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RAW23
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:07:00 - [211]
 

Originally by: Mac Aoidh
Originally by: Florestan Bronstein
Quote:
@swearte
Swearte Widfarend

#tweetfleet I love @EveOnline they try to make a balanced, reasonable (seems so) approach to monetizing 3PP, and whiners explode. #moartears

Retweeted by HilmarVeigar


Linkage

at least Hilmar is having fun...


This almost ****es me off more than the dev blog. Apparently, the CEO of CCP thinks we're all just whiners!

Dirk Decibel
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:07:00 - [212]
 



I'll just go ahead and quote this:

Originally by: Kronus Heilgar


I'd just like to take this moment to state in a very clear manner what it is you are doing here:
You are charging people who work for free to make your game better you asshats


Phigmeta
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:07:00 - [213]
 

Originally by: CCP Zymurgist
CCP Atlas has some great news for 3rd party developers in his latest dev blog. Read all about the new business license and monetizing 3rd party apps here.

Read German translation

Read Russian translation

Addendum from CCP Guard: Don't miss CCP Zulu's update in this post





Here let me translate that for you:

CCP has decided that:

a) our war on RMT has not gone well because our PLEX sales are stagnant.
b) The reaction of the Eve folk to the JB nerf has NOT made more supers die (therefore forcing more PLEX purchases)
c) We anticipate that the AOR idea won't really take off because this ISN'T freaking WOW
d) We are getting more and more greedy and really only working on stuff that makes YOU spend more RL money on our stupidity.

SOOOO we have now opened up a new way to screw you .... thank me.

Apollo Gabriel
Mercatoris
Etherium Cartel
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:07:00 - [214]
 

Edited by: Apollo Gabriel on 15/06/2011 19:10:50
Page 6 mid page.

Originally by: Chribba
ok seriously, I've like Ctrl+A, backspace this post 5 times now, tbh I'm out of words.

I would like to know how many 3rd party developer/sites are doing it for the ****ing awesome income it generates?! Seriously, this if anything WILL kill development of sites and services.

As a creator of sites/applications/services for New Eden since well over 6 years now, I can tell you that I have never once created something with the goal to make money off it, this whole thing about needing a license to make something for the community is just ****ing ******ed! Just hearing this makes my interest/will for developing things crash.

This is not about the $99, this is about how you want to charge me because I want to do something for the community out of my free will - does that sense? Do you feel I am stealing your IP, making massive amounts of money off your IP? Then tell me straight up, don't try to bind it into some fluffy clouds and call it "great news".

Every IPO in Market Discussions will now require a license, since after all, it's donations. Corporations should get a license too, I mean having a corp tax of >0.0% could be seen as a donation to the corporation...

And yeah, I guess me and everyone else with an EVE IP tattoo will need a license, I mean, some other geek may think it's awesome and want to buy me a beer...

I'm just very sad to see this even being discussed, talk about a punch in the face. Don't get me wrong, I see your point of EVE IP, and yes I can agree that it may need to be controlled to some extent, but this is not the way. Not by far.

/c


I would have thought this thread an over-reaction threadnaut if it weren't for these words.

Chas Davia
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:08:00 - [215]
 

Edited by: Chas Davia on 15/06/2011 19:10:16
CCP are just being lazy and copying Apple:

http://developer.apple.com/programs/ios/

However, they are categorically NOT Apple - the market for eve aps != the market for iOS apps, especially if the $99 fee does not come with commercial support, and a development pack / suite. Everyone is in agreement that there is a requirement for a commercial exploitation licence - but this seems a step too far.

Most API developers are INCREASING the value of the CCP IP, not making money from it.

Joe SMASH
You Got A Purty Mouth
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:08:00 - [216]
 

As a show of force that most 3rd party devs do NOT like this rule. I think we should figure out a day where all Eve Online 3rd party sites get taken offline. This will show the community what it will be like if CCP gets this in place. For those 24 hours, the Eve community (voted best in the MMO world!) goes quiet and CCP will (hopefully) begin to see their many mistakes with this new set of rules.

GKO
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:09:00 - [217]
 

"What will CCP do next?" lol :) It feels like Atlas got drunk and posted a troll :)
You made even Chribba cry Dude...

In case you did not see this coming CCP: This is a game about spaceships. Do some research. There are important things to fix in YOUR client software. This creates a need for 3rd party apps, but hell yeah, let them pay you to help you :)

And that asshats quote comes here.

Xailia
Unsteady Corporation
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:11:00 - [218]
 

Quote:
We have kept the fee as low as possible and hope that the $99 fee. . .

$99 is not "as low as possible", $0 is. Neutral

Mojang originally was going to charge for their mod API license, but then changed it to be free (see Notch's blog). So this kind of licensing can be done without charging the developers.

