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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:20:00 - [151]
 

Edited by: Akita T on 22/06/2011 11:29:17


ISSUE BROUGHT FORTH A FEW WEEKS AGO.

The CQ environment (still) runs worse than 3 times slower compared to the old hangar view.

Even people with NEWER graphics cards will "suffer" from increased video card heat levels due to nearly three times the workload being required (compared to the old hangar view).




The first step seems to have been taken - we have the option to NOT load the CQ environment.
What it does is keep displaying the "Loading" screen on the background without ever actually loading anything.
This is a decent fallback for the people with less than stellar performance machines which would be overwhelmed by the extreme graphics of the CQ, but it's a very poor compromise for people that actually wanted to run the CQ environment every now and then.

BUT IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE ONLY TEMPORARY !!! WTF ?!? BLOG linkage

A much better fallback however would be the option to maintain the current hangar view alongside the CQ environment.
Sure, start off new players inside the CQ if you want, make the option to load the old hangar instead of CQ hard to accidentally find in the menu if you want, but allow the option to remain.
It even makes far more RP sense - the boarding of a pod and subsequent exit from it is supposed to be a relatively slow process, and you're not supposed to look exactly tidy (all covered in pod goo and naked) the moment you get out of a pod, so getting out of it every time you dock makes very little sense.
Keeping the current station environment alongside CQ should not be such a big deal (I mean, how hard it can be NOT to delete something), and it would go a long way towards appeasing some people that don't even know yet that they'll be annoyed by its absence (let's face it, not everybody knows what's coming, and you can fully expect a horde of angry people coming to the forums for the first time to complain).

But let's say that for some reason, you can't keep the old hangar environments, no matter what reason.
The current compromise only allows us to select between CQ at same graphics detail as the rest of the game, or no CQ at all (just a blank screen with the neocom on it, from what I understand).
The problem that should be obvious with that is the fact even the lowest detail level CQ has a noticeably worse framerate compared to the highest detail level current hangar or space environment.
CQ and space need to have two completely separate sets of graphics options, and a much lower graphics detail option than the ones available now needs to be present. Ideally, you should be able to set it in such a way that inside CQ you can get roughly the same FPS as you can get while flying in space.
Granted, some parts of CQ would look like crap under those conditions and at the current development level (heck, some parts look bad even on highest everything right now), but that's a different story.


So, to recap, if CCP insists, well, ok, keep the CQ environment as the default enabled option, but:

* MANDATORY - separate the CQ from the non-CQ graphics detail settings into two completely separate groups which you can set differently

* MANDATORY - keep the ESC menu option to not load any environment at all


* STRONGLY PREFERRED - add some even lower graphics detail levels for CQ

* OPTIONAL BUT HIGHLY DESIRABLE - do not delete the current hangar environments AND make them an alternative (default disabled) via the ESC menu



Hell, ideally entering CQ would be a station service button in the old hangar view !

Illwill Bill
Svea Crusaders
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:20:00 - [152]
 

Suggestion (assuming it's not already implemented):
Gather some stats about the number of players who chose to disable the CQ. The numbers could prove to be interesting.

Toll Collector
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:21:00 - [153]
 

Who else figured out this "point and click and hope for the best" is dumb. and I mean the people complaining about it as you can move character with WASD and when you are next to something clicking the option you want works.

Thunder Wind
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:21:00 - [154]
 

I am getting an "Outdated Video Card" message on both my Laptop and Desktop. I pulled my ATI card and replaced it with a better quality (But older) Nvidia card. Smother and better 3D Graph, and I still get the message. When I hit escape to lower the setting it kills the game altogether.

Shader Model 3 Needed. I wanted to just disable the setting with ESC and continue to play as usual. But it wonít let me.

As it stands I have a 3 Year Old Laptop I can no longer use to play as the Video card is integrated and no ability to replace. I have a Desktop that it seems I need to go buy a new video card for.

