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blankseplocked So CCP, now that you have ruined T3 command ships...
 
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ALTOTHEIX
Advocates of Sin
Posted - 2011.06.21 15:40:00 - [31]
 

Originally by: Syphon Lodian
Originally by: Shepard Book
You wanting to be unprobable makes you the barbie IMO.


+1 internets for you sir.

Redeemable upon request.



lol

Malken
Celestial Apocalypse
Posted - 2011.06.21 15:43:00 - [32]
 

afaik there is no "T3 Command Ships", just the "T3 Strategic Cruiser"

no ship should ever be unscannable.


Myra2007
Millstone Industries
Posted - 2011.06.21 15:46:00 - [33]
 

If you pay attention you're not going to get caught either way. Greyscale really did eve a disservice when he decided to let unprobable ships on tq back in the day. Look at you you even forgot how to keep people from scanning you.

Tammarr
Posted - 2011.06.21 15:47:00 - [34]
 

How many virtue set all 5s covert ops pilots with best gear is out there? I wouldnt be to worried =)

Nah Ting Tooluze
Posted - 2011.06.21 15:54:00 - [35]
 

Originally by: Tammarr
How many virtue set all 5s covert ops pilots with best gear is out there? I wouldnt be to worried =)


All those afk cloaky ones are, you just know it. :)

Makko Gray
Pheno-Tech Industries
Crimson Wings.
Posted - 2011.06.21 16:03:00 - [36]
 

Originally by: Nah Ting Tooluze
Originally by: Tammarr
How many virtue set all 5s covert ops pilots with best gear is out there? I wouldnt be to worried =)


All those afk cloaky ones are, you just know it. :)


But they don't need to scan you out as they're already behind you!! /o\

John Wilkes Booth
Posted - 2011.06.21 16:08:00 - [37]
 

Your entire argument is flawed from the beginning. T3 are NOT supposed to be better than their specialized counterparts. A T3 command ship isn't supposed to be better than those actual specialized T2 command ships. A tengu set up for ecm shouldn't be better at jamming than a falcon. T3 isn't about being able to set up a ship better than an already existing specialized ship. It is about having the flexibility to make a ship that fits different roles sufficiently from the same hull, but at the cost of it not being AS good as the specialized T2 ship. There is no need to whine about a T3 command ship no longer being better than the specialized T2 command ship, because it never should have been in the first place.

MaiLina KaTar
Posted - 2011.06.21 16:10:00 - [38]
 

Originally by: Main ForumAlt
Originally by: Black Dranzer
Originally by: Ghoest
You cant always get what you want.


But if you try sometimes..


You get what you need!

Oh... you a-holes!

Now that **** will be in my head all day!

I see what you did there!

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2011.06.21 16:39:00 - [39]
 

Frankly, I will continue to use T3 gang boosters whether they are probeable or not. In fact, I kinda welcome this change because it means that I will face fewer gangs with gang bonuses, and thus will have an even bigger advantage in combat.

Also, Command Ships 5 crew checking in. Cool

Telvani
Crouching Woman Hidden Cucumber
Posted - 2011.06.21 16:53:00 - [40]
 

Edited by: Telvani on 21/06/2011 16:55:00
While I'm glad it is no longer possible to make unprobable ships this change does sound awful. Doesn't it remove all skill from scanning? I was hoping CCP would just alter the forumla to ( (Sig rad / SS) + X) and just make X a number so you dont get unprobable ship but some ships are still more difficult to find, or change it to MAX(1.2,(Sig rad/SS)) putting a bottom value on ship sig and keeping everything probable.

Now sod sisters gear, sod the virtues, rip off your grav rigs and dont worry about probe placement just spam more probes on that result untill it lights up. How is that an improvement? Did CCP even look into the many routes they could have gone down to solve this problem (and it was a problem).

Another easy game mechanic for our new players and the micro transactions cash they bring to CCP.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2011.06.21 16:55:00 - [41]
 

They put the max at JUST below unscannable. I think someone said you needed max skills, implants, 6 probes, and a really tight probe configuration to hit someone who was previously unscannable.

Seriously, you people need to stop hyperventilating.

Telvani
Crouching Woman Hidden Cucumber
Posted - 2011.06.21 17:00:00 - [42]
 

I'm sorry, their patch notes are very ambiguous, it sounds like they just lets you use as many probes as you want? which would mean with enough probes out you wouldn't even need half the scan strength you had before to find someone.

While I apologise for not checking on Sisi I do feel a change this big does warrant better communication from CCP and we shouldn't be forced to use sisi to see exactly how its gunna work.

Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
Posted - 2011.06.21 17:11:00 - [43]
 

Fantastic fix.

Now don't get me wrong, this would have been on my training to-do list for one of my accounts anyways, as the unscannable booster ships were total win.

That being said, they were also ridiculous and provided a massive advantage in pvp with zero drawbacks. Zero drawbacks is extremely un-Eve like, as most ships, modules, and tactics in eve have their cost, even if its just their ridiculous isk price (I'm looking at you, Bhaalgorns/Machariels).

I want CCP to go a step further, and require command ships to actually be on the field to provide their bonus. I think bonuses should be given a range, even if its as far as 300km, forcing the command ships to be present with their supporting fleets to be effective.

Command ships, when properly fit and piloted, can certainly hold their own in combat, with a solid fleet protecting them. I think this should be mandatory, as it makes for more exciting engagements with high-value targets on the field and the challenge of keeping them alive, along with the tide-turning factor of taking one down in the middle of a big fight.

