

Hulkageddon Orphanage
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:44:00 - [1619]

Originally by: Constantinus Maximus
That "Your characters will be stored safely" is bull****.

They have no policy on it apart from saying they may one day delete them.

Good, so if we cancel they get insta deleted?

Then that's another reason not to return, NAIL HAMMER COFFIN.

Carmine Lady
Yarr Collective
Posted - 2011.06.23 17:45:00 - [1620]

Edited by: Carmine Lady on 23/06/2011 17:45:48

sums up my feelings

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