Please understand I really like what I have read in these updates. It really looks like fun and unique and different way to look and play. But you always made it possible to make video to a lower quality if needed so the game would still run. As it stands I now have 3 accounts paid for two months in advance I can no longer use. Now even if you fix this, I canít get the patch because my current client will not even load on any of my machines. I would have to download the entire game again and hope itís fixed.

Any chance on advice that does not require me to buy a new Laptop and buy a new Nvidia video card?

Ilah Gruhbarn
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:21:00 - [155]
 

Edited by: Ilah Gruhbarn on 22/06/2011 01:26:24
fps from 60 in station/space drop to 30fps in station and remained 60 in space while dual boxing i guess it is not bad...

chars look wash out comparing how they look in character creator=not so good nothing special at best.

800mm AC look like crap and fire effect is weak,model is missing whole from where bullets are coming out from.

ALL ships are pathetically small machariel is totally fake and immersion breaking looking smaller/same as other BS class.

i am not impressed so far i lost performance and got my fav ship c****d at while gaining nothing.

super edit. I AM STILL IN MY SHIP while walking supposedly around CQ this is BALZ either option to leave capsule or remain in ship otherwise GO HOME with this ****y incarna STOP BREAKING IMMERSION FOR YOUR MONEY STORE.

Dimension Secretary
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:22:00 - [156]
 

Edited by: Dimension Secretary on 22/06/2011 01:23:58
Forgot to say that i really would like a more freer movement with cam and also walking. I hate the aswd keys, even when cursor keys are free and not used. And btw, who played again with the sorting, now the ships window under station info sorts by a type, which i can't make out. You already screwed last time the wallet sorting, now that.

And.. if you graphics card gets hot, put it back to vertical sync (intervall default), that at least stops it from running wild, had that even before, nobody needs 200fps in space with 80 deg hot graphic chips.

Zanthan Kamaar
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:24:00 - [157]
 

My framerate is dropping thru the floor while in captain's quarters with a fairly average computer. That is my only real complaint. I am pretty indifferent to the ability to walk around now. I hope the future in station stuff is interesting. I personally couldn't care less about outrageous apparel prices. My biggest concern at this point is the mechanics with bombs and such in highsec. This is a major issue for many players. Other than that, the corp recruitment window is nearly non functional for large corps. Though I know you are aware of this issue already Wink

Toll Collector
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:25:00 - [158]
 

Originally by: Thunder Wind
I am getting an "Outdated Video Card" message on both my Laptop and Desktop. I pulled my ATI card and replaced it with a better quality (But older) Nvidia card. Smother and better 3D Graph, and I still get the message. When I hit escape to lower the setting it kills the game altogether.

Shader Model 3 Needed. I wanted to just disable the setting with ESC and continue to play as usual. But it wonít let me.

As it stands I have a 3 Year Old Laptop I can no longer use to play as the Video card is integrated and no ability to replace. I have a Desktop that it seems I need to go buy a new video card for.

Please understand I really like what I have read in these updates. It really looks like fun and unique and different way to look and play. But you always made it possible to make video to a lower quality if needed so the game would still run. As it stands I now have 3 accounts paid for two months in advance I can no longer use. Now even if you fix this, I canít get the patch because my current client will not even load on any of my machines. I would have to download the entire game again and hope itís fixed.

Any chance on advice that does not require me to buy a new Laptop and buy a new Nvidia video card?



They told us a while ago Incarna would require shader model 3.0 and there was no way around it.

OttoParts
Caldari
Corporation 432
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:27:00 - [159]
 

My feedback:

After letting EVE (and my Captain's Quarters) load for 5 minutes, I was surprised to see that I was able to see myself walking around. It only took five minutes to realize it wasn't a first person view, but rather third person.

