open All Channels
seplocked EVE Alliance Tournament Discussion
blankseplocked How to fix the tournament ....
 
This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 
Author Topic

Poetic Stanziel
Gallente
Macbeth Transport and Freight LLC
Posted - 2011.06.21 02:36:00 - [1]
 

The easy fix to the tournament, and one that would eliminate most meta-gaming (i.e. fixing of matches and joke setups) would be to switch to a single elimination system. The group stage winners from the previous year are seeded deeper into the match tree.

Basically, lose a match, you are immediately out of the tournament. Every fight is important, every fight you have to bring your best.

Sure, some teams may buy wins (advancement), but I think that sort of metagaming would not be common (except perhaps at the very early stages) ... the deeper you get into the tournament, the more serious the teams are, the less likely they can be bought off.

None of this would solve what happened in the Final. No ruleset can solve that problem, other than human intervention.

To solve that, simply have five judges ... if a majority rule that there was match fixing, both teams are disqualified. Joke setups and what happened in the final are hard to argue as being anything other than what they were.

AngryMax
Gallente
Warriors tribe
DarkSide.
Posted - 2011.06.21 02:53:00 - [2]
 

Problem is that if you face PL in round one, and you lose, it knocks you out of tournament while you could make it to the semi-finals given alternative brackets.


Raimo
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2011.06.21 05:15:00 - [3]
 

Originally by: AngryMax
Problem is that if you face Hydrabreak in round one, and you lose, it knocks you out of tournament while you could make it to the semi-finals given alternative brackets.




FYP

Poetic Stanziel
Gallente
Macbeth Transport and Freight LLC
Posted - 2011.06.21 05:19:00 - [4]
 

Edited by: Poetic Stanziel on 21/06/2011 06:00:22

Originally by: AngryMax
Problem is that if you face PL in round one, and you lose, it knocks you out of tournament while you could make it to the semi-finals given alternative brackets.


Except, that I said that all the teams that made it to the Group Stage in a previous year would be seeded later into the tournament. Therefore, no teams would face PL or Hydrabreak or Darkside on the first day.

So, you might have 64 teams on the first two days, 32 teams on the third day, on the 4th day the remaining 16 teams plus the 16 teams from the previous year's group stage (so 32 teams) would be pitted against each other, on day 5 the remaining 16 teams, and on day 6 you have 8 teams, then 4, then 2, then the winner.

Digger Nicks
Posted - 2011.06.22 18:54:00 - [5]
 

Why would you fix something that isn't broken?????????????????????????????????????????????????

Abaddonah
Posted - 2011.06.23 02:25:00 - [6]
 

Originally by: Digger Nicks
Why would you fix something that isn't broken?????????????????????????????????????????????????


It's broken. I started playing this game because I found the PL V RUR match while surfing Youtube and thought it was amazing. I reschedule my weekends to watch the Tournament every year. Next year, I doubt I'll even bother to catch the youtube releases. Clearly this sort of outcome will become the standard. CCP might as well just skip the hoopla, give PL Billions of isk and the prizes, and save the plain ticket money for the insider announcers who also had to fake their opinions due to prior knowledge of the fix...

To win the Sponsored Prizes players had to guess the winners and to that end, even the Sponsors got screwed.

Throughout history there are hundreds if not thousands of examples of fixed outcomes that had to be investigated and people held responsible. That will not happen here and no justice will be served.

The Alliance Tournament was and will be a waste of time to watch…

Again, save us the time and just hand the isk and prizes to whoever you like CCP because this was no contest…

Kurj Valdoria
Caldari
Guiding Hand Social Club
Dystopia Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.23 02:28:00 - [7]
 

There's no way to prevent metagaming. What we should focus on is 3rd/4th place prizes for those unlucky enough to not be on Hydrobreak.

Poetic Stanziel
Gallente
Macbeth Transport and Freight LLC
Posted - 2011.06.23 03:43:00 - [8]
 

Originally by: Kurj Valdoria
There's no way to prevent metagaming.

