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blankseplocked Is this the AT final I raced home for?
 
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Merdaneth
Amarr
Defensores Fidei
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.19 22:54:00 - [1]
 

I just came home in time to watch the AT9 Finals. The excitement was quickly lost as I was treated to a nonsense match.

This kind of metagaming, while undoubtedly very interesting to the participants, sadly doesn't make for an interesting tournament to watch. And I see more matches I missed suffered from it. There is enough poor quality PvP and metagaming already, I don't think we need more on things like the alliance tournament.

Some of my friends have some interest in EVE partially due to me telling them about Alliance Tournament. It is a thing people that aren't EVE players can follow, relate too and enjoy somewhat. However, I think if they watch this disgrace of a final, they'll just think 'what kind of a ****ed up game is that' and certainly won't be tempted to start playing. I think this Alliance Tournament final is poor publicity. A game that appears to be filled with metagaming and corruption by established parties isn't attractive to new gamers.

Regardless, the teams that got to the finals are still excellent PvPers, but the poor tournament design by CCP (coupled with them having no fair-play rules and even explicitily encouraging non-fair play) has sadly reduced the final to an uninteresting TV event. The teams played by the rules as advertized, they should get full prizes. They may have made a poor PR choice with running the finals this way, but I don't blame for this mess. They were playing EVE the way CCP says they want their players too.








Tyzzara
Minmatar
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
Posted - 2011.06.20 04:09:00 - [2]
 

For the most part I agree with the OP

But what a way to slap us all in the face.

CCP, fans, contestants and all.

It is what it is. And I do blame them.

Blacksquirrel
Posted - 2011.06.20 04:13:00 - [3]
 

What happened exactly I missed the last 2-3 matches...

Zuquar Bonaparte
New Dawn Corporation
Circle-Of-Two
Posted - 2011.06.20 04:18:00 - [4]
 

Originally by: Blacksquirrel
What happened exactly I missed the last 2-3 matches...


short version- outbreak crushed hydra just so they could bend over and take it up there you know what in the final match, huge disgrace.

Roosterton
Eternal Frontier
Posted - 2011.06.20 04:21:00 - [5]
 

Originally by: Zuquar Bonaparte
Originally by: Blacksquirrel
What happened exactly I missed the last 2-3 matches...


short version- outbreak crushed hydra just so they could bend over and take it up there you know what in the final match, huge disgrace.


True version - 0utbreak, after working closely with Hydra, decided that Hydra deserved to win more than they did, and thus gave them the victory.

Blacksquirrel
Posted - 2011.06.20 04:29:00 - [6]
 

I see.

Not really winning if there's no competition.

Roosterton
Eternal Frontier
Posted - 2011.06.20 04:33:00 - [7]
 

Originally by: Blacksquirrel
I see.

Not really winning if there's no competition.


Oh, there was competition. Hydra beat PL, or did you forget?

Celia Therone
Posted - 2011.06.20 04:42:00 - [8]
 

What happened was that Hydra and Outbreak, who had practiced together and regarded themselves as one team, attempted to stage a dramatic match whereby Outbreak would initially dominate and then Hydra would stage a hero comeback.

However they messed it up and made it totally obvious that they weren't competing and ended up with an almost 15 minute snoozefest of tedium and fail in front of CCP Management, sponsors, customers and press.

Various comments by members of Outbreak and Hydra claim that this was either a failure to implement their fake battle correctly because they were still celebrating getting into the finals or a deliberate failure as they wanted to troll the tourney/forums for tears.

Blacksquirrel
Posted - 2011.06.20 04:44:00 - [9]
 

I meant per match... not ladder climbing which yes it did take skill and luck to get there.

Disappointing to hear. Imagine if teams at the world cup, Olympics just gave up at the end and said... Eh you guys had a better season. I guess im hearing they knew each other or had close relations or some such. But I know people I compete against too... I dont just throw in the towel.

This is like sumo wrestling.

Red Maiden
Gallente
Aliastra
Posted - 2011.06.20 04:50:00 - [10]
 

I'm a new player and the final match did *not* dampen my enthusiasm or appreciation of the tournament or the matches that led up to it. At all.

Really, I think most people are overreacting to how the final unfolded. Sure, it would have been nice to see an actual battle, but it did not take away from all the other excellent fights. Even the matches where meta gaming ruled were pretty interesting because they revealed a whole other facet of EVE that wouldn't normally be exposed through just pew pew.

This tournament made EVE even more interesting to me, and I'm betting that your friends will feel the same way if/when they watch it on YouTube.

Fumb Duck
Awww Diddums..
Ninja Unicorns with Huge Horns
Posted - 2011.06.20 05:24:00 - [11]
 

Get a life CVA boy, racing home, damn there is a thing called youtube you know...

What would have been epic would have been if the thrasher ****d the vindi, now that would have been a fun end to things..
Doubt Hydras ego could have handled the best loser tag for two years in a row though..

Still all the best to the Hydra and 0utbreak fellas, you did well getting there, I'd put your route into the finals would have been like going to a nightclub and pulling the hottest chick in there...
and the final is you getting home and not being able to get it up so to speak...
Still there is always foreplay huh?