I couldn't figure out how to get to the Noble Exchange at first. Keeping in mind that I wasn't testing any patches, wasn't digging through Youtube videos, wasn't reading exactly how to do what... That was a button that certainly should have been put by the market, in my opinion. However, after looking at the very few things that were available, compared to what the market could field, I am glad it was nowhere near the button for the market after all.

Additionally, I was shocked to see the prices for items on the Noble Exchange. Noble is a good word for this market- you'll need to be crapping gold to think about buying anything on it for a (and I emphasis) VIRTUAL character that, as of this writing, and with no future date set in stone (or even guessed at by CCP, at least that I can see), I will be the sole viewer of. Or in other words, I don't need to spend an easy $100USD so that I can feel good about my virtual alter ego. I do that enough with my subscription costs alone, thank you.

And that was as far as I got before quitting EVE. Bloated, slow, expensive, and clunky as all hell to use- that's my impression of Incarna as it was designed.

Thunder Wind
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:27:00 - [160]
 

Originally by: Toll Collector
Originally by: Thunder Wind
I am getting an "Outdated Video Card" message on both my Laptop and Desktop. I pulled my ATI card and replaced it with a better quality (But older) Nvidia card. Smother and better 3D Graph, and I still get the message. When I hit escape to lower the setting it kills the game altogether.

Shader Model 3 Needed. I wanted to just disable the setting with ESC and continue to play as usual. But it wonít let me.

As it stands I have a 3 Year Old Laptop I can no longer use to play as the Video card is integrated and no ability to replace. I have a Desktop that it seems I need to go buy a new video card for.

Please understand I really like what I have read in these updates. It really looks like fun and unique and different way to look and play. But you always made it possible to make video to a lower quality if needed so the game would still run. As it stands I now have 3 accounts paid for two months in advance I can no longer use. Now even if you fix this, I canít get the patch because my current client will not even load on any of my machines. I would have to download the entire game again and hope itís fixed.

Any chance on advice that does not require me to buy a new Laptop and buy a new Nvidia video card?



They told us a while ago Incarna would require shader model 3.0 and there was no way around it.


Thx , i didnt want to go buy something if there was a work around. Confused

E Resistor
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:27:00 - [161]
 

first and foremost: Worst Expansion EVAR !!!
It does not add any value to my gameplay and i only experience downsides (random bugs, imposed Incarna, bad turret icons) so far.


While i totally support CCPs aim to expand their vision of a Scifi simulation, try not to impair parts of the game that are well established and functional like the good old ship spinning hangar view.

1) I really don't see any argument against not having the option of totally switching the walking in stations part off and keep having the old hangar view, where i can view my active ship at the angle and zoom level i want without having to go into a preview or fitting screen. This would also be more consistent with the EVE lore. Anyhow, the big catchphrase here is choice which we are not given...yea, its either Incarna or look at a wallpaper (latter one isn't really a good choice and was stated to be only a temporary solution in a dev-blog)

2) Turrets: every effort that goes into making pew-pew look more awesome is extremely appreciated. while animations and effects look fine, i can't get rid of the impression that most new turret models just suck. some don't fit the weapon type, some look way too fragile, some too chunky even comical and others just plain bad. also many of the animations from inactive to active states just seem way too fancy and forced. This is purely my personal opinion on the new turret graphics but as far as i have seen i am by far not alone.

TL;DR
as unlikely as it is to have any impact

- give us the Option of Old Hangar View instead of Incarna (for ppl that like EVE even without controlling a human avatar) AKA GIVE US SHIP SPINNING BACK
- rework or better redesign all the guns at least make their icons easier to recognize

MuntadaralZaidi
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:29:00 - [162]
 

OK, so I'm actually giving WiS a chance. Some feedback, though I'm not entirely sure CCP will care.

We need a way to re-center the screen at the current location of the mouse cursor. As it is, zooming in zooms in over the shoulder...which leads to the avatar being obscured by chat and the inventory windows. I know there's a mirror, but honestly, if CCP wants to charge obscene prices for vanity clothing, the least CCP could do is give us the ability to zoom in/out to look at it without having the avatar go so ridiculously off-center.