Having your Claymore / Damnation sitting at a POS giving bonuses is about as lame as your tech 3 sitting unscannable at a safe spot.

Please CCP, put command ships in the fray. They belong there.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2011.06.21 17:20:00 - [44]
 

Edited by: Liang Nuren on 21/06/2011 17:21:07
Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen
Please CCP, put command ships in the fray. They belong there.


Command Ships are interesting, because they already provide big benefits that T3s don't - like bonuses immediately on jumping into the enemy and damage on the field. Most people using T3s would actually be better off with command ships.

-Liang

Ed: BTW, I'm also not a fan of grid only gang bonuses... ;-)

JC Anderson
Caldari
Noir.
Noir. Mercenary Group
Posted - 2011.06.21 17:25:00 - [45]
 

Am glad they changed this as well.

Idris alDin
Posted - 2011.06.21 17:37:00 - [46]
 

Originally by: Dace Kaveira
T3's were ment to function in Wormholes. To stop players from getting stuck in Wormholes or have to transport in dozens of ships they designed the capabilities of the T3.


definitely.. owait you can't swap subsystems at a pos. /facepalms

Cataca
Posted - 2011.06.21 17:47:00 - [47]
 

I hope people realize that to get those prior unscanable ships you need to have flawless probing skills, sister probes, cov ops 5 and a virtue set.

Both sides, the defensive and the guys celebrating this as the best thing ever, do have to realize that it wont be that easy to catch them still.

Cipher Jones
Minmatar
Posted - 2011.06.21 17:48:00 - [48]
 

Quote:
Why do I ask even asking? I already know the answer. My game of Internet Spaceships has been replaced with Internet Barbies.



No, your Barbie like tactics have been replaced by more realistic internet space ships. There is a world of difference.

Telvani
Crouching Woman Hidden Cucumber
Posted - 2011.06.21 17:53:00 - [49]
 

If you try and make boosters grid or range based you are gunna see some heavy grid-fu use

IF you make them on grid you will see boosters sat 10,000km away on grid with a nice load of WTF space inbetween.

IF you make them 250km range or similar you will see compressed grids with boosters sat 200km away on a different grid.

People need to bear in mind that these ships represent one less ship on the field they are not a 'free' bonus and after this patch they will be a bit more balanced, it will also buff POS (and by extention dreads) as they will be far more useful tactically.

Lord o'Darkness
Posted - 2011.06.21 17:55:00 - [50]
 

Originally by: Dace Kaveira
T3's were ment to function in Wormholes. To stop players from getting stuck in Wormholes or have to transport in dozens of ships they designed the capabilities of the T3. The original idea of a T3 commandship was mere to function properly when set up inside a POS shield or when accomponied by Logistic ships. The reason why CCP gave T3's serveral roles is that any player could train up for them, head into a Wormhole with friends and change out their ships as needed. Therefore T3's can't outclass original T2's else there is no use for T2's. T3's were also ment to create a new class between HAC's and Battleships, increasing DPS and moving the tank near Battleships. However for a higher price then the above stated ship sizes. Also the T3 subsystems were created to function like nomads. A group of T3 pilots could move into a Wormhole, rat the **** out of there and move back to highsec, what ever they need to finish off a site that could be provided by the subsystems, which can be Logstics, EW, commandlinks or rough DPS. If T3's would outclass T2's in any of the above said ways, what would be the use of T2's as a small group of proper planned T3's could easily take out a much bigger group of T2's. However the prices of T3's are truly higher, it doesn't change the fact that the ways in EVE to gain lots of ISK have been improved and made way cheaper then before the T3 release. Hence this all, if you read this far you should've understood that you can, in no way, demand or even come up with the idea that T3's should outclass the capabilities of the way older T2's. Have fun.


I am sure you are aware that you cannot change subsystems in wormhole space, right?

Lord o'Darkness
Posted - 2011.06.21 17:57:00 - [51]
 

Edited by: Lord o''Darkness on 21/06/2011 17:58:45
Edit: double post Embarassed

Mutnin
Amarr
Mutineers
Posted - 2011.06.21 18:07:00 - [52]
 

Originally by: Dace Kaveira
T3's were ment to function in Wormholes. To stop players from getting stuck in Wormholes or have to transport in dozens of ships they designed the capabilities of the T3. The original idea of a T3 commandship was mere to function properly when set up inside a POS shield or when accomponied by Logistic ships. The reason why CCP gave T3's serveral roles is that any player could train up for them, head into a Wormhole with friends and change out their ships as needed. Therefore T3's can't outclass original T2's else there is no use for T2's. T3's were also ment to create a new class between HAC's and Battleships, increasing DPS and moving the tank near Battleships. However for a higher price then the above stated ship sizes. Also the T3 subsystems were created to function like nomads. A group of T3 pilots could move into a Wormhole, rat the **** out of there and move back to highsec, what ever they need to finish off a site that could be provided by the subsystems, which can be Logstics, EW, commandlinks or rough DPS. If T3's would outclass T2's in any of the above said ways, what would be the use of T2's as a small group of proper planned T3's could easily take out a much bigger group of T2's. However the prices of T3's are truly higher, it doesn't change the fact that the ways in EVE to gain lots of ISK have been improved and made way cheaper then before the T3 release. Hence this all, if you read this far you should've understood that you can, in no way, demand or even come up with the idea that T3's should outclass the capabilities of the way older T2's. Have fun.


Aside from the wall of text with no paragraphs, this makes no sense because you can't change sub systems in a POS. Wink


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