Jaari Val'Dara
Caldari
Deep Space Nomads Corp
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:12:00 - [219]
 

I remember of zero punctuation review of eve. He said eve is like a job that you have to pay for. Now developers that spend time and money to give us great services will have to pay CCP for a second job.

Kersh Marelor
Amarr
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:13:00 - [220]
 

Originally by: Kronus Heilgar
You are charging people who work for free to make your game better you asshats


QFT.

Apollo Gabriel
Mercatoris
Etherium Cartel
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:15:00 - [221]
 

I am guessing the intent here was:

Some players wanted to develop 3rd party isk revenue services. CCP didn't want to deal with IP violations, so came up with the licensing system. Then as the did with skill descriptions, completely ****ed it up.

Kainan Mai
Amarr
APEX ARDENT COALITION
C0NVICTED
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:16:00 - [222]
 


bp920091
Killer Koalas
R.A.G.E
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:16:00 - [223]
 

Originally by: Kersh Marelor
Originally by: Kronus Heilgar
You are charging people who work for free to make your game better you asshats


QFT.


This needs to be said again and again until CCP GETS IT!!!

Algathas
Minmatar
The Revenge of Auntie Freeze
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:18:00 - [224]
 

Originally by: Kronus Heilgar

You are charging people who work for free to make your game better you asshats


Blane Xero
Amarr
The Firestorm Cartel
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:18:00 - [225]
 

Originally by: Chribba
ok seriously, I've like Ctrl+A, backspace this post 5 times now, tbh I'm out of words.

I would like to know how many 3rd party developer/sites are doing it for the ****ing awesome income it generates?! Seriously, this if anything WILL kill development of sites and services.

As a creator of sites/applications/services for New Eden since well over 6 years now, I can tell you that I have never once created something with the goal to make money off it, this whole thing about needing a license to make something for the community is just ****ing ******ed! Just hearing this makes my interest/will for developing things crash.

This is not about the $99, this is about how you want to charge me because I want to do something for the community out of my free will - does that sense? Do you feel I am stealing your IP, making massive amounts of money off your IP? Then tell me straight up, don't try to bind it into some fluffy clouds and call it "great news".

Every IPO in Market Discussions will now require a license, since after all, it's donations. Corporations should get a license too, I mean having a corp tax of >0.0% could be seen as a donation to the corporation...

And yeah, I guess me and everyone else with an EVE IP tattoo will need a license, I mean, some other geek may think it's awesome and want to buy me a beer...

I'm just very sad to see this even being discussed, talk about a punch in the face. Don't get me wrong, I see your point of EVE IP, and yes I can agree that it may need to be controlled to some extent, but this is not the way. Not by far.

/c
Sorry Chribba, but welcome to New-Era CCP. Money is the way, **** the players and **** the people who support the game.

Liang Nuren
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:18:00 - [226]
 

Originally by: Apollo Gabriel
I am guessing the intent here was:

Some players wanted to develop 3rd party isk revenue services. CCP didn't want to deal with IP violations, so came up with the licensing system. Then as the did with skill descriptions, completely ****ed it up.


It was a can of worms that should NEVER have been opened up tbh.

Hakaru Ishiwara
Minmatar
Republic Military School
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:19:00 - [227]
 

Oh god. I totally forgot about EVE Voice and CCP's hair brained scheme to nickle and dime its customers... Now they are back at it.

@ CCP: Trying to exact blood out of your [supremely] loyal 3rd party developers is counter-intuitive. These people offer services that greatly enrich YOUR mother ****ing IP and current cash cow.

Unbelievable.

Jessie42
Minmatar
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:20:00 - [228]
 

Dear Hilmar,

Suck a ****.

Love, Goonwaffe.

Kronus Heilgar
Dark Orbit Media
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:20:00 - [229]
 

Thank you everyone who has quoted my red rage text,
You are charging people who work for free to make your game better, you asshats
as I really think it's helped to drive the point home to CCP.

As a developer myself, I have been rather shocked and frustrated by this decision. I have taken it upon myself to organize a shut-down of 3rd party apps/services that are effected by this but who never intend to make a RL dime. For details and to proclaim your support, visit the main thread

Here


Woo Glin
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:20:00 - [230]
 

I regularly pay isk for pictures of hairy bellies, does this apply to me?

P.S. Convo me if you have a big hairy belly and want to rub it on cam for iskies. No gay **** just two dudes showin' off their bellies.

Kelduum Revaan
EVE University
Ivy League
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:21:00 - [231]
 

Ok, my turn now.

For those who don't know me, I'm the CEO of EVE University, and I run a fairly popular site with 110,000+ unique visitors per month across all the sites.

Hosting costs aren't cheap at all, as there's the forums, wiki, mumble server and so on open to the community at large, and in fact, right now I am in the middle of moving to another hosting platform that can cope with the level of traffic we get.