Needs run button. Capsuleers are theoretically supposed to be the elite of the elite as far as soldiers are concerned...yet movement is this clunky?

Needs embark/disembark. If you dock, you get old station view. If you disembark, you go to CQ. Likewise, needs a setting to control whether or not to auto-disembark upon docking. This way, we would get ship spinning back xD

Confirming Noble Exchange prices are ridiculous. I hadn't planned on using AUR before, way to affirm my plans CCP. If the prices were actually reasonable I might have actually considered using ISK a few months down the line, if I saw anything I liked. (Also, not that this matters with the ridiculous prices, but the selection is quite limited.)

FPS are generally between 20-35 with a GTX 260M/core duo/6 gb ram. About 30 when I'm just standing there, closer to 20 when I'm moving or rotating the camera. It did improve to 35-45 when I got out to the new incarnation of the ship hangar.

I have a cooling pad for my laptop, and it seems to be keeping heat issues under control. If I didn't, it would be melted by now, I'm sure, but anyone who uses a laptop for games should have a cooling pad anyway...

Unlike some here, I'm willing to give WiS a chance, as I'm sure there will be more to it once we can get into public areas of stations; however it still needs a significant amount of work imo

Tesla Grass
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:32:00 - [163]
 

Firstly CCP, cheers for the second patch in a row that I was totally looking foward too, and yet again, seems to have delivered in keeping my playing Eve for some time.
BRING BACK THE ABILITY TO SPIN MY SHIP!
That was the first thing I noticed and the only thing that really annoys me.

Its great that you guys have finally included a Agent Finder, but I feel its a bit half arsed.
Why can you only search by "solar system" and not by "constellation, or region"?

Cheers for the game CCP

Reilly Duvolle
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:32:00 - [164]
 

Originally by: MuntadaralZaidi
We need a way to re-center the screen at the current location of the mouse cursor. As it is, zooming in zooms in over the shoulder...which leads to the avatar being obscured by chat and the inventory windows. I know there's a mirror, but honestly, if CCP wants to charge obscene prices for vanity clothing, the least CCP could do is give us the ability to zoom in/out to look at it without having the avatar go so ridiculously off-center.


Esc - display and graphichs tab - bottom left = Incarna camera controls

Cunane Jeran
Gallente
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:33:00 - [165]
 

Edited by: Cunane Jeran on 22/06/2011 01:43:29
Incarna as a whole I like, walking up to my very humble Vexor was a moment of awe, while I've had to turn off station graphics due to a dying pc, as soon as I get a new one, I'll have that back, but I really would like to see it alongside the old hanger view, CQ I feel would be great if it was a choice, say your docking up for a while, doing some trading or talking crap with corpies, being able to walk around, sit down etc is fantastic. But if your in lowsec docking for a quick ammo resupply or pickup it completely breaks immerison to get out of the pod and stand in your quarters like a numpty. Maybe a "disembark?" opition when you dock wouldn't go amiss.

What really REALLY needs looking at is the vanity items, namely the fact they are macro transactions. I think a lot of the playerbase was expecting a fair deal, maybe a new shirt/trousers costing in the region of $5-7 dollars at the most, but these prices are just ******ed. $50 dollars for just a monocle is plain crazy.

What makes it crazier is if you get podded, you loose it. I can see why its being done your targeting the plex for isk crowd, but please such a huge money grab for vanity items is frankly insulting.

Please rethink the pricing. I for one would use the store alot if it was reasonable *MICRO*transactions.

daint666
Minmatar
WEPRA CORP
White Noise.
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:34:00 - [166]
 

Edited by: daint666 on 22/06/2011 01:44:00
about 10 major points here:

-> The gun icons look TERRIBAD. Seriously they all look the same, there's no distinction between size or type. The icons look like what i've seen in the icons for some 10 year old futuristic RTS

-> Prices for stuff are awful, just dont expect to see me buying any of that utter crap.