There is no way to eliminate it, but you can mitigate it. I believe a single-elimination tournament, as I described, would mitigate much metagaming. There is no longer the option to metagame the points, it is all about winning, or you're out.

Randomize All
Posted - 2011.06.23 08:53:00 - [9]
 

Originally by: Kurj Valdoria
There's no way to prevent metagaming. What we should focus on is 3rd/4th place prizes for those unlucky enough to not be on Hydrobreak.


Hydrabreak will be concentrating on 3rd/4th places in AT10 in addition to 1st & 2nd.

Levistus Junior
Caldari
Trojan Trolls
Controlled Chaos
Posted - 2011.06.23 11:25:00 - [10]
 

Originally by: Poetic Stanziel


To solve that, simply have five judges ... if a majority rule that there was match fixing, both teams are disqualified. Joke setups and what happened in the final are hard to argue as being anything other than what they were.


That won't work. If team A wants to lose against team B and they're working together, team A can just fly a setup that has a hard counter, and team B just bring the perfect counter. Problem solved

Jovan Geldon
Gallente
Lead Farmers
Kill It With Fire
Posted - 2011.06.23 12:32:00 - [11]
 

These threads never address the real issue; *why* should metagaming be banned?

Poetic Stanziel
Gallente
Macbeth Transport and Freight LLC
Posted - 2011.06.23 21:02:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Jovan Geldon
These threads never address the real issue; *why* should metagaming be banned?

It should NOT be banned. It should only be mitigated.

CCP cannot and should not police metagaming, they should only implement a tournament system that mitigates it.

Mercurial Blood
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2011.06.27 06:14:00 - [13]
 

Originally by: Poetic Stanziel
Originally by: Jovan Geldon
These threads never address the real issue; *why* should metagaming be banned?

It should NOT be banned. It should only be mitigated.

CCP cannot and should not police metagaming, they should only implement a tournament system that mitigates it.


Naw I like it the way it is.

Lykouleon
Wildly Inappropriate
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.06.27 17:05:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Poetic Stanziel
Originally by: Jovan Geldon
These threads never address the real issue; *why* should metagaming be banned?

It should NOT be banned. It should only be mitigated.

CCP cannot and should not police metagaming, they should only implement a tournament system that mitigates it.


Why should metagaming be mitigated?

Takakura Hirohito
Posted - 2011.06.28 02:01:00 - [15]
 

Originally by: Lykouleon
Originally by: Poetic Stanziel
Originally by: Jovan Geldon
These threads never address the real issue; *why* should metagaming be banned?

It should NOT be banned. It should only be mitigated.

CCP cannot and should not police metagaming, they should only implement a tournament system that mitigates it.


Why should metagaming be mitigated?


Mitigated metagaming negates meditating migrations. Clearly.

Also, metagaming is not fun to watch. Sure, there are a minority that enjoy it, but most people want to see good tactics, good piloting, and good setups.

Cry Nova
Posted - 2011.06.28 12:44:00 - [16]
 

Matches should be monitored by CCP in-game.

If a match is fixed, both teams get blown up, pod and all, and get disqualified from the tournament.

Moto Tsume
Minmatar
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2011.06.29 21:53:00 - [17]
 

Edited by: Moto Tsume on 29/06/2011 21:53:11
be all and end all is less ***gotry is a PVP tournament, if your going to *** about dont turn up.

PVP tourney is for pvp and I thing the games should have judges that instapop teams that dont fight and give their slot to some one who gives a damn.

hydra and outbreak will always be silly little gimps in my eyes now not worth a tear.

in fact CCP is also equally at blame for allowing it.

Headerman
Minmatar
Quovis
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
Posted - 2011.06.30 06:54:00 - [18]
 

Personally i think any match where any team found (by CCP) not doing their best should be placed 'On Hold' in the competition while the evidence CCP has seen is put forward to a CQ window for every player in New Eden in real time, and have them vote yes or no to them being kicked out based on the 'evidence'.