Precisionist
Posted - 2011.06.20 06:06:00 - [12]
 

Originally by: Roosterton
Originally by: Blacksquirrel
I see.

Not really winning if there's no competition.


Oh, there was competition. Hydra beat PL, or did you forget?


This is stupid, it was the finals, should be the 2 very good teams giving it their all, that is why they asked 50 questions about ppl walking in stations more than they usually do in previous matches, its suppose to be the finale, not a let down throwaway fixed win. Worst tourney ever.

Raimo
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2011.06.20 06:19:00 - [13]
 

Edited by: Raimo on 20/06/2011 06:20:34
Originally by: Red Maiden
I'm a new player and the final match did *not* dampen my enthusiasm or appreciation of the tournament or the matches that led up to it. At all.

Really, I think most people are overreacting to how the final unfolded. Sure, it would have been nice to see an actual battle, but it did not take away from all the other excellent fights. Even the matches where meta gaming ruled were pretty interesting because they revealed a whole other facet of EVE that wouldn't normally be exposed through just pew pew.

This tournament made EVE even more interesting to me, and I'm betting that your friends will feel the same way if/when they watch it on YouTube.


<3 hopefully the quiet majority will see things this way in the end TBH

(And I don't disagree with the OP, always ways to improve the ruleset for a better tourney)

Scorpii Zenith
Minmatar
Native Freshfood
Posted - 2011.06.20 07:06:00 - [14]
 

Originally by: Merdaneth
I just came home in time to watch the AT9 Finals. The excitement was quickly lost as I was treated to a nonsense match.

This kind of metagaming, while undoubtedly very interesting to the participants, sadly doesn't make for an interesting tournament to watch. And I see more matches I missed suffered from it. There is enough poor quality PvP and metagaming already, I don't think we need more on things like the alliance tournament.

Some of my friends have some interest in EVE partially due to me telling them about Alliance Tournament. It is a thing people that aren't EVE players can follow, relate too and enjoy somewhat. However, I think if they watch this disgrace of a final, they'll just think 'what kind of a ****ed up game is that' and certainly won't be tempted to start playing. I think this Alliance Tournament final is poor publicity. A game that appears to be filled with metagaming and corruption by established parties isn't attractive to new gamers.

Regardless, the teams that got to the finals are still excellent PvPers, but the poor tournament design by CCP (coupled with them having no fair-play rules and even explicitily encouraging non-fair play) has sadly reduced the final to an uninteresting TV event. The teams played by the rules as advertized, they should get full prizes. They may have made a poor PR choice with running the finals this way, but I don't blame for this mess. They were playing EVE the way CCP says they want their players too.








Agree, it was really bad entertainment. CCP should think about their product again, it's bad in this form.

Nobody would bother to watch fixed UEFA final..

Kagumichan
Degenerate Corp
Get Off My Lawn
Posted - 2011.06.20 07:12:00 - [15]
 

Edited by: Kagumichan on 20/06/2011 07:13:12
Originally by: Scorpii Zenith
Nobody would bother to watch fixed UEFA final..


But you DO watch fixed UEFA finals, they just smooth out the edges so people who can't see it can't tell it's fixed. Football is the most corrupt sport in the U.K, in fact probably the most corrupt in the world, what other sport is there where players intentionally dive on the floor and pretend to be hurt so they can cheat and get a free shot at winning? I don't see rugby players QQ'ing 'cos they scr@ped their knees on the grass.

Scorpii Zenith
Minmatar
Native Freshfood
Posted - 2011.06.20 16:36:00 - [16]
 

Edited by: Scorpii Zenith on 20/06/2011 16:36:51
Originally by: Kagumichan
Edited by: Kagumichan on 20/06/2011 07:13:12
Originally by: Scorpii Zenith
Nobody would bother to watch fixed UEFA final..


But you DO watch fixed UEFA finals, they just smooth out the edges so people who can't see it can't tell it's fixed. Football is the most corrupt sport in the U.K, in fact probably the most corrupt in the world, what other sport is there where players intentionally dive on the floor and pretend to be hurt so they can cheat and get a free shot at winning? I don't see rugby players QQ'ing 'cos they scr@ped their knees on the grass.
Newsflash, it's ILLEGAL in real life.

Everyone who get caught, will be punished since sports do involve real big money.

For example UEFA final few years ago, gamblers did bet on that match result for over 30 million euros in betfair alone.

Not to mention sponsors etc etc.

It all depends on viewers, if there isn't specators or tv audience, that sport will die away. That's why they are trying to fight against fixed games and tournaments.

In EVE, CCP just doesn't give damn and I am sure that community will remember this one.

Atleast from now on we know that it's pointless to watch those tournaments since they are fixed from the start untill final match.

Blacko Bellamy
Posted - 2011.06.20 17:13:00 - [17]
 

Edited by: Blacko Bellamy on 20/06/2011 17:14:22


Originally by: Kagumichan
Edited by: Kagumichan on 20/06/2011 07:13:12
Originally by: Scorpii Zenith
Nobody would bother to watch fixed UEFA final..