-> CQ runs fine for me but it does nothing. It slows me undocking, and shows me a few screens about previous updates that i couldnt give a flying **** about. Incursions? Planets? i dont actually give a toss.

-> The entire CQ was so awful that its now off within 20 mins. just stupid, really. Let me spin my ship in the other thing please.

-> some crappy little autocannon looks miles more impressive than my 1400 howitzer. WTF! 1400mm is the size of a small car FFS.

-> The only good thing to come out of this entire expansion is the good looking maller. Now hurry up and make faction BC's for Sansha and other races. Also make Republic Fleet Hurricanes/cyclones etc. NOT A STUPID PIECE OF **** RE-TEXTURED SCORPION.


Kent Reeves
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:34:00 - [167]
 

Where were you people when this was being tested?

My 2 cents: My graphics card is warm (very warm) which isn't a problem, I can just turn up the fan speed (75% is a bit excessive though. I don't even use this much playing high-end FPS.)

My problem is with the limited "content" actually released. A lot of us were expecting the other CQs (amarr/caldari/gallente) to be available upon launch and that you left the minmatar one on SiSi simply for some SURPRISE factor. I am disappointed. You could have at least given us those (and maybe a corporate office).

Samuel Wess
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:34:00 - [168]
 

Edited by: Samuel Wess on 22/06/2011 01:37:35
I was missing the old hangar but now i noticed the turret icons too Laughing They all look like pieces of gray stuff over there ugly and not different one from another...come one you should do things better not worst. Maybe they look cool fitted on the ships (haven't really checked that yet) but something is wrong with the icons in hangar.

Edit: In the middle of every difficulty lies opportunity. Maybe we will get a new better game from other developers.

darius mclever
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:34:00 - [169]
 

Originally by: Akita T
Edited by: Akita T on 22/06/2011 01:20:32

ISSUE BROUGHT FORTH A FEW WEEKS AGO.

The CQ environment (still) runs worse than 3 times slower compared to the old hangar view.

Even people with NEWER graphics cards will "suffer" from video card overheating due to nearly three times the workload being required (compared to the old hangar view).



[snip]



seconded.

a *single* client in the CQ was getting my gfx card to 67įC and mostlikely higher if i hadnt switched off the CQ stuff.

usually i needed 3 clients to reach like 65įC. Carbon UI was already pushing up the temperature of 2-3 clients. this makes it almost impossible, if just one client is docked.

so for now ... CQ off for me.

Khudin Hadashur
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:34:00 - [170]
 

First off: if at all technically possible I would strongly suggest an Incarna 'light' mode for those who are simply not interested in walking around or are at the lower end of the performance spectrum. A bunk with some interactive screens will do fine.

First impressions for now are as follows:

Pro
*New turrets look nice (tried several flavors of artillery and it agreed with me).

*New Maller model looks very nice. Scorpion update from earlier was also a success, so please continue on this path.

*Agent finder is a a very good start, will need a bit more iteration to make it a great in-game tool.


Con
*Turret icons on your targeted ships are way too dark, making it hard to distinguish what weapons system is activated on what target.

*Salvager icon is severely underwhelming.

*Noble Exchange items are ridiculously overpriced - I honestly can not see why one would want to spend one month of gametime on a dress or pants.

*Ability to drag ship into hangar to make it active will be missed, hopefully this can be implemented again in some form.

*Character in CQ somehow does not resemble what you've built in the character creator, even at maxed graphics.

DHuncan
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:36:00 - [171]
 

How to leave ship and undock with capsule?

Skunkguru
Super Batungwaa Ninja Warriors
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:37:00 - [172]
 

Give us the old station environment as an option!!

Akkukkak
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:38:00 - [173]
 

What a piece of crap. Incredible fail!! CQ Su*cks.