That way, people get a say, everyone is aware of whats going on, and would do a decent job of putting the 'Tournament' back into the alliance tournament.

Edenmain
Euphoria Released
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2011.07.02 19:23:00 - [19]
 

Edited by: Edenmain on 02/07/2011 19:23:49
There is a way to fix all this metagaming and stuff...

Bring 10 pilots in ships to beat us.

If you can't beat us we win, if you do then you win, it's pretty ****ing simple lol

SwindonBadger
0utbreak
Outbreak.
Posted - 2011.07.03 19:22:00 - [20]
 

Well Ladies and genitals

Here are some facts,

To win the tourney you dont need 10 000 people in your alliance, you just need to tell your &&*** lolly *** sucking leaders that using 5 super caps for 5 roaming 0utbreak ships will not teach u jip about how to acutally play this game.

100 percent whine and no trousers is due to bad leadership and flocks of sheep bleeting.

The best things in this game do not come from numbers , I have loved every match of this toruney and hell yeh it would been more satisfying to see hydra or 0utbreak fight PL or Darkside in the final, but you know what... if they aint good enough pilots .. no amount of spying, attempted playing poaching can outdo pure ninja skill in the heart of battle.

We learned this by fighting heavily outnumbered in 0.0 every night, every day. Every time you gank someone your pilots learn nothing. NOTHING...

In a little time I will be openinig a traning corp for those people who would like to learn, only the very best of you with tru spirit will be introduced to my boss as a possible scoute for 0utbreak the rest of you will learn pain and death and rejection, and in this rejection you might just find yourself alive for the first time.

And no we wont be doing the tourny in this new corp, the only things that will matter is how many corpses u scalped for Garmons Mum, if she is pleased you might be raised from t1 frig to inty... and so on. Old 0utbreak mebers welcome but u still gotta get me 100 corpses. just need one or two weeks and then we role into no mans land.

Major Stallion
The Money Shot Inc.
Posted - 2011.07.04 23:04:00 - [21]
 

Originally by: AngryMax
Problem is that if you face PL in round one, and you lose, it knocks you out of tournament while you could make it to the semi-finals given alternative brackets.




if youre not good enough to advance, then youre not good enough to advance. There should be no round-robin, or second chances.

Moto Tsume
Minmatar
Macabre Votum
Morsus Mihi
Posted - 2011.07.05 00:48:00 - [22]
 

why when you can bring 20 pilots and make your selves look like ****s.

Ein Phantom
Posted - 2011.07.05 03:09:00 - [23]
 

Metagaming and actual combat skill are both integral aspects of EVE. Separating one from the other would destroy the spirit of EVE. If you remove or even mitigate metagaming from the Alliance Tournament, then you reduce the tournament to a boring one-dimensional explosion fest. Metagaming provides an interesting and appealing backdrop to each match.

Face it. HYDRA RELOADED won twice. They won the tournament in both combat skill and intelligent metagaming. This has never been done before in the previous eight years. They are the pinnacle of achievement in the Alliance Tournament.

Shaemell Buttleson
Posted - 2011.07.07 20:43:00 - [24]
 

The tournament was fixed you muppet!


TV Evangelist
Imminent Ruin
Posted - 2011.08.06 21:20:00 - [25]
 

Fixing the AT is super easy. Get rid of prizes. Make it bragging rights only.

fgft Athonille
Posted - 2011.08.08 15:03:00 - [26]
 

ban them all, vacate prizes only way to fix it

wont happen so wont get fixed

btw eve uni, stop war dec exploiting. i hope you eventually get banned for it


 

This thread is older than 90 days and has been locked due to inactivity.


 


The new forums are live

Please adjust your bookmarks to https://forums.eveonline.com

These forums are archived and read-only