But you DO watch fixed UEFA finals, they just smooth out the edges so people who can't see it can't tell it's fixed. Football is the most corrupt sport in the U.K, in fact probably the most corrupt in the world, what other sport is there where players intentionally dive on the floor and pretend to be hurt so they can cheat and get a free shot at winning? I don't see rugby players QQ'ing 'cos they scr@ped their knees on the grass.


That is correct.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992%E2%80%9393_UEFA_Champions_League

Read up, what the punishment for OL was.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Italian_football_scandal

Read up, what happened and the consequences for the 5 teams involved in the scandal.


I also agree with you, in the Premier League is way too much money, which is way too tempting. We will see more scandals.


I see a difference, how these professional leagues acted and how CCP reacted in their own tournament scandal so far.



Kagumichan
Degenerate Corp
Get Off My Lawn
Posted - 2011.06.20 17:33:00 - [18]
 

It's only been a day and no doubt they were all tired and needed to get home last night, so how about giving them time to talk over what action to take before condemning them, yes?

flapie 2
Gallente
Posted - 2011.06.20 17:42:00 - [19]
 

Originally by: Kagumichan
It's only been a day and no doubt they were all tired and needed to get home last night, so how about giving them time to talk over what action to take before condemning them, yes?


Your actually thinking there gonna take action ....... even i'm not that optimistic. Would love to see it happen never the less, but sadly enough knowing CCP they allready got away with it.

Kagumichan
Degenerate Corp
Get Off My Lawn
Posted - 2011.06.20 17:47:00 - [20]
 

They may do, they may not do, who knows?

Though I think right now they may have more pressing matters, like getting Incarna ready for launch tomorrow.

Better to serve the needs of the many, that adhere to the cries of the few.

Saint Lazarus
Pwn 'N Play
Chaos Theory Alliance
Posted - 2011.06.20 19:40:00 - [21]
 

I was so thrashed I dont even remember the final tbh, anyone who does was doing it wrong

grumpyguts1
Posted - 2011.06.20 20:15:00 - [22]
 

EVE is all about out thinking and outplaying other players, it is considered "meta gaming". You can't compare EVE to real life.. I would love to go suicide gank some people in RL and only have to worry about loosing the tools I used to do it with... but you can't... DOH, Hulkageddon is loved by many, even some carebears get in on the action . In the end it was all fun to watch, some where a little boring... but hey... we will all be back next year to watch and some to *****... great work CCP and the teams involved...

******* grumpy returns the soap box to OP*******

fly safe... mmmm this is EVE never mind.. just flyLaughing


Edenmain
Euphoria Released
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2011.06.22 21:20:00 - [23]
 


I think CCP should increase the prize money and maybe even give extra ships to us as we have done them a massive favour.

We have made AT10's finals absolutely essential viewing imagine knocking out HYDRA next year? This heroic feet could be you! So get testing,

because we will be........ Cool

Dark Soldat
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
Posted - 2011.06.22 22:05:00 - [24]
 

What if we repeat our feat next year and just straight up don't show up for the finals, that will shoe the whiners !

Abaddonah
Posted - 2011.06.23 02:38:00 - [25]
 

Originally by: Edenmain

I think CCP should increase the prize money and maybe even give extra ships to us as we have done them a massive favour.

We have made AT10's finals absolutely essential viewing imagine knocking out HYDRA next year? This heroic feet could be you! So get testing,

because we will be........ Cool


Smug...

Levistus Junior
Caldari
Trojan Trolls
Controlled Chaos
Posted - 2011.06.23 13:37:00 - [26]
 

Originally by: Blacko Bellamy
Edited by: Blacko Bellamy on 20/06/2011 17:14:22


Originally by: Kagumichan
Edited by: Kagumichan on 20/06/2011 07:13:12
Originally by: Scorpii Zenith
Nobody would bother to watch fixed UEFA final..


But you DO watch fixed UEFA finals, they just smooth out the edges so people who can't see it can't tell it's fixed. Football is the most corrupt sport in the U.K, in fact probably the most corrupt in the world, what other sport is there where players intentionally dive on the floor and pretend to be hurt so they can cheat and get a free shot at winning? I don't see rugby players QQ'ing 'cos they scr@ped their knees on the grass.


That is correct.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992%E2%80%9393_UEFA_Champions_League

Read up, what the punishment for OL was.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Italian_football_scandal

Read up, what happened and the consequences for the 5 teams involved in the scandal.


I also agree with you, in the Premier League is way too much money, which is way too tempting. We will see more scandals.


I see a difference, how these professional leagues acted and how CCP reacted in their own tournament scandal so far.





Well, modern football is very much about whatever you can do to win and get away with it rather than fair play. Think of tactical fouls (deliberately committing an act that's punishable by the rules because the benefit far outweighs the penalty in the given case) or dives. Also, how many time has a referee unintentionally favored a team (such as missing a handball in the penalty area) and the favored team went and told him he was wrong?

That's exactly what Hydra and Outbreak did: the thing that best served their interests without breaking the rules. That's what people in most competitions do.


 

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