CCP: Why do you asked for Feedback? Its a joke?

Solution: make all this CQ optional and you will see the real "feedback" Razz

MuntadaralZaidi
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:38:00 - [174]
 

Originally by: Reilly Duvolle
Originally by: MuntadaralZaidi
We need a way to re-center the screen at the current location of the mouse cursor. As it is, zooming in zooms in over the shoulder...which leads to the avatar being obscured by chat and the inventory windows. I know there's a mirror, but honestly, if CCP wants to charge obscene prices for vanity clothing, the least CCP could do is give us the ability to zoom in/out to look at it without having the avatar go so ridiculously off-center.


Esc - display and graphichs tab - bottom left = Incarna camera controls


Thank you - new question - why the hell did that setting default 100% to the right?

I still think we need to be able to re-center by cursor; it would be far more intuitive than digging around the settings in the ESC menu.

Solara Handel
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:40:00 - [175]
 

The camera zoom is off center in CQ. Looks pretty though, very detailed environment.

DHuncan
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:41:00 - [176]
 

Originally by: DHuncan
How to leave ship and undock with capsule?


Never mind.

Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:43:00 - [177]
 

at least this patch features only a poorly thought out useless 'feature' everyone has disabled, instead of something game-breaking

thanks!

Kalpel
Caldari
United Systems of the Allegiance
Important Internet Spaceship League
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:44:00 - [178]
 

Originally by: Amber Villaneous
I can't spin my ships you fuggin a$$hats!


This ^^^ and you guys can fix rail guns on the harpy , one gun goes up and the other gun goes down, WTF? it looks F***king stupid now


You need left side and right side guns Rolling Eyes, can't believe you guys missed that

Sunbird Huy
Caldari
WEPRA CORP
White Noise.
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:45:00 - [179]
 

800mm rep. artillery II :
A four-barreled, intermediate-range, powerful cannon capable of causing tremendous damage. The icon and I believe fitted module...displays 2 barreled turret.

1400mm Howitzer Artillery II :
Two barrels also? What the hell?

Seriously, not only that you haven't improved EVE, you have swept the ground underneath our space feet. or anti-gravity thrusters on our spaceships... whatever...

Zora'e
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
Talocan United
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:47:00 - [180]
 

Originally by: CCP Caedmon
If you are having performance issues it is possible to adjust your graphics settings in the "Display & Graphics" tab of the Esc Menu.

Additionally there is a check-box called "Load Station Environment" under the "Graphic Content Settings" column on the right hand side of the "Display & Graphics" tab. Uncheck this box to replace the station environment with a static image the next time you dock (if you are currently in a station you must undock and redock to see the change take effect).


You guys are morons. You know what. I really don't care if you ban my accounts at this point. You ignored every thread and every suggestion in the test server feedback section of the forums regarding making WiS optional (like you people originally promised us). You remove previously working and functional content in favor of a STATIC IMAGE for those who choose NOT to load Barbies in space when you could easily have kept to your STATED PROMISE to us that we would have the OPTION to decant or not and made everyone happy.

You could have made everybody happy by adding a simple, single button to the neocom [Decant] but no. You just had to roll out your USELESS. Hardware damaging product. And force it down peoples throats. Then to add insult to injury you add MT into the equation at grossly inflated prices.

Seriously... I've seen more intelligence coming from a dead cat. You guys seriously need to see a shrink if you think for a single second this is good business.

Go back to your dev meeting, light up that garbage you are obviously smoking, and grow a clue. You pretty much guaranteed WiS will fail (at this point) with how you rolled it out and you guys ain't smart enough to figure it out. Seriously... My comp can handle WiS, but i'll never load it again until the day you remove the option to disable it, at which point I will take my RL isk somewhere else.

Barbies in closets.
Terrible graphics performance.
Over priced 'vanity' items.

I was for Incarna. I looked forward to what you promised us. This... Rolling Eyes



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