To run all our services, we accept donations of ISK and items in-game, and use Shattered Crystal affiliate links and PayPal donations to cover the majority of the server/hosting costs.

In short, we pretty much break even assuming we don't have any major outgoings, and something like $99 per year, while possible (I'd have to either fund it out of my own pocket, or ask for donations, which I hate) would be far from ideal.

To CCP in general: I think its safe to say the devblog needs some drastic clarifications, or there is a very good chance you will lose the people who love EVE so much they go beyond subscribing and buying GTCs/PLEX - they spend their free time to help the community, and by extension CCP.

Scalar Angulargf
Rayn Enterprises
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:21:00 - [232]
 

Originally by: Chribba
ok seriously, I've like Ctrl+A, backspace this post 5 times now, tbh I'm out of words.

I would like to know how many 3rd party developer/sites are doing it for the ****ing awesome income it generates?! Seriously, this if anything WILL kill development of sites and services.

As a creator of sites/applications/services for New Eden since well over 6 years now, I can tell you that I have never once created something with the goal to make money off it, this whole thing about needing a license to make something for the community is just ****ing ******ed! Just hearing this makes my interest/will for developing things crash.

This is not about the $99, this is about how you want to charge me because I want to do something for the community out of my free will - does that sense? Do you feel I am stealing your IP, making massive amounts of money off your IP? Then tell me straight up, don't try to bind it into some fluffy clouds and call it "great news".

Every IPO in Market Discussions will now require a license, since after all, it's donations. Corporations should get a license too, I mean having a corp tax of >0.0% could be seen as a donation to the corporation...

And yeah, I guess me and everyone else with an EVE IP tattoo will need a license, I mean, some other geek may think it's awesome and want to buy me a beer...

I'm just very sad to see this even being discussed, talk about a punch in the face. Don't get me wrong, I see your point of EVE IP, and yes I can agree that it may need to be controlled to some extent, but this is not the way. Not by far.

/c


Not empty quoting. Seriously what the ****. Commercial websites, I can see. Donations for hosting costs? I don't think so.

Lutz Major
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:22:00 - [233]
 

You should be charged for the countless hours that 3rd party developers used to write documentations about your precious API! Sad

Dierdra Vaal
Caldari
Veto.
Veto Corp
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:24:00 - [234]
 

Edited by: Dierdra Vaal on 15/06/2011 19:25:34
I would urge CCP to amend or clarify their policy to state the following rules:

1: If you make any real-world (dollars, euros, whatever) profit (this means: after covering your costs) off your service/app/website, you need a commercial licence.

2: If you do not make any real world profit off your service/app/website, you can use the non-commercial licence.

This will allow people to monetize their apps for profit, but not hurt those who just provide a service for their corp or for eve, at their own expense (server costs, etc).

Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:26:00 - [235]
 

Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha on 15/06/2011 19:27:29
You are charging people who work for free to make your game better you asshats


Here's HOW MUCH I make for providing the six and totally free and open to everyone services on my self paid hosted website.

A WHOLE 0.26 in 6 months!!!


Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.



Anyone understand why this initiative is completely ret****ed?


Moreover I spent weeks making the graphics inspired to EvE despite the website is for my other MMOs as well. I will have to tear everything down and suffer labour derived damage.

Mac Aoidh
Caldari Provisions
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:27:00 - [236]
 

Originally by: Lutz Major
You should be charged for the countless hours that 3rd party developers used to write documentations about your precious API! Sad


I don't think you can put a price on what developers like Chribba have done for the game.

woddel
Gallente
Canis Industries Ltd
Avaricious Cartel
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:28:00 - [237]
 

Originally by: Joe SMASH
As a show of force that most 3rd party devs do NOT like this rule. I think we should figure out a day where all Eve Online 3rd party sites get taken offline. This will show the community what it will be like if CCP gets this in place. For those 24 hours, the Eve community (voted best in the MMO world!) goes quiet and CCP will (hopefully) begin to see their many mistakes with this new set of rules.


i'm in with www.eve-commander.com and agents.eve-commander.com...

salty Milk
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:28:00 - [238]
 

I get the feeling this is the tip of the iceberg.

Under the water I'm detecting 3rd party development of hats.

Feroz
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:28:00 - [239]
 

Originally by: Kronus Heilgar

You are charging people who work for free to make your game better you asshats






SPAECMARNIES
Ghosts of Ragnarok
Test Alliance Please Ignore
Posted - 2011.06.15 19:29:00 - [240]
 

CCP is just proving again they have lost all contact with reality. I was working on Eden, an all-in mac-tool for fittings and character management, which is bound to be released for _free_ and as _open source_ (BSD), and I'll consider dropping that project immediately.

**** you, CCP. **** you